STEM kid only looking at Research universities?

[Anonymous]

My DC has put together a preliminary list of schools to apply for admission (science/engineering). Great stats, high test scores/solid grades, ECs are music & science, some sports.

The list is comprised of all research universities. Do you think it’s a mistake to not consider any liberal arts colleges at all? I think the isolated campus locations and small sizes may have been the deterrent. I personally like the potential for more personal attention that LACs offer.

I have no clue. DC is our oldest. Thoughts?

[Anonymous]

I think you can encourage the idea of "diversification" in college applications without taking over the process--say he should add a liberal arts college and a true safety to the research university list. Last year there seemed to be an overrun of high stats tech-oriented kids at research universities making it harder to get at accepted than many were expecting. Liberal arts colleges might also offer your son finacial aid/merit aid (you have to look at whether they are known for this) and you can look for ones that are in or near cities. For liberal arts colleges, it can be important to demonstrate interest so he needs to be on board with it--not just you tossing one more into the mix. Look for which schools have a great track record in STEM PhD placement. Many might not have an engineering program--so that's one way to weed out if he wants engineering as the undergrad major. (If he's a straight to PhD type that's less important--just choose the closest science to his interest).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think you can encourage the idea of "diversification" in college applications without taking over the process--say he should add a liberal arts college and a true safety to the research university list. Last year there seemed to be an overrun of high stats tech-oriented kids at research universities making it harder to get at accepted than many were expecting. Liberal arts colleges might also offer your son finacial aid/merit aid (you have to look at whether they are known for this) and you can look for ones that are in or near cities. For liberal arts colleges, it can be important to demonstrate interest so he needs to be on board with it--not just you tossing one more into the mix. Look for which schools have a great track record in STEM PhD placement. Many might not have an engineering program--so that's one way to weed out if he wants engineering as the undergrad major. (If he's a straight to PhD type that's less important--just choose the closest science to his interest).

Thank you - I was hesitant to jump in and add schools, I didn’t want to take over. I think I may google some options that may fit the bill with DCs wants.

[Anonymous]

I would have him look at liberal arts and smaller schools without grad schools. Reason being, he’s more likely to get a research assistantship working directly with a professor at schools he’s not conpeting with grad students. R1 schools for grad school definitely but it’s a disadvantage for undergrad. Look at Vassar which just built a huge state of the art sciences building.

—signed, science PhD who greatly benefited from having a research assistantship in undergrad to get into grad school at a top tier school

[Anonymous]

If you haven’t already, take him to visit one so he can see the environment. My older STEM kid was totally turned off by large research universities and chose a LAC, my younger STEM kid finds LACs feel too small and stifling and is only looking at larger research universities. They can be successful at either one. The most important factor is that they “click” with their environment and take advantage of the opportunities offered.

[Anonymous]

That approach worked out well for my STEM-oriented DC. I made the case for LACs, and pointed out some of the more urban and more science-oriented ones, but still no interest on DC’s part. No problem finding great safeties within the major research university category if you can afford OOS tuition. FWIW, there has been lots of interaction with/support from faculty during DC’s first two years at a major research university. LACs certainly don’t have a monopoly on that!

[Anonymous]

Thank you PPs. May I ask which science LACs your students considered?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would have him look at liberal arts and smaller schools without grad schools. Reason being, he’s more likely to get a research assistantship working directly with a professor at schools he’s not conpeting with grad students. R1 schools for grad school definitely but it’s a disadvantage for undergrad. Look at Vassar which just built a huge state of the art sciences building.

—signed, science PhD who greatly benefited from having a research assistantship in undergrad to get into grad school at a top tier school

Interesting advice, thank you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DC has put together a preliminary list of schools to apply for admission (science/engineering). Great stats, high test scores/solid grades, ECs are music & science, some sports.

The list is comprised of all research universities. Do you think it’s a mistake to not consider any liberal arts colleges at all? I think the isolated campus locations and small sizes may have been the deterrent. I personally like the potential for more personal attention that LACs offer.

I have no clue. DC is our oldest. Thoughts?

It depends on which STEM field he is interested in. Physics departments, even in large R1 universities, tend to be small, and he'll have no trouble finding mentors. Biology departments are huge, and here a LAC might be better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DC has put together a preliminary list of schools to apply for admission (science/engineering). Great stats, high test scores/solid grades, ECs are music & science, some sports.

The list is comprised of all research universities. Do you think it’s a mistake to not consider any liberal arts colleges at all? I think the isolated campus locations and small sizes may have been the deterrent. I personally like the potential for more personal attention that LACs offer.

I have no clue. DC is our oldest. Thoughts?

It depends on which STEM field he is interested in. Physics departments, even in large R1 universities, tend to be small, and he'll have no trouble finding mentors. Biology departments are huge, and here a LAC might be better.

Right now, it seems Biology is the stronger interest (biomedical engineering, bioinformatics, microbiology, genomics).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DC has put together a preliminary list of schools to apply for admission (science/engineering). Great stats, high test scores/solid grades, ECs are music & science, some sports.

The list is comprised of all research universities. Do you think it’s a mistake to not consider any liberal arts colleges at all? I think the isolated campus locations and small sizes may have been the deterrent. I personally like the potential for more personal attention that LACs offer.

I have no clue. DC is our oldest. Thoughts?

It depends on which STEM field he is interested in. Physics departments, even in large R1 universities, tend to be small, and he'll have no trouble finding mentors. Biology departments are huge, and here a LAC might be better.

Right now, it seems Biology is the stronger interest (biomedical engineering, bioinformatics, microbiology, genomics).

My not-interested-in-LACs DC is a biologist; has had no problem getting lab gigs/finding mentors at an R1 school (even as a freshman & sophomore). Have your DC ask/talk to STEM majors when he tours.

[Anonymous]

I had one kid apply to only LACs and one to only large schools. Neither wanted to go to the other type of school. I don’t think you need to force a mix of the two as long as there are safeties on the list.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I had one kid apply to only LACs and one to only large schools. Neither wanted to go to the other type of school. I don’t think you need to force a mix of the two as long as there are safeties on the list.

Thank you - DC does have safeties, and they are all big universities too

[Anonymous]

If he wants an engineering degree, he really should go to a school with an engineering program, not a LAC.

If he wants to major in bio, be aware that many programs are packed full of pre-meds. Premeds tend to be cut throat and care about nothing but grades. It's easy for them to suck all of the fun out of the subject. Look for a school where there are a substantial number of bio majors who want to be biologists.

--STEM PhD, married to an engineer

[Anonymous]

I went to a huge university (Berkeley). Once you get into the major and get beyond the feeder courses, it's not all huge classes; you do get know your professors. Each school and major is like a smaller university inside a huge one, with all the resources of a big research school.

The only reason not to go to a big school IMO (besides personal taste), is if you are not at all self-directed. It is really, really easy to fall into party culture, cutting classes, etc., because there is very little oversight those first few semesters, and there are a lot of opportunities for distraction. Also, no one is going to notice or care if you miss your 250-person lecture.