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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]To be fair to the PP, *I* am the one who said there is only one path to God.

Based on my understanding of the Quran, the only time Christians and Jews are "cool with God" was before the final revelations of Muhammad. Who can fault Jews and Christians for believing what they believe before Muhammad came along? After all, Islam is simply an "expansion pack" and you can't fault someone for not playing a game when the game hasn't been released yet. Many Muslims twists this into the argument that as long as a Christian/Jew didn't learn about Islam, even modern day Christians/Jews, that's okay because they didn't know.

First, this contradicts with the versus condemning Christians/Jews who don't convert to Islam. Second, can you find any modern day Christians/Jews who have *not* heard of Islam? Substantially all modern day Christians and Jews have heard of Islam, have been told that there is one more revelation from a prophet called Muhammad, yet they rejected this knowledge as false. These Christians and Jews are going to hell according to the Quran.

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First, which verse are you referring to that "condemns Christians/jews who don't convert to Islam? Are you referring still to 9:30? That particular verse does not condemn Christians/jews for not converting to Islam, it condemns those Christians/Jews who were responsible for corrupting the original Gospel or Jesus' message and misleading their descendants.

Many modern day Christians/Jews all know of Islam, just as many Muslims also know of Christianity and Judaism. Few Christians/Jews actually study Islam. Islam requires a serious study to recognize its validity and truth. In fact, Christianity requires a serious study to recognize that the Gospel was indeed altered significantly by people. Yes, it is incumbent for people to try to study Islam or at least their own religion if they have any awareness that it had been altered significantly. However, to what degree Allah holds such an expectation and how serious the punishment is for not studying Christianity or Islam is a determination that only Allah can make. As I said, intention is key. I am sure there are many other factors to consider, such as the ease of learning quranic arabic, the time available, etc.. That said, the Quranic verses make clear well meaning Christians and Jews will not be barred from Heaven or from God's grace. That is the point.[/quote]

Different PP here. She's undoubtedly referring to 3:86.

[b]Props for the off-topic and unecessary swipe at the gospels.[/b] But while we're on the subject, you claim the gospels were distorted by men. Yes, it's true that Islam claims the Quran is God's own words as dictated to Mohammed, but the gospels never make such a claim. (I wouldn't want to be stuck with immutable "god's words" about some of the things in your book.)

But this begs a question: how could you claim, earlier, that people who were simply quoting Quranic verses were out to "vilify Islam" when in fact you think these very same verses are "God's own words" and therefore perfect?

When people can merely cite passages from your holy book and you think they're "vilifying" your religion, maybe it's time to examine your religion.[/quote]

"One path to God" PP here. That comment further digs 15:22 into a hole: even by moderate interpretations of the Quran which allow for Christians and Jews to enter into Paradise under certain situations, that entry is dependent on the Christian/Jew being a Faithful practitioner. Clearly the Quran indicates that those Christians and Jews who practice their faith based on altered versions of the Torah or Bible are deemed Unfaithful by Allah - multiple verses of the Quran references this point. It's a frequent claim by Muslims that the truth, perfection, and beauty of Islam comes in no small part from the accuracy with which the Quran has been preserved.  If Muslims believe the modern Torah and Bible to have been altered, then all of its practitioners are Unfaithful by definition as directed in the Quran.

A Muslim might argue now that the Quran also regard the Torah and Bible as "valid", and not corrupted. But bear in mind that the Quran was written in year 609, and there might have been an authoritative Torah and Bible at the time that the Quran recognized as valid. But it is the claim of modern Muslims that these documents are no longer faithful to their original versions.

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