Ukraine can win; but they have to be absolute bad guy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Ukraine is getting the $$$$ - at the top- and American tax payer play da fool.

I don't like the US getting entangled in foreign wars. But time and time again we have sent our money to overseas locations - Iraq ring a bell? - because reasons. We feel we have strategic reasons for wanting to (fill in the blank). I think Putin wants to re establish the former USSR and apparently, our analysts don't think that would be a good idea. I hate that it costs us money but don't you think it's probably a good idea for us to NOT give Putin whatever he wants on a silver platter? What would you just shrug as he invades a sovereign country? What if he turns on another one next? He's killing innocent civilians, you think we should just shrug?

Without costing a US military life, the US and the world has managed to bring the Russians to their knees. Why is this bad? Don't we want to stop the bullies?

Thank you for confirming you only count the American dead, everyone else is just noise.

??? Russia is one who can stop all of this killing.

If Russia stopped fighting, the Ukraine would go right back to shelling civilians in the Donbas, like they did from 14-22.

You mean after Russia sent in it's little green men and declared the region independent?

You mean after the lawful government was overthrown in a coup? People are just supposed to be ok with that and not object?

Wrong. You realize you are repeating Kremlin propaganda and perpetuating a lie, right?

Propaganda in this war is going both ways, and censorship around Ukraine in MSM is strong. In fact, there are things you are simply no longer allowed to say about Ukraine that you were allowed to, as recently as in 2014.

For instance, these Guardian articles would have never been allowed to run today:

Well for one thing the current leader of Ukraine’s “regime” is Jewish. Not a neo-nazi.

So it is your contention, is it not, that with Zelensky's ascent to power all neo-Nazi elements (that the Western commentators freely acknowledged in 2014) have vanished?

Or is it your contention that neo-Nazi elements simply cannot coexist with a Jewish president?

It’s my contention that there are neo-Nazi elements everywhere unfortunately including in the US and Russia where they might go by a different name.

It’s also my contention that Ukraine 20th century history is filled with bloodshed, death, and destruction, brought about primarily by anti-democratic authoritarian thugs who ran either Russia/USSR or Germany. The Jews of Ukraine Galicia/Lithuania/Latvia/Poland/Russia, etc were especially hit hard by non-Jews from all sorts of ethnic groups some of whose descendants are still filled with raging anti-Semitism. Yes also in Russia. Why do you think so many Russian and Soviet Jews left in the 1970’s, 1980’s and 1900’s?

Bloodlands is an illuminating, heartbreaking book. I suggest you read it.

Snyder is a propagandist.

Everyone able to leave Russia in the 1970s and 1980s has left, not just the Jews. It's just that the Jews could use the door nobody else could.

It is quite charming you mention the Jews of Ukraine and the Baltics "hit especially hard" by non-Jews, really, what you mean is "locals". Has Ukraine ever addressed the history of its extensive collaboration with the Nazis? Have the Baltics? Especially the Baltics? The only countries in Europe where SS veterans still march in celebration parades? The Baltics that suppress and censor local authors who want to acknowledge what happened? The Baltics that squashed the memorial exhibit of the Salaspils concentration camp FOR CHILDREN in the UN on the pretense that it paints the country in a bad light? Damn right it does but does that mean it shouldn't be acknowledged? So, don't talk about the thugs who ran the USSR, the antisemitism in Ukraine and the Baltics is very very native.

Ukrainians fought the Soviets with Germans because the Soviets had starved them to death on the previous decade.

This whole anti semitism thing is partly pearl clutching.

And then they realized the Germans were just as bad as the Soviets. Also starved them and looted their country. True facts! They got hit from both sides. And from within. What a tragic century. And now more tragedy.

Just read an article about Russia’s recent plundering of Ukrainian treasures. Plus ca change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ukraine is getting the $$$$ - at the top- and American tax payer play da fool.

I don't like the US getting entangled in foreign wars. But time and time again we have sent our money to overseas locations - Iraq ring a bell? - because reasons. We feel we have strategic reasons for wanting to (fill in the blank). I think Putin wants to re establish the former USSR and apparently, our analysts don't think that would be a good idea. I hate that it costs us money but don't you think it's probably a good idea for us to NOT give Putin whatever he wants on a silver platter? What would you just shrug as he invades a sovereign country? What if he turns on another one next? He's killing innocent civilians, you think we should just shrug?

Without costing a US military life, the US and the world has managed to bring the Russians to their knees. Why is this bad? Don't we want to stop the bullies?

Thank you for confirming you only count the American dead, everyone else is just noise.

??? Russia is one who can stop all of this killing.

If Russia stopped fighting, the Ukraine would go right back to shelling civilians in the Donbas, like they did from 14-22.

You mean after Russia sent in it's little green men and declared the region independent?

You mean after the lawful government was overthrown in a coup? People are just supposed to be ok with that and not object?

Wrong. You realize you are repeating Kremlin propaganda and perpetuating a lie, right?

Propaganda in this war is going both ways, and censorship around Ukraine in MSM is strong. In fact, there are things you are simply no longer allowed to say about Ukraine that you were allowed to, as recently as in 2014.

For instance, these Guardian articles would have never been allowed to run today:

Well for one thing the current leader of Ukraine’s “regime” is Jewish. Not a neo-nazi.

So it is your contention, is it not, that with Zelensky's ascent to power all neo-Nazi elements (that the Western commentators freely acknowledged in 2014) have vanished?

Or is it your contention that neo-Nazi elements simply cannot coexist with a Jewish president?

It’s my contention that there are neo-Nazi elements everywhere unfortunately including in the US and Russia where they might go by a different name.

It’s also my contention that Ukraine 20th century history is filled with bloodshed, death, and destruction, brought about primarily by anti-democratic authoritarian thugs who ran either Russia/USSR or Germany. The Jews of Ukraine Galicia/Lithuania/Latvia/Poland/Russia, etc were especially hit hard by non-Jews from all sorts of ethnic groups some of whose descendants are still filled with raging anti-Semitism. Yes also in Russia. Why do you think so many Russian and Soviet Jews left in the 1970’s, 1980’s and 1900’s?

Bloodlands is an illuminating, heartbreaking book. I suggest you read it.

Snyder is a propagandist.

Everyone able to leave Russia in the 1970s and 1980s has left, not just the Jews. It's just that the Jews could use the door nobody else could.

It is quite charming you mention the Jews of Ukraine and the Baltics "hit especially hard" by non-Jews, really, what you mean is "locals". Has Ukraine ever addressed the history of its extensive collaboration with the Nazis? Have the Baltics? Especially the Baltics? The only countries in Europe where SS veterans still march in celebration parades? The Baltics that suppress and censor local authors who want to acknowledge what happened? The Baltics that squashed the memorial exhibit of the Salaspils concentration camp FOR CHILDREN in the UN on the pretense that it paints the country in a bad light? Damn right it does but does that mean it shouldn't be acknowledged? So, don't talk about the thugs who ran the USSR, the antisemitism in Ukraine and the Baltics is very very native.

Ukrainians fought the Soviets with Germans because the Soviets had starved them to death on the previous decade.

This whole anti semitism thing is partly pearl clutching.

lol right what the Germans planned for them was soooo much better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has Russia ever addressed its history of anti-semitism, the Gulags, the Holodomor?

Beautiful sleight of hand - you call them Russians when you want to, and Soviets when you want to. Blame Georgia for Stalin, why don’t you LOL.

How about Russian Soviets? Or Soviet Russians, does that work? At any rate where are the monuments and apologies for the Gulag, pogroms, and Holodomor?

Pogroms are the Ukrainian thing. Gulags they did to themselves. The famine, eh, get in line after the Kazakhs, you don’t get to brand a joint tragedy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ukraine is getting the $$$$ - at the top- and American tax payer play da fool.

I don't like the US getting entangled in foreign wars. But time and time again we have sent our money to overseas locations - Iraq ring a bell? - because reasons. We feel we have strategic reasons for wanting to (fill in the blank). I think Putin wants to re establish the former USSR and apparently, our analysts don't think that would be a good idea. I hate that it costs us money but don't you think it's probably a good idea for us to NOT give Putin whatever he wants on a silver platter? What would you just shrug as he invades a sovereign country? What if he turns on another one next? He's killing innocent civilians, you think we should just shrug?

Without costing a US military life, the US and the world has managed to bring the Russians to their knees. Why is this bad? Don't we want to stop the bullies?

Thank you for confirming you only count the American dead, everyone else is just noise.

??? Russia is one who can stop all of this killing.

If Russia stopped fighting, the Ukraine would go right back to shelling civilians in the Donbas, like they did from 14-22.

You mean after Russia sent in it's little green men and declared the region independent?

You mean after the lawful government was overthrown in a coup? People are just supposed to be ok with that and not object?

Wrong. You realize you are repeating Kremlin propaganda and perpetuating a lie, right?

Propaganda in this war is going both ways, and censorship around Ukraine in MSM is strong. In fact, there are things you are simply no longer allowed to say about Ukraine that you were allowed to, as recently as in 2014.

For instance, these Guardian articles would have never been allowed to run today:

Well for one thing the current leader of Ukraine’s “regime” is Jewish. Not a neo-nazi.

So it is your contention, is it not, that with Zelensky's ascent to power all neo-Nazi elements (that the Western commentators freely acknowledged in 2014) have vanished?

Or is it your contention that neo-Nazi elements simply cannot coexist with a Jewish president?

It’s my contention that there are neo-Nazi elements everywhere unfortunately including in the US and Russia where they might go by a different name.

It’s also my contention that Ukraine 20th century history is filled with bloodshed, death, and destruction, brought about primarily by anti-democratic authoritarian thugs who ran either Russia/USSR or Germany. The Jews of Ukraine Galicia/Lithuania/Latvia/Poland/Russia, etc were especially hit hard by non-Jews from all sorts of ethnic groups some of whose descendants are still filled with raging anti-Semitism. Yes also in Russia. Why do you think so many Russian and Soviet Jews left in the 1970’s, 1980’s and 1900’s?

Bloodlands is an illuminating, heartbreaking book. I suggest you read it.

Snyder is a propagandist.

Everyone able to leave Russia in the 1970s and 1980s has left, not just the Jews. It's just that the Jews could use the door nobody else could.

It is quite charming you mention the Jews of Ukraine and the Baltics "hit especially hard" by non-Jews, really, what you mean is "locals". Has Ukraine ever addressed the history of its extensive collaboration with the Nazis? Have the Baltics? Especially the Baltics? The only countries in Europe where SS veterans still march in celebration parades? The Baltics that suppress and censor local authors who want to acknowledge what happened? The Baltics that squashed the memorial exhibit of the Salaspils concentration camp FOR CHILDREN in the UN on the pretense that it paints the country in a bad light? Damn right it does but does that mean it shouldn't be acknowledged? So, don't talk about the thugs who ran the USSR, the antisemitism in Ukraine and the Baltics is very very native.

Ukrainians fought the Soviets with Germans because the Soviets had starved them to death on the previous decade.

This whole anti semitism thing is partly pearl clutching.

And then they realized the Germans were just as bad as the Soviets. Also starved them and looted their country. True facts! They got hit from both sides. And from within. What a tragic century. And now more tragedy.

Just read an article about Russia’s recent plundering of Ukrainian treasures. Plus ca change.

Ukrainians WERE the soviets just like everyone else in the USSR. I mean twenty years ago you probably thought everyone who lived there was Russian and now look at you!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is an easy win-win here, and that is let the Russian populated parts go to Russia. Then they can have a clean break from Russia and go their own way. They will never be able to effectively govern these parts anyway.

Russia had those parts and still invaded the entire country anyway.

Russia did not invade the entire country. Russia never meant to invade all of Ukraine. Russian generals are not idiots who think you can invade all of Ukraine with 180K soldiers.

But apparently they ARE idiots because they are getting their @sses kicked by some random satellite country.

So you are arguing that officers that studied as naseum the Second World War, and German invasion of Poland are that stupid? That Germany amassed 1,2 million troops to conquer a smaller and less populous country than Ukraine, and the thought they will conquer some 45 million people with 180K troops?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think at the first sign that Russia will use a nuclear weapon the West will abandon Ukraine. It is one thing to waste Ukrainian lives and line the pockets of military industrial complex CEOs, and a whole other thing to destroy Europe in totality.

Meh, if Russia seriously begins to try, the Russian military will take Putin out. It just won't happen.

Lol!!!

[Anonymous]

Russia is slowly realizing that they exist because the west allows them to.

The west is focused on the real war to come with China.

Russia is just another Iran with better alcohol.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Russia is slowly realizing that they exist because the west allows them to.

The west is focused on the real war to come with China.

Russia is just another Iran with better alcohol.

There’s no reason for war with China. They aren’t planning to invade the US. Please stop Sabre rattling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is an easy win-win here, and that is let the Russian populated parts go to Russia. Then they can have a clean break from Russia and go their own way. They will never be able to effectively govern these parts anyway.

Russia had those parts and still invaded the entire country anyway.

Russia did not invade the entire country. Russia never meant to invade all of Ukraine. Russian generals are not idiots who think you can invade all of Ukraine with 180K soldiers.

But apparently they ARE idiots because they are getting their @sses kicked by some random satellite country.

So you are arguing that officers that studied as naseum the Second World War, and German invasion of Poland are that stupid? That Germany amassed 1,2 million troops to conquer a smaller and less populous country than Ukraine, and the thought they will conquer some 45 million people with 180K troops?

Did you not see the traffic backup outside of Kyiv that spanned miles and consisted of Russian tanks and armor that couldn’t reach their target? The massive numbers of deserters and supply shortages?

What mire could a general possibly do to show how completely inept they are at basic warfare? We can all see with our own eyes. Who are you trying to BS?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Russia is slowly realizing that they exist because the west allows them to.

The west is focused on the real war to come with China.

Russia is just another Iran with better alcohol.

There’s no reason for war with China. They aren’t planning to invade the US. Please stop Sabre rattling.

China and the West will be in full conventional war in under 5 years.

Taiwan is the reason.

Russia may still be Russia; or some fragmented shell of itself. Do not care what happens to any human in that “country” or what it devolves to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ukraine is getting the $$$$ - at the top- and American tax payer play da fool.

I don't like the US getting entangled in foreign wars. But time and time again we have sent our money to overseas locations - Iraq ring a bell? - because reasons. We feel we have strategic reasons for wanting to (fill in the blank). I think Putin wants to re establish the former USSR and apparently, our analysts don't think that would be a good idea. I hate that it costs us money but don't you think it's probably a good idea for us to NOT give Putin whatever he wants on a silver platter? What would you just shrug as he invades a sovereign country? What if he turns on another one next? He's killing innocent civilians, you think we should just shrug?

Without costing a US military life, the US and the world has managed to bring the Russians to their knees. Why is this bad? Don't we want to stop the bullies?

Thank you for confirming you only count the American dead, everyone else is just noise.

??? Russia is one who can stop all of this killing.

If Russia stopped fighting, the Ukraine would go right back to shelling civilians in the Donbas, like they did from 14-22.

You mean after Russia sent in it's little green men and declared the region independent?

You mean after the lawful government was overthrown in a coup? People are just supposed to be ok with that and not object?

Wrong. You realize you are repeating Kremlin propaganda and perpetuating a lie, right?

Propaganda in this war is going both ways, and censorship around Ukraine in MSM is strong. In fact, there are things you are simply no longer allowed to say about Ukraine that you were allowed to, as recently as in 2014.

For instance, these Guardian articles would have never been allowed to run today:

Well for one thing the current leader of Ukraine’s “regime” is Jewish. Not a neo-nazi.

So it is your contention, is it not, that with Zelensky's ascent to power all neo-Nazi elements (that the Western commentators freely acknowledged in 2014) have vanished?

Or is it your contention that neo-Nazi elements simply cannot coexist with a Jewish president?

It’s my contention that there are neo-Nazi elements everywhere unfortunately including in the US and Russia where they might go by a different name.

It’s also my contention that Ukraine 20th century history is filled with bloodshed, death, and destruction, brought about primarily by anti-democratic authoritarian thugs who ran either Russia/USSR or Germany. The Jews of Ukraine Galicia/Lithuania/Latvia/Poland/Russia, etc were especially hit hard by non-Jews from all sorts of ethnic groups some of whose descendants are still filled with raging anti-Semitism. Yes also in Russia. Why do you think so many Russian and Soviet Jews left in the 1970’s, 1980’s and 1900’s?

Bloodlands is an illuminating, heartbreaking book. I suggest you read it.

Snyder is a propagandist.

Everyone able to leave Russia in the 1970s and 1980s has left, not just the Jews. It's just that the Jews could use the door nobody else could.

It is quite charming you mention the Jews of Ukraine and the Baltics "hit especially hard" by non-Jews, really, what you mean is "locals". Has Ukraine ever addressed the history of its extensive collaboration with the Nazis? Have the Baltics? Especially the Baltics? The only countries in Europe where SS veterans still march in celebration parades? The Baltics that suppress and censor local authors who want to acknowledge what happened? The Baltics that squashed the memorial exhibit of the Salaspils concentration camp FOR CHILDREN in the UN on the pretense that it paints the country in a bad light? Damn right it does but does that mean it shouldn't be acknowledged? So, don't talk about the thugs who ran the USSR, the antisemitism in Ukraine and the Baltics is very very native.

Ukrainians fought the Soviets with Germans because the Soviets had starved them to death on the previous decade.

This whole anti semitism thing is partly pearl clutching.

And then they realized the Germans were just as bad as the Soviets. Also starved them and looted their country. True facts! They got hit from both sides. And from within. What a tragic century. And now more tragedy.

Just read an article about Russia’s recent plundering of Ukrainian treasures. Plus ca change.

Ukrainians WERE the soviets just like everyone else in the USSR. I mean twenty years ago you probably thought everyone who lived there was Russian and now look at you!

Yes there was a Soviet Ukraine and a Soviet Russia.

Ukraine is an actual place separate from Russian. Ukrainian is its own language and not the same as Russian. Kyiv is centuries older than Moscow. Russia took its name from the historical state of Kyivan Rus’ and not the other way around.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Russia is slowly realizing that they exist because the west allows them to.

The west is focused on the real war to come with China.

Russia is just another Iran with better alcohol.

There’s no reason for war with China. They aren’t planning to invade the US. Please stop Sabre rattling.

Jesus, how dumb are you? What about little Taiwan thing? About China becoming the dominant superpower in Asia? You think that is acceptable to the U.S?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has Russia ever addressed its history of anti-semitism, the Gulags, the Holodomor?

Beautiful sleight of hand - you call them Russians when you want to, and Soviets when you want to. Blame Georgia for Stalin, why don’t you LOL.

How about Russian Soviets? Or Soviet Russians, does that work? At any rate where are the monuments and apologies for the Gulag, pogroms, and Holodomor?

Pogroms are the Ukrainian thing. Gulags they did to themselves. The famine, eh, get in line after the Kazakhs, you don’t get to brand a joint tragedy.

The Jews of Nizhnii Novograd would like to have a word with you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is an easy win-win here, and that is let the Russian populated parts go to Russia. Then they can have a clean break from Russia and go their own way. They will never be able to effectively govern these parts anyway.

Russia had those parts and still invaded the entire country anyway.

Russia did not invade the entire country. Russia never meant to invade all of Ukraine. Russian generals are not idiots who think you can invade all of Ukraine with 180K soldiers.

But apparently they ARE idiots because they are getting their @sses kicked by some random satellite country.

So you are arguing that officers that studied as naseum the Second World War, and German invasion of Poland are that stupid? That Germany amassed 1,2 million troops to conquer a smaller and less populous country than Ukraine, and the thought they will conquer some 45 million people with 180K troops?

Did you not see the traffic backup outside of Kyiv that spanned miles and consisted of Russian tanks and armor that couldn’t reach their target? The massive numbers of deserters and supply shortage?

What mire could a general possibly do to show how completely inept they are at basic warfare? We can all see with our own eyes. Who are you trying to BS?

You are not that educated, are you?
Russia is destroying Ukraine as a country. That is their goal, not invading it fully.
That is the goal, to wreck it to hell. They at doing that part great.

[Anonymous]

Who is the apologist for murderous Russian actions on here?

This is not WWIi. This is Russia invading a country and committing a shocking number of gruesome war crimes against civilians including children, as well as targeting cultural artifacts and heritage for theft and destruction. All because its psychopath dictator former KGB agent insanely thinks he can restore the Soviet “glory” that never was.