Reply to What exactly is Chechyna'a beef with the USA?

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[quote=Anonymous][quote=jsteele][quote=Anonymous]

I think you are over -reacting Jeff, and if you were a journalist, I think you'd be called on the carpet for allowing personal attachments to seep into the way you try to steer/ control the message on this forum.[b] You should be able to hear that criticism.[/b]

I have only skimmed the thread, but if there is a single post on here that says ver batim , " the brothers are another example of the world wide  coordinated war by muslims" I have yet to see it on this thread.

Yes, people are angry, and people are sick of this, and have a right to be upset at seeing 8 year olds killed and 6 year olds with their legs blown off.

True, nearly 1 Million Iraqis are dead because of us, and their blood is equal to ours. It is true that out media dehumanizes Arabs , and muslims in general, and frankly I'd like to see us kick Israel to the curb, and take the side of justice once and for all over there.

But that does not make me less angry seeing American children with their legs blown off, and dead 8 year olds, killed by someone we took in , gave a scholarship to, made one of our own and, in the case of Katherine and her family, loved.

Its infuriating. And what they did is wrong.[/quote]

Thank you. The one thing I wanted was advice about what is or is not posted in this forum from someone who admits to only skimming it.  The fact that you, me, or any other reader is angry does not mean that events and motivations should not be properly understood. In fact, using anger instead of reason is exactly what leads to mistakes like the invasion of Iraq.

[b]Do you think we are better off or worse off if we understand the true motivations of the brothers? 
[/b]
In the run up to the Iraq invasion I participated in a discussion forum and was one of the lone voices speaking against the invasion. On the day Colin Powell gave his presentation, a poster called me out saying, "any questions?"  I replied that I didn't have any questions, but that I expected almost every single fact that Powell had stated would eventually be shown to be false. I proved to be correct about that. However, at the time, the vast majority of people reacted to me the way you guys are. Yeah, I was really funny and my biases were making it difficult to think logically.

[b]As I said in an earlier post, if Jim and Bob Smith decide the world sucks and they want to blow it up, they are two mentally disturbed kids. [/b]Unless they turn out to be Muslim, then they are international terrorists. If Adam Lanza had been Chechen, we would be referring to Sandy Hook as America's Breslan.  But, that's okay because people are angry.

[/quote]

I don't think the brothers understood their true motivations, Jeff. Seeing that the older brother listened to the rants of  radical imams over and over again,  just shows us where he was directing his anger, but that does not show us his motivation. The super ego is the first casualty of the toxic mix of rage + testosterone in the young adult male. A rationale, does not a motive make. A rapist for example, might say, " all prostitutes are sinners and they deserve to die in hell" , but that rant does not reveal their motivation. No rapist says," I raped and killed those women because I am a sexually repressed victim of extreme child abuse and I feel powerless unless I can unleash my rage against that which makes me feel powerless"

As the President said, "they are those who destroy because they cannot build,.... and think that makes them powerful ". That pretty much hits the nail on the head.

Secondly, you were not alone in your suspicions prior to the gulf war, you just may have been someone who was asked your opinion. There were many Americans who saw the writing on the wall back during the election as the R nominee ( Bush vs McCain) was being decided, we just have other jobs, lines of work, some of us were out of the country even.

I realized there was going to be a war when I saw who Bush wanted to pick for his VP, his Sec of State and his Defense Secretary in like July of 2000 and I work in a completely unrelated field.

I debated why Bush the son, would be a disaster with a lot of Egyptians, Yemenis and Lebanese as I was abroad during those years and do you know what they all said, " Bush will be good, we liked the father"

I warned them , " No, you don't want Bush to win, if he does, within a year there will be a war." I told them all " that is the only reason these men have picked him as their nominee... because they can control him, look at their resumes and their agenda is obvious" The answer of my learned Lebanese and Egyptian hosts, " "No, Bush the father was good, the son will be like the father"

By your reasoning anyone who supported Bush is a hater of muslims, a fascist, a follower. Well, how do you explain then the millions of muslims in the middle east who were just praying that Bush v Gore would be decided in Bush's favor ? None of them could get passed the small , truly meaningless fact the Lieberman was jewish, until they became victims of the war themselves.
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