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[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]I see this argument a lot, that positive-only training works just as well as balanced training and takes 3 times as long.  And that makes it better somehow?  The longer an animal wanders around in confusion, the longer it takes to correct problems and the more dangerous the situation is.

FWIW, I could walk our golden just fine with a choke chain (probably could have used a flat collar but never tried) while my mother was hauled around with the prong collar.  Goldens are great dogs but have necks like iron.    They just don't care.  While other methods may be needed to train a good walk, a prong collar won't hurt them.  [/quote]

Agree. I am like 90% percent positive, but the tools themselves are not an issue, it's how they're used. There are different types of prong collars, some better than others. The good ones where the owner is giving treats for walking well and the prong is a natural consequence of lunging, are fine. Especially on an older dog that hasn't been trained since very young or a dog that's not food-motivated. Positive only fails those dogs; balanced training is where it's at. These people should consult a trainer. [/quote]

Op:  I'm sorry but, "balanced training" is not where it is at.  And btw, my discussion was also meant to discuss the article not just these particular friends.  Let me give you an example...long time ago in schools there was a belief that corporal punishment helped kids learn or behave. Imagine today that your kid gets a wrong answer and instead of showing them where they made the mistake in a kind way they get hit on their hands with a ruler?  If they are told that they are lazy and stupid?  Will the child want to learn or will they give up?

All the aversive methods cause pain, fear and can do serious physical and damage the relationship between the owner.  We have learned that hitting kids is wrong why can we treat our good friends the same way?  And remember, dogs do not speak English ( or any other language)  They have to learn by repetition and it is a lifelong journey!

Beyonce practiced her concert for 8 months for a two hour show and yet we expect our dogs to pick up things so much quicker.  Why is that?  And no I am not a dog trainer but, I accept that I will work at where my dog is not where I want him to be.\

As to my friends they have used trainers but, this friend is too weak to actually walk the dog!  The other partner can do it so they should let the one spouse be on walk duty and the other can come along for the exercise![/quote]

Not OP.  Repeat to yourself, this is not my business.  My opinion on prong collars is not shared by many others.  I cannot and should not tell other people how they should handle training and walking their dog.  Just because I think what I believe is right, does not make it so. [/quote]

WRONG!  Animals cannot speak for themselves!   It is harmful to them.  Did you even read the article?  One dog almost lost their eye!  If you saw a kid being beaten would you say "hey none of my business?"  Some people beat their kids and they believe it is the right thing to do.  NOOOO In fact I am going to double down and work on getting these things banned.

We have to speak up for those who cannot speak up for themselves![/quote]

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