90th percentile

[Anonymous]

My DS had an A- unweighted average without really studying (mix of gen ed, honors and AP) and got about 90 or 91% of the questions correct on the SAT and ACT without doing any prep, which seemed consistent with his A- school performance. No idea what his percentiles were, but he got a 1490 and a 34.

No way was this kid headed to a competitive school - he is not academic at all and really only likes music. The score doesn't tell you that much about the student.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DS had an A- unweighted average without really studying (mix of gen ed, honors and AP) and got about 90 or 91% of the questions correct on the SAT and ACT without doing any prep, which seemed consistent with his A- school performance. No idea what his percentiles were, but he got a 1490 and a 34.

No way was this kid headed to a competitive school - he is not academic at all and really only likes music. The score doesn't tell you that much about the student.

The scores tell you that the kid is capable of doing the work at a competitive school.

That he does not want to attend a competitive school tells you that he is the victim of poor parenting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here--many say, "oh kid got 1350 but has all As in tough classes so it must be grade inflation" "they couldn't keep up in a top college", I am questioning that myth

Because it's not 1990. The SAT has become easier and easier as it has evolved. A 1350 back then was closer to 98th percentile because the test was actually more rigorous and tested something called scholastic aptitude. Then it was about "assessment." Huh?? Now the College Board has renamed the test to literally stand for the letters "S A T" I guess because you sit for the test.

Also a 1350 on the new digital adaptive test means the student did not make it into the harder sections, right?

No that’s not what it means.

[Anonymous]

I don’t understand OP’s logic. There aren’t enough “top schools” to admit 10% of the entire college bound population. And also, it’s not really true that a typical 90tb percentile kid could do well at the very top schools. I want to emphasize the word “typical” in my last sentence, because tests aren’t perfect and there are always unusual exceptions. But for the most part a 90th percentile kid probably wouldn’t do well at the most rigorous schools. Even a 99th percentile kid can struggle to keep up with the 99.99th percentile kids at MIT or Caltech.

But I would agree that a 90th percentile kid could do very well at most colleges, as long as you’re not talking about the top 25-50 colleges in the entire country. There are many, many, decent colleges in the US. It’s a huge field! Not everyone can be Ivy bound.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DS had an A- unweighted average without really studying (mix of gen ed, honors and AP) and got about 90 or 91% of the questions correct on the SAT and ACT without doing any prep, which seemed consistent with his A- school performance. No idea what his percentiles were, but he got a 1490 and a 34.

No way was this kid headed to a competitive school - he is not academic at all and really only likes music. The score doesn't tell you that much about the student.

Maybe just an unambitious kid? Late bloomer?

Those stats are great with no prep.

[Anonymous]

For those of you who think 90th percentile is a good benchmark for top schools, like the Ivy League or Stanford or MIT, where do you draw the line? The parents of 85th percentile kids probably think the difference between 90th and 85th percentile is meaningless. And the parents of 80th percentile kids, 75th percentile kids etc would also feel differently. Is it just that you don’t believe tests reveal anything?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand OP’s logic. There aren’t enough “top schools” to admit 10% of the entire college bound population. And also, it’s not really true that a typical 90tb percentile kid could do well at the very top schools. I want to emphasize the word “typical” in my last sentence, because tests aren’t perfect and there are always unusual exceptions. But for the most part a 90th percentile kid probably wouldn’t do well at the most rigorous schools. Even a 99th percentile kid can struggle to keep up with the 99.99th percentile kids at MIT or Caltech.

But I would agree that a 90th percentile kid could do very well at most colleges, as long as you’re not talking about the top 25-50 colleges in the entire country. There are many, many, decent colleges in the US. It’s a huge field! Not everyone can be Ivy bound.

The second part is just silly. They don't need to "keep up with" Harvard's valedictorian to do well there. You seem to think these schools SAT ranges cover all students there. They don't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here--many say, "oh kid got 1350 but has all As in tough classes so it must be grade inflation" "they couldn't keep up in a top college", I am questioning that myth

Because it's not 1990. The SAT has become easier and easier as it has evolved. A 1350 back then was closer to 98th percentile because the test was actually more rigorous and tested something called scholastic aptitude. Then it was about "assessment." Huh?? Now the College Board has renamed the test to literally stand for the letters "S A T" I guess because you sit for the test.

Also a 1350 on the new digital adaptive test means the student did not make it into the harder sections, right?

No that’s not what it means.

Pretty close.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand OP’s logic. There aren’t enough “top schools” to admit 10% of the entire college bound population. And also, it’s not really true that a typical 90tb percentile kid could do well at the very top schools. I want to emphasize the word “typical” in my last sentence, because tests aren’t perfect and there are always unusual exceptions. But for the most part a 90th percentile kid probably wouldn’t do well at the most rigorous schools. Even a 99th percentile kid can struggle to keep up with the 99.99th percentile kids at MIT or Caltech.

But I would agree that a 90th percentile kid could do very well at most colleges, as long as you’re not talking about the top 25-50 colleges in the entire country. There are many, many, decent colleges in the US. It’s a huge field! Not everyone can be Ivy bound.

The second part is just silly. They don't need to "keep up with" Harvard's valedictorian to do well there. You seem to think these schools SAT ranges cover all students there. They don't.

Ok so where do you want to draw the line for who is smart enough? For the most part these elite colleges do make exceptions but in general they aim to admit the most brightest or most talented. So I’m not sure what you are suggesting. Should all elite schools not have the right to consider the highest test scores or the most capable of students? Should Juilliard admit anyone who can play a reasonable Mozart sonata even if they’re not really one of the best players out there?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand OP’s logic. There aren’t enough “top schools” to admit 10% of the entire college bound population. And also, it’s not really true that a typical 90tb percentile kid could do well at the very top schools. I want to emphasize the word “typical” in my last sentence, because tests aren’t perfect and there are always unusual exceptions. But for the most part a 90th percentile kid probably wouldn’t do well at the most rigorous schools. Even a 99th percentile kid can struggle to keep up with the 99.99th percentile kids at MIT or Caltech.

But I would agree that a 90th percentile kid could do very well at most colleges, as long as you’re not talking about the top 25-50 colleges in the entire country. There are many, many, decent colleges in the US. It’s a huge field! Not everyone can be Ivy bound.

The second part is just silly. They don't need to "keep up with" Harvard's valedictorian to do well there. You seem to think these schools SAT ranges cover all students there. They don't.

+1
There are plenty of kids with lower scores at each Ivy. Also, there are significant variations between majors. 90%ilers should not go to math or computer science. But they can do well (i.e. be above average, or even top quarter) at many departments.

[Anonymous]

Raygun was “good enough” to qualify for the Olympics… but I’m still not sure that was a good idea. Just saying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why is a 90th percentile SAT score not good enough for all As? An A is 90 percent or better, and additionally if only 90th percentile and above kids get As then really there is no grade inflation. None of this makes sense.

You are confusing two different metrics.

90%
When you get a A (using a 90% cutoff) it means you received 90% (or more) of the points that the teacher allowed to be earned during the semester.

90th percentile
When you score at the 90th percentile on the SAT, it means that off all the people who took the SAT, your score was better than 90% of the people who took the SAT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Raygun was “good enough” to qualify for the Olympics… but I’m still not sure that was a good idea. Just saying.

I would say, for her, it probably was a good idea, overall.

So, yeah, if Harvard calls your 90th percentile kid, let them go there. "Doing well" is very subjective anyways. Many supersmart kids get crushed when they are #2. Meanwhile someone less brilliant could be happy with their lower GPA and better in using connections provided by the brand name school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For those of you who think 90th percentile is a good benchmark for top schools, like the Ivy League or Stanford or MIT, where do you draw the line? The parents of 85th percentile kids probably think the difference between 90th and 85th percentile is meaningless. And the parents of 80th percentile kids, 75th percentile kids etc would also feel differently. Is it just that you don’t believe tests reveal anything?

Just to clarify,
NO ONE on here except OP has tried to say 90th%ile is a benchmark for top schools. It is far below the 25th%ile, even pre test optional. The average student at ivy/plus is 99th %ile. So 99th%ile is the benchmark, 98th as the lowest reasonable bar that is reasonable as a possible acceptance AND a decent chance of getting near average in most majors. 90th%ile is well below average at UVa, William and Mary. It is however a reasonable benchmark for many schools in the top 50-100.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here--many say, "oh kid got 1350 but has all As in tough classes so it must be grade inflation" "they couldn't keep up in a top college", I am questioning that myth

Because it's not 1990. The SAT has become easier and easier as it has evolved. A 1350 back then was closer to 98th percentile because the test was actually more rigorous and tested something called scholastic aptitude. Then it was about "assessment." Huh?? Now the College Board has renamed the test to literally stand for the letters "S A T" I guess because you sit for the test.

Also a 1350 on the new digital adaptive test means the student did not make it into the harder sections, right?

No that’s not what it means.

Pretty close.

No. The score couldn’t be higher than 1260.