Reply to SCOTUS outlaws race as college admissions factor

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][twitter]https://twitter.com/kimmythepooh/status/1674527485055074306[/twitter]

Facts matter. The right has "won" again on this thanks to a corrupt court and the Federalist Society that has perfected gaming the system.[/quote]

Is it your belief that no Asian Americans feel aggrieved by the recent admissions practices at elite colleges and universities?[/quote]

These schools have single digit admit rates. No one is entitled to gain acceptance. The fact is, the Asian population makes up X percent of the US population. Asian students make up X+++ at these elite schools. They are already oversampled. Do you think the student bodies should just be all Asian students?[/quote]

You didn't answer my question.

To answer yours, no.

By your logic, African-Americas are also "oversampled" in the Harvard student body. Weird.[/quote]

Yes, I believe there are Asian-Americans who feel aggrieved. There are also whites, blacks, women, gays, lesbians and others who feel aggrieved too. Tons of kids who worked their tails off and were certainly qualified to be considered for schools like Harvard. But a manufactured lawsuit that complains about a fictional "less deserving black student" over the more deserving Asian student is ridiculous. [/quote]

[b]So a black son of a biglaw partner from from McClean is more deserving than an Asian daughter of poor, recent immigrants with better stats?[/b]

These policies were on a path toward creating a class within a class wherein privileged black kids had their places essentially secured at these elite schools by dint of their privilege with numbers that were incomparable to their similarly (though not exactly the same) privileged peers. Similarly enough, these educated professional class types were also the chief beneficiaries reaping the largess flowing from BLM and DEI initiatives while leaving everybody in the hood still poor and downtrodden and settling in their wealthy enclaves with other elites.

These institutions wanted to have their cake and eat it too. Wanted to keep "acceptable" diversity figures, while keeping a sufficient quotient of full-pay students and keeping minority retention/attrition rates from looking like a complete mockery AND pretending that they are doing the lord's work by throwing a kid from the trenches a scholarship every now and then.  They should just own that they are instruments for the perpetuation of generational privilege and keep the song and dance.

Surely these games are not the answer. [/quote]

You all keep citing this one example. My response, I don't know, I am not in the admissions office and not responsible for the composition of a class of incoming students. What I do know, having two kids very recently gone through the college admissions process, is that the schools weigh many factors into each applicant - can they do the work, what in their background makes them a unique applicant, what will they study? What does our school need in terms of students who will contribute to the school community, be it as a writer for a student newspaper, an actor, a musician, an athlete, whatever. So I don't know anything beyond what you have posted that is bolded. Assuming both students scored well enough (your scenario says the Asian student has better stats) - maybe the Asian student wants to go into engineering and the stats for that are not the same as the African-American applicant, who in addition to stats that are good enough for the school, also plans to major in English, has won writing awards, and also plans to continue their acting career in the school's theater department? Whereas the Asian student comes from a less advantaged background, has good stats, never worked a job, didn't do much otherwise in terms of extracurriculars etc.

See the dilemma these schools face? Provide more context for both students AND the school, and then we can play the game. In fact, this is an exercise my kids school does with the parents of juniors early in junior year, so parents can understand what the Admissions officers are up against with these applications.

As others have noted in the college thread over the last several years, with grade inflation, the watering down of the SAT etc, the fact is, there are tens of thousands of "good" students with "strong stats" and tons of awesome extracurriculars and volunteer service. All of that is good enough to get tossed into a viable admissions pool, so you go from the 50,000 applications down to 12,000 applications for the same 2,000 spots. From there it is a whole host of non-academic considerations.

And still, there are more Asians relative to the general population and fewer blacks relative to the general population.

Now, post SCOTUS decision, I am willing to bet that neither of the applicants you note, will gain admission to these schools. Oh well.[/quote]

You have to remember the Asian applicants to Harvard excelled in all categories.  They had greats scores, great extracurriculars, great everything.  By assuming the Asian applicants had poor extracurriculars, you're perpetuating the stereotype that Asians are just test taking machines.

The one area where Asian applicants failed as a group was in the personality rating, where somehow the Asian applicants had the lowest personality ratings across every decile.  The evidence is damning unless you believe Asians uniformly have the worst personalities.  What's worse, the Asian applicants ranked high in the personal interviews too, but somehow systematically ended up with the worst personality scores.

I don't know if Affirmative Action as a whole needed to be removed, but Harvard needed to be rebuked.  I don't know how anyone can defend what Harvard did, and it's kind of telling that the left basically condones Harvard's casual racism.  Hardly anyone on the left admits to the discrimination.  Yes, Asian are overrepresented at Harvard.  You can be overrepresented and still be discriminated against.[/quote]

I made no such assertions. I was going on an extended hypothetical offered by the person I was responding to. the bottom line is, there are hundreds of thousands of "top" students qualified to be at these elite schools, where there are only thousands of seats available. So many more qualified kids will be rejected. Crying to the supreme court about it doesn't open up more seats, doesn't raise the admission rate, etc. the bottom line is that there are kids who are going to be upset about being rejected. The idea that Asian applicants are somehow more worthy of any of these seats when their percentages relative to the overall population were oversampled makes the case less compelling. So congratulations, rather than being 21% of the make up of these schools, you should expect that it will fall to closer to 10% or less and in total, it will now be much harder for minorities to gain acceptance to these schools.

Hoisted by your own petard.[/quote]

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