I support giving permanent status for DACA recipients only if...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:''Why on earth does the GOP have a hard-on for a Wall?''

That's why

''57.9% of Illegals Caught at U.S.-Mexico Border in FY17 Not Mexican; From 111 Other Countries''

''A significant majority—57.9 percent—came from 111 other countries.

In fact, during fiscal year 2017, the Border Patrol apprehended deportable aliens along the U.S.-Mexico border who came from 84 countries that are not in the Americas.''

https://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/terence-p-jeffrey/579-illegals-caught-southwest-border-fy17-not-mexicans

Where these people are from and with what intentions are they crossing the border?

Got a legitimate source for this?

You didn't follow the news a couple years back when more people were coming from central america than mexico?

http://www.latimes.com/world/mexico-americas/la-fg-mexico-us-security-20171026-story.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) They have no prior criminal convictions

2) They are either pursuing education or has a job and not relying on public assistance

3) Chain immigration is ended for everyone except those bringing over minor dependents.

What about you? Do you support giving permanent status and under what conditions?

That is all already built in. Glad you're on board

OP here...I believe 1 and 2 are but not 3.

“Chain migration” is such a bullshit, GOP made-up concept — yet another way scare white people afraid of the brownification of America.

This BS term is their spin on family sponsorship, which is ALREADY incredibly expensive, protracted and arduous. You can’t just tell the government you want your family here, and then they say GREAT! and it’s done. The process takes years (exact length depends on country of origin and family relation), requires all the usual background checks, etc — and then the petitioner has to be able to demonstrate financial ability to sponsor the family member in case s/he cannot work.

Immigrant families with loved ones back home often send money back home in order to protect and support these family members over the years.

So: either stop the efforts to say we’re a country of family values, and support keeping families together; OR admit we don’t give a shit about brown families and drop the outrage over immigrants sending money back home. But either way, don’t play this BS game where the GOP is worried about this phenomenon that already doesn’t exist. I don’t know of any multimillionaire DACA recipents able to petition for all of their cousins.

OP here...this isn't true. I know for a fact because I have family who sponsored their parents who are elderly. They come here and obtain their green cards and are able to apply for public assistance. They are on medicaid, and live in assisted living, go to government sponsored adult daycares all at the taxpayers expense. This is also happening all over my Potomac neighborhood. The adult children sponsor their parents who had already transferred all their own savings to the adult kids so on paper they are poor. They can then apply for medicaid (sometimes with a wait) and go to adult daycare centers, get taxi allowances, etc. All those buses you see with Asian characters that say adult daycare are running around getting these folks. BTW, just because on paper it says the adult children are promising financial support for their parents when they applied, it is never enforced. This is the same for siblings only for siblings, it is a longer wait. My parents sponsored a sibling over and it was a 10 year wait. However, once the siblings are here, they can apply for green card and a few years later apply for public assistance (as long as they are elderly). I am totally against this and believe our taxes should be helping those that truly need help, not those hiding their own savings so they can benefit from taxpayers money.

[Anonymous]

Chinese are abusing the immigration system

Among other things, I showed that most of the seniors receiving aid actually had well-off sons and daughters, and were living with them. During that time, a typical scenario in Silicon Valley, for instance, was that of husband and wife both from Taiwan, both making good money as engineers, and living in an expensive house — and with the down payment for that house coming in part from SSI money from the old folk. The latter would also serve as babysitters for the grandkids, and when the grandkids got older, the seniors would move into government-subsidized senior housing. The seniors would enjoy yearly trips back home to Taiwan — people on welfare enjoying international vacations, while some American black people on welfare had never even seen the ocean. Again, all of this was legal (with one possibly questionable aspect), and indeed promoted by the federal government.

talk to people that actually have to deal with immigrants, not the educated elite in Bethesda with jewish guilt.

https://normsaysno.wordpress.com/2017/04/28/immigration-and-welfare-use/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) They have no prior criminal convictions

2) They are either pursuing education or has a job and not relying on public assistance

3) Chain immigration is ended for everyone except those bringing over minor dependents.

What about you? Do you support giving permanent status and under what conditions?

That is all already built in. Glad you're on board

OP here...I believe 1 and 2 are but not 3.

“Chain migration” is such a bullshit, GOP made-up concept — yet another way scare white people afraid of the brownification of America.

This BS term is their spin on family sponsorship, which is ALREADY incredibly expensive, protracted and arduous. You can’t just tell the government you want your family here, and then they say GREAT! and it’s done. The process takes years (exact length depends on country of origin and family relation), requires all the usual background checks, etc — and then the petitioner has to be able to demonstrate financial ability to sponsor the family member in case s/he cannot work.

Immigrant families with loved ones back home often send money back home in order to protect and support these family members over the years.

So: either stop the efforts to say we’re a country of family values, and support keeping families together; OR admit we don’t give a shit about brown families and drop the outrage over immigrants sending money back home. But either way, don’t play this BS game where the GOP is worried about this phenomenon that already doesn’t exist. I don’t know of any multimillionaire DACA recipents able to petition for all of their cousins.

OP here...this isn't true. I know for a fact because I have family who sponsored their parents who are elderly. They come here and obtain their green cards and are able to apply for public assistance. They are on medicaid, and live in assisted living, go to government sponsored adult daycares all at the taxpayers expense. This is also happening all over my Potomac neighborhood. The adult children sponsor their parents who had already transferred all their own savings to the adult kids so on paper they are poor. They can then apply for medicaid (sometimes with a wait) and go to adult daycare centers, get taxi allowances, etc. All those buses you see with Asian characters that say adult daycare are running around getting these folks. BTW, just because on paper it says the adult children are promising financial support for their parents when they applied, it is never enforced. This is the same for siblings only for siblings, it is a longer wait. My parents sponsored a sibling over and it was a 10 year wait. However, once the siblings are here, they can apply for green card and a few years later apply for public assistance (as long as they are elderly). I am totally against this and believe our taxes should be helping those that truly need help, not those hiding their own savings so they can benefit from taxpayers money.

Yes, this is happening, and it is patently unfair. Elderly foreigners are getting free medical care, paid for by American taxpayers, that middle-income American taxpayers cannot afford for themselves. The entire system is upside down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) They have no prior criminal convictions

2) They are either pursuing education or has a job and not relying on public assistance

3) Chain immigration is ended for everyone except those bringing over minor dependents.

What about you? Do you support giving permanent status and under what conditions?

That is all already built in. Glad you're on board

OP here...I believe 1 and 2 are but not 3.

“Chain migration” is such a bullshit, GOP made-up concept — yet another way scare white people afraid of the brownification of America.

This BS term is their spin on family sponsorship, which is ALREADY incredibly expensive, protracted and arduous. You can’t just tell the government you want your family here, and then they say GREAT! and it’s done. The process takes years (exact length depends on country of origin and family relation), requires all the usual background checks, etc — and then the petitioner has to be able to demonstrate financial ability to sponsor the family member in case s/he cannot work.

Immigrant families with loved ones back home often send money back home in order to protect and support these family members over the years.

So: either stop the efforts to say we’re a country of family values, and support keeping families together; OR admit we don’t give a shit about brown families and drop the outrage over immigrants sending money back home. But either way, don’t play this BS game where the GOP is worried about this phenomenon that already doesn’t exist. I don’t know of any multimillionaire DACA recipents able to petition for all of their cousins.

OP here...this isn't true. I know for a fact because I have family who sponsored their parents who are elderly. They come here and obtain their green cards and are able to apply for public assistance. They are on medicaid, and live in assisted living, go to government sponsored adult daycares all at the taxpayers expense. This is also happening all over my Potomac neighborhood. The adult children sponsor their parents who had already transferred all their own savings to the adult kids so on paper they are poor. They can then apply for medicaid (sometimes with a wait) and go to adult daycare centers, get taxi allowances, etc. All those buses you see with Asian characters that say adult daycare are running around getting these folks. BTW, just because on paper it says the adult children are promising financial support for their parents when they applied, it is never enforced. This is the same for siblings only for siblings, it is a longer wait. My parents sponsored a sibling over and it was a 10 year wait. However, once the siblings are here, they can apply for green card and a few years later apply for public assistance (as long as they are elderly). I am totally against this and believe our taxes should be helping those that truly need help, not those hiding their own savings so they can benefit from taxpayers money.

Similar situation in Australia: https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/jun/28/plan-to-restrict-pension-for-older-migrants-unprecedented-in-australia

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) They have no prior criminal convictions

2) They are either pursuing education or has a job and not relying on public assistance

3) Chain immigration is ended for everyone except those bringing over minor dependents.

What about you? Do you support giving permanent status and under what conditions?

Yes. And make them pay a fee that is used to improve border security.

Would this be part of the $495 fee they already pay or an additional fee?

Even if it's an additional fee, that's still far less compared to what they would have had to pay to become a citizen legally without the program.

Love it, keep moving the goalposts.

OP said there were three conditions. Those are already in place or in the bill. So now lets add more stuff. As it is, the DACA folks are accretive to our society from a cost standpoint.

What goalposts? I'm not OP. I didn't say I only had 3 conditions. Different people have different opinions on what should be done. That's not moving the goalpost.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

2) They are either pursuing education or has a job and not relying on public assistance

I work in post-secondary education and this is easily gamed. Most of them churn free esol, elementary remedial, and "training" courses and can claim to be "college students" (even if they lack a high school diploma) for 6 7 8 years. So many daca don't work, aren't really in college, they're just running out the clock for amnesty while collecting benefits.

Yes I left my IA job because of this very reason I had to see in the school. Parents were to poor to pay lunch for their children but they can buy nice clothes, gaming system and new iPhone .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Chinese are abusing the immigration system

Among other things, I showed that most of the seniors receiving aid actually had well-off sons and daughters, and were living with them. During that time, a typical scenario in Silicon Valley, for instance, was that of husband and wife both from Taiwan, both making good money as engineers, and living in an expensive house — and with the down payment for that house coming in part from SSI money from the old folk. The latter would also serve as babysitters for the grandkids, and when the grandkids got older, the seniors would move into government-subsidized senior housing. The seniors would enjoy yearly trips back home to Taiwan — people on welfare enjoying international vacations, while some American black people on welfare had never even seen the ocean. Again, all of this was legal (with one possibly questionable aspect), and indeed promoted by the federal government.

talk to people that actually have to deal with immigrants, not the educated elite in Bethesda with jewish guilt.

https://normsaysno.wordpress.com/2017/04/28/immigration-and-welfare-use/

I know few families who are sucking tax payers $$$ by putting elderly parents on walfare .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) They have no prior criminal convictions

2) They are either pursuing education or has a job and not relying on public assistance

3) Chain immigration is ended for everyone except those bringing over minor dependents.

What about you? Do you support giving permanent status and under what conditions?

That is all already built in. Glad you're on board

OP here...I believe 1 and 2 are but not 3.

“Chain migration” is such a bullshit, GOP made-up concept — yet another way scare white people afraid of the brownification of America.

This BS term is their spin on family sponsorship, which is ALREADY incredibly expensive, protracted and arduous. You can’t just tell the government you want your family here, and then they say GREAT! and it’s done. The process takes years (exact length depends on country of origin and family relation), requires all the usual background checks, etc — and then the petitioner has to be able to demonstrate financial ability to sponsor the family member in case s/he cannot work.

Immigrant families with loved ones back home often send money back home in order to protect and support these family members over the years.

So: either stop the efforts to say we’re a country of family values, and support keeping families together; OR admit we don’t give a shit about brown families and drop the outrage over immigrants sending money back home. But either way, don’t play this BS game where the GOP is worried about this phenomenon that already doesn’t exist. I don’t know of any multimillionaire DACA recipents able to petition for all of their cousins.

OP here...this isn't true. I know for a fact because I have family who sponsored their parents who are elderly. They come here and obtain their green cards and are able to apply for public assistance. They are on medicaid, and live in assisted living, go to government sponsored adult daycares all at the taxpayers expense. This is also happening all over my Potomac neighborhood. The adult children sponsor their parents who had already transferred all their own savings to the adult kids so on paper they are poor. They can then apply for medicaid (sometimes with a wait) and go to adult daycare centers, get taxi allowances, etc. All those buses you see with Asian characters that say adult daycare are running around getting these folks. BTW, just because on paper it says the adult children are promising financial support for their parents when they applied, it is never enforced. This is the same for siblings only for siblings, it is a longer wait. My parents sponsored a sibling over and it was a 10 year wait. However, once the siblings are here, they can apply for green card and a few years later apply for public assistance (as long as they are elderly). I am totally against this and believe our taxes should be helping those that truly need help, not those hiding their own savings so they can benefit from taxpayers money.

I'm an immigrant too and I agree what you are saying . I have seen it plenty of free-loaders. American immigration system is broken and whatever the laws we have it is not enforced ,most of them. Most Americans are sleeping and don't care to know.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) They have no prior criminal convictions

2) They are either pursuing education or has a job and not relying on public assistance

3) Chain immigration is ended for everyone except those bringing over minor dependents.

What about you? Do you support giving permanent status and under what conditions?

That is all already built in. Glad you're on board

OP here...I believe 1 and 2 are but not 3.

“Chain migration” is such a bullshit, GOP made-up concept — yet another way scare white people afraid of the brownification of America.

This BS term is their spin on family sponsorship, which is ALREADY incredibly expensive, protracted and arduous. You can’t just tell the government you want your family here, and then they say GREAT! and it’s done. The process takes years (exact length depends on country of origin and family relation), requires all the usual background checks, etc — and then the petitioner has to be able to demonstrate financial ability to sponsor the family member in case s/he cannot work.

Immigrant families with loved ones back home often send money back home in order to protect and support these family members over the years.

So: either stop the efforts to say we’re a country of family values, and support keeping families together; OR admit we don’t give a shit about brown families and drop the outrage over immigrants sending money back home. But either way, don’t play this BS game where the GOP is worried about this phenomenon that already doesn’t exist. I don’t know of any multimillionaire DACA recipents able to petition for all of their cousins.

OP here...this isn't true. I know for a fact because I have family who sponsored their parents who are elderly. They come here and obtain their green cards and are able to apply for public assistance. They are on medicaid, and live in assisted living, go to government sponsored adult daycares all at the taxpayers expense. This is also happening all over my Potomac neighborhood. The adult children sponsor their parents who had already transferred all their own savings to the adult kids so on paper they are poor. They can then apply for medicaid (sometimes with a wait) and go to adult daycare centers, get taxi allowances, etc. All those buses you see with Asian characters that say adult daycare are running around getting these folks. BTW, just because on paper it says the adult children are promising financial support for their parents when they applied, it is never enforced. This is the same for siblings only for siblings, it is a longer wait. My parents sponsored a sibling over and it was a 10 year wait. However, once the siblings are here, they can apply for green card and a few years later apply for public assistance (as long as they are elderly). I am totally against this and believe our taxes should be helping those that truly need help, not those hiding their own savings so they can benefit from taxpayers money.

yes but PP read an article in vox so she is an expert on immigration

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) They have no prior criminal convictions

2) They are either pursuing education or has a job and not relying on public assistance

3) Chain immigration is ended for everyone except those bringing over minor dependents.

What about you? Do you support giving permanent status and under what conditions?

That is all already built in. Glad you're on board

OP here...I believe 1 and 2 are but not 3.

“Chain migration” is such a bullshit, GOP made-up concept — yet another way scare white people afraid of the brownification of America.

This BS term is their spin on family sponsorship, which is ALREADY incredibly expensive, protracted and arduous. You can’t just tell the government you want your family here, and then they say GREAT! and it’s done. The process takes years (exact length depends on country of origin and family relation), requires all the usual background checks, etc — and then the petitioner has to be able to demonstrate financial ability to sponsor the family member in case s/he cannot work.

Immigrant families with loved ones back home often send money back home in order to protect and support these family members over the years.

So: either stop the efforts to say we’re a country of family values, and support keeping families together; OR admit we don’t give a shit about brown families and drop the outrage over immigrants sending money back home. But either way, don’t play this BS game where the GOP is worried about this phenomenon that already doesn’t exist. I don’t know of any multimillionaire DACA recipents able to petition for all of their cousins.

OP here...this isn't true. I know for a fact because I have family who sponsored their parents who are elderly. They come here and obtain their green cards and are able to apply for public assistance. They are on medicaid, and live in assisted living, go to government sponsored adult daycares all at the taxpayers expense. This is also happening all over my Potomac neighborhood. The adult children sponsor their parents who had already transferred all their own savings to the adult kids so on paper they are poor. They can then apply for medicaid (sometimes with a wait) and go to adult daycare centers, get taxi allowances, etc. All those buses you see with Asian characters that say adult daycare are running around getting these folks. BTW, just because on paper it says the adult children are promising financial support for their parents when they applied, it is never enforced. This is the same for siblings only for siblings, it is a longer wait. My parents sponsored a sibling over and it was a 10 year wait. However, once the siblings are here, they can apply for green card and a few years later apply for public assistance (as long as they are elderly). I am totally against this and believe our taxes should be helping those that truly need help, not those hiding their own savings so they can benefit from taxpayers money.

I'm an immigrant too and I agree what you are saying . I have seen it plenty of free-loaders. American immigration system is broken and whatever the laws we have it is not enforced ,most of them. Most Americans are sleeping and don't care to know.

i am an immigrant as well and never got anything for free nor brought any family. however my nanny who was also an immigrant brought a bunch of relatives (adult children who brought spouses etc) and I was amazed at all the free godina she was somehow getting. that women knew everything and where to get it. she was very savvy while I, a phd, had no idea of the possibilities. you really need ground-level knowledge to understand how immigration actually works.

[Anonymous]

1. Pay a fine for breaking the law.
2. Admit guilt., and apologize.
3. submit to background check.
4. take a class in civics.
5. pay another fine for paperwork.
6. say please!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) They have no prior criminal convictions

2) They are either pursuing education or has a job and not relying on public assistance

3) Chain immigration is ended for everyone except those bringing over minor dependents.

What about you? Do you support giving permanent status and under what conditions?

That is all already built in. Glad you're on board

OP here...I believe 1 and 2 are but not 3.

“Chain migration” is such a bullshit, GOP made-up concept — yet another way scare white people afraid of the brownification of America.

This BS term is their spin on family sponsorship, which is ALREADY incredibly expensive, protracted and arduous. You can’t just tell the government you want your family here, and then they say GREAT! and it’s done. The process takes years (exact length depends on country of origin and family relation), requires all the usual background checks, etc — and then the petitioner has to be able to demonstrate financial ability to sponsor the family member in case s/he cannot work.

Immigrant families with loved ones back home often send money back home in order to protect and support these family members over the years.

So: either stop the efforts to say we’re a country of family values, and support keeping families together; OR admit we don’t give a shit about brown families and drop the outrage over immigrants sending money back home. But either way, don’t play this BS game where the GOP is worried about this phenomenon that already doesn’t exist. I don’t know of any multimillionaire DACA recipents able to petition for all of their cousins.

OP here...this isn't true. I know for a fact because I have family who sponsored their parents who are elderly. They come here and obtain their green cards and are able to apply for public assistance. They are on medicaid, and live in assisted living, go to government sponsored adult daycares all at the taxpayers expense. This is also happening all over my Potomac neighborhood. The adult children sponsor their parents who had already transferred all their own savings to the adult kids so on paper they are poor. They can then apply for medicaid (sometimes with a wait) and go to adult daycare centers, get taxi allowances, etc. All those buses you see with Asian characters that say adult daycare are running around getting these folks. BTW, just because on paper it says the adult children are promising financial support for their parents when they applied, it is never enforced. This is the same for siblings only for siblings, it is a longer wait. My parents sponsored a sibling over and it was a 10 year wait. However, once the siblings are here, they can apply for green card and a few years later apply for public assistance (as long as they are elderly). I am totally against this and believe our taxes should be helping those that truly need help, not those hiding their own savings so they can benefit from taxpayers money.

I'm an immigrant too and I agree what you are saying . I have seen it plenty of free-loaders. American immigration system is broken and whatever the laws we have it is not enforced ,most of them. Most Americans are sleeping and don't care to know.

i am an immigrant as well and never got anything for free nor brought any family. however my nanny who was also an immigrant brought a bunch of relatives (adult children who brought spouses etc) and I was amazed at all the free godina she was somehow getting. that women knew everything and where to get it. she was very savvy while I, a phd, had no idea of the possibilities. you really need ground-level knowledge to understand how immigration actually works.

Immigrants cannot bring married adult children. Only citizens can and the wait is long, so forgive me if I doubt the veracity of this claim. -someone with extensive ground-level knowledge of immigration.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1) They have no prior criminal convictions

2) They are either pursuing education or has a job and not relying on public assistance

3) Chain immigration is ended for everyone except those bringing over minor dependents.

What about you? Do you support giving permanent status and under what conditions?

That is all already built in. Glad you're on board

OP here...I believe 1 and 2 are but not 3.

“Chain migration” is such a bullshit, GOP made-up concept — yet another way scare white people afraid of the brownification of America.

This BS term is their spin on family sponsorship, which is ALREADY incredibly expensive, protracted and arduous. You can’t just tell the government you want your family here, and then they say GREAT! and it’s done. The process takes years (exact length depends on country of origin and family relation), requires all the usual background checks, etc — and then the petitioner has to be able to demonstrate financial ability to sponsor the family member in case s/he cannot work.

Immigrant families with loved ones back home often send money back home in order to protect and support these family members over the years.

So: either stop the efforts to say we’re a country of family values, and support keeping families together; OR admit we don’t give a shit about brown families and drop the outrage over immigrants sending money back home. But either way, don’t play this BS game where the GOP is worried about this phenomenon that already doesn’t exist. I don’t know of any multimillionaire DACA recipents able to petition for all of their cousins.

OP here...this isn't true. I know for a fact because I have family who sponsored their parents who are elderly. They come here and obtain their green cards and are able to apply for public assistance. They are on medicaid, and live in assisted living, go to government sponsored adult daycares all at the taxpayers expense. This is also happening all over my Potomac neighborhood. The adult children sponsor their parents who had already transferred all their own savings to the adult kids so on paper they are poor. They can then apply for medicaid (sometimes with a wait) and go to adult daycare centers, get taxi allowances, etc. All those buses you see with Asian characters that say adult daycare are running around getting these folks. BTW, just because on paper it says the adult children are promising financial support for their parents when they applied, it is never enforced. This is the same for siblings only for siblings, it is a longer wait. My parents sponsored a sibling over and it was a 10 year wait. However, once the siblings are here, they can apply for green card and a few years later apply for public assistance (as long as they are elderly). I am totally against this and believe our taxes should be helping those that truly need help, not those hiding their own savings so they can benefit from taxpayers money.

yes but PP read an article in vox so she is an expert on immigration

No, it’s because I actually worked on immigration policy.

Straw man. Your “anecdotes” are likely not accurate, but even if they are, are far from a reflection of reality of family sponsorship. It takes years, decades to bring a relative here, and tens of thousands of dollars. The process for sponsorship is as exactly as I described it. Even the word “chain” implies there’s link after link, when the reality is that most families aren’t ever able to sponsor a relative, let alone two.

But since we’re evidently going to based this debate on anecdotes via an anonymous bulletin board, here’s one: when I was a kid, my mother attempted to sponsor her sister, and finally gave up hope on the idea by the time I was in college.

[Anonymous]

If we're going to be intellectually honest about this debate, we should remember that "they should go back to their home country" or "I want them gone" or "get them out" = Deportation Force with Elian Gonzalez style raids and apprehensions and transportation costs back to wherever. We should factor in the full cost of a Deportation Force against the public resources being used by DACA kids. Is it worth the cost?