Rant about Deal and their religious field trip

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I’ll tell you this much, OP: all this does is teach your kid to hate. Not good.

OP here. Honest question. Why does it teach my kids to hate?

Your unwillingness even to tolerate a dress code so that your kid can learn about a mosque strictly as an academic subject sends a message of intolerance, inflexibility, and hate.

Her kid can learn about the academic subject in class. I hope you stretched before that massive reach you just made.

Not a massive reach. She’s basically saying she refuses to let her kid enter a mosque. It’s hate, pure and simple.

OP here. Nah, I don't hate muslims, catholics, jews, buddhists, mormons, scientologists, or any other person following any religion. And I wouldn't dare visiting a temple of any denomination and not follow their rules. That's why I have no interest in visiting any religious site. What I don't like is a public school "forcing" religious rules on my kids. And if you don't think the school is forcing them, I'd argue that the school is in a position of power. You might argue they might opt out but kids that age usually want to do whatever the other kids their age do.

NP. OP, it does appear to me that you’re acting out of intolerance and, frankly, selfishness. This world needs more love, more understanding, and more support for other cultures and belief systems. Requesting that your child follow the norms of another culture is part of showing respect for that culture. The school isn’t “forcing them.” As you already stated, you can opt out. This seems like an unusual fight to pick. Instead of arguing that the school is somehow using its power to abuse you, what if you reframe your thinking to seeing this as an opportunity for education and an opportunity to show respect to another culture?

How is tolerating the subjugation of girls and women an acceptable form of “respect”? If anything, as a child I would learn to hate religion and be intolerant of such ignorance and misogyny. But evidently it’s completely cool to DCUM that the girls will be forced to cover up and exhibit their virtue while the boys are not required.

As a man, when I visit a synagogue as a visitor or tourist, I manage to cover my head without ever being subjugated or hating Judaism. When I visit a mosque as a visitor or tourist, I wear loose fitting clothing and long pants and sleeves without being subjugated or hating Islam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ll tell you this much, OP: all this does is teach your kid to hate. Not good.

OP here. Honest question. Why does it teach my kids to hate?

Your unwillingness even to tolerate a dress code so that your kid can learn about a mosque strictly as an academic subject sends a message of intolerance, inflexibility, and hate.

Her kid can learn about the academic subject in class. I hope you stretched before that massive reach you just made.

Not a massive reach. She’s basically saying she refuses to let her kid enter a mosque. It’s hate, pure and simple.

OP here. Nah, I don't hate muslims, catholics, jews, buddhists, mormons, scientologists, or any other person following any religion. And I wouldn't dare visiting a temple of any denomination and not follow their rules. That's why I have no interest in visiting any religious site. What I don't like is a public school "forcing" religious rules on my kids. And if you don't think the school is forcing them, I'd argue that the school is in a position of power. You might argue they might opt out but kids that age usually want to do whatever the other kids their age do.

NP. OP, it does appear to me that you’re acting out of intolerance and, frankly, selfishness. This world needs more love, more understanding, and more support for other cultures and belief systems. Requesting that your child follow the norms of another culture is part of showing respect for that culture. The school isn’t “forcing them.” As you already stated, you can opt out. This seems like an unusual fight to pick. Instead of arguing that the school is somehow using its power to abuse you, what if you reframe your thinking to seeing this as an opportunity for education and an opportunity to show respect to another culture?

How is tolerating the subjugation of girls and women an acceptable form of “respect”? If anything, as a child I would learn to hate religion and be intolerant of such ignorance and misogyny. But evidently it’s completely cool to DCUM that the girls will be forced to cover up and exhibit their virtue while the boys are not required.

As a man, when I visit a synagogue as a visitor or tourist, I manage to cover my head without ever being subjugated or hating Judaism. When I visit a mosque as a visitor or tourist, I wear loose fitting clothing and long pants and sleeves without being subjugated or hating Islam.

You are choosing to visit a synagogue or a mosque as a visitor or a tourist. You manage to cover your head or wear loose fitting clothing "without being subjugated" because it's a CHOICE. It's not a requirement, forced on you by a public school system, with the only option being to miss out on a field trip.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ll tell you this much, OP: all this does is teach your kid to hate. Not good.

OP here. Honest question. Why does it teach my kids to hate?

Your unwillingness even to tolerate a dress code so that your kid can learn about a mosque strictly as an academic subject sends a message of intolerance, inflexibility, and hate.

Her kid can learn about the academic subject in class. I hope you stretched before that massive reach you just made.

Not a massive reach. She’s basically saying she refuses to let her kid enter a mosque. It’s hate, pure and simple.

OP here. Nah, I don't hate muslims, catholics, jews, buddhists, mormons, scientologists, or any other person following any religion. And I wouldn't dare visiting a temple of any denomination and not follow their rules. That's why I have no interest in visiting any religious site. What I don't like is a public school "forcing" religious rules on my kids. And if you don't think the school is forcing them, I'd argue that the school is in a position of power. You might argue they might opt out but kids that age usually want to do whatever the other kids their age do.

NP. OP, it does appear to me that you’re acting out of intolerance and, frankly, selfishness. This world needs more love, more understanding, and more support for other cultures and belief systems. Requesting that your child follow the norms of another culture is part of showing respect for that culture. The school isn’t “forcing them.” As you already stated, you can opt out. This seems like an unusual fight to pick. Instead of arguing that the school is somehow using its power to abuse you, what if you reframe your thinking to seeing this as an opportunity for education and an opportunity to show respect to another culture?

How is tolerating the subjugation of girls and women an acceptable form of “respect”? If anything, as a child I would learn to hate religion and be intolerant of such ignorance and misogyny. But evidently it’s completely cool to DCUM that the girls will be forced to cover up and exhibit their virtue while the boys are not required.

As a man, when I visit a synagogue as a visitor or tourist, I manage to cover my head without ever being subjugated or hating Judaism. When I visit a mosque as a visitor or tourist, I wear loose fitting clothing and long pants and sleeves without being subjugated or hating Islam.

There is a difference between choosing to go as a tourist and going as part of a school sponsored trip. If the dress code is different for boys and girls and distributed in writing, OP should complain to the principal and DCPS and state that their child will both attend and adhere to the dress code for boys and that you will be happy to file a civil rights complaint if the school has a problem with it.

[Anonymous]

you are what is wrong with the world. Just because you decide YOU are athirst doesn't mean others need to comply with your beliefs seeing you don't respect others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ll tell you this much, OP: all this does is teach your kid to hate. Not good.

OP here. Honest question. Why does it teach my kids to hate?

Your unwillingness even to tolerate a dress code so that your kid can learn about a mosque strictly as an academic subject sends a message of intolerance, inflexibility, and hate.

Her kid can learn about the academic subject in class. I hope you stretched before that massive reach you just made.

Not a massive reach. She’s basically saying she refuses to let her kid enter a mosque. It’s hate, pure and simple.

OP here. Nah, I don't hate muslims, catholics, jews, buddhists, mormons, scientologists, or any other person following any religion. And I wouldn't dare visiting a temple of any denomination and not follow their rules. That's why I have no interest in visiting any religious site. What I don't like is a public school "forcing" religious rules on my kids. And if you don't think the school is forcing them, I'd argue that the school is in a position of power. You might argue they might opt out but kids that age usually want to do whatever the other kids their age do.

NP. OP, it does appear to me that you’re acting out of intolerance and, frankly, selfishness. This world needs more love, more understanding, and more support for other cultures and belief systems. Requesting that your child follow the norms of another culture is part of showing respect for that culture. The school isn’t “forcing them.” As you already stated, you can opt out. This seems like an unusual fight to pick. Instead of arguing that the school is somehow using its power to abuse you, what if you reframe your thinking to seeing this as an opportunity for education and an opportunity to show respect to another culture?

How is tolerating the subjugation of girls and women an acceptable form of “respect”? If anything, as a child I would learn to hate religion and be intolerant of such ignorance and misogyny. But evidently it’s completely cool to DCUM that the girls will be forced to cover up and exhibit their virtue while the boys are not required.

What you consider “subjugation of women” may be some woman’s CHOICE. Who are you to tell them they are wrong? It’s a head covering. People of many faiths, men AND women, wear them. I choose to dress modestly because it’s important to ME, not just because my faith tells me to be modest. Would you care to now tell me I’m subjugating myself because I hold this value, one that is different than yours? That’s not very tolerant or respectful of you.

The OP is also denying her child (and herself) the opportunity to get to know somebody different, or to see the world through different eyes. That’s to choose ignorance.

[Anonymous]

Traditionally, I believe both men and women cover their heads in a mosque (and also in a synagogue, unless it's Reform).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have thought about this a while, and I do agree with OP that this is BS. A religious institution can do whatever it wants. I have no problem with people who choose to practice Islam, and find it to be far less objectionable than Christianity.

But a school should not be doing a field trip to a religious institution that requires girls to conform to BS gender discrimination practiced by that religion. That's wrong.

I don't see how ignorance is to her advantage. All the other children will be having an educational experience and will leave the trip more informed while the kids that skip it are deprived.

Even if the education they receive includes information about how religions treat men and women differently...that is important to understand even if you reject those teachings. Ignorance is never advantageous.

[Anonymous]

It’s very obvious to me why Deal has chosen a church, a mosque and a synagogue. Christianity is the largest religion in the USA, and hatred and bigotry towards Jews and Muslim is the most prevalent form of religious hatred and bigotry in the US. It makes all the sense in the world for the schools to educate students on all three, because education is the cure for bigotry.

I would be stunned if the teachers weren’t making any effort to explain in advance of the visits to the girls in the class why they would need to wear head coverings. If, after hearing that, a girl still wishes to go on the field trip, then great. If not, then she can tell her parents she wants to opt out. I can guarantee you that my head strong 10 year old would let me know her preference and I would accommodate it. But it would be her decision, not mine.

No one is trying to indoctrinate OP’s kid. The aim is to educate and stimulate discussion.

[Anonymous]

My Muslim mother refuses to cover her head. She also doesn’t go to mosque, although she does fast for Ramadan like a Christmas and Easter Christian. I hope the school doesn’t teach Islam as though it’s a singular religion

[Anonymous]

What a stupid hill to die on, OP. You are really depriving your kids of a wonderful experience.

[Anonymous]

What a wonderful field trip! I am thrilled to hear the school is exposing kids to world religions, both because it is important to world history (for better and worse) and because it can only help to increase tolerance and respect as they grow up.

If the school were asking you to do something against your family's values, then I would understand you not allowing your daughter to participate. But is covering your head really against your family's values? Does your kid never wear a hat?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ll tell you this much, OP: all this does is teach your kid to hate. Not good.

OP here. Honest question. Why does it teach my kids to hate?

Your unwillingness even to tolerate a dress code so that your kid can learn about a mosque strictly as an academic subject sends a message of intolerance, inflexibility, and hate.

Her kid can learn about the academic subject in class. I hope you stretched before that massive reach you just made.

Not a massive reach. She’s basically saying she refuses to let her kid enter a mosque. It’s hate, pure and simple.

OP here. Nah, I don't hate muslims, catholics, jews, buddhists, mormons, scientologists, or any other person following any religion. And I wouldn't dare visiting a temple of any denomination and not follow their rules. That's why I have no interest in visiting any religious site. What I don't like is a public school "forcing" religious rules on my kids. And if you don't think the school is forcing them, I'd argue that the school is in a position of power. You might argue they might opt out but kids that age usually want to do whatever the other kids their age do.

NP. OP, it does appear to me that you’re acting out of intolerance and, frankly, selfishness. This world needs more love, more understanding, and more support for other cultures and belief systems. Requesting that your child follow the norms of another culture is part of showing respect for that culture. The school isn’t “forcing them.” As you already stated, you can opt out. This seems like an unusual fight to pick. Instead of arguing that the school is somehow using its power to abuse you, what if you reframe your thinking to seeing this as an opportunity for education and an opportunity to show respect to another culture?

How is tolerating the subjugation of girls and women an acceptable form of “respect”? If anything, as a child I would learn to hate religion and be intolerant of such ignorance and misogyny. But evidently it’s completely cool to DCUM that the girls will be forced to cover up and exhibit their virtue while the boys are not required.

As a man, when I visit a synagogue as a visitor or tourist, I manage to cover my head without ever being subjugated or hating Judaism. When I visit a mosque as a visitor or tourist, I wear loose fitting clothing and long pants and sleeves without being subjugated or hating Islam.

There is a difference between choosing to go as a tourist and going as part of a school sponsored trip. If the dress code is different for boys and girls and distributed in writing, OP should complain to the principal and DCPS and state that their child will both attend and adhere to the dress code for boys and that you will be happy to file a civil rights complaint if the school has a problem with it.

You sound like book banner. Don't stick your head in the sand and pretend there are no viewpoints in the world that don't comply with your views.

Islam, Christianity, Judaism and mamy other religions exist in the world whether you have knowledge of them or not. Don't be ignorant. Bring educated does not mean you agree with every viewpoint or artwork or religion or author, etc. That you study.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What a wonderful field trip! I am thrilled to hear the school is exposing kids to world religions, both because it is important to world history (for better and worse) and because it can only help to increase tolerance and respect as they grow up.

If the school were asking you to do something against your family's values, then I would understand you not allowing your daughter to participate. But is covering your head really against your family's values? Does your kid never wear a hat?

My Muslim mother refuses to cover her head because of her experience with gender-based violence. Understanding what hair and coverings can mean to some people is also a part of tolerance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a wonderful field trip! I am thrilled to hear the school is exposing kids to world religions, both because it is important to world history (for better and worse) and because it can only help to increase tolerance and respect as they grow up.

If the school were asking you to do something against your family's values, then I would understand you not allowing your daughter to participate. But is covering your head really against your family's values? Does your kid never wear a hat?

My Muslim mother refuses to cover her head because of her experience with gender-based violence. Understanding what hair and coverings can mean to some people is also a part of tolerance.

Of course. But if she were a student, learning about a new religion, would it not be important to at least visit a place of worship of that religion as part of her education?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ll tell you this much, OP: all this does is teach your kid to hate. Not good.

OP here. Honest question. Why does it teach my kids to hate?

Your unwillingness even to tolerate a dress code so that your kid can learn about a mosque strictly as an academic subject sends a message of intolerance, inflexibility, and hate.

Her kid can learn about the academic subject in class. I hope you stretched before that massive reach you just made.

Not a massive reach. She’s basically saying she refuses to let her kid enter a mosque. It’s hate, pure and simple.

OP here. Nah, I don't hate muslims, catholics, jews, buddhists, mormons, scientologists, or any other person following any religion. And I wouldn't dare visiting a temple of any denomination and not follow their rules. That's why I have no interest in visiting any religious site. What I don't like is a public school "forcing" religious rules on my kids. And if you don't think the school is forcing them, I'd argue that the school is in a position of power. You might argue they might opt out but kids that age usually want to do whatever the other kids their age do.

NP. OP, it does appear to me that you’re acting out of intolerance and, frankly, selfishness. This world needs more love, more understanding, and more support for other cultures and belief systems. Requesting that your child follow the norms of another culture is part of showing respect for that culture. The school isn’t “forcing them.” As you already stated, you can opt out. This seems like an unusual fight to pick. Instead of arguing that the school is somehow using its power to abuse you, what if you reframe your thinking to seeing this as an opportunity for education and an opportunity to show respect to another culture?

How is tolerating the subjugation of girls and women an acceptable form of “respect”? If anything, as a child I would learn to hate religion and be intolerant of such ignorance and misogyny. But evidently it’s completely cool to DCUM that the girls will be forced to cover up and exhibit their virtue while the boys are not required.

As a man, when I visit a synagogue as a visitor or tourist, I manage to cover my head without ever being subjugated or hating Judaism. When I visit a mosque as a visitor or tourist, I wear loose fitting clothing and long pants and sleeves without being subjugated or hating Islam.

There is a difference between choosing to go as a tourist and going as part of a school sponsored trip. If the dress code is different for boys and girls and distributed in writing, OP should complain to the principal and DCPS and state that their child will both attend and adhere to the dress code for boys and that you will be happy to file a civil rights complaint if the school has a problem with it.

You sound like book banner. Don't stick your head in the sand and pretend there are no viewpoints in the world that don't comply with your views.

Islam, Christianity, Judaism and mamy other religions exist in the world whether you have knowledge of them or not. Don't be ignorant. Bring educated does not mean you agree with every viewpoint or artwork or religion or author, etc. That you study.

Public schools don't get to apply discriminatory dress codes or requirements. If the school feels head coverings are necessary for girls, they can either mandate them for boys too or find another field trip.