TJ parents - would your kid do it again? Best tips for success for a positive experience?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another family who would not do it again. We did not let younger sibling even apply to TJ (even though sibling was in precalc in 8th grade). Stuck with base school and couldn’t be happier.

TJ is for the quirky kids but it also attracts lots of quirky teachers. We struggled with a lot of the teachers. Assumed kids were smart and could teach themselves. One math teacher only demonstrated about 6 math problems for a whole quarter. No thanks - don’t need to feed into the “prestige” of TJ while paying $$$ for tutors to actually teach the kids.

I think you are exaggerating a bit there.. what do you think students do for the whole math period if the teacher doesn't teach, as you claim? Many motivated high schoolers (certainly TJ attendees), are definitely capable of teaching themselves, by reading the assigned book material or course notes, looking things up online, or asking teachers for help when stuck. These are some of the most important skills for students to learn well before heading to college.

If you had to pay $$$ for tutors for your older child, it might mean that they may not have been ready to learn at a TJ/college pace. Or maybe they were pushed too far ahead, too quickly. Your younger sibling seems to be very accelerated if they're doing precalc in 8th grade. If I see this level of acceleration as a parent, I would definitely want to make sure that they have learned the material well without gaps. Here's another question: If your younger sibling took precalc in 8th, what math classes will they take and what will they learn at their base high school?

+1000

It is complete nonsense when people say math teachers dont teach at TJ. It is the exact opposite. They are incredible teachers because they encourage students to discover mathematical concepts by themselves by asking questions instead of showing them how to solve a problem. That is precisely the strength of TJ.

This takes a lot of effort on the teachers part. Many are used to the Curie style of giving an example problem first and then asking students to do variations on that problem. Which teaches speed and accuracy but little actual understanding.

That is why so many parents who put their child at Curie complain "they dont teach math". It is a near certainty that the parent above put their child in Curie. This is so predictable.

I am the PP who made the comment about the TJ math teacher only teaching 6 math problems a quarter.

I absolutely did NOT put my child in Curie and I resent the accusation. We did no prep for TJ (yes, it was when admissions was based on a test).

DC loved math and excelled at it until he got to TJ. He is bright, but not the type to pick up Linear Algebra by himself without some instruction. And let’s not forget these are HS students, not college students who need to teach themselves or camp outside of a professors office for office hours.

Our solution was to take math classes at NOVA DE vs taking them at TJ with their crappy math teachers. Shocker - DC loved math again, is doing great so far in his 3 university math classes at a university that does proof based math. Glad to be rid of TJ.

For the PP who’s DCs math teacher has not entered grades in grade book. There is a FCPS regulation that TJ teachers seem to think they’re exempt from requiring grades being entered into grade book in a timely manner. I’ve had this conversation with math dept before.

I am not referring to prep for TJ exam at all. I am referring to the teaching style that is followed by Curie and others like them.

The way they teach is exact copy of how they teach in India. It is diametrically opposite to how it should be taught and taught at TJ. I was on a meeting with TJ principal and about 100 or so parents and this same concern you mentioned was asked again and again.

In math you should always give the student a first shot at solving the problem by themselves without even teaching them the theory. The student discovers the theory by themselves. A very tough ask of the student AND the teacher, because the teacher should only try to get the student to the answer by asking them questions, not giving them tips or show steps in solving the problem.

If you do this way, you have less need for repetition and students understand the material better.

Curie does the opposite. It starts with 3-4 examples then the students see the pattern and imitate those steps to solve the problem. The students understanding is shaky at best in this case. The moment you give them a twist on the problem, they say "we were never taught this material in class."

I see this with every single kid who was at Curie or similar type of class.

DP.
This is the dumbest thing I have read in a while.

I mean, all they're saying is that one method teaches kids how to do problems while the other method encourages them to figure out how to solve them on their own.

Curie's methods are why you had reports of kids crying on their way out of the exam in the first year that FCPS used the Quant-Q.

There's very limited value in producing a large volume of students who only have the ability to do work that they've already been shown how to do.

Your obsession with Curie and fake narratives!

*shrug* I mean, it's just more evidence of what happened during that period between the classes of 2022 and 2024. Curie, to their credit, caught up to the Quant-Q in the ensuing two years but they were caught with their pants down for the Class of 2022 and that's why you saw Asian admissions go from:

74.9% of Class of 2021
65.2% of Class of 2022
72.3% of Class of 2023
74% of Class of 2024

If you think that was an accident, you're just not paying attention.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another family who would not do it again. We did not let younger sibling even apply to TJ (even though sibling was in precalc in 8th grade). Stuck with base school and couldn’t be happier.

TJ is for the quirky kids but it also attracts lots of quirky teachers. We struggled with a lot of the teachers. Assumed kids were smart and could teach themselves. One math teacher only demonstrated about 6 math problems for a whole quarter. No thanks - don’t need to feed into the “prestige” of TJ while paying $$$ for tutors to actually teach the kids.

I think you are exaggerating a bit there.. what do you think students do for the whole math period if the teacher doesn't teach, as you claim? Many motivated high schoolers (certainly TJ attendees), are definitely capable of teaching themselves, by reading the assigned book material or course notes, looking things up online, or asking teachers for help when stuck. These are some of the most important skills for students to learn well before heading to college.

If you had to pay $$$ for tutors for your older child, it might mean that they may not have been ready to learn at a TJ/college pace. Or maybe they were pushed too far ahead, too quickly. Your younger sibling seems to be very accelerated if they're doing precalc in 8th grade. If I see this level of acceleration as a parent, I would definitely want to make sure that they have learned the material well without gaps. Here's another question: If your younger sibling took precalc in 8th, what math classes will they take and what will they learn at their base high school?

+1000

It is complete nonsense when people say math teachers dont teach at TJ. It is the exact opposite. They are incredible teachers because they encourage students to discover mathematical concepts by themselves by asking questions instead of showing them how to solve a problem. That is precisely the strength of TJ.

This takes a lot of effort on the teachers part. Many are used to the Curie style of giving an example problem first and then asking students to do variations on that problem. Which teaches speed and accuracy but little actual understanding.

That is why so many parents who put their child at Curie complain "they dont teach math". It is a near certainty that the parent above put their child in Curie. This is so predictable.

I am the PP who made the comment about the TJ math teacher only teaching 6 math problems a quarter.

I absolutely did NOT put my child in Curie and I resent the accusation. We did no prep for TJ (yes, it was when admissions was based on a test).

DC loved math and excelled at it until he got to TJ. He is bright, but not the type to pick up Linear Algebra by himself without some instruction. And let’s not forget these are HS students, not college students who need to teach themselves or camp outside of a professors office for office hours.

Our solution was to take math classes at NOVA DE vs taking them at TJ with their crappy math teachers. Shocker - DC loved math again, is doing great so far in his 3 university math classes at a university that does proof based math. Glad to be rid of TJ.

For the PP who’s DCs math teacher has not entered grades in grade book. There is a FCPS regulation that TJ teachers seem to think they’re exempt from requiring grades being entered into grade book in a timely manner. I’ve had this conversation with math dept before.

I am not referring to prep for TJ exam at all. I am referring to the teaching style that is followed by Curie and others like them.

The way they teach is exact copy of how they teach in India. It is diametrically opposite to how it should be taught and taught at TJ. I was on a meeting with TJ principal and about 100 or so parents and this same concern you mentioned was asked again and again.

In math you should always give the student a first shot at solving the problem by themselves without even teaching them the theory. The student discovers the theory by themselves. A very tough ask of the student AND the teacher, because the teacher should only try to get the student to the answer by asking them questions, not giving them tips or show steps in solving the problem.

If you do this way, you have less need for repetition and students understand the material better.

Curie does the opposite. It starts with 3-4 examples then the students see the pattern and imitate those steps to solve the problem. The students understanding is shaky at best in this case. The moment you give them a twist on the problem, they say "we were never taught this material in class."

I see this with every single kid who was at Curie or similar type of class.

DP.
This is the dumbest thing I have read in a while.

LOL. If Curie dumbed down you kid, it is on you!

[Anonymous]

TJ has exceptional teachers in the math department. The narrative that they dont teach math is primarily led by parents who have kids in Curie classes where they learned a completely different approach.

That is why every year we have parents complaining that teachers are giving questions on exams that they did not teach in class.

If your child likes this kind of instruction TJ is the place to be. It results in a much deeper understanding of material.

It is a perfectly valid to question if such level of rigor is necessary in high school. But then why do you need TJ? You can go to base HS if this is not what you like.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:TJ has exceptional teachers in the math department. The narrative that they dont teach math is primarily led by parents who have kids in Curie classes where they learned a completely different approach.

That is why every year we have parents complaining that teachers are giving questions on exams that they did not teach in class.

If your child likes this kind of instruction TJ is the place to be. It results in a much deeper understanding of material.

It is a perfectly valid to question if such level of rigor is necessary in high school. But then why do you need TJ? You can go to base HS if this is not what you like.

I posted earlier and my kid did not do any outside math prepping courses. She’s just always been really quick at math and gets it with very little practice needed after the concept was introduced. She’s had all As on report cards for math while at TJ.

But that doesn’t mean she is a future mathematician. I don’t understand the point for HS classes of not teaching kids directly HOW to do math and instead leaving them to just have to read the book and google on their own to figure out how to do the problems.

I do not see the lack of direct instruction in math by multiple math teachers at TJ as one of the pro’s of the school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another family who would not do it again. We did not let younger sibling even apply to TJ (even though sibling was in precalc in 8th grade). Stuck with base school and couldn’t be happier.

TJ is for the quirky kids but it also attracts lots of quirky teachers. We struggled with a lot of the teachers. Assumed kids were smart and could teach themselves. One math teacher only demonstrated about 6 math problems for a whole quarter. No thanks - don’t need to feed into the “prestige” of TJ while paying $$$ for tutors to actually teach the kids.

I think you are exaggerating a bit there.. what do you think students do for the whole math period if the teacher doesn't teach, as you claim? Many motivated high schoolers (certainly TJ attendees), are definitely capable of teaching themselves, by reading the assigned book material or course notes, looking things up online, or asking teachers for help when stuck. These are some of the most important skills for students to learn well before heading to college.

If you had to pay $$$ for tutors for your older child, it might mean that they may not have been ready to learn at a TJ/college pace. Or maybe they were pushed too far ahead, too quickly. Your younger sibling seems to be very accelerated if they're doing precalc in 8th grade. If I see this level of acceleration as a parent, I would definitely want to make sure that they have learned the material well without gaps. Here's another question: If your younger sibling took precalc in 8th, what math classes will they take and what will they learn at their base high school?

+1000

It is complete nonsense when people say math teachers dont teach at TJ. It is the exact opposite. They are incredible teachers because they encourage students to discover mathematical concepts by themselves by asking questions instead of showing them how to solve a problem. That is precisely the strength of TJ.

This takes a lot of effort on the teachers part. Many are used to the Curie style of giving an example problem first and then asking students to do variations on that problem. Which teaches speed and accuracy but little actual understanding.

That is why so many parents who put their child at Curie complain "they dont teach math". It is a near certainty that the parent above put their child in Curie. This is so predictable.

I am the PP who made the comment about the TJ math teacher only teaching 6 math problems a quarter.

I absolutely did NOT put my child in Curie and I resent the accusation. We did no prep for TJ (yes, it was when admissions was based on a test).

DC loved math and excelled at it until he got to TJ. He is bright, but not the type to pick up Linear Algebra by himself without some instruction. And let’s not forget these are HS students, not college students who need to teach themselves or camp outside of a professors office for office hours.

Our solution was to take math classes at NOVA DE vs taking them at TJ with their crappy math teachers. Shocker - DC loved math again, is doing great so far in his 3 university math classes at a university that does proof based math. Glad to be rid of TJ.

For the PP who’s DCs math teacher has not entered grades in grade book. There is a FCPS regulation that TJ teachers seem to think they’re exempt from requiring grades being entered into grade book in a timely manner. I’ve had this conversation with math dept before.

I am not referring to prep for TJ exam at all. I am referring to the teaching style that is followed by Curie and others like them.

The way they teach is exact copy of how they teach in India. It is diametrically opposite to how it should be taught and taught at TJ. I was on a meeting with TJ principal and about 100 or so parents and this same concern you mentioned was asked again and again.

In math you should always give the student a first shot at solving the problem by themselves without even teaching them the theory. The student discovers the theory by themselves. A very tough ask of the student AND the teacher, because the teacher should only try to get the student to the answer by asking them questions, not giving them tips or show steps in solving the problem.

If you do this way, you have less need for repetition and students understand the material better.

Curie does the opposite. It starts with 3-4 examples then the students see the pattern and imitate those steps to solve the problem. The students understanding is shaky at best in this case. The moment you give them a twist on the problem, they say "we were never taught this material in class."

I see this with every single kid who was at Curie or similar type of class.

DP.
This is the dumbest thing I have read in a while.

I mean, all they're saying is that one method teaches kids how to do problems while the other method encourages them to figure out how to solve them on their own.

Curie's methods are why you had reports of kids crying on their way out of the exam in the first year that FCPS used the Quant-Q.

There's very limited value in producing a large volume of students who only have the ability to do work that they've already been shown how to do.

There is no such thing as a "curie method".
It's how math is taught in pretty much every country but here. If you think America is producing the best mathematicians then you're crazy.

Quant Q produced slightly more random results because that's what happens when you have a skill test that cannot be prepared for, the annoyed students look more like the applicant pool.

And the vast majority of curie kids don't get into TJ.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another family who would not do it again. We did not let younger sibling even apply to TJ (even though sibling was in precalc in 8th grade). Stuck with base school and couldn’t be happier.

TJ is for the quirky kids but it also attracts lots of quirky teachers. We struggled with a lot of the teachers. Assumed kids were smart and could teach themselves. One math teacher only demonstrated about 6 math problems for a whole quarter. No thanks - don’t need to feed into the “prestige” of TJ while paying $$$ for tutors to actually teach the kids.

I think you are exaggerating a bit there.. what do you think students do for the whole math period if the teacher doesn't teach, as you claim? Many motivated high schoolers (certainly TJ attendees), are definitely capable of teaching themselves, by reading the assigned book material or course notes, looking things up online, or asking teachers for help when stuck. These are some of the most important skills for students to learn well before heading to college.

If you had to pay $$$ for tutors for your older child, it might mean that they may not have been ready to learn at a TJ/college pace. Or maybe they were pushed too far ahead, too quickly. Your younger sibling seems to be very accelerated if they're doing precalc in 8th grade. If I see this level of acceleration as a parent, I would definitely want to make sure that they have learned the material well without gaps. Here's another question: If your younger sibling took precalc in 8th, what math classes will they take and what will they learn at their base high school?

+1000

It is complete nonsense when people say math teachers dont teach at TJ. It is the exact opposite. They are incredible teachers because they encourage students to discover mathematical concepts by themselves by asking questions instead of showing them how to solve a problem. That is precisely the strength of TJ.

This takes a lot of effort on the teachers part. Many are used to the Curie style of giving an example problem first and then asking students to do variations on that problem. Which teaches speed and accuracy but little actual understanding.

That is why so many parents who put their child at Curie complain "they dont teach math". It is a near certainty that the parent above put their child in Curie. This is so predictable.

I am the PP who made the comment about the TJ math teacher only teaching 6 math problems a quarter.

I absolutely did NOT put my child in Curie and I resent the accusation. We did no prep for TJ (yes, it was when admissions was based on a test).

DC loved math and excelled at it until he got to TJ. He is bright, but not the type to pick up Linear Algebra by himself without some instruction. And let’s not forget these are HS students, not college students who need to teach themselves or camp outside of a professors office for office hours.

Our solution was to take math classes at NOVA DE vs taking them at TJ with their crappy math teachers. Shocker - DC loved math again, is doing great so far in his 3 university math classes at a university that does proof based math. Glad to be rid of TJ.

For the PP who’s DCs math teacher has not entered grades in grade book. There is a FCPS regulation that TJ teachers seem to think they’re exempt from requiring grades being entered into grade book in a timely manner. I’ve had this conversation with math dept before.

I am not referring to prep for TJ exam at all. I am referring to the teaching style that is followed by Curie and others like them.

The way they teach is exact copy of how they teach in India. It is diametrically opposite to how it should be taught and taught at TJ. I was on a meeting with TJ principal and about 100 or so parents and this same concern you mentioned was asked again and again.

In math you should always give the student a first shot at solving the problem by themselves without even teaching them the theory. The student discovers the theory by themselves. A very tough ask of the student AND the teacher, because the teacher should only try to get the student to the answer by asking them questions, not giving them tips or show steps in solving the problem.

If you do this way, you have less need for repetition and students understand the material better.

Curie does the opposite. It starts with 3-4 examples then the students see the pattern and imitate those steps to solve the problem. The students understanding is shaky at best in this case. The moment you give them a twist on the problem, they say "we were never taught this material in class."

I see this with every single kid who was at Curie or similar type of class.

DP.
This is the dumbest thing I have read in a while.

I mean, all they're saying is that one method teaches kids how to do problems while the other method encourages them to figure out how to solve them on their own.

Curie's methods are why you had reports of kids crying on their way out of the exam in the first year that FCPS used the Quant-Q.

There's very limited value in producing a large volume of students who only have the ability to do work that they've already been shown how to do.

Your obsession with Curie and fake narratives!

*shrug* I mean, it's just more evidence of what happened during that period between the classes of 2022 and 2024. Curie, to their credit, caught up to the Quant-Q in the ensuing two years but they were caught with their pants down for the Class of 2022 and that's why you saw Asian admissions go from:

74.9% of Class of 2021
65.2% of Class of 2022
72.3% of Class of 2023
74% of Class of 2024

If you think that was an accident, you're just not paying attention.

DP

It's possible quant Q reduced the effect of test specific prep, is also possible quant Q made admissions a bit more random so the admitted students looked a bit more like the applicant pool.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:TJ has exceptional teachers in the math department. The narrative that they dont teach math is primarily led by parents who have kids in Curie classes where they learned a completely different approach.

That is why every year we have parents complaining that teachers are giving questions on exams that they did not teach in class.

If your child likes this kind of instruction TJ is the place to be. It results in a much deeper understanding of material.

It is a perfectly valid to question if such level of rigor is necessary in high school. But then why do you need TJ? You can go to base HS if this is not what you like.

My kid did not go to curie but I do not hear this complaint from Indian parents. Maybe they just don't complain to me because I'm not Indian but the most common complaint I have seen (aside from general griping about rigor that everyone engaged in) is the rigor in the non STEM classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another family who would not do it again. We did not let younger sibling even apply to TJ (even though sibling was in precalc in 8th grade). Stuck with base school and couldn’t be happier.

TJ is for the quirky kids but it also attracts lots of quirky teachers. We struggled with a lot of the teachers. Assumed kids were smart and could teach themselves. One math teacher only demonstrated about 6 math problems for a whole quarter. No thanks - don’t need to feed into the “prestige” of TJ while paying $$$ for tutors to actually teach the kids.

I think you are exaggerating a bit there.. what do you think students do for the whole math period if the teacher doesn't teach, as you claim? Many motivated high schoolers (certainly TJ attendees), are definitely capable of teaching themselves, by reading the assigned book material or course notes, looking things up online, or asking teachers for help when stuck. These are some of the most important skills for students to learn well before heading to college.

If you had to pay $$$ for tutors for your older child, it might mean that they may not have been ready to learn at a TJ/college pace. Or maybe they were pushed too far ahead, too quickly. Your younger sibling seems to be very accelerated if they're doing precalc in 8th grade. If I see this level of acceleration as a parent, I would definitely want to make sure that they have learned the material well without gaps. Here's another question: If your younger sibling took precalc in 8th, what math classes will they take and what will they learn at their base high school?

+1000

It is complete nonsense when people say math teachers dont teach at TJ. It is the exact opposite. They are incredible teachers because they encourage students to discover mathematical concepts by themselves by asking questions instead of showing them how to solve a problem. That is precisely the strength of TJ.

This takes a lot of effort on the teachers part. Many are used to the Curie style of giving an example problem first and then asking students to do variations on that problem. Which teaches speed and accuracy but little actual understanding.

That is why so many parents who put their child at Curie complain "they dont teach math". It is a near certainty that the parent above put their child in Curie. This is so predictable.

I am the PP who made the comment about the TJ math teacher only teaching 6 math problems a quarter.

I absolutely did NOT put my child in Curie and I resent the accusation. We did no prep for TJ (yes, it was when admissions was based on a test).

DC loved math and excelled at it until he got to TJ. He is bright, but not the type to pick up Linear Algebra by himself without some instruction. And let’s not forget these are HS students, not college students who need to teach themselves or camp outside of a professors office for office hours.

Our solution was to take math classes at NOVA DE vs taking them at TJ with their crappy math teachers. Shocker - DC loved math again, is doing great so far in his 3 university math classes at a university that does proof based math. Glad to be rid of TJ.

For the PP who’s DCs math teacher has not entered grades in grade book. There is a FCPS regulation that TJ teachers seem to think they’re exempt from requiring grades being entered into grade book in a timely manner. I’ve had this conversation with math dept before.

I am not referring to prep for TJ exam at all. I am referring to the teaching style that is followed by Curie and others like them.

The way they teach is exact copy of how they teach in India. It is diametrically opposite to how it should be taught and taught at TJ. I was on a meeting with TJ principal and about 100 or so parents and this same concern you mentioned was asked again and again.

In math you should always give the student a first shot at solving the problem by themselves without even teaching them the theory. The student discovers the theory by themselves. A very tough ask of the student AND the teacher, because the teacher should only try to get the student to the answer by asking them questions, not giving them tips or show steps in solving the problem.

If you do this way, you have less need for repetition and students understand the material better.

Curie does the opposite. It starts with 3-4 examples then the students see the pattern and imitate those steps to solve the problem. The students understanding is shaky at best in this case. The moment you give them a twist on the problem, they say "we were never taught this material in class."

I see this with every single kid who was at Curie or similar type of class.

DP.
This is the dumbest thing I have read in a while.

I mean, all they're saying is that one method teaches kids how to do problems while the other method encourages them to figure out how to solve them on their own.

Curie's methods are why you had reports of kids crying on their way out of the exam in the first year that FCPS used the Quant-Q.

There's very limited value in producing a large volume of students who only have the ability to do work that they've already been shown how to do.

There is no such thing as a "curie method".
It's how math is taught in pretty much every country but here. If you think America is producing the best mathematicians then you're crazy.

Quant Q produced slightly more random results because that's what happens when you have a skill test that cannot be prepared for, the annoyed students look more like the applicant pool.

And the vast majority of curie kids don't get into TJ.

Vast majority of students who enroll in Curie drop out along the way. The ones who survive their curriculum through completion have high success once enrolled at TJ.

[Anonymous]

Dr. Po-Shen Loh, the former IMO coach for the USA Math team has written about this style of coaching, explicitly mentioning Indian teaching style.

It is just painful to see bright young students misguided by parents who dont know better. If any are interested, read up on what Dr. Po-Shen Loh has written.

Many go to Curie and then end up hiring tutors all through high school to keep up.

You do you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dr. Po-Shen Loh, the former IMO coach for the USA Math team has written about this style of coaching, explicitly mentioning Indian teaching style.

It is just painful to see bright young students misguided by parents who dont know better. If any are interested, read up on what Dr. Po-Shen Loh has written.

Many go to Curie and then end up hiring tutors all through high school to keep up.

You do you.

Do you have a link to Dr. Po saying this about "indian style teaching"

BTW, how many of the regeneron semifinalists this year do you think are curie alums?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another family who would not do it again. We did not let younger sibling even apply to TJ (even though sibling was in precalc in 8th grade). Stuck with base school and couldn’t be happier.

TJ is for the quirky kids but it also attracts lots of quirky teachers. We struggled with a lot of the teachers. Assumed kids were smart and could teach themselves. One math teacher only demonstrated about 6 math problems for a whole quarter. No thanks - don’t need to feed into the “prestige” of TJ while paying $$$ for tutors to actually teach the kids.

I think you are exaggerating a bit there.. what do you think students do for the whole math period if the teacher doesn't teach, as you claim? Many motivated high schoolers (certainly TJ attendees), are definitely capable of teaching themselves, by reading the assigned book material or course notes, looking things up online, or asking teachers for help when stuck. These are some of the most important skills for students to learn well before heading to college.

If you had to pay $$$ for tutors for your older child, it might mean that they may not have been ready to learn at a TJ/college pace. Or maybe they were pushed too far ahead, too quickly. Your younger sibling seems to be very accelerated if they're doing precalc in 8th grade. If I see this level of acceleration as a parent, I would definitely want to make sure that they have learned the material well without gaps. Here's another question: If your younger sibling took precalc in 8th, what math classes will they take and what will they learn at their base high school?

+1000

It is complete nonsense when people say math teachers dont teach at TJ. It is the exact opposite. They are incredible teachers because they encourage students to discover mathematical concepts by themselves by asking questions instead of showing them how to solve a problem. That is precisely the strength of TJ.

This takes a lot of effort on the teachers part. Many are used to the Curie style of giving an example problem first and then asking students to do variations on that problem. Which teaches speed and accuracy but little actual understanding.

That is why so many parents who put their child at Curie complain "they dont teach math". It is a near certainty that the parent above put their child in Curie. This is so predictable.

I am the PP who made the comment about the TJ math teacher only teaching 6 math problems a quarter.

I absolutely did NOT put my child in Curie and I resent the accusation. We did no prep for TJ (yes, it was when admissions was based on a test).

DC loved math and excelled at it until he got to TJ. He is bright, but not the type to pick up Linear Algebra by himself without some instruction. And let’s not forget these are HS students, not college students who need to teach themselves or camp outside of a professors office for office hours.

Our solution was to take math classes at NOVA DE vs taking them at TJ with their crappy math teachers. Shocker - DC loved math again, is doing great so far in his 3 university math classes at a university that does proof based math. Glad to be rid of TJ.

For the PP who’s DCs math teacher has not entered grades in grade book. There is a FCPS regulation that TJ teachers seem to think they’re exempt from requiring grades being entered into grade book in a timely manner. I’ve had this conversation with math dept before.

I am not referring to prep for TJ exam at all. I am referring to the teaching style that is followed by Curie and others like them.

The way they teach is exact copy of how they teach in India. It is diametrically opposite to how it should be taught and taught at TJ. I was on a meeting with TJ principal and about 100 or so parents and this same concern you mentioned was asked again and again.

In math you should always give the student a first shot at solving the problem by themselves without even teaching them the theory. The student discovers the theory by themselves. A very tough ask of the student AND the teacher, because the teacher should only try to get the student to the answer by asking them questions, not giving them tips or show steps in solving the problem.

If you do this way, you have less need for repetition and students understand the material better.

Curie does the opposite. It starts with 3-4 examples then the students see the pattern and imitate those steps to solve the problem. The students understanding is shaky at best in this case. The moment you give them a twist on the problem, they say "we were never taught this material in class."

I see this with every single kid who was at Curie or similar type of class.

I understand what you're trying to say, but this method is NOT about leaving a student alone with a book and coming to get them sixty minutes later. The self-discovery method requires just as much scaffolding and support from the teacher, in the form of thoughtful, adaptable prompts and guiding the students, and not letting them veer off track. It is most assuredly NOT "leave them to figure it out by themselves."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another family who would not do it again. We did not let younger sibling even apply to TJ (even though sibling was in precalc in 8th grade). Stuck with base school and couldn’t be happier.

TJ is for the quirky kids but it also attracts lots of quirky teachers. We struggled with a lot of the teachers. Assumed kids were smart and could teach themselves. One math teacher only demonstrated about 6 math problems for a whole quarter. No thanks - don’t need to feed into the “prestige” of TJ while paying $$$ for tutors to actually teach the kids.

I think you are exaggerating a bit there.. what do you think students do for the whole math period if the teacher doesn't teach, as you claim? Many motivated high schoolers (certainly TJ attendees), are definitely capable of teaching themselves, by reading the assigned book material or course notes, looking things up online, or asking teachers for help when stuck. These are some of the most important skills for students to learn well before heading to college.

If you had to pay $$$ for tutors for your older child, it might mean that they may not have been ready to learn at a TJ/college pace. Or maybe they were pushed too far ahead, too quickly. Your younger sibling seems to be very accelerated if they're doing precalc in 8th grade. If I see this level of acceleration as a parent, I would definitely want to make sure that they have learned the material well without gaps. Here's another question: If your younger sibling took precalc in 8th, what math classes will they take and what will they learn at their base high school?

+1000

It is complete nonsense when people say math teachers dont teach at TJ. It is the exact opposite. They are incredible teachers because they encourage students to discover mathematical concepts by themselves by asking questions instead of showing them how to solve a problem. That is precisely the strength of TJ.

This takes a lot of effort on the teachers part. Many are used to the Curie style of giving an example problem first and then asking students to do variations on that problem. Which teaches speed and accuracy but little actual understanding.

That is why so many parents who put their child at Curie complain "they dont teach math". It is a near certainty that the parent above put their child in Curie. This is so predictable.

I am the PP who made the comment about the TJ math teacher only teaching 6 math problems a quarter.

I absolutely did NOT put my child in Curie and I resent the accusation. We did no prep for TJ (yes, it was when admissions was based on a test).

DC loved math and excelled at it until he got to TJ. He is bright, but not the type to pick up Linear Algebra by himself without some instruction. And let’s not forget these are HS students, not college students who need to teach themselves or camp outside of a professors office for office hours.

Our solution was to take math classes at NOVA DE vs taking them at TJ with their crappy math teachers. Shocker - DC loved math again, is doing great so far in his 3 university math classes at a university that does proof based math. Glad to be rid of TJ.

For the PP who’s DCs math teacher has not entered grades in grade book. There is a FCPS regulation that TJ teachers seem to think they’re exempt from requiring grades being entered into grade book in a timely manner. I’ve had this conversation with math dept before.

I am not referring to prep for TJ exam at all. I am referring to the teaching style that is followed by Curie and others like them.

The way they teach is exact copy of how they teach in India. It is diametrically opposite to how it should be taught and taught at TJ. I was on a meeting with TJ principal and about 100 or so parents and this same concern you mentioned was asked again and again.

In math you should always give the student a first shot at solving the problem by themselves without even teaching them the theory. The student discovers the theory by themselves. A very tough ask of the student AND the teacher, because the teacher should only try to get the student to the answer by asking them questions, not giving them tips or show steps in solving the problem.

If you do this way, you have less need for repetition and students understand the material better.

Curie does the opposite. It starts with 3-4 examples then the students see the pattern and imitate those steps to solve the problem. The students understanding is shaky at best in this case. The moment you give them a twist on the problem, they say "we were never taught this material in class."

I see this with every single kid who was at Curie or similar type of class.

I understand what you're trying to say, but this method is NOT about leaving a student alone with a book and coming to get them sixty minutes later. The self-discovery method requires just as much scaffolding and support from the teacher, in the form of thoughtful, adaptable prompts and guiding the students, and not letting them veer off track. It is most assuredly NOT "leave them to figure it out by themselves."

I did not say leave the student alone with a book. I specifically mentioned how difficult it is to use this method for the teachers because they have to ask them the right questions whenever the student gets stuck. It is not easy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dr. Po-Shen Loh, the former IMO coach for the USA Math team has written about this style of coaching, explicitly mentioning Indian teaching style.

It is just painful to see bright young students misguided by parents who dont know better. If any are interested, read up on what Dr. Po-Shen Loh has written.

Many go to Curie and then end up hiring tutors all through high school to keep up.

You do you.

Do you have a link to Dr. Po saying this about "indian style teaching"

BTW, how many of the regeneron semifinalists this year do you think are curie alums?

He wrote a blog post on how it is difficult for him to give advice for people from India because of the reasons I mention above.

As to regeneron semifinalists, I know how that works and who is helping/doing the work.
I was a judge for several years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dr. Po-Shen Loh, the former IMO coach for the USA Math team has written about this style of coaching, explicitly mentioning Indian teaching style.

It is just painful to see bright young students misguided by parents who dont know better. If any are interested, read up on what Dr. Po-Shen Loh has written.

Many go to Curie and then end up hiring tutors all through high school to keep up.

You do you.

Do you have a link to Dr. Po saying this about "indian style teaching"

BTW, how many of the regeneron semifinalists this year do you think are curie alums?

He wrote a blog post on how it is difficult for him to give advice for people from India because of the reasons I mention above.

As to regeneron semifinalists, I know how that works and who is helping/doing the work.
I was a judge for several years.

Why so cagey with specifics? Why are you invested in protecting the grifters?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dr. Po-Shen Loh, the former IMO coach for the USA Math team has written about this style of coaching, explicitly mentioning Indian teaching style.

It is just painful to see bright young students misguided by parents who dont know better. If any are interested, read up on what Dr. Po-Shen Loh has written.

Many go to Curie and then end up hiring tutors all through high school to keep up.

You do you.

Many Curie alums tutor under represented students.