Consensus world view of TOP 5/6 UK University Rankings (Prestige/Research)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. Currently tossing up potential choices for DS if a conditional offer for economics from Edinburgh comes through (already has offer from Durham).

Similar spot here. Son has offers from Bristol and Exeter. Waiting on Edinburgh and St Andrews.
Is your son leaning Edinburgh if everything comes through?

He was leaning towards Durham but think he might be rethinking. However, a conditional offer from Edinburgh likely to require a higher score so need to think hard about that. Aldo applied to Bristol but no offer yet. Would be a good option.

My son was enamored with Exeter’s campus after touring it. Nothing like the other four. He likes the Bristol program with their Innovation hub addition to the Business and Management program. He applied to Business programs everywhere but Edinburgh, where he applied to their MA Interdisciplinary Futures program after touring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. Currently tossing up potential choices for DS if a conditional offer for economics from Edinburgh comes through (already has offer from Durham).

Similar spot here. Son has offers from Bristol and Exeter. Waiting on Edinburgh and St Andrews.
Is your son leaning Edinburgh if everything comes through?

My DD got unconditional offers at St. Andrews and Edinburgh in November, but has heard nothing from the LSE.

Anyone hear anything from there?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. Currently tossing up potential choices for DS if a conditional offer for economics from Edinburgh comes through (already has offer from Durham).

Similar spot here. Son has offers from Bristol and Exeter. Waiting on Edinburgh and St Andrews.
Is your son leaning Edinburgh if everything comes through?

My DD got unconditional offers at St. Andrews and Edinburgh in November, but has heard nothing from the LSE.

Anyone hear anything from there?

Is she really planning on attending one of the three? As of now, is she leaning STA or UofE?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. Currently tossing up potential choices for DS if a conditional offer for economics from Edinburgh comes through (already has offer from Durham).

Similar spot here. Son has offers from Bristol and Exeter. Waiting on Edinburgh and St Andrews.
Is your son leaning Edinburgh if everything comes through?

My DD got unconditional offers at St. Andrews and Edinburgh in November, but has heard nothing from the LSE.

Anyone hear anything from there?

Is she really planning on attending one of the three? As of now, is she leaning STA or UofE?

I'm hoping she'll choose a US option! I don't like the idea of her so far. But the choice is hers. I will discourage anything that isn't unconditional -- I don't want that hanging over her head in June and July.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. Currently tossing up potential choices for DS if a conditional offer for economics from Edinburgh comes through (already has offer from Durham).

Similar spot here. Son has offers from Bristol and Exeter. Waiting on Edinburgh and St Andrews.
Is your son leaning Edinburgh if everything comes through?

My DD got unconditional offers at St. Andrews and Edinburgh in November, but has heard nothing from the LSE.

Anyone hear anything from there?

Is she really planning on attending one of the three? As of now, is she leaning STA or UofE?

I'm hoping she'll choose a US option! I don't like the idea of her so far. But the choice is hers. I will discourage anything that isn't unconditional -- I don't want that hanging over her head in June and July.

I hear you. Most offers to Americans from these schools are unconditional as they know what they are competing against.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ok, say room and board is about 10k per yr. That is 30k plus 123k =153k . Say $188k total.

Tell me a university in the US where u can get better than or an equivalent to an Oxford degree in Economics for $188k including room and board?

Nowhere is room and board $10k for a year. It’s $20k per year. Then you have added travel costs, so that’s probably $5k per year minimum. Then all other costs at $5k. Again probably too low.

So, 40,000 pounds =$48,000. So total COA is at least $78k per year so that’s $234k

Someone mentioned Berkeley or UCLA would be equivalent and if you have taken all the APs you need for Oxford you could be in a position to graduate in three years at those places as well as a Michigan if that’s what you want.

The delta is just much less than it used to be just two years ago.

I’m not the PP, but since I have a kid at Oxford, I think I know a little bit about my cash outflow here…..I’m not adding other living costs outside of Dorm/Food and I’m not telling you which college my son is at, other than he is studying Econ.

Room and Board is dependent on the college you are in. BUT the range (IN POUNDS) for accomodations and Food, straight from Oxford’s website is:

FOOD: 2,835 to 4,445 pounds
ACCOMODATIOn: 6,705 to 8,325 pounds
TOTAL for ROOM & BOARD: from 9,540 to 12,770

Course fees this year = 41,130 pounds.

So ALL IN for ONE YEAR of studies at OXFORD = 50,670 to 53,900 pounds.

At Today’s Exchange rate that equals $63,080 to $67,100 dollars PER YEAR. TIMES 3 YEARS = $189,240 to $210,300 to get an Economics degree at Oxford including TUITION + ROOM AND BOARD.

So the previous poster was very very close with his $188k number.

The question remains, is $189k for an Oxford Economics Degree worth it? That is the equivalent of a $47,310 dollars per year for a US Degree INCLUDING TUITION, ROOM AND BOARD. Since most top 25 US colleges Room and Board are 12 to 15k, lets say the equivalent Tuition cost in the US is $35,000 dollars.

Taking any scholarships out of the way to compare Apples to Apples, where else can you get an equivalent Economics degree to Oxford for $35k Tuition in the US. The options are very limited and this looks like it was the whole point from the previous poster.

For us it was a no brainer. We do not pay this much. My son was able to receive two separate scholarships and our cost is currently about 65% of the amount I indicated above….

Actually this is not bad. Didn’t even know scholarships were available.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. Currently tossing up potential choices for DS if a conditional offer for economics from Edinburgh comes through (already has offer from Durham).

Similar spot here. Son has offers from Bristol and Exeter. Waiting on Edinburgh and St Andrews.
Is your son leaning Edinburgh if everything comes through?

He was leaning towards Durham but think he might be rethinking. However, a conditional offer from Edinburgh likely to require a higher score so need to think hard about that. Aldo applied to Bristol but no offer yet. Would be a good option.

My son was enamored with Exeter’s campus after touring it. Nothing like the other four. He likes the Bristol program with their Innovation hub addition to the Business and Management program. He applied to Business programs everywhere but Edinburgh, where he applied to their MA Interdisciplinary Futures program after touring.

Bristol’s new $100M Temple Quarter project will house their Innovation dept. It looks like a great opportunity. My husband used to teach at Bristol and he retired last year after 16 years. Bristol is moving up fast. They now officially have UK’s fastest supercomputer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. Currently tossing up potential choices for DS if a conditional offer for economics from Edinburgh comes through (already has offer from Durham).

Similar spot here. Son has offers from Bristol and Exeter. Waiting on Edinburgh and St Andrews.
Is your son leaning Edinburgh if everything comes through?

He was leaning towards Durham but think he might be rethinking. However, a conditional offer from Edinburgh likely to require a higher score so need to think hard about that. Aldo applied to Bristol but no offer yet. Would be a good option.

My son was enamored with Exeter’s campus after touring it. Nothing like the other four. He likes the Bristol program with their Innovation hub addition to the Business and Management program. He applied to Business programs everywhere but Edinburgh, where he applied to their MA Interdisciplinary Futures program after touring.

Bristol’s new $100M Temple Quarter project will house their Innovation dept. It looks like a great opportunity. My husband used to teach at Bristol and he retired last year after 16 years. Bristol is moving up fast. They now officially have UK’s fastest supercomputer.

This is great for Bristol. The previous top supercomputer in the UK (Archer 2) was at Edinburgh. And if they get their funding figured out they will get the next big Billion pound supercomputer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
My husband and I get tons of questions about this from our American friends. Now that our two younger kids are about to go through the process, we’ve been following this forum closely, and we’ve noticed these questions come up frequently. Hopefully, this helps!

This perspective is specifically for non-UK students/residents, as many of us in the UK unfortunately still rely heavily on our League Tables. These rankings take student satisfaction into account but tend to undervalue research output and overall research quality. This has its pros and cons but sometimes leads to results where universities like Loughborough, Bath, or St Andrews rank ahead of institutions that are considered more prestigious on an international scale.

After moving away from the UK after university and graduate school, spending seven years in Southeast Asia, 14 years in the US, and additional time in South America and Europe before returning to the US, I’ve come to realize that there is a fairly consistent global consensus (outside the UK) on which UK universities are the most prestigious—regardless of what our domestic League Tables might suggest.

To be clear, this doesn’t mean that universities outside this top group aren’t excellent. There are fantastic programs at Bath, Warwick, Bristol, St Andrews, etc. However, outside the UK, these six universities tend to be viewed by major employers and top universities as the most impressive and prestigious, with significantly stronger alumni networks:

1. Oxford/Cambridge
2. Imperial
3. UCL
4. Edinburgh/King’s

This ranking aligns well with global university rankings that factor in research output. I didn’t include LSE because it has such a narrow academic focus, but within those fields, it is, of course, world renowned.

My husband and I attended three of these six universities, plus one outside the list, and our experiences living all over the world have reinforced this perspective. In the US, St Andrews might be viewed positively in certain regions, but overall, the top 5–6 universities have remained consistent over time. Bristol is also well-regarded internationally and is often perceived as a step above St Andrews due to its broader research strength.

I frequently get questions from American friends about Warwick, Bristol, Bath, Exeter, and Lancaster for their kids. While these are great universities, some of which are particularly strong in specific subjects, outside the UK they generally don’t carry the same level of prestige as the six mentioned above. And based on what I’ve seen here on DCUM, prestige seems to matter a lot to many people in the US.

That said, students at these universities outside of the top 5-6 will still receive an excellent education. If the alternative is a T50–T75 US school, attending one of these top 10/12 UK universities outside the top 5 could still be a great option, especially for independent students who know exactly what they want to study.

Hope this helps!

Thank you for the nice informative write up!

[Anonymous]

Interesting Thread. We have a Junior that is adamant about going abroad.

Outside of Oxbridge/LSE or Imperial, how the next level of UK universities compare to US universities? I’m not asking about Job Prospects. Just a comparison of pedigrees in since this always the topic around DCUM.

What are the US universities that would group well with each of these?

UCL
Kings
Edinburgh
St Andrews

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Interesting Thread. We have a Junior that is adamant about going abroad.

Outside of Oxbridge/LSE or Imperial, how the next level of UK universities compare to US universities? I’m not asking about Job Prospects. Just a comparison of pedigrees in since this always the topic around DCUM.

What are the US universities that would group well with each of these?

UCL
Kings
Edinburgh
St Andrews

Based on QS rankings:

UCL - in between Caltech and Penn/Berkeley
Edinburgh - in between Yale and Columbia
Kings - in between Columbia and UCLA/NYU/Michigan

based on Times Higher Education:

UCL - around Cornell/Michigan/Columbia/UCLA
Edinburgh - around Duke/Nothwestern/NYU
Kings - around UCSD and ahead of Brown/UT etc

Based on US News:

UCL right by Columbia and Yale
Kinds and Edinburgh about tied and right by NYU

Based on # of Nobel Prize Winners according to Aron Frishberg website:

UCL - 24 (around Penn and Washington U)
Edinburgh - 20 (around NYU, UCSD and ahead of UCLA and Michigan
Kings - 11 (around Duke and USC)
St Andrews - 3 (around Missouri/Pitt and FLorida)

St Andrews doesnt do well in World Rankings as these are usually weighted towards research output and quality of research and not so much on undergraduate teaching.

But you can clearly see based on a variety of sources, the equivalent universities….

[Anonymous]

St Andrews is more focused on undergraduate education, while the others are “research universities” where the graduate programs and research are viewed as more important by the faculty.

All in that set would be solid choices. Pick the one which is best fit for your student — and look into details of the students intended degree program at each university. Different unis will have stronger or weaker offerings in different academic areas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, thanks for posting. Currently tossing up potential choices for DS if a conditional offer for economics from Edinburgh comes through (already has offer from Durham).

Similar spot here. Son has offers from Bristol and Exeter. Waiting on Edinburgh and St Andrews.
Is your son leaning Edinburgh if everything comes through?

My DD got unconditional offers at St. Andrews and Edinburgh in November, but has heard nothing from the LSE.

Anyone hear anything from there?

Is she really planning on attending one of the three? As of now, is she leaning STA or UofE?

I'm hoping she'll choose a US option! I don't like the idea of her so far. But the choice is hers. I will discourage anything that isn't unconditional -- I don't want that hanging over her head in June and July.

It’s OK takes up an offer from an American university and a conditional offer from a UK university. It’s sort of like staying on the waitlist of the school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting Thread. We have a Junior that is adamant about going abroad.

Outside of Oxbridge/LSE or Imperial, how the next level of UK universities compare to US universities? I’m not asking about Job Prospects. Just a comparison of pedigrees in since this always the topic around DCUM.

What are the US universities that would group well with each of these?

UCL
Kings
Edinburgh
St Andrews

Based on QS rankings:

UCL - in between Caltech and Penn/Berkeley
Edinburgh - in between Yale and Columbia
Kings - in between Columbia and UCLA/NYU/Michigan

based on Times Higher Education:

UCL - around Cornell/Michigan/Columbia/UCLA
Edinburgh - around Duke/Nothwestern/NYU
Kings - around UCSD and ahead of Brown/UT etc

Based on US News:

UCL right by Columbia and Yale
Kinds and Edinburgh about tied and right by NYU

Based on # of Nobel Prize Winners according to Aron Frishberg website:

UCL - 24 (around Penn and Washington U)
Edinburgh - 20 (around NYU, UCSD and ahead of UCLA and Michigan
Kings - 11 (around Duke and USC)
St Andrews - 3 (around Missouri/Pitt and FLorida)

St Andrews doesnt do well in World Rankings as these are usually weighted towards research output and quality of research and not so much on undergraduate teaching.

But you can clearly see based on a variety of sources, the equivalent universities….

I think this would be correct within the UK, as in how these universities are perceived in a relative sense. In other words, Oxford/Cambridge are sort of the HYP of the UK, and LSE is a Penn/Chicago, Imperial an MIT, and so on.

But in terms of actual comparison with US universities, I’m not sure I would put UCL, Edinburgh, Kings, etc as high as the list above. UCL is maybe a T30, Edinburgh and Kings T50s. Or maybe you could make an argument of all as T30s, it isn’t exact. But aside from research output, I would put these schools a bit lower than their QS or THE rankings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting Thread. We have a Junior that is adamant about going abroad.

Outside of Oxbridge/LSE or Imperial, how the next level of UK universities compare to US universities? I’m not asking about Job Prospects. Just a comparison of pedigrees in since this always the topic around DCUM.

What are the US universities that would group well with each of these?

UCL
Kings
Edinburgh
St Andrews

Based on QS rankings:

UCL - in between Caltech and Penn/Berkeley
Edinburgh - in between Yale and Columbia
Kings - in between Columbia and UCLA/NYU/Michigan

based on Times Higher Education:

UCL - around Cornell/Michigan/Columbia/UCLA
Edinburgh - around Duke/Nothwestern/NYU
Kings - around UCSD and ahead of Brown/UT etc

Based on US News:

UCL right by Columbia and Yale
Kinds and Edinburgh about tied and right by NYU

Based on # of Nobel Prize Winners according to Aron Frishberg website:

UCL - 24 (around Penn and Washington U)
Edinburgh - 20 (around NYU, UCSD and ahead of UCLA and Michigan
Kings - 11 (around Duke and USC)
St Andrews - 3 (around Missouri/Pitt and FLorida)

St Andrews doesnt do well in World Rankings as these are usually weighted towards research output and quality of research and not so much on undergraduate teaching.

But you can clearly see based on a variety of sources, the equivalent universities….

I think this would be correct within the UK, as in how these universities are perceived in a relative sense. In other words, Oxford/Cambridge are sort of the HYP of the UK, and LSE is a Penn/Chicago, Imperial an MIT, and so on.

But in terms of actual comparison with US universities, I’m not sure I would put UCL, Edinburgh, Kings, etc as high as the list above. UCL is maybe a T30, Edinburgh and Kings T50s. Or maybe you could make an argument of all as T30s, it isn’t exact. But aside from research output, I would put these schools a bit lower than their QS or THE rankings.

I disagree as it relates to UCL, Edinburgh and Kings. There is a reason every major world ranking that takes into account research ranks them that highly (even the American biased USNWR rankings say so)…….You cant discount research and quality of research and just say “well…I think it is more like T50”. There is a reason research at these places are done at the top level…..Better universities bring better funding and more qualified professors, in turn they produce more research, which in turn brings in more funding, which in turn bring in better students, which in turn ……... It is a cycle that has been going on forever….you can discount an amazing research output of a school that has produced 20 Nobel Prize Winners and say “nah…I dont agree….it is all irrelevant…….they are at the same level of VT or FSU”. Cmon…