“My friends warned me not to marry a white woman”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m white, H is Latino. We’ve struggled a LOT with the division of domestic labor and everything defaulting to me. We’ve tried Fair Play a few times without much success, but decided to give it another shot.

We went out for a coffee date a couple weekends ago to talk and divide up the cards. I tried to keep everything light-hearted and fun, and to have open conversations like the book says to. H kept getting more and more visibly irritated with the whole thing, and in the middle of dividing up the cards loudly said in the coffee shop: “my friends warned me not to marry a white woman because they don’t clean!”

I shrugged it off and didn’t respond because there were literally tables within 2-3 feet of us that I’m sure heard it. I brought it up later and he did apologize. But the more I sit with it, the more it really bothers me. His mom has talked about how he should be with a woman who stays home and does all the domestic work (which is a moot point, because H can’t afford it on his salary alone). And sometimes H makes offhand comments about white people (like a got into a certain hobby, and his response was “that’s such a white person thing to do”).

Am I making a big deal out of nothing? Or should I be concerned over this?

Don't use the word "Latino" for starters. It's offensive. Him using "white" is also indicative of issues. "Like should marry like" is an old saying that rings true. People of different backgrounds or cultures rarely mix well.

Race, income, culture, etc. differences tend to cause issues in a relationship.
What did you mean by "like the books says to"? You have a manual or something? People could use a marriage manual these days.
As far as staying at home and doing the domestic work, try it. Just do actual work though and not fill your time watching Oprah or obsessing about silly things.

You obviously are not Latino. The bolded is the writing of a progressive white person. Stop speaking over everyone.

How racist of you to call me white, not white, or any color. Look in the mirror before you speak that racist nonsense again.

So, you admit you're NOT Latino. Stop acting like you're offended for another race.

[Anonymous]

OP, this is pretty malignant. And I would almost be willing to live with it until the kids are 18 just to continue to reason it out just to be a good influence on kids, because if you divorce, god knows what mumbo jumbo his family will say to them without you to moderate/correct. I am sorry.

Side note: Is he also one of those latino Trumpers who love the machismo of a 'big strong successful man' even though he isn't strong or successful? Run.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, this is pretty malignant. And I would almost be willing to live with it until the kids are 18 just to continue to reason it out just to be a good influence on kids, because if you divorce, god knows what mumbo jumbo his family will say to them without you to moderate/correct. I am sorry.

Side note: Is he also one of those latino Trumpers who love the machismo of a 'big strong successful man' even though he isn't strong or successful? Run.

OP. No, he’s not any of those. Very liberal and very feminist when we met. Definitely not the “big strong successful man” type, he’s more the man bun/soy latte type.

That’s why this is so weird to me. I could chalk up his not helping at home to ADHD and the fact that he’s not a planner, but now it’s starting to feel like he’s frustrated we don’t follow more traditional gender roles.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m white, H is Latino. We’ve struggled a LOT with the division of domestic labor and everything defaulting to me. We’ve tried Fair Play a few times without much success, but decided to give it another shot.

We went out for a coffee date a couple weekends ago to talk and divide up the cards. I tried to keep everything light-hearted and fun, and to have open conversations like the book says to. H kept getting more and more visibly irritated with the whole thing, and in the middle of dividing up the cards loudly said in the coffee shop: “my friends warned me not to marry a white woman because they don’t clean!”

I shrugged it off and didn’t respond because there were literally tables within 2-3 feet of us that I’m sure heard it. I brought it up later and he did apologize. But the more I sit with it, the more it really bothers me. His mom has talked about how he should be with a woman who stays home and does all the domestic work (which is a moot point, because H can’t afford it on his salary alone). And sometimes H makes offhand comments about white people (like a got into a certain hobby, and his response was “that’s such a white person thing to do”).

Am I making a big deal out of nothing? Or should I be concerned over this?

plenty of Latinos are white. Latino is not a race.

[Anonymous]

How much does he earn and how much do you earn?

Do you have a nanny? I can’t believe you don’t have housecleaners. This seems like an easy fix. If he doesn’t step up, just hire them.

[Anonymous]

What that comment meant is he thinks cleaning should not have to be his job. He thinks it’s your responsibility.

Sounds like you already know you have a problem.

He’s lazy. And entitled.

[Anonymous]

He’s a sexist a-hole. Plenty of them in every culture. Should have called him Out on that in the cafe immediately. He knows he can get away with it. Plenty of Latina women would kick his ass. He’s just playing the card he thinks will hurt you/stun you the most. You need to stop accommodating this man child and make it clear it’s not cute or sexy. Tell him to go live with his mom if he wants to be babied.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lot of poorer people are fine staying poor and are uninterested in living an American modern lifestyle. It sounds like the family and he don't like a wife who works. A lot of military people are the same way. The mom is triangulating the relationship and it will just continue to get worse. I would either stay home and live on one salary and clean or find another guy and let this one go. You will always be at odds and it will be worse with kids. I don't even understand why there needs to be a division of labor issue without kids. How hard is it to take care of two adults? Does he have ambition and a plan to gain monetary status and provide or does he envision a much simpler life in an apartment? What do you want? It's already 2 against one and this mother will continually feed him that there is a better woman out there. She probably wants him home with her and doesn't care if he marries or not.

+1 how is there so much to already negotiate about?

[Anonymous]

I am wondering about the sudden shift and whether he has had a cultural "awakening" or something like that where now he is questioning the marriage as a result of his "new found" awareness of colonialism and oppression.

It sounds like when you met him he was a good match and liberal/feminist as you said but now he's become far left/"woke" etc.

Did something change in his social circle, media consumption, etc? Maybe he just needs to work through some anger or complicated feelings about race/ethnicity--however, he should be honest about that with you and if there's anger there he needs to not take it out on you specifically. From this lens, he's displacing anger about oppression onto you. In which case, it's not really about how much you should be cleaning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of poorer people are fine staying poor and are uninterested in living an American modern lifestyle. It sounds like the family and he don't like a wife who works. A lot of military people are the same way. The mom is triangulating the relationship and it will just continue to get worse. I would either stay home and live on one salary and clean or find another guy and let this one go. You will always be at odds and it will be worse with kids. I don't even understand why there needs to be a division of labor issue without kids. How hard is it to take care of two adults? Does he have ambition and a plan to gain monetary status and provide or does he envision a much simpler life in an apartment? What do you want? It's already 2 against one and this mother will continually feed him that there is a better woman out there. She probably wants him home with her and doesn't care if he marries or not.

+1 how is there so much to already negotiate about?

Dp. There are always communal chores when people live together. It’s not sufficient to simply clean up after yourself which op’s spouse may not even be doing based on his mom’s reaction. Cleaning the bathroom at least once a week with bleach, vacuuming, dusting. If you aren’t doing this someone (cleaners likely) should be. Op don’t have kids with this man child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am wondering about the sudden shift and whether he has had a cultural "awakening" or something like that where now he is questioning the marriage as a result of his "new found" awareness of colonialism and oppression.

It sounds like when you met him he was a good match and liberal/feminist as you said but now he's become far left/"woke" etc.

Did something change in his social circle, media consumption, etc? Maybe he just needs to work through some anger or complicated feelings about race/ethnicity--however, he should be honest about that with you and if there's anger there he needs to not take it out on you specifically. From this lens, he's displacing anger about oppression onto you. In which case, it's not really about how much you should be cleaning.

OP. He’s been reading more books about it lately. He also hit 45 and had sort of a midlife “oh my god this is it” awakening.

There’s been some other weird shifts in behavior and he’s gotten mad at me for the weirdest things. We were talking about celebrity controversies and I mentioned I could see a controversy one day coming out about Adam Sandler, and H flipped out and yelled “you live in a fantasy land and it’s so frustrating”. He’s not an Adam Sandler fan and I thought it was a light hearted talk about celebrities but he got angry for no real reason.

[Anonymous]

WTF, why would she quit her job and become economically dependent on this jerk. Don't do that, op.

Hire a cleaning person.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well if you get divorced, you will also have to do all the cooking and cleaning. Yes, it will be slightly less without a manchild around, but it's still a lot. And there are probably things your husband takes care of -- manly things -- that he takes care of for you, that you would then have to do yourself if you got divorced.

Huh? Why are you assuming she would have full custody? Most divorces are fifty fifty.

Get divorced and go fifty fifty. Let him cook and clean for him and the kids all by himself fifty percent of the time.

Though realistically the labor would probably be shifted to his mom or sister. Would serve them right!

[Anonymous]

I'm Hispanic, my wife is white. Both of us have T10 grad degrees and both of us easily earn well into 6 figures. Everything was fine and dandy until 2016 and race was never an issue. But for the past 8 years, we (and our families) have been on eggshells on issues of race. Thank you Trump for turning the country into the Balkans.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I mean, if you were dating we'd advise you to break up - right?

How is your relationship overall?

Yes, this sounds concerning! Also trollish.

Relationship overall has issues. I’ve posted before, often in the ADHD or domestic labor threads. Example, he took the cleaning card but has yet to clean. Doesn’t like having any expectations placed on him.

Is there anything but inertia keeping you in this relationship?

Main thing is kids. If we didn’t have them, I’d bail.

You will not change him. Either go with the flow and then make changes together or divorce. Your kids will benefit from you being home. Just choose a cheaper place to live that you can live on one salary. If he still is a jerk and eventually cheats at least your kids will have more money. If you are smart, you will still get a job later in life. Maybe take some classes to keep current.

If he wanted you to stay home because of religious reasons or because he worked overseas how would you live your life? Maybe just pretend that there is a better reason for you to stay home than him just wanting a stay at home mom. Many make a wonderful like this way. They are fit, they are close to their kids, and have lots of friends. Set aside a set amount of money for the kids each month for their needs and activities. If he wants more money he can earn it.

Why should SHE be the one to compromise for the good of the family?

His views are archaic, and he should not be rewarded for misogyny.

Because it's not worth living in misery with two people against you and turning your kids against you. Why wasn't this discussed before marriage? She can't have it all anyway. Why not stay home and have it fail monetarily while actually taking care of the kids and building memories and then actually have them be on board with going back to work later?

Because she likes to work and why in the WORLD would she give up her means of support when she's married to a guy it sounds like she may be divorcing. I don't think OP is going to be better off if she becomes more dependent on a husband she doesn't seem to like or trust. Also she doesn't want to stay home.

Agreed. You stay at work but stop paying for everything as if you stay home and get the cleaning person. Problem solved