Social Class: How do you know what social class do you belong to?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read “Class” by Paul Fussell (or by Jilly Cooper for the UK equivalent). It’s now very dated, but the principles still hold up. It is a combination of money and social mindset, but honestly more social expectations than actual dollars. I can tell that I have jumped up a class as a result of actions taken over several generations - my extended family and I at this point are no longer in the same group, but it was a result more of education and environment than one family getting “richer”. I have no idea which branch of the family earns more. But I went to the Ivy League, work around the highest level of government, have very different expectations of my children in terms of expectations for them like advanced degrees vs trade school, value completely different forms of activity, entertainment (think the opera vs NASCAR), and so forth.

But don’t you agree that the real solution is for us to finally solve the stubborn problem of income inequality?

All work isn't equally valuable.

You are completely wrong about that, stupid MAGA.

That's how these low-class strivers elevate themselves (though only in their own minds). They can't exist unless they're putting everyone else down.

I am not sure you see the irony here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read “Class” by Paul Fussell (or by Jilly Cooper for the UK equivalent). It’s now very dated, but the principles still hold up. It is a combination of money and social mindset, but honestly more social expectations than actual dollars. I can tell that I have jumped up a class as a result of actions taken over several generations - my extended family and I at this point are no longer in the same group, but it was a result more of education and environment than one family getting “richer”. I have no idea which branch of the family earns more. But I went to the Ivy League, work around the highest level of government, have very different expectations of my children in terms of expectations for them like advanced degrees vs trade school, value completely different forms of activity, entertainment (think the opera vs NASCAR), and so forth.

But don’t you agree that the real solution is for us to finally solve the stubborn problem of income inequality?

All work isn't equally valuable.

You are completely wrong about that, stupid MAGA.

That's how these low-class strivers elevate themselves (though only in their own minds). They can't exist unless they're putting everyone else down.

I am not sure you see the irony here.

+1000

And middle. That is the answer OP (and everyone else). Literally everyone on this thread is a member of the MIDDLE CLASS. And it is hilarious how many of you don’t like it. Desperately striving to go from MC to UMC … still middle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read “Class” by Paul Fussell (or by Jilly Cooper for the UK equivalent). It’s now very dated, but the principles still hold up. It is a combination of money and social mindset, but honestly more social expectations than actual dollars. I can tell that I have jumped up a class as a result of actions taken over several generations - my extended family and I at this point are no longer in the same group, but it was a result more of education and environment than one family getting “richer”. I have no idea which branch of the family earns more. But I went to the Ivy League, work around the highest level of government, have very different expectations of my children in terms of expectations for them like advanced degrees vs trade school, value completely different forms of activity, entertainment (think the opera vs NASCAR), and so forth.

But don’t you agree that the real solution is for us to finally solve the stubborn problem of income inequality?

All work isn't equally valuable.

You are completely wrong about that, stupid MAGA.

That's how these low-class strivers elevate themselves (though only in their own minds). They can't exist unless they're putting everyone else down.

I am not sure you see the irony here.

Pointing out that someone is completely unjustified in putting other people down is not the same as putting people down. So, no?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read “Class” by Paul Fussell (or by Jilly Cooper for the UK equivalent). It’s now very dated, but the principles still hold up. It is a combination of money and social mindset, but honestly more social expectations than actual dollars. I can tell that I have jumped up a class as a result of actions taken over several generations - my extended family and I at this point are no longer in the same group, but it was a result more of education and environment than one family getting “richer”. I have no idea which branch of the family earns more. But I went to the Ivy League, work around the highest level of government, have very different expectations of my children in terms of expectations for them like advanced degrees vs trade school, value completely different forms of activity, entertainment (think the opera vs NASCAR), and so forth.

But don’t you agree that the real solution is for us to finally solve the stubborn problem of income inequality?

All work isn't equally valuable.

You are completely wrong about that, stupid MAGA.

That's how these low-class strivers elevate themselves (though only in their own minds). They can't exist unless they're putting everyone else down.

I am not sure you see the irony here.

+1000

And middle. That is the answer OP (and everyone else). Literally everyone on this thread is a member of the MIDDLE CLASS. And it is hilarious how many of you don’t like it. Desperately striving to go from MC to UMC … still middle.

Meh. Desperate strivers are rare. Most of the PPs don’t care.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read “Class” by Paul Fussell (or by Jilly Cooper for the UK equivalent). It’s now very dated, but the principles still hold up. It is a combination of money and social mindset, but honestly more social expectations than actual dollars. I can tell that I have jumped up a class as a result of actions taken over several generations - my extended family and I at this point are no longer in the same group, but it was a result more of education and environment than one family getting “richer”. I have no idea which branch of the family earns more. But I went to the Ivy League, work around the highest level of government, have very different expectations of my children in terms of expectations for them like advanced degrees vs trade school, value completely different forms of activity, entertainment (think the opera vs NASCAR), and so forth.

But don’t you agree that the real solution is for us to finally solve the stubborn problem of income inequality?

All work isn't equally valuable.

You are completely wrong about that, stupid MAGA.

That's how these low-class strivers elevate themselves (though only in their own minds). They can't exist unless they're putting everyone else down.

I am not sure you see the irony here.

Pointing out that someone is completely unjustified in putting other people down is not the same as putting people down. So, no?

Pretzel logic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read “Class” by Paul Fussell (or by Jilly Cooper for the UK equivalent). It’s now very dated, but the principles still hold up. It is a combination of money and social mindset, but honestly more social expectations than actual dollars. I can tell that I have jumped up a class as a result of actions taken over several generations - my extended family and I at this point are no longer in the same group, but it was a result more of education and environment than one family getting “richer”. I have no idea which branch of the family earns more. But I went to the Ivy League, work around the highest level of government, have very different expectations of my children in terms of expectations for them like advanced degrees vs trade school, value completely different forms of activity, entertainment (think the opera vs NASCAR), and so forth.

But don’t you agree that the real solution is for us to finally solve the stubborn problem of income inequality?

What makes you think that there are no class system in socialists country? You either very stupid or very naive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read “Class” by Paul Fussell (or by Jilly Cooper for the UK equivalent). It’s now very dated, but the principles still hold up. It is a combination of money and social mindset, but honestly more social expectations than actual dollars. I can tell that I have jumped up a class as a result of actions taken over several generations - my extended family and I at this point are no longer in the same group, but it was a result more of education and environment than one family getting “richer”. I have no idea which branch of the family earns more. But I went to the Ivy League, work around the highest level of government, have very different expectations of my children in terms of expectations for them like advanced degrees vs trade school, value completely different forms of activity, entertainment (think the opera vs NASCAR), and so forth.

But don’t you agree that the real solution is for us to finally solve the stubborn problem of income inequality?

All work isn't equally valuable.

Nobody claims all jobs should be paid equally when talking about income inequality. But We are dangerously close to having a gap too wide to sustain a democracy.

The middle class will be the first to destabilize. Anger erupts, conspiracy theories of a rigged system and divides in political parties that are too extreme to hold on to democracy.

The economy slows, debt and predatory lending begins.

Populism and polarization rises along with extreme political rhetoric. Nationalist leaders are elected and they start to dismantle established institutions.

The US is on the list of countries that are in danger of democratic backsliding. We have a national leader who has ended many institutions that helped make our country thrive. The US has withdrawn from the World Health Organization, USAID which helped developing countries, the Dept of Education is weakened at a time when students aren’t doing as well as ten years ago. DEI programs are gone along with dozens of international programs.

This is a good article that explains it.

https://news.cornell.edu/stories/2024/01/democratic-decline-global-phenomenon-even-wealthy-nations

It’s hard to watch this happening.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Using myself as an example. Immigrant that has been in the States for 25 years now. When I was a kid growing up my father was in a profession that was pretty high status. We lived in beautiful homes in posh neighborhoods around the world and attending private school with children of government officials, CEOs, and the global elite.

However my father was self made and did not have any generational wealth. His chosen profession, although prestigious and elevated our family status and lifestyle, was not something like investment banking where you can amass a lot of wealth.

So when he retired...our lifestyle shifted dramatically. So here we are my siblings and I, literally with champagne tastes and beer budget if you will.

2 of them married rich so because of our lifestyle growing up, easily and smoothly integrated into the upper class families of their spouses.

The other two of us are UMC/MC professionals. We are pretty class conscious and class confused.

Wonder if anyone has been through something similar and has any advice.

In America, you have the opportunity to decide what class you are in. If you believe it, you're in it. It's not externally imposed on you like everywhere else. It's why everyone immigrates here.

+1. There are many people in America who have lots of money but no class; while there are many who are very poor but have a lot of class. Class is decided by how you conduct yourself.

No it's not. There is no class system here. You can buy your way in wherever you want. And if you're poor, nobody cares how classy you are.

This right here is what new money with no class has to tell themselves.

I've personally met so many rich people with little to no class and a lot of very well educated poor people with a lot of class.

And yes, people would much rather be around a poor college professor than you.

You may think Lauren Bezos has no class, but she couldn't care less what people she never interacts with thinks about her "class". She doesn't care what people who think they are classy and have high opinions have to say about her.

The feeling is mutual.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Using myself as an example. Immigrant that has been in the States for 25 years now. When I was a kid growing up my father was in a profession that was pretty high status. We lived in beautiful homes in posh neighborhoods around the world and attending private school with children of government officials, CEOs, and the global elite.

However my father was self made and did not have any generational wealth. His chosen profession, although prestigious and elevated our family status and lifestyle, was not something like investment banking where you can amass a lot of wealth.

So when he retired...our lifestyle shifted dramatically. So here we are my siblings and I, literally with champagne tastes and beer budget if you will.

2 of them married rich so because of our lifestyle growing up, easily and smoothly integrated into the upper class families of their spouses.

The other two of us are UMC/MC professionals. We are pretty class conscious and class confused.

Wonder if anyone has been through something similar and has any advice.

In America, you have the opportunity to decide what class you are in. If you believe it, you're in it. It's not externally imposed on you like everywhere else. It's why everyone immigrates here.

+1. There are many people in America who have lots of money but no class; while there are many who are very poor but have a lot of class. Class is decided by how you conduct yourself.

No it's not. There is no class system here. You can buy your way in wherever you want. And if you're poor, nobody cares how classy you are.

This right here is what new money with no class has to tell themselves.

I've personally met so many rich people with little to no class and a lot of very well educated poor people with a lot of class.

And yes, people would much rather be around a poor college professor than you.

You may think Lauren Bezos has no class, but she couldn't care less what people she never interacts with thinks about her "class". She doesn't care what people who think they are classy and have high opinions have to say about her.

Well let me know when she joins DCUM. I'll make sure to ask her about a wide range of things. Until then, if you think money equals class, you will never have class.

Class is not the same as manners. The most famous "class" ever would be the English upper classes, who could be both well mannered and terribly mannered. Plenty of aristocrats took pride in being badly mannered, exhibiting a vulgarity that would be at home with Lauren Boebert. Manners does not make the class. And that is where you're falling into a trap.

Lauren Boebert is far from my favorite person but she is not a lesser class than, say, Abigail Spanberger or Nancy Pelosi. They belong to different socio-economic groups. All three are politically and legally equal. If you keep thinking class is manners or how many degrees you have, you're missing it entirely.

The aristocracy could get away with all sorts of behaviors. Because no matter how they behaved, their status remained intact.
It is their lessers who had to adhere to social etiquette as they had reputations to uphold.

[Anonymous]

In India, caste and class system was very strict, still is but not to that level. I guess their is some simulation everywhere, like Americans considered whites higher class than blacks and country club members higher class then YMCA members etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We don't have social classes here. Now you know.

Lol

Yes, we do.

While it’s not as clear cut as in other countries, the USA still has classes.

An overly simplistic way to explain:

-Blue collar vs white collar…but there’s a big gray area since many blue collar workers can amass a fortune and outpace many white collar professionals. To wit: my plumber lives in a nearly $2M home, owns vacation homes in his “home” country plus at the DE beaches, sends his kids to private school, and owns a portfolio of rentals that he flipped. If you saw him roll up in his truck, you’d never realize he’s so wealthy. (He told me he nets $1M/year.)

-By neighborhood

-By schools

-By education (college/advanced degrees)

-By country club(s)

-By status

Old money is a completely different animal. Truly old money status that has been sustained and grown over 4-5 generations is in its own class.

This can all be changed in one person’s lifetime. You can be born poor and end up wealthy.

It’s less of a class and more of a current designation, if you care about such things. And, you shouldn’t care about such things.

This. Class in the US is not really about class as much as wealth. And unlike other cultures, there is very little real influence that is exclusive to “old” money that can’t be had with new money.

While OPs post does reveal their immigrant mindset, I give them credit for being more honest about their downward social mobility than American born natives in the same position.

Not everyone in the social register is wealthy. But they are certainly old family.
Old families and old money has cachet and gravitas that new money can't buy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't know what class am I? I don't know.

Moved to US from overseas when I was 12 and all the social connections were left behind, family came with no money and what was in suitcase. But going back three generations immediate family were a law professor, a pediatric heart surgeon, a OB/GYN specializing in high-risk pregnancies, a pediatrician, a patent chemist. Then we moved from that overnight into poverty because post-USSR we had no money and even less when it was converted to USD. Now as an adult, my income is still very low, live in a tiny condo, dress poor because can't afford anything else. But I still very much value education, love books, spend a fortune on extracurriculars for the kids, There's very little in my checking and not much in savings. I buy artisanal foods and joke to husband that this is my chandelier now (to replace the one we left behind, because I've no place or money to hang the real thing here). What class is this?

You are a prole.
It sounds like everyone in your family had to work so you are all basically skilled workers. That is to say, you are not leisure class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We don't have social classes here. Now you know.

Lol

Yes, we do.

While it’s not as clear cut as in other countries, the USA still has classes.

An overly simplistic way to explain:

-Blue collar vs white collar…but there’s a big gray area since many blue collar workers can amass a fortune and outpace many white collar professionals. To wit: my plumber lives in a nearly $2M home, owns vacation homes in his “home” country plus at the DE beaches, sends his kids to private school, and owns a portfolio of rentals that he flipped. If you saw him roll up in his truck, you’d never realize he’s so wealthy. (He told me he nets $1M/year.)

-By neighborhood

-By schools

-By education (college/advanced degrees)

-By country club(s)

-By status

Old money is a completely different animal. Truly old money status that has been sustained and grown over 4-5 generations is in its own class.

This can all be changed in one person’s lifetime. You can be born poor and end up wealthy.

It’s less of a class and more of a current designation, if you care about such things. And, you shouldn’t care about such things.

This. Class in the US is not really about class as much as wealth. And unlike other cultures, there is very little real influence that is exclusive to “old” money that can’t be had with new money.

While OPs post does reveal their immigrant mindset, I give them credit for being more honest about their downward social mobility than American born natives in the same position.

Not everyone in the social register is wealthy. But they are certainly old family.
Old families and old money has cachet and gravitas that new money can't buy.

Where? If you can’t afford the lifestyle or keep up you will get left behind.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We don't have social classes here. Now you know.

Lol

Yes, we do.

While it’s not as clear cut as in other countries, the USA still has classes.

An overly simplistic way to explain:

-Blue collar vs white collar…but there’s a big gray area since many blue collar workers can amass a fortune and outpace many white collar professionals. To wit: my plumber lives in a nearly $2M home, owns vacation homes in his “home” country plus at the DE beaches, sends his kids to private school, and owns a portfolio of rentals that he flipped. If you saw him roll up in his truck, you’d never realize he’s so wealthy. (He told me he nets $1M/year.)

-By neighborhood

-By schools

-By education (college/advanced degrees)

-By country club(s)

-By status

Old money is a completely different animal. Truly old money status that has been sustained and grown over 4-5 generations is in its own class.

This can all be changed in one person’s lifetime. You can be born poor and end up wealthy.

It’s less of a class and more of a current designation, if you care about such things. And, you shouldn’t care about such things.

This. Class in the US is not really about class as much as wealth. And unlike other cultures, there is very little real influence that is exclusive to “old” money that can’t be had with new money.

While OPs post does reveal their immigrant mindset, I give them credit for being more honest about their downward social mobility than American born natives in the same position.

I am not sure that is the only criteria for the Maidstone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We don't have social classes here. Now you know.

Lol

Yes, we do.

While it’s not as clear cut as in other countries, the USA still has classes.

An overly simplistic way to explain:

-Blue collar vs white collar…but there’s a big gray area since many blue collar workers can amass a fortune and outpace many white collar professionals. To wit: my plumber lives in a nearly $2M home, owns vacation homes in his “home” country plus at the DE beaches, sends his kids to private school, and owns a portfolio of rentals that he flipped. If you saw him roll up in his truck, you’d never realize he’s so wealthy. (He told me he nets $1M/year.)

-By neighborhood

-By schools

-By education (college/advanced degrees)

-By country club(s)

-By status

Old money is a completely different animal. Truly old money status that has been sustained and grown over 4-5 generations is in its own class.

This can all be changed in one person’s lifetime. You can be born poor and end up wealthy.

It’s less of a class and more of a current designation, if you care about such things. And, you shouldn’t care about such things.

This. Class in the US is not really about class as much as wealth. And unlike other cultures, there is very little real influence that is exclusive to “old” money that can’t be had with new money.

While OPs post does reveal their immigrant mindset, I give them credit for being more honest about their downward social mobility than American born natives in the same position.

Not everyone in the social register is wealthy. But they are certainly old family.
Old families and old money has cachet and gravitas that new money can't buy.

Where? If you can’t afford the lifestyle or keep up you will get left behind.

I think they just descend into middle class working stiffs. But the cultural capital still opens doors for the next generation. Look at the Auchinclosses, the Burdens and more locally to DC, the Grovsnors and the Harrimans.