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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]

You want people to assume the out of wedlock birth was an immaculate conception based on gospel? But who other than Christians believe in the word of the gospel? Your "proof" is your OWN book though. And it requires me to assume the premise is true. The gospel is true perhaps to you but not to me or everyone else. So your reasoning is ill conceived. Try again.

I think the word " pedophile " was used in this thread, if not by you, then clearly by others.

There has been ample information provided by Muslima to explain Islamic inheritance, testimony, and divorce. I do not rely on Sharia though as Sharia is man made law. I rely on the Quran.  Muslima might not have explained everything but she did a fairly decent job. Her "flowery" descriptions rubbed you the wrong way, huh? It sounds like you simply hated that she spoke devoutly about her faith.

Everything was explained to you. So in essence a Muslim woman under a true Islamic State is not required to support herself. She may but isn't required. Her brothers, uncles, father, are required to support her unless she is married. This is why inheritance laws gives men more money, so they can support women.

If a Muslim woman wants to divorce, she may, but has the addl hurdle of seeking a divorce through the court. A man needs two witnesses. The addl requirement acts as a safeguard for women in a system entrenched with institutional discrimination toward women, as it is in place to ensure a woman is not making a decision that will be more harmful to her in the long run. Moreover, men are not permitted to take back anything they bestowed to the wife during the marriage. This is in stark contrast to divorce laws in the US, where spouses often fight for who gets what, and women are in financial hardship after divorce.

Overall, it looks to me that Islam does a fine job of providing true "equality" because it is a more just system.

You follow me?? [/quote]

That sound you hear is everybody reading this smacking their heads against their screens. We don't follow you, Muslima (yes, it's clear from your rhetorical style that you're Muslima, just not logged in at the moment), because the errors in logic are overwhelming.
1. You said Jesus was born "out of wedlock," so it was explained that Joseph married Mary so there was no "out of wedlock birth" as you had claimed several times. So now you're on a different tangent about immaculate conception and how you don't believe the gospels - yet you call us Islamophobes for not taking the word of your holy book. Whatever....
2. You, Muslima, have been told multiple times that your descriptions are half-truths and therefore misleading. To the extent you got all flowery, it was for the purpose of throwing up a smoke screen and avoiding clarity and truth.  THAT is the problem with your language and rhetorical style.
3. You haven't mentioned how divorced women lose custody of their children at a young age.

I'm satisfied if the facts get out there. Then DCUM readers can make up their own minds. The problem is, you're exhausting, and a person could spend an entire day tracking down your every logical fallacy and flowery smokescreen that's meant to camouflage the hard facts.[/quote]

Hon, I am not Muslima. I assure you. I have to ask - are you basing your knowledge of Islam on Hollywood? Is it based on the movie, "Not Without My Daughter," or google research, perhaps? You may as well believe all rabbit stand on two feet and say "What's up Doc?" WTH?

So pardon me, it was technically not an "Out of wedlock" birth but now you say Mary had a shot gun wedding? In those days it was likely the most shameful and disgraceful of all acts. To justify it, I am to rely on the truth of YOUR OWN book, the gospel? So because the gospel said it's "immaculate" I must believe that to be truth? Is there any proof that is more universally acceptable that you can offer other than reliance on your own religous book?

You are terribly confused so let me clarify what we are debating here. You (or others) made the accusation that the islamic system is inequitable and therefore unjust toward women. Muslima and I (and possibly others, I don't know) explained the rationale behind islamic laws in the area of inheritance, divorce, and testimony. To explain the rationale, wouldn't I need to explain the Islamic system in more detail? I certainly wouldn't refer to gospel or the Torah to explain Islamic principles, would I? It simply wouldn't make sense to do so.

Contrast that with your assertion that Mary's conception was "immaculate" as a defense to my objection to Muhammad being called a pedophile. To defend Mary's pregnancy, you relied solely on your own religious book rather than any other universally accepted proof, such as scientific proof.

I was asked to explain the rationale for my religious principles, which I correctly and adequately did by explaining how things work in a true Islamic state. You were asked to defend mary's "immaculate" conception, which you could only do by relying on your religious book. You failed.

I hope I'm not wasting time here educating you on how to effectively argue a point. [/quote]

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