RTO is a myth/joke

[Anonymous]

Maybe they have been DOGE'd and are unemployed.

[Anonymous]

This obsession with making people sit in an office is really bizarre. I seriously think it’s a psychological problem.

[Anonymous]

Why are people like this, seriously? If people take leave, WFH, or just flex their schedule to be able to complete dropoff/pickup/Friday afternoon showing up for kid, why are you so upset? What's it to you.

I mean most families are already paying a small fortune for summer camp and everything else it takes to make raising kids work. Its like some of ya'll live to make life harder.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can't WFH, I work in the medical field so my job will always be in person. Even in blizzard/hurricane/whatever conditions I've had to sleep at the hospital because I am expected to be at work.

I will never understand the absolute vitriol about WFH/RTO. You realize most of you sound like immature idiots right? So you're jealous some people have a better work/life balance or work schedule than you. Ok, change jobs instead of attacking them. So someone makes a snide remark about you working from home? Ignore it instead of making some snide comeback.

Seriously this forum is supposed to be composed of mature adults and it's like a middle school schoolyard in here with the maturity level.

It is because RTO doesn’t make sense for many of our jobs. Unlike yours, many of us just sit at a desk and work on projects/assignments. There’s very little office interaction. Since it makes literally no difference where we do our work, why force a commute and all the trouble to just to sit in an office all day, rather than sit at home in front of the exact same computer?

[Anonymous]

going from two hours a week to four hours a week of work is doubling their workload.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can't WFH, I work in the medical field so my job will always be in person. Even in blizzard/hurricane/whatever conditions I've had to sleep at the hospital because I am expected to be at work.

I will never understand the absolute vitriol about WFH/RTO. You realize most of you sound like immature idiots right? So you're jealous some people have a better work/life balance or work schedule than you. Ok, change jobs instead of attacking them. So someone makes a snide remark about you working from home? Ignore it instead of making some snide comeback.

Seriously this forum is supposed to be composed of mature adults and it's like a middle school schoolyard in here with the maturity level.

It is because RTO doesn’t make sense for many of our jobs. Unlike yours, many of us just sit at a desk and work on projects/assignments. There’s very little office interaction. Since it makes literally no difference where we do our work, why force a commute and all the trouble to just to sit in an office all day, rather than sit at home in front of the exact same computer?

+1. I literally use the same laptop teleworking at home as I do at work. It's work that can be done from anywhere. As a taxpayer, it makes me mad to waste money keeping the office open unnecessarily. All of our productivity is tracked religiously, so no concerns there either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can't WFH, I work in the medical field so my job will always be in person. Even in blizzard/hurricane/whatever conditions I've had to sleep at the hospital because I am expected to be at work.

I will never understand the absolute vitriol about WFH/RTO. You realize most of you sound like immature idiots right? So you're jealous some people have a better work/life balance or work schedule than you. Ok, change jobs instead of attacking them. So someone makes a snide remark about you working from home? Ignore it instead of making some snide comeback.

Seriously this forum is supposed to be composed of mature adults and it's like a middle school schoolyard in here with the maturity level.

It is because RTO doesn’t make sense for many of our jobs. Unlike yours, many of us just sit at a desk and work on projects/assignments. There’s very little office interaction. Since it makes literally no difference where we do our work, why force a commute and all the trouble to just to sit in an office all day, rather than sit at home in front of the exact same computer?

+1. I literally use the same laptop teleworking at home as I do at work. It's work that can be done from anywhere. As a taxpayer, it makes me mad to waste money keeping the office open unnecessarily. All of our productivity is tracked religiously, so no concerns there either.

People who have never worked a Fed job don't understand just how much tracking there is. Every. Single. Click. is monitored. They can see how long I was on each screen. If I'm idle too long and I "time out", I sometimes need to submit proof that it was because I was in a webinar or in a meeting where my laptop wasn't needed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting how Feds accrued so much leave over the past few years. I wonder why they didn’t they take much leave but now suddenly need to.

It really is amazing

Or to be able to work form 6 to 2:30

Bet the first 3 hours are reading dcum.

Feds are back in the office and you are still miserable. This is a reflection of how miserable your life is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Interesting how Feds accrued so much leave over the past few years. I wonder why they didn’t they take much leave but now suddenly need to.

For myself, I can't flex my schedule and I have to get my son to an activity at 6pm. So on days that I have to drive the carpool, with an hour commute, I need to use an hour of leave. It's only once every other week, my husband and I alternate driving it, but it adds up.

This is why you need to find a private sector job.

In most private sector jobs, there is way less “you must work 40 hours.” It’s completely normal to leave an hour or two early once a week because your child has an event. A private sector manager would find it bizarre to receive a request to take one hour of leave.

It’s as if the only thing that matters in the public sector is sitting at your desk 40 hours a week.

It really is true, but it has always been like this. But as public sector employees we’re told that private sector requires much more overtime and fewer benefits.

[Anonymous]

I’m a fed and I am burning down my leave between kids and an aging parent. I am considering going part-time because it’s just not sustainable. I will have no leave if a family emergency comes up at this rate.

FWIW, when I was teleworking I was much more productive. I am working considerably less now with no telework flexibility. It’s so stupid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How do I know? Because I see hundreds of parents (many of whom I know are federal employees) every day picking their kids up from camp at 2:30 in the afternoon (after 9 am drop offs).

Then attending Friday camp shows every Friday from 2- 3 pm.

So unless they’re taking tons of leave, I’m pretty sure all these people haven’t RTO’d.

Yes so many “complaints” on DCUM and elsewhere about RTO. Doesn’t add up.

Meanwhile, opm issues guidance basically directing agencies to let employees TW if they have to pray that day.

It’s a joke.

Have you considered things like carpools or staggered shifts? Parent A does the 9 am drop off and Parent B does pickup. Also most of my kids’ camps go through at least 3 or 4, I don’t know any ending at 2:30.

Not to mention, yes many parents are burning lots of leave to make this work. Camp registration opened in Jan/Feb. My kids are in some camps that we may not have done due to hours/location if we had known about a commute back then (I wasn’t originally slated to RTO but then an office was found in April and my CBA has been violated). We couldn’t get our money back, so we’re using paid leave to manage it, which sucks. No one wants to burn PTO on camp pickup vs. a vacation.

Also my private sector DH still works at home full time (and has since well before COVID). So we still have a teleworking parent who does a lot of the camp runs. It’s just that my formerly flexible lower paying government job is now just a lower paying government job. My DH has makes more money, has more flexibility, and full telework working for a private company.

At this point I would steer anyone remotely educated and competent away from a career in government. It’s all downsides for less pay. But instead of worrying about the low quality of future hires under these conditions, OP is pissed we aren’t all chained to a desk with a long commute all summer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At this point I'd rather use my leave than to keep accruing it.

Why? I'm not judging I'm really asking - as a leave hoarder myself. IDK I don't expect to stay in government - whether of my own volition or being let go - so the way I see it, why not grab 30-40k+ out the door? Is it about not wanting to miss time with your kids etc?

DP but federal employment is toxic right now and the less I have to be there the better. I do so much less work now, I don’t think I’ve worked a single 40 hour week since RTO in March. Also sick leave isn’t paid out, so I’d rather take care of my mental health and use my sick leave. I had been keeping it since it can be counted toward service time for retirement. But if I get RIF’d then what is the point of having that leave.

Congrats to this administration for getting my butt into a seat in some commercial real estate making some rich guy richer, but I now do my job for the hours I’m there. No OT. No weekend work. No logging back on to finish something. I take leave if I’m not feeling 100% mentally and physically healthy or use annual leave to accommodate all the life things that I now have less time for due to the commute.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How do I know? Because I see hundreds of parents (many of whom I know are federal employees) every day picking their kids up from camp at 2:30 in the afternoon (after 9 am drop offs).

Then attending Friday camp shows every Friday from 2- 3 pm.

So unless they’re taking tons of leave, I’m pretty sure all these people haven’t RTO’d.

Yes so many “complaints” on DCUM and elsewhere about RTO. Doesn’t add up.

Meanwhile, opm issues guidance basically directing agencies to let employees TW if they have to pray that day.

It’s a joke.

Have you considered things like carpools or staggered shifts? Parent A does the 9 am drop off and Parent B does pickup. Also most of my kids’ camps go through at least 3 or 4, I don’t know any ending at 2:30.

Not to mention, yes many parents are burning lots of leave to make this work. Camp registration opened in Jan/Feb. My kids are in some camps that we may not have done due to hours/location if we had known about a commute back then (I wasn’t originally slated to RTO but then an office was found in April and my CBA has been violated). We couldn’t get our money back, so we’re using paid leave to manage it, which sucks. No one wants to burn PTO on camp pickup vs. a vacation.

Also my private sector DH still works at home full time (and has since well before COVID). So we still have a teleworking parent who does a lot of the camp runs. It’s just that my formerly flexible lower paying government job is now just a lower paying government job. My DH has makes more money, has more flexibility, and full telework working for a private company.

At this point I would steer anyone remotely educated and competent away from a career in government. It’s all downsides for less pay. But instead of worrying about the low quality of future hires under these conditions, OP is pissed we aren’t all chained to a desk with a long commute all summer.

You are lucky. My spouse was working from home long before covid, not a fed and RTO in January. Commute is 1-2 hours each way and its sole sucking. He goes in early, comes home early but often puts in another few hours as his supervisor is cross country and co-workers all over the world and they don't consider his work schedule/time difference and expect him to be available when they choose to work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Interesting how Feds accrued so much leave over the past few years. I wonder why they didn’t they take much leave but now suddenly need to.

Let’s see. With telework I could use my lunch break for a telehealth appointment or a virtual IEP meeting. Now I have nowhere private to take a call, so I have to take leave. Or I could get a medical appointment or errand done early and still log on by 9:30.

A 1 hour commute (2 hours round trip) is 10 hours per week, which comes out to 40+ hours per month. You can’t imagine how cramming the equivalent of an entire extra workweek into each month would cause people to need to take leave to accommodate the things they used to do during that 40 hours.

Over a year that is 480 hours in lost time is finite. People now have to take leave. Not to mention getting less sleep + feeling run down and depressed + exposure to germs on metro/in the office = higher likelihood of getting sick. Which means taking even more leave.

The taxpayers now have to pay for my transit subsidy and office space (new space that we didn’t previously have) and get less work in return.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My old boss said once I find it funny you took a job in a building that did not move but now it is further away.

The building did not move you did. My building is actually in a suburban town close to DC with amazing schools and a metro.

We have people at work who live one hour away who moved after taking job complaining about commute. Why they wanted a huge house on a huge plot and by office would get you a smaller house with a smaller plot.

Then they also complain about tolls, gas, traffic every day.

Covid just made it worse. My prior company is still remote as CEO moved full time to his beach house in NJ, the COO is in his Delaware Beach house and another C level person moved to to a Florida to avoid state taxes. But really will that last forever? All three of those C level people are early 60s and milking it as would have just retired if forced back.

Well I’m a fed who did buy a smaller, older home near my office (10-15 min commute) and then it closed because telework was going so great and it saved the agency money. And now they are paying for office space they found me an hour away. I’m not the only one this happened to. There are also people who took remote jobs and now have to “return” to an office they’ve never worked in.