Coffee in Lincoln Park with David Catania

[Anonymous]

Actually lack of rigor isn't the main problem in Ward 6 middle schools. It is small numbers of academically well-prepared students being sprinkled in with large numbers of students needing remediation to get up to grade level at three different middle schools and no articulated plan to address that issue, let alone acknowledgement that it is an issue.

Parents of mid/high achieving students will go anywhere they can band together with a number of other mid/high achieving students, of any an all race and SES backgrounds. This is seen again and again with the OOB lottery, charter schools, people moving out of the city.

It is a primary, basic, observable and predictable phenomenon that DCPS should try to use to their advantage in jump starting ward 6 middle schools, and therefore Eastern HS, rather than ignoring it and deriding it. It's a shifting of feeder patterns, a re-branding of schools.

If we were able to cluster ( pun intended, this was the point of the original Capitol Hill Cluster School )our high-performing students in one place it would energize the whole middle school sector and give the elementary schools that are still working to improve the primary education they offer time for their efforts to bear fruit. Then we could have a true educational success story in Ward 6.

Right now, that isn't going to happen unless your time frame is a decade or more when demographic changes may just do it for you.

[Anonymous]

Yes, exactly, well said. My own family is reluctantly facing the music this summer for little kids. We get it now: we will probaby not have access to a DC public MS where our children will learn alongside a critical mass of well-prepared peers, even a decade from now.

Too many listened politely to Catania yesterday without trying to pin him down on a time-frame (10-15 years?) for proposed improvements that would create an Alice-Deal-for-All scenario.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, exactly, well said. My own family is reluctantly facing the music this summer for little kids. We get it now: we will probaby not have access to a DC public MS where our children will learn alongside a critical mass of well-prepared peers, even a decade from now.

Too many listened politely to Catania yesterday without trying to pin him down on a time-frame (10-15 years?) for proposed improvements that would create an Alice-Deal-for-All scenario.

What do you want him - or any candidate for that matter - to say to this? "Yes, ma'am, I will fight to make this a city for the well-off. I promise, the rest of the city will look like Tenleytown if I can help it; none of that struggling riffraff?" (Or was that not what you meant by "alongside a critical mass of well-prepared peers"?) By the way, if it's that part of town you're looking for, why not move there?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, exactly, well said. My own family is reluctantly facing the music this summer for little kids. We get it now: we will probaby not have access to a DC public MS where our children will learn alongside a critical mass of well-prepared peers, even a decade from now.

Too many listened politely to Catania yesterday without trying to pin him down on a time-frame (10-15 years?) for proposed improvements that would create an Alice-Deal-for-All scenario.

What do you want him - or any candidate for that matter - to say to this? "Yes, ma'am, I will fight to make this a city for the well-off. I promise, the rest of the city will look like Tenleytown if I can help it; none of that struggling riffraff?" (Or was that not what you meant by "alongside a critical mass of well-prepared peers"?) By the way, if it's that part of town you're looking for, why not move there?

Sounds like a solid plan

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thank God that was your take away. I don't think the Hill schools need a "bold reinvention". What I want in a mayor is much broader than that.

+1
I have kids in elementary and middle school in Capitol Hill and am starting to resent people with kids barely out of diapers - who I bet you have never set foot in any of the Hill's middle or high schools - telling me that my children need to be subjected to "bold action" so you can feel better about living around here for a few years (and then pack up and leave anyway).
Besides, declarations about "bold reinvention" and "scrap it all" are so devoid of any historic insight. Eastern was closed - I mean closed, closed - and reopened in a completely new facility, under completely new leadership, teachers, (test-in) IB diploma track and all - doesn't get much bolder than that. Certainly as bold as George Bush had in mind when adopting NCLB. It's doing very well btw, diploma track included. Could use your support for sure, but certainly doesn't need any more "bold actions". And maybe, just maybe, take a few hours off and tour our middle schools. I mean tour, actually go speak to students, teachers, and parents. Go there asking questions rather than bringing all the answers with no insight. Let them explain to you how they handle advanced students (honors tracks, academies and all included, whether they call it that or not), if that's what you're hoping your child may be. And, darn it, that's not asking "how white are you?" or "how rich are you?".

[Anonymous]

Fair enough, pp. But why doesn't DCPS talk about these issues and explain outright how they handle advanced students in populations where the majority are struggling to meet proficiency? Why is it all hush hush? They leave parents to flail around and listen to rumors and ask stupid questions rather than attack the obvious issue head on. AND NO when parents ask how will this particular school address these issues it is not the same as asking "how white and rich are you ?". That is somebody else's hang up.

We are so steeped in rancor and suspicion and judgement that no one can even have an open conversation. That's the problem.

Cut the people some slack and explain in a civil manner that we don't need bold action because x,y and z already exist rather than lambasting them from some high horse. You are making things worse

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, exactly, well said. My own family is reluctantly facing the music this summer for little kids. We get it now: we will probaby not have access to a DC public MS where our children will learn alongside a critical mass of well-prepared peers, even a decade from now.

Too many listened politely to Catania yesterday without trying to pin him down on a time-frame (10-15 years?) for proposed improvements that would create an Alice-Deal-for-All scenario.

What do you want him - or any candidate for that matter - to say to this? "Yes, ma'am, I will fight to make this a city for the well-off. I promise, the rest of the city will look like Tenleytown if I can help it; none of that struggling riffraff?" (Or was that not what you meant by "alongside a critical mass of well-prepared peers"?) By the way, if it's that part of town you're looking for, why not move there?

Nobody is asking for Tenleytown or referring to kids as riffraff ( except you ) That is your imagination. People are asking reasonable questions about the huge achievement gap in a city that doesn't handle education that well. That's perfectly reasonable to ask how that can be managed

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, exactly, well said. My own family is reluctantly facing the music this summer for little kids. We get it now: we will probaby not have access to a DC public MS where our children will learn alongside a critical mass of well-prepared peers, even a decade from now.

Too many listened politely to Catania yesterday without trying to pin him down on a time-frame (10-15 years?) for proposed improvements that would create an Alice-Deal-for-All scenario.

the 'Alice-Deal for all' idiocy was Bowser's line, not Catania's. In fact, Deal would be a mixed bag for Ward 6 given its shear size and greater critical mass of affluent families than could be achieved in Ward 6 (any meaningful catchment big enough to rival Deal on size at least). Deal CAN'T be simply replicated anywhere else in DC. It's complete fools good to buy into this argument. There are many other options to improve MS offereings, but if you're hanging on for Deal you'll be waiting a lot longer than 15 years.

[Anonymous]

That's precisely what is being done if you care to skim through actual information, websites, emails, tweets, data and all. Or you can hear it from officials in a few one-liners and then everyone sneer how they don't know what they're doing. No, the obvious explanation for why so many prefer the rumor mill and playground klatsch is that it's so much easier than the to actually inform yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Fair enough, pp. But why doesn't DCPS talk about these issues and explain outright how they handle advanced students in populations where the majority are struggling to meet proficiency? Why is it all hush hush? They leave parents to flail around and listen to rumors and ask stupid questions rather than attack the obvious issue head on. AND NO when parents ask how will this particular school address these issues it is not the same as asking "how white and rich are you ?". That is somebody else's hang up.

We are so steeped in rancor and suspicion and judgement that no one can even have an open conversation. That's the problem.

Cut the people some slack and explain in a civil manner that we don't need bold action because x,y and z already exist rather than lambasting them from some high horse. You are making things worse

I'm not the PP, but I can certainly understand why she was frustrated and possibly less than civil. I too noticed, during the DME proposal comment time period, an awful lot of parents of kids only just starting PS3 who had a lot of opinions about what was and was not acceptable for middle and high school. My child is a couple years older, but it still rankled that there were so many parents saying "Do something to improve the upper grades of every non-Ward 3 non-Brent/Maury elementary school, every middle and high school but Deal and Wilson, or we will go to a charter/private/Maryland!" There were certainly people who engaged in the debate with honesty, while also clearly having their own neighborhood biases, but I also saw an awful lot of people with no actual, direct experience within the school system who had very strong opinions about how unacceptable the middle school they're zoned for is for their about-to-turn-3-year-old.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:That's precisely what is being done if you care to skim through actual information, websites, emails, tweets, data and all. Or you can hear it from officials in a few one-liners and then everyone sneer how they don't know what they're doing. No, the obvious explanation for why so many prefer the rumor mill and playground klatsch is that it's so much easier than the to actually inform yourself.

I have skimmed the social media and see little more than pithy energizers and DC CAS rallies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thank God that was your take away. I don't think the Hill schools need a "bold reinvention". What I want in a mayor is much broader than that.

+1
I have kids in elementary and middle school in Capitol Hill and am starting to resent people with kids barely out of diapers - who I bet you have never set foot in any of the Hill's middle or high schools - telling me that my children need to be subjected to "bold action" so you can feel better about living around here for a few years (and then pack up and leave anyway).
Besides, declarations about "bold reinvention" and "scrap it all" are so devoid of any historic insight. Eastern was closed - I mean closed, closed - and reopened in a completely new facility, under completely new leadership, teachers, (test-in) IB diploma track and all - doesn't get much bolder than that. Certainly as bold as George Bush had in mind when adopting NCLB. It's doing very well btw, diploma track included. Could use your support for sure, but certainly doesn't need any more "bold actions". And maybe, just maybe, take a few hours off and tour our middle schools. I mean tour, actually go speak to students, teachers, and parents. Go there asking questions rather than bringing all the answers with no insight. Let them explain to you how they handle advanced students (honors tracks, academies and all included, whether they call it that or not), if that's what you're hoping your child may be. And, darn it, that's not asking "how white are you?" or "how rich are you?".

How can you be certain that a young family has in fact never set foot in any of the Hill's public middle or high schools? What if we told you that we've volunteered in these very schools, and that what we've observed has convinced us not to send our little children unless test-in programs are instituted?

Bold action where Hill schoolare are concerned is code for AAP/GT and test-in. I've taught IB curriculum classes in schools in New York. If a single Eastern student earns the 28 IB points needed to clear the full diploma hurdle (the whole point of having an IB program) in the next decade, I'll be surprised. Meanwhile, up in MoCo in the test-in IB program at Richard Montgomery HS, more than 90% of enrolled IB students earn the full diploma, with the average pass rate in the high 30s (45 points maximum). A good many of the RM IB students are neither white nor rich.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fair enough, pp. But why doesn't DCPS talk about these issues and explain outright how they handle advanced students in populations where the majority are struggling to meet proficiency? Why is it all hush hush? They leave parents to flail around and listen to rumors and ask stupid questions rather than attack the obvious issue head on. AND NO when parents ask how will this particular school address these issues it is not the same as asking "how white and rich are you ?". That is somebody else's hang up.

We are so steeped in rancor and suspicion and judgement that no one can even have an open conversation. That's the problem.

Cut the people some slack and explain in a civil manner that we don't need bold action because x,y and z already exist rather than lambasting them from some high horse. You are making things worse

I'm not the PP, but I can certainly understand why she was frustrated and possibly less than civil. I too noticed, during the DME proposal comment time period, an awful lot of parents of kids only just starting PS3 who had a lot of opinions about what was and was not acceptable for middle and high school. My child is a couple years older, but it still rankled that there were so many parents saying "Do something to improve the upper grades of every non-Ward 3 non-Brent/Maury elementary school, every middle and high school but Deal and Wilson, or we will go to a charter/private/Maryland!" There were certainly people who engaged in the debate with honesty, while also clearly having their own neighborhood biases, but I also saw an awful lot of people with no actual, direct experience within the school system who had very strong opinions about how unacceptable the middle school they're zoned for is for their about-to-turn-3-year-old.

And what do you think those parents of 3-year olds are basing their ideas on? Yes, families with slightly older kids whom they respect who see no path past 5th grade in Ward 6. Make a path for those people ( I.e. Speak openly and frankly about handling an achievement gap at middle school age, have a plan, facilitate students who do well academically to gather in one place ) and you will see their smiling happy faces and a sea change in the parents of 3-years olds perceptions of middle school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fair enough, pp. But why doesn't DCPS talk about these issues and explain outright how they handle advanced students in populations where the majority are struggling to meet proficiency? Why is it all hush hush? They leave parents to flail around and listen to rumors and ask stupid questions rather than attack the obvious issue head on. AND NO when parents ask how will this particular school address these issues it is not the same as asking "how white and rich are you ?". That is somebody else's hang up.

We are so steeped in rancor and suspicion and judgement that no one can even have an open conversation. That's the problem.

Cut the people some slack and explain in a civil manner that we don't need bold action because x,y and z already exist rather than lambasting them from some high horse. You are making things worse

I'm not the PP, but I can certainly understand why she was frustrated and possibly less than civil. I too noticed, during the DME proposal comment time period, an awful lot of parents of kids only just starting PS3 who had a lot of opinions about what was and was not acceptable for middle and high school. My child is a couple years older, but it still rankled that there were so many parents saying "Do something to improve the upper grades of every non-Ward 3 non-Brent/Maury elementary school, every middle and high school but Deal and Wilson, or we will go to a charter/private/Maryland!" There were certainly people who engaged in the debate with honesty, while also clearly having their own neighborhood biases, but I also saw an awful lot of people with no actual, direct experience within the school system who had very strong opinions about how unacceptable the middle school they're zoned for is for their about-to-turn-3-year-old.

Why shouldnt parents of young kids being weighing on middle school? based on feeder rights etc, where our kid goes to PS can make a HUGE different 10 years later. Im ok sending my kid to out IB school for preschool (Bruce Monroe) but the fact is there is no viable middle school or high school option on the table. The mythical reopening of McFarland? So while I would be happy to raise tons of money, head up a PTA (that doesn't even exist), I know I am going to play the lottery starting PS3 just to see if we can get lucky enough for either a charter with a middle school or an elem with better feeder options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, exactly, well said. My own family is reluctantly facing the music this summer for little kids. We get it now: we will probaby not have access to a DC public MS where our children will learn alongside a critical mass of well-prepared peers, even a decade from now.

Too many listened politely to Catania yesterday without trying to pin him down on a time-frame (10-15 years?) for proposed improvements that would create an Alice-Deal-for-All scenario.

What do you want him - or any candidate for that matter - to say to this? "Yes, ma'am, I will fight to make this a city for the well-off. I promise, the rest of the city will look like Tenleytown if I can help it; none of that struggling riffraff?" (Or was that not what you meant by "alongside a critical mass of well-prepared peers"?) By the way, if it's that part of town you're looking for, why not move there?

How about I'll fight to create schools Hill families of various stripes don't flee in droves? How about, we'll make a practice of asking you, parent, taxpayer and voter, exactly what it would take to convince you to keep your kids in Hill schools past 4th grade, and doing our damndest to provide it? That might work. We will almost certainly move to NW or the burbs soon enough, thanks.