Anonymous wrote:The one part I am not sure how it will plan out are kid who are young for their team but a grade older than the other Q4s. For example, a September birthday who is in 6th grade. Do they stay with the 6th graders or have an option to play with 5th graders? If the intent is for school year alignment then it seems that there is two cascading criteria, but I am not sure if this is a hard or soft rule. Birthday and then school year or is really only based on your birthday.
Clubs that want to set their players up for being recruited and playing in college will put young Aug/Sept birthday players on the team thats their grade in school.
So you are saying it is a soft rule (ie at the discretion of each club) vs hard. Does anyone know that for fact? I think this has a big part in the spirit of the conversation you are having with your kid.
The way it worked pre 2017 (went clubs switched to BY) was the "better" higher level of competition clubs would always roster younger than the eligibility window players with their grade in school team. Other not as competitive clubs would let players play down a grade but everyone knew that if this player wanted to get recruited and play in college that they'd have to play up with their grade eventually. When this happens its usually easiest to switch clubs. So in the end it just makes more sense to roster young grade up players on the A or B team thats their grade in school.
One other thing, ten years ago there wasnt such a push by parents to redshirt and play down. In fact it was the opposite everyone wanted to play up which is sonehting US Soccer exploited to implement BY.
Wasn't true for my kids teams. All age based in SY.
Were your clubs top teams DA at the time?
Can you point to a doc or website where DA played on grade instead of age?
People weren't interested in playing down back then. It just wasnt something you ran into very often. If anything you'd hear about players playing up a grade and graduating HS early to play at some super college.
If this was true, it was a flaw in the system, because it put some kids at a disadvantage, making them the youngest on the team, younger than other states. A very few may have battled through and became tremendous players as a result (known as the underdog effect), but it was at the cost of others who may have been decent prospects but cycled out of the sport as a result. Leaving it up to the clubs and families makes a lot of sense.
If all players played on the same team this would be true. But because there's B team it doesn't make sense. You need to look more closely at all the RAE "proof" you cant live without. Almost all of it is geared to National Team selection only. Which means it doesn't consider B teams.
Not true, nice try.
Very true. Go ahead try and find a RAE paper or website that considers B teams as an alternate for youger players that aren't big/good enough for the A team. It doesn't exist because if you bring B teams into the discussion RAE doesnt work.
If players are young and not good enough for the A team playing on the B team will let them get more touches and develop more as a player. When they get older being younger evens out but the B team player has had the opportunity to be the top player on the team for multiple seasons. Once they jump up to the A team they'll be primed to work for a top position on the A team becasue thats what theyre used to.
RAE doesn't go away when kids get older. Top teams are over indexed on older kids in the age cohort. Period. Has nothing to do with your B team mumbo jumbo. Your Horatio Alger tale of B team to A team is a silly myth.
Go ahead try to find a RAE publication that includes B teams in the assessment. It doesnt exist because RAE falls appart if you include B teams. With the assumption that B team players will become A team players when they're older and the same size as everyone else on the team.
You are arguing that top teams will have a relatively even distribution after puberty presumably as B team players move to the top team. But the data doesn't back this up. The top teams remain skewed toward the older side of the age cohort. Essentially, the definition of RAE.
Do you admit that B team players if they're good will find their way to the A team as they ger older?
My experience has been that this happens with about half the team. Some of the B team players are older and some are younger. It's been about even.
If you think about it the younger aug/sept players that could play on a grade down A team would probabaly be the leaders on a correct grade B team. These are the ones most likely to be moved up to correct grade A team. Keep in mind that just because you want to play on a grade down A team doesnt mean that your kid will make the team.
2nd team players get labelled 2nd players via coach lock and the fact that clubs want to increase revenue by bringing in players to the first team rather than promoting within. Second team players are younger than first team players in an age cohort, again by RAE definition. Being on the first team is crucial to maximizing one's youth soccer outcome.
PP is exactly right. I am a data scientist. RAE is real. It's meant to be interpreted at a population level but you can see it play out on teams in the area, including ours. And coach bias is real too. Once a B team player by HS, it is next to impossible to move up. Your coaching has been worse, your teammates are worse, and the field competition has been worse. You have had fewer practices, games, and showcases. You are trying to play catch-up to kids that have had the top of all of this probably for several years. It can happen, but odds are not in your favor. That's RAE and coach bias in action.
As a Molecular Rocket Engineer/Scientist you are wrong. As has been stated multiple times top players will find an A team to play on. It might not be at your club it also might also be at your club. Coaches are always looking for a way to win (believe it or not). What do you think woukd happen if an A team player guested with the B team and tried their hardest at a game. Most likely if they were a forward they would score at will. If they were a mid or defender they would win every 1on1 and control the field. This is why they play on the A team and this is also why B team players play on the B team. By the time players get to HS players have been sorted by physical ability. It has nothing to do with coaching.
if you want to see the reason A team players are on the A team and B team players are on the B team. Watch High School soccer tryouts. They all play each other and Its obvious which players are better and which are worse.
This is sorta true, except the part where half the B team has the youngest players in the player pool AND those kids are the ones more likely to play on varsity as freshmen, at least under the BY system. (Also, some A team players skip HS altogether).
This is the problem with RAE its a super excuse that can be used to justify anything.
Are there winners / losers in the birthday lottery? Yes
Does complaining about RAE change anything? No
Everyone has natural talent and abilities. For some its going to be playing soccer. Some will get lucky and be the oldest. Some will be natualy talented and the youngest. Either way both of these players will need to work their butts off to maintain their spot on the A team. I think its disingenuous to say that players are only on the A team because of when they were born. Everyone has opportunities its what you make of them that sets players appart.
RAE isn't being used as an excuse. It is a factor in understanding the development of individual players relative to their status on the age distribution of players in their player pool.
It is like the oldest are starting to ride a bike with a push while the youngest have to start with the brakes continually rubbing the tire. The youngest may get stronger but most find another sport instead.
I am sure that hearing that certain kids got opportunities not available to others can bother you because it undermines your belief that everyone has the same chances in life, unfortunately this simply isn't true. Shockingly youth sports ignores RAE unless you realize that the system was setup by babyboomers who tend to ignore science so here we are. Those in winning side don't want to change the rules and those on the losing side do but nobody is trying for fairness, they all want an edge.
If RAE didn't exist would anybody care about the age change? Hell, no.
I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand.
No matter what my kid was going to make the A team. We did futsal, arena/indoor, rec, latin leagues, etc. They were the one dragging my to sign them up. They were the one getting asked by friends to guest with their team. This was all as a Sept birthday. Which is ironic because now with the BY to SY change they're going to be an absolute beast. I feel sorry for the younger players because they dont have a chance.
This is very understood by everyone who has read your attempts at cyberbullying while ruining multiple threads, "I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand."
The only person ruining threads is you.
RAE is BS because theres nothing you can do about it.
Playing on a grade down team has repercussions and is detrimental to being recruited for playing in college.
Go have your pity party somewhere else. I can show you how to get your kid on an A team. But it takes work and dedication and even with all the hard work your kid might not make it. Sorry thats just how it works. Wait until you see that A team players who dont have to work out or even train and they're naturally better than everyone on the team. What excuse will you bring out then?
Everyone here agrees that no matter how talented your kid is OR when they were born, they still have to work their tail off to achieve their best.
That said, there's plenty to do, especially now that the age groups are changing and savvy parents will be looking to maximize their kid's chances where that hard work may pay off beyond just the fun and privilege of playing a sport. Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage, in youth sports.
You keep saying RAE type things. "Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage" Again, you cant change your kids birthday so why does it matter? Using your logic if your kid is not the oldest they might as well not play.
No, but now there's a bunch of kids who might be the oldest unless their forced to play with their grade -- your big thing in this and every thread. Look, if you're right and its a burden not to play at showcases with their grad class (others here have disagreed), let those families and clubs decide that this is challenging path they want to take, instead of forcing them to be the youngest on teams -- which also is challenging in its own right.
Here's the thing if your kid isnt good enough to play on their grade A or B teams 99% chance theyre also not good enough to play on the grade down A team. So where does this leave you? Playing on the grade down B team?
Clubs and coaches wont want to waste their time with young Aug/Sept birthdays playing on grade down A teams.
Clubs want kids to play on age, great get to play up and squeaky wheels sometimes get to play up. Clubs aren't wasting their time with anyone. They are taking $3,000 more or less for a 10 month youth sport regardless of age or team level where they can cut you the next year or you can leave on your own or you can come back the next year and start the process over again. No loyalty on either side.
Its way easier to say players in X grade go over there and Y grade come with us during tryouts.
Exactly, group everyone with the correct grade player pool from the beginning. Then clubs wont need to address it later when players are looking to get recruited to play in college.
Oh crazy August guy you are at least predictable.
There's already been one commenter saying this is what they're club plans to do. More will announce this policy. Also in a couple of years parents will get the hint that clubs are grouping players by grade even if they dont say it outloud. The more competitive a club is the more likely they'll be grouping players by grade.
What does competitiveness have to do with school grade?
Competitiveness is based on team and individual skills with coaching that matches the opponents to a certain level
Sigh... Obviously your kid doesnt play on a top team.
When clubs are more competitive it means they will field better teams. More wins brings more competition for positions and roster spots. If a club across the board has 5-10 possibilities for every position they wont waste their time with grade older players playing down. The less competitive clubs will see what the more competitive clubs are doing and follow suit. Eventually all that will be left are the bottom of the barrel clubs that are just looking for bodies and will have no issues with players playing down a grade. Mostly because they have no other options.
Sigh, ugh, sigh ugh. Your kid obviously doesn't play on a top team in a top league in a top area at a top position. These teams want wins and trophies, they will have half the team as August kids whatever grade as long as they are the oldest. Welcome to the real world.
Anonymous wrote:The one part I am not sure how it will plan out are kid who are young for their team but a grade older than the other Q4s. For example, a September birthday who is in 6th grade. Do they stay with the 6th graders or have an option to play with 5th graders? If the intent is for school year alignment then it seems that there is two cascading criteria, but I am not sure if this is a hard or soft rule. Birthday and then school year or is really only based on your birthday.
Clubs that want to set their players up for being recruited and playing in college will put young Aug/Sept birthday players on the team thats their grade in school.
So you are saying it is a soft rule (ie at the discretion of each club) vs hard. Does anyone know that for fact? I think this has a big part in the spirit of the conversation you are having with your kid.
The way it worked pre 2017 (went clubs switched to BY) was the "better" higher level of competition clubs would always roster younger than the eligibility window players with their grade in school team. Other not as competitive clubs would let players play down a grade but everyone knew that if this player wanted to get recruited and play in college that they'd have to play up with their grade eventually. When this happens its usually easiest to switch clubs. So in the end it just makes more sense to roster young grade up players on the A or B team thats their grade in school.
One other thing, ten years ago there wasnt such a push by parents to redshirt and play down. In fact it was the opposite everyone wanted to play up which is sonehting US Soccer exploited to implement BY.
Wasn't true for my kids teams. All age based in SY.
Were your clubs top teams DA at the time?
Can you point to a doc or website where DA played on grade instead of age?
People weren't interested in playing down back then. It just wasnt something you ran into very often. If anything you'd hear about players playing up a grade and graduating HS early to play at some super college.
If this was true, it was a flaw in the system, because it put some kids at a disadvantage, making them the youngest on the team, younger than other states. A very few may have battled through and became tremendous players as a result (known as the underdog effect), but it was at the cost of others who may have been decent prospects but cycled out of the sport as a result. Leaving it up to the clubs and families makes a lot of sense.
If all players played on the same team this would be true. But because there's B team it doesn't make sense. You need to look more closely at all the RAE "proof" you cant live without. Almost all of it is geared to National Team selection only. Which means it doesn't consider B teams.
Not true, nice try.
Very true. Go ahead try and find a RAE paper or website that considers B teams as an alternate for youger players that aren't big/good enough for the A team. It doesn't exist because if you bring B teams into the discussion RAE doesnt work.
If players are young and not good enough for the A team playing on the B team will let them get more touches and develop more as a player. When they get older being younger evens out but the B team player has had the opportunity to be the top player on the team for multiple seasons. Once they jump up to the A team they'll be primed to work for a top position on the A team becasue thats what theyre used to.
RAE doesn't go away when kids get older. Top teams are over indexed on older kids in the age cohort. Period. Has nothing to do with your B team mumbo jumbo. Your Horatio Alger tale of B team to A team is a silly myth.
Go ahead try to find a RAE publication that includes B teams in the assessment. It doesnt exist because RAE falls appart if you include B teams. With the assumption that B team players will become A team players when they're older and the same size as everyone else on the team.
You are arguing that top teams will have a relatively even distribution after puberty presumably as B team players move to the top team. But the data doesn't back this up. The top teams remain skewed toward the older side of the age cohort. Essentially, the definition of RAE.
Do you admit that B team players if they're good will find their way to the A team as they ger older?
My experience has been that this happens with about half the team. Some of the B team players are older and some are younger. It's been about even.
If you think about it the younger aug/sept players that could play on a grade down A team would probabaly be the leaders on a correct grade B team. These are the ones most likely to be moved up to correct grade A team. Keep in mind that just because you want to play on a grade down A team doesnt mean that your kid will make the team.
2nd team players get labelled 2nd players via coach lock and the fact that clubs want to increase revenue by bringing in players to the first team rather than promoting within. Second team players are younger than first team players in an age cohort, again by RAE definition. Being on the first team is crucial to maximizing one's youth soccer outcome.
PP is exactly right. I am a data scientist. RAE is real. It's meant to be interpreted at a population level but you can see it play out on teams in the area, including ours. And coach bias is real too. Once a B team player by HS, it is next to impossible to move up. Your coaching has been worse, your teammates are worse, and the field competition has been worse. You have had fewer practices, games, and showcases. You are trying to play catch-up to kids that have had the top of all of this probably for several years. It can happen, but odds are not in your favor. That's RAE and coach bias in action.
As a Molecular Rocket Engineer/Scientist you are wrong. As has been stated multiple times top players will find an A team to play on. It might not be at your club it also might also be at your club. Coaches are always looking for a way to win (believe it or not). What do you think woukd happen if an A team player guested with the B team and tried their hardest at a game. Most likely if they were a forward they would score at will. If they were a mid or defender they would win every 1on1 and control the field. This is why they play on the A team and this is also why B team players play on the B team. By the time players get to HS players have been sorted by physical ability. It has nothing to do with coaching.
if you want to see the reason A team players are on the A team and B team players are on the B team. Watch High School soccer tryouts. They all play each other and Its obvious which players are better and which are worse.
This is sorta true, except the part where half the B team has the youngest players in the player pool AND those kids are the ones more likely to play on varsity as freshmen, at least under the BY system. (Also, some A team players skip HS altogether).
This is the problem with RAE its a super excuse that can be used to justify anything.
Are there winners / losers in the birthday lottery? Yes
Does complaining about RAE change anything? No
Everyone has natural talent and abilities. For some its going to be playing soccer. Some will get lucky and be the oldest. Some will be natualy talented and the youngest. Either way both of these players will need to work their butts off to maintain their spot on the A team. I think its disingenuous to say that players are only on the A team because of when they were born. Everyone has opportunities its what you make of them that sets players appart.
RAE isn't being used as an excuse. It is a factor in understanding the development of individual players relative to their status on the age distribution of players in their player pool.
It is like the oldest are starting to ride a bike with a push while the youngest have to start with the brakes continually rubbing the tire. The youngest may get stronger but most find another sport instead.
I am sure that hearing that certain kids got opportunities not available to others can bother you because it undermines your belief that everyone has the same chances in life, unfortunately this simply isn't true. Shockingly youth sports ignores RAE unless you realize that the system was setup by babyboomers who tend to ignore science so here we are. Those in winning side don't want to change the rules and those on the losing side do but nobody is trying for fairness, they all want an edge.
If RAE didn't exist would anybody care about the age change? Hell, no.
I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand.
No matter what my kid was going to make the A team. We did futsal, arena/indoor, rec, latin leagues, etc. They were the one dragging my to sign them up. They were the one getting asked by friends to guest with their team. This was all as a Sept birthday. Which is ironic because now with the BY to SY change they're going to be an absolute beast. I feel sorry for the younger players because they dont have a chance.
This is very understood by everyone who has read your attempts at cyberbullying while ruining multiple threads, "I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand."
The only person ruining threads is you.
RAE is BS because theres nothing you can do about it.
Playing on a grade down team has repercussions and is detrimental to being recruited for playing in college.
Go have your pity party somewhere else. I can show you how to get your kid on an A team. But it takes work and dedication and even with all the hard work your kid might not make it. Sorry thats just how it works. Wait until you see that A team players who dont have to work out or even train and they're naturally better than everyone on the team. What excuse will you bring out then?
Everyone here agrees that no matter how talented your kid is OR when they were born, they still have to work their tail off to achieve their best.
That said, there's plenty to do, especially now that the age groups are changing and savvy parents will be looking to maximize their kid's chances where that hard work may pay off beyond just the fun and privilege of playing a sport. Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage, in youth sports.
You keep saying RAE type things. "Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage" Again, you cant change your kids birthday so why does it matter? Using your logic if your kid is not the oldest they might as well not play.
New entrant to the discussion. I acknowledge RAE exists but I don’t pay attention to it because I can’t control it. If people studied more sports psychology about belief and why you can achieve something, you would be more successful than believing in some theory of why your child is bound to fail.
My kid is a Q4 2014. I never paid attention to her birthday at all until this fall when we were doing middle school shopping and noticed all of her old teammates were already in middle school. I then began to process that she is technically a 2015 per the school classes.
While she is middle of the pack, 1st team on a big club, she will be the number #1 or #2 if she repeats U12. Her skill is the same but she is simply at the top of the band and not the bottom.
Now, it will not matter just like I never accepted excuses that she was younger in our current system. When she played bigger girls, I taught her to scan and play with anticipation. She can’t change being slight. She can learn how to beat Goliath. I imagine my daughter will now be the Goliath if we repeat U12 and there will be Q2 2015’s coming after her if she does not continue to develop.
Since you are happy with your club, sure, it won't impact your Q4. But for Q4s at smaller clubs or one of the 2nd teams, it may allow them the opportunity to play on better teams and/or in better leagues. And that absolutely matters for recruiting purposes (if that is their goal). Playing in a higher league is the difference between a college coach reading your email and one just deleting it (even if the players are exactly the same). The difference between a coach coming to your showcase game or not.
Everything you mentioned is passive. That’s why my kid is where she is. We control it and are proactive.
We don’t wait for anything. My kids spot for next year will be known by February. We don’t like our club and are moving. The Q2 kids should spend more time on the pitch this winter than complaining about the rules and they could have similar options.
Recruiting will be similar to the club process. If a college coach is not responding to my kids email and videos, I can see when the schools games are. I have easily met D1 players after games and their parents. If I am not getting a response from a school, it is easy to get a USB drive with my highlights, get it in someone’s hands or simply a card with a website with my kids CV. If a school doubts the level my kids plays at, bring them to an ID event or invite them to a practice. My kid is okay with being embarrassed. Even if my kid is a high school sophomore competing against college sophomores, a coach will like my kids gonads over your ivory tower approach. Colleges want kids who are hungry and tenacious. They are the leaders of the future. Not the child of a kid making excuses on an anonymous board. This is a peak into how level kids and families operate. I have learned in business and speaking with families of high level players who have come before me. What are you going to do with this information?
Yeah, pretty sedintary attitude accepting Feb. They need to be more proactive to get ahead. Gotta have a CV ready for a kindergarten if you expect them to ever work.
Anonymous wrote:The one part I am not sure how it will plan out are kid who are young for their team but a grade older than the other Q4s. For example, a September birthday who is in 6th grade. Do they stay with the 6th graders or have an option to play with 5th graders? If the intent is for school year alignment then it seems that there is two cascading criteria, but I am not sure if this is a hard or soft rule. Birthday and then school year or is really only based on your birthday.
Clubs that want to set their players up for being recruited and playing in college will put young Aug/Sept birthday players on the team thats their grade in school.
So you are saying it is a soft rule (ie at the discretion of each club) vs hard. Does anyone know that for fact? I think this has a big part in the spirit of the conversation you are having with your kid.
The way it worked pre 2017 (went clubs switched to BY) was the "better" higher level of competition clubs would always roster younger than the eligibility window players with their grade in school team. Other not as competitive clubs would let players play down a grade but everyone knew that if this player wanted to get recruited and play in college that they'd have to play up with their grade eventually. When this happens its usually easiest to switch clubs. So in the end it just makes more sense to roster young grade up players on the A or B team thats their grade in school.
One other thing, ten years ago there wasnt such a push by parents to redshirt and play down. In fact it was the opposite everyone wanted to play up which is sonehting US Soccer exploited to implement BY.
Wasn't true for my kids teams. All age based in SY.
Were your clubs top teams DA at the time?
Can you point to a doc or website where DA played on grade instead of age?
People weren't interested in playing down back then. It just wasnt something you ran into very often. If anything you'd hear about players playing up a grade and graduating HS early to play at some super college.
If this was true, it was a flaw in the system, because it put some kids at a disadvantage, making them the youngest on the team, younger than other states. A very few may have battled through and became tremendous players as a result (known as the underdog effect), but it was at the cost of others who may have been decent prospects but cycled out of the sport as a result. Leaving it up to the clubs and families makes a lot of sense.
If all players played on the same team this would be true. But because there's B team it doesn't make sense. You need to look more closely at all the RAE "proof" you cant live without. Almost all of it is geared to National Team selection only. Which means it doesn't consider B teams.
Not true, nice try.
Very true. Go ahead try and find a RAE paper or website that considers B teams as an alternate for youger players that aren't big/good enough for the A team. It doesn't exist because if you bring B teams into the discussion RAE doesnt work.
If players are young and not good enough for the A team playing on the B team will let them get more touches and develop more as a player. When they get older being younger evens out but the B team player has had the opportunity to be the top player on the team for multiple seasons. Once they jump up to the A team they'll be primed to work for a top position on the A team becasue thats what theyre used to.
RAE doesn't go away when kids get older. Top teams are over indexed on older kids in the age cohort. Period. Has nothing to do with your B team mumbo jumbo. Your Horatio Alger tale of B team to A team is a silly myth.
Go ahead try to find a RAE publication that includes B teams in the assessment. It doesnt exist because RAE falls appart if you include B teams. With the assumption that B team players will become A team players when they're older and the same size as everyone else on the team.
You are arguing that top teams will have a relatively even distribution after puberty presumably as B team players move to the top team. But the data doesn't back this up. The top teams remain skewed toward the older side of the age cohort. Essentially, the definition of RAE.
Do you admit that B team players if they're good will find their way to the A team as they ger older?
My experience has been that this happens with about half the team. Some of the B team players are older and some are younger. It's been about even.
If you think about it the younger aug/sept players that could play on a grade down A team would probabaly be the leaders on a correct grade B team. These are the ones most likely to be moved up to correct grade A team. Keep in mind that just because you want to play on a grade down A team doesnt mean that your kid will make the team.
2nd team players get labelled 2nd players via coach lock and the fact that clubs want to increase revenue by bringing in players to the first team rather than promoting within. Second team players are younger than first team players in an age cohort, again by RAE definition. Being on the first team is crucial to maximizing one's youth soccer outcome.
PP is exactly right. I am a data scientist. RAE is real. It's meant to be interpreted at a population level but you can see it play out on teams in the area, including ours. And coach bias is real too. Once a B team player by HS, it is next to impossible to move up. Your coaching has been worse, your teammates are worse, and the field competition has been worse. You have had fewer practices, games, and showcases. You are trying to play catch-up to kids that have had the top of all of this probably for several years. It can happen, but odds are not in your favor. That's RAE and coach bias in action.
As a Molecular Rocket Engineer/Scientist you are wrong. As has been stated multiple times top players will find an A team to play on. It might not be at your club it also might also be at your club. Coaches are always looking for a way to win (believe it or not). What do you think woukd happen if an A team player guested with the B team and tried their hardest at a game. Most likely if they were a forward they would score at will. If they were a mid or defender they would win every 1on1 and control the field. This is why they play on the A team and this is also why B team players play on the B team. By the time players get to HS players have been sorted by physical ability. It has nothing to do with coaching.
if you want to see the reason A team players are on the A team and B team players are on the B team. Watch High School soccer tryouts. They all play each other and Its obvious which players are better and which are worse.
This is sorta true, except the part where half the B team has the youngest players in the player pool AND those kids are the ones more likely to play on varsity as freshmen, at least under the BY system. (Also, some A team players skip HS altogether).
This is the problem with RAE its a super excuse that can be used to justify anything.
Are there winners / losers in the birthday lottery? Yes
Does complaining about RAE change anything? No
Everyone has natural talent and abilities. For some its going to be playing soccer. Some will get lucky and be the oldest. Some will be natualy talented and the youngest. Either way both of these players will need to work their butts off to maintain their spot on the A team. I think its disingenuous to say that players are only on the A team because of when they were born. Everyone has opportunities its what you make of them that sets players appart.
RAE isn't being used as an excuse. It is a factor in understanding the development of individual players relative to their status on the age distribution of players in their player pool.
It is like the oldest are starting to ride a bike with a push while the youngest have to start with the brakes continually rubbing the tire. The youngest may get stronger but most find another sport instead.
I am sure that hearing that certain kids got opportunities not available to others can bother you because it undermines your belief that everyone has the same chances in life, unfortunately this simply isn't true. Shockingly youth sports ignores RAE unless you realize that the system was setup by babyboomers who tend to ignore science so here we are. Those in winning side don't want to change the rules and those on the losing side do but nobody is trying for fairness, they all want an edge.
If RAE didn't exist would anybody care about the age change? Hell, no.
I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand.
No matter what my kid was going to make the A team. We did futsal, arena/indoor, rec, latin leagues, etc. They were the one dragging my to sign them up. They were the one getting asked by friends to guest with their team. This was all as a Sept birthday. Which is ironic because now with the BY to SY change they're going to be an absolute beast. I feel sorry for the younger players because they dont have a chance.
This is very understood by everyone who has read your attempts at cyberbullying while ruining multiple threads, "I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand."
The only person ruining threads is you.
RAE is BS because theres nothing you can do about it.
Playing on a grade down team has repercussions and is detrimental to being recruited for playing in college.
Go have your pity party somewhere else. I can show you how to get your kid on an A team. But it takes work and dedication and even with all the hard work your kid might not make it. Sorry thats just how it works. Wait until you see that A team players who dont have to work out or even train and they're naturally better than everyone on the team. What excuse will you bring out then?
Everyone here agrees that no matter how talented your kid is OR when they were born, they still have to work their tail off to achieve their best.
That said, there's plenty to do, especially now that the age groups are changing and savvy parents will be looking to maximize their kid's chances where that hard work may pay off beyond just the fun and privilege of playing a sport. Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage, in youth sports.
You keep saying RAE type things. "Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage" Again, you cant change your kids birthday so why does it matter? Using your logic if your kid is not the oldest they might as well not play.
No, but now there's a bunch of kids who might be the oldest unless their forced to play with their grade -- your big thing in this and every thread. Look, if you're right and its a burden not to play at showcases with their grad class (others here have disagreed), let those families and clubs decide that this is challenging path they want to take, instead of forcing them to be the youngest on teams -- which also is challenging in its own right.
Here's the thing if your kid isnt good enough to play on their grade A or B teams 99% chance theyre also not good enough to play on the grade down A team. So where does this leave you? Playing on the grade down B team?
Clubs and coaches wont want to waste their time with young Aug/Sept birthdays playing on grade down A teams.
Clubs want kids to play on age, great get to play up and squeaky wheels sometimes get to play up. Clubs aren't wasting their time with anyone. They are taking $3,000 more or less for a 10 month youth sport regardless of age or team level where they can cut you the next year or you can leave on your own or you can come back the next year and start the process over again. No loyalty on either side.
Its way easier to say players in X grade go over there and Y grade come with us during tryouts.
Exactly, group everyone with the correct grade player pool from the beginning. Then clubs wont need to address it later when players are looking to get recruited to play in college.
Oh crazy August guy you are at least predictable.
There's already been one commenter saying this is what they're club plans to do. More will announce this policy. Also in a couple of years parents will get the hint that clubs are grouping players by grade even if they dont say it outloud. The more competitive a club is the more likely they'll be grouping players by grade.
What does competitiveness have to do with school grade?
Competitiveness is based on team and individual skills with coaching that matches the opponents to a certain level
Sigh... Obviously your kid doesnt play on a top team.
When clubs are more competitive it means they will field better teams. More wins brings more competition for positions and roster spots. If a club across the board has 5-10 possibilities for every position they wont waste their time with grade older players playing down. The less competitive clubs will see what the more competitive clubs are doing and follow suit. Eventually all that will be left are the bottom of the barrel clubs that are just looking for bodies and will have no issues with players playing down a grade. Mostly because they have no other options.
Sigh, ugh, sigh ugh. Your kid obviously doesn't play on a top team in a top league in a top area at a top position. These teams want wins and trophies, they will have half the team as August kids whatever grade as long as they are the oldest. Welcome to the real world.
Sorry to be the one that shines the light of reality into your world. Unfortunately some people you just cant reach.
Anonymous wrote:The one part I am not sure how it will plan out are kid who are young for their team but a grade older than the other Q4s. For example, a September birthday who is in 6th grade. Do they stay with the 6th graders or have an option to play with 5th graders? If the intent is for school year alignment then it seems that there is two cascading criteria, but I am not sure if this is a hard or soft rule. Birthday and then school year or is really only based on your birthday.
Clubs that want to set their players up for being recruited and playing in college will put young Aug/Sept birthday players on the team thats their grade in school.
So you are saying it is a soft rule (ie at the discretion of each club) vs hard. Does anyone know that for fact? I think this has a big part in the spirit of the conversation you are having with your kid.
The way it worked pre 2017 (went clubs switched to BY) was the "better" higher level of competition clubs would always roster younger than the eligibility window players with their grade in school team. Other not as competitive clubs would let players play down a grade but everyone knew that if this player wanted to get recruited and play in college that they'd have to play up with their grade eventually. When this happens its usually easiest to switch clubs. So in the end it just makes more sense to roster young grade up players on the A or B team thats their grade in school.
One other thing, ten years ago there wasnt such a push by parents to redshirt and play down. In fact it was the opposite everyone wanted to play up which is sonehting US Soccer exploited to implement BY.
Wasn't true for my kids teams. All age based in SY.
Were your clubs top teams DA at the time?
Can you point to a doc or website where DA played on grade instead of age?
People weren't interested in playing down back then. It just wasnt something you ran into very often. If anything you'd hear about players playing up a grade and graduating HS early to play at some super college.
If this was true, it was a flaw in the system, because it put some kids at a disadvantage, making them the youngest on the team, younger than other states. A very few may have battled through and became tremendous players as a result (known as the underdog effect), but it was at the cost of others who may have been decent prospects but cycled out of the sport as a result. Leaving it up to the clubs and families makes a lot of sense.
If all players played on the same team this would be true. But because there's B team it doesn't make sense. You need to look more closely at all the RAE "proof" you cant live without. Almost all of it is geared to National Team selection only. Which means it doesn't consider B teams.
Not true, nice try.
Very true. Go ahead try and find a RAE paper or website that considers B teams as an alternate for youger players that aren't big/good enough for the A team. It doesn't exist because if you bring B teams into the discussion RAE doesnt work.
If players are young and not good enough for the A team playing on the B team will let them get more touches and develop more as a player. When they get older being younger evens out but the B team player has had the opportunity to be the top player on the team for multiple seasons. Once they jump up to the A team they'll be primed to work for a top position on the A team becasue thats what theyre used to.
RAE doesn't go away when kids get older. Top teams are over indexed on older kids in the age cohort. Period. Has nothing to do with your B team mumbo jumbo. Your Horatio Alger tale of B team to A team is a silly myth.
Go ahead try to find a RAE publication that includes B teams in the assessment. It doesnt exist because RAE falls appart if you include B teams. With the assumption that B team players will become A team players when they're older and the same size as everyone else on the team.
You are arguing that top teams will have a relatively even distribution after puberty presumably as B team players move to the top team. But the data doesn't back this up. The top teams remain skewed toward the older side of the age cohort. Essentially, the definition of RAE.
Do you admit that B team players if they're good will find their way to the A team as they ger older?
My experience has been that this happens with about half the team. Some of the B team players are older and some are younger. It's been about even.
If you think about it the younger aug/sept players that could play on a grade down A team would probabaly be the leaders on a correct grade B team. These are the ones most likely to be moved up to correct grade A team. Keep in mind that just because you want to play on a grade down A team doesnt mean that your kid will make the team.
2nd team players get labelled 2nd players via coach lock and the fact that clubs want to increase revenue by bringing in players to the first team rather than promoting within. Second team players are younger than first team players in an age cohort, again by RAE definition. Being on the first team is crucial to maximizing one's youth soccer outcome.
PP is exactly right. I am a data scientist. RAE is real. It's meant to be interpreted at a population level but you can see it play out on teams in the area, including ours. And coach bias is real too. Once a B team player by HS, it is next to impossible to move up. Your coaching has been worse, your teammates are worse, and the field competition has been worse. You have had fewer practices, games, and showcases. You are trying to play catch-up to kids that have had the top of all of this probably for several years. It can happen, but odds are not in your favor. That's RAE and coach bias in action.
As a Molecular Rocket Engineer/Scientist you are wrong. As has been stated multiple times top players will find an A team to play on. It might not be at your club it also might also be at your club. Coaches are always looking for a way to win (believe it or not). What do you think woukd happen if an A team player guested with the B team and tried their hardest at a game. Most likely if they were a forward they would score at will. If they were a mid or defender they would win every 1on1 and control the field. This is why they play on the A team and this is also why B team players play on the B team. By the time players get to HS players have been sorted by physical ability. It has nothing to do with coaching.
if you want to see the reason A team players are on the A team and B team players are on the B team. Watch High School soccer tryouts. They all play each other and Its obvious which players are better and which are worse.
This is sorta true, except the part where half the B team has the youngest players in the player pool AND those kids are the ones more likely to play on varsity as freshmen, at least under the BY system. (Also, some A team players skip HS altogether).
This is the problem with RAE its a super excuse that can be used to justify anything.
Are there winners / losers in the birthday lottery? Yes
Does complaining about RAE change anything? No
Everyone has natural talent and abilities. For some its going to be playing soccer. Some will get lucky and be the oldest. Some will be natualy talented and the youngest. Either way both of these players will need to work their butts off to maintain their spot on the A team. I think its disingenuous to say that players are only on the A team because of when they were born. Everyone has opportunities its what you make of them that sets players appart.
RAE isn't being used as an excuse. It is a factor in understanding the development of individual players relative to their status on the age distribution of players in their player pool.
It is like the oldest are starting to ride a bike with a push while the youngest have to start with the brakes continually rubbing the tire. The youngest may get stronger but most find another sport instead.
I am sure that hearing that certain kids got opportunities not available to others can bother you because it undermines your belief that everyone has the same chances in life, unfortunately this simply isn't true. Shockingly youth sports ignores RAE unless you realize that the system was setup by babyboomers who tend to ignore science so here we are. Those in winning side don't want to change the rules and those on the losing side do but nobody is trying for fairness, they all want an edge.
If RAE didn't exist would anybody care about the age change? Hell, no.
I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand.
No matter what my kid was going to make the A team. We did futsal, arena/indoor, rec, latin leagues, etc. They were the one dragging my to sign them up. They were the one getting asked by friends to guest with their team. This was all as a Sept birthday. Which is ironic because now with the BY to SY change they're going to be an absolute beast. I feel sorry for the younger players because they dont have a chance.
This is very understood by everyone who has read your attempts at cyberbullying while ruining multiple threads, "I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand."
The only person ruining threads is you.
RAE is BS because theres nothing you can do about it.
Playing on a grade down team has repercussions and is detrimental to being recruited for playing in college.
Go have your pity party somewhere else. I can show you how to get your kid on an A team. But it takes work and dedication and even with all the hard work your kid might not make it. Sorry thats just how it works. Wait until you see that A team players who dont have to work out or even train and they're naturally better than everyone on the team. What excuse will you bring out then?
Everyone here agrees that no matter how talented your kid is OR when they were born, they still have to work their tail off to achieve their best.
That said, there's plenty to do, especially now that the age groups are changing and savvy parents will be looking to maximize their kid's chances where that hard work may pay off beyond just the fun and privilege of playing a sport. Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage, in youth sports.
You keep saying RAE type things. "Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage" Again, you cant change your kids birthday so why does it matter? Using your logic if your kid is not the oldest they might as well not play.
New entrant to the discussion. I acknowledge RAE exists but I don’t pay attention to it because I can’t control it. If people studied more sports psychology about belief and why you can achieve something, you would be more successful than believing in some theory of why your child is bound to fail.
My kid is a Q4 2014. I never paid attention to her birthday at all until this fall when we were doing middle school shopping and noticed all of her old teammates were already in middle school. I then began to process that she is technically a 2015 per the school classes.
While she is middle of the pack, 1st team on a big club, she will be the number #1 or #2 if she repeats U12. Her skill is the same but she is simply at the top of the band and not the bottom.
Now, it will not matter just like I never accepted excuses that she was younger in our current system. When she played bigger girls, I taught her to scan and play with anticipation. She can’t change being slight. She can learn how to beat Goliath. I imagine my daughter will now be the Goliath if we repeat U12 and there will be Q2 2015’s coming after her if she does not continue to develop.
Since you are happy with your club, sure, it won't impact your Q4. But for Q4s at smaller clubs or one of the 2nd teams, it may allow them the opportunity to play on better teams and/or in better leagues. And that absolutely matters for recruiting purposes (if that is their goal). Playing in a higher league is the difference between a college coach reading your email and one just deleting it (even if the players are exactly the same). The difference between a coach coming to your showcase game or not.
Everything you mentioned is passive. That’s why my kid is where she is. We control it and are proactive.
We don’t wait for anything. My kids spot for next year will be known by February. We don’t like our club and are moving. The Q2 kids should spend more time on the pitch this winter than complaining about the rules and they could have similar options.
Recruiting will be similar to the club process. If a college coach is not responding to my kids email and videos, I can see when the schools games are. I have easily met D1 players after games and their parents. If I am not getting a response from a school, it is easy to get a USB drive with my highlights, get it in someone’s hands or simply a card with a website with my kids CV. If a school doubts the level my kids plays at, bring them to an ID event or invite them to a practice. My kid is okay with being embarrassed. Even if my kid is a high school sophomore competing against college sophomores, a coach will like my kids gonads over your ivory tower approach. Colleges want kids who are hungry and tenacious. They are the leaders of the future. Not the child of a kid making excuses on an anonymous board. This is a peak into how level kids and families operate. I have learned in business and speaking with families of high level players who have come before me. What are you going to do with this information?
Yeah, pretty sedintary attitude accepting Feb. They need to be more proactive to get ahead. Gotta have a CV ready for a kindergarten if you expect them to ever work.
The really ambitious parents already sent their kids to play club in Europe!
Anonymous wrote:The one part I am not sure how it will plan out are kid who are young for their team but a grade older than the other Q4s. For example, a September birthday who is in 6th grade. Do they stay with the 6th graders or have an option to play with 5th graders? If the intent is for school year alignment then it seems that there is two cascading criteria, but I am not sure if this is a hard or soft rule. Birthday and then school year or is really only based on your birthday.
Clubs that want to set their players up for being recruited and playing in college will put young Aug/Sept birthday players on the team thats their grade in school.
So you are saying it is a soft rule (ie at the discretion of each club) vs hard. Does anyone know that for fact? I think this has a big part in the spirit of the conversation you are having with your kid.
The way it worked pre 2017 (went clubs switched to BY) was the "better" higher level of competition clubs would always roster younger than the eligibility window players with their grade in school team. Other not as competitive clubs would let players play down a grade but everyone knew that if this player wanted to get recruited and play in college that they'd have to play up with their grade eventually. When this happens its usually easiest to switch clubs. So in the end it just makes more sense to roster young grade up players on the A or B team thats their grade in school.
One other thing, ten years ago there wasnt such a push by parents to redshirt and play down. In fact it was the opposite everyone wanted to play up which is sonehting US Soccer exploited to implement BY.
Wasn't true for my kids teams. All age based in SY.
Were your clubs top teams DA at the time?
Can you point to a doc or website where DA played on grade instead of age?
People weren't interested in playing down back then. It just wasnt something you ran into very often. If anything you'd hear about players playing up a grade and graduating HS early to play at some super college.
If this was true, it was a flaw in the system, because it put some kids at a disadvantage, making them the youngest on the team, younger than other states. A very few may have battled through and became tremendous players as a result (known as the underdog effect), but it was at the cost of others who may have been decent prospects but cycled out of the sport as a result. Leaving it up to the clubs and families makes a lot of sense.
If all players played on the same team this would be true. But because there's B team it doesn't make sense. You need to look more closely at all the RAE "proof" you cant live without. Almost all of it is geared to National Team selection only. Which means it doesn't consider B teams.
Not true, nice try.
Very true. Go ahead try and find a RAE paper or website that considers B teams as an alternate for youger players that aren't big/good enough for the A team. It doesn't exist because if you bring B teams into the discussion RAE doesnt work.
If players are young and not good enough for the A team playing on the B team will let them get more touches and develop more as a player. When they get older being younger evens out but the B team player has had the opportunity to be the top player on the team for multiple seasons. Once they jump up to the A team they'll be primed to work for a top position on the A team becasue thats what theyre used to.
RAE doesn't go away when kids get older. Top teams are over indexed on older kids in the age cohort. Period. Has nothing to do with your B team mumbo jumbo. Your Horatio Alger tale of B team to A team is a silly myth.
Go ahead try to find a RAE publication that includes B teams in the assessment. It doesnt exist because RAE falls appart if you include B teams. With the assumption that B team players will become A team players when they're older and the same size as everyone else on the team.
You are arguing that top teams will have a relatively even distribution after puberty presumably as B team players move to the top team. But the data doesn't back this up. The top teams remain skewed toward the older side of the age cohort. Essentially, the definition of RAE.
Do you admit that B team players if they're good will find their way to the A team as they ger older?
My experience has been that this happens with about half the team. Some of the B team players are older and some are younger. It's been about even.
If you think about it the younger aug/sept players that could play on a grade down A team would probabaly be the leaders on a correct grade B team. These are the ones most likely to be moved up to correct grade A team. Keep in mind that just because you want to play on a grade down A team doesnt mean that your kid will make the team.
2nd team players get labelled 2nd players via coach lock and the fact that clubs want to increase revenue by bringing in players to the first team rather than promoting within. Second team players are younger than first team players in an age cohort, again by RAE definition. Being on the first team is crucial to maximizing one's youth soccer outcome.
PP is exactly right. I am a data scientist. RAE is real. It's meant to be interpreted at a population level but you can see it play out on teams in the area, including ours. And coach bias is real too. Once a B team player by HS, it is next to impossible to move up. Your coaching has been worse, your teammates are worse, and the field competition has been worse. You have had fewer practices, games, and showcases. You are trying to play catch-up to kids that have had the top of all of this probably for several years. It can happen, but odds are not in your favor. That's RAE and coach bias in action.
As a Molecular Rocket Engineer/Scientist you are wrong. As has been stated multiple times top players will find an A team to play on. It might not be at your club it also might also be at your club. Coaches are always looking for a way to win (believe it or not). What do you think woukd happen if an A team player guested with the B team and tried their hardest at a game. Most likely if they were a forward they would score at will. If they were a mid or defender they would win every 1on1 and control the field. This is why they play on the A team and this is also why B team players play on the B team. By the time players get to HS players have been sorted by physical ability. It has nothing to do with coaching.
if you want to see the reason A team players are on the A team and B team players are on the B team. Watch High School soccer tryouts. They all play each other and Its obvious which players are better and which are worse.
This is sorta true, except the part where half the B team has the youngest players in the player pool AND those kids are the ones more likely to play on varsity as freshmen, at least under the BY system. (Also, some A team players skip HS altogether).
This is the problem with RAE its a super excuse that can be used to justify anything.
Are there winners / losers in the birthday lottery? Yes
Does complaining about RAE change anything? No
Everyone has natural talent and abilities. For some its going to be playing soccer. Some will get lucky and be the oldest. Some will be natualy talented and the youngest. Either way both of these players will need to work their butts off to maintain their spot on the A team. I think its disingenuous to say that players are only on the A team because of when they were born. Everyone has opportunities its what you make of them that sets players appart.
RAE isn't being used as an excuse. It is a factor in understanding the development of individual players relative to their status on the age distribution of players in their player pool.
It is like the oldest are starting to ride a bike with a push while the youngest have to start with the brakes continually rubbing the tire. The youngest may get stronger but most find another sport instead.
I am sure that hearing that certain kids got opportunities not available to others can bother you because it undermines your belief that everyone has the same chances in life, unfortunately this simply isn't true. Shockingly youth sports ignores RAE unless you realize that the system was setup by babyboomers who tend to ignore science so here we are. Those in winning side don't want to change the rules and those on the losing side do but nobody is trying for fairness, they all want an edge.
If RAE didn't exist would anybody care about the age change? Hell, no.
I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand.
No matter what my kid was going to make the A team. We did futsal, arena/indoor, rec, latin leagues, etc. They were the one dragging my to sign them up. They were the one getting asked by friends to guest with their team. This was all as a Sept birthday. Which is ironic because now with the BY to SY change they're going to be an absolute beast. I feel sorry for the younger players because they dont have a chance.
This is very understood by everyone who has read your attempts at cyberbullying while ruining multiple threads, "I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand."
The only person ruining threads is you.
RAE is BS because theres nothing you can do about it.
Playing on a grade down team has repercussions and is detrimental to being recruited for playing in college.
Go have your pity party somewhere else. I can show you how to get your kid on an A team. But it takes work and dedication and even with all the hard work your kid might not make it. Sorry thats just how it works. Wait until you see that A team players who dont have to work out or even train and they're naturally better than everyone on the team. What excuse will you bring out then?
Everyone here agrees that no matter how talented your kid is OR when they were born, they still have to work their tail off to achieve their best.
That said, there's plenty to do, especially now that the age groups are changing and savvy parents will be looking to maximize their kid's chances where that hard work may pay off beyond just the fun and privilege of playing a sport. Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage, in youth sports.
You keep saying RAE type things. "Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage" Again, you cant change your kids birthday so why does it matter? Using your logic if your kid is not the oldest they might as well not play.
No, but now there's a bunch of kids who might be the oldest unless their forced to play with their grade -- your big thing in this and every thread. Look, if you're right and its a burden not to play at showcases with their grad class (others here have disagreed), let those families and clubs decide that this is challenging path they want to take, instead of forcing them to be the youngest on teams -- which also is challenging in its own right.
Here's the thing if your kid isnt good enough to play on their grade A or B teams 99% chance theyre also not good enough to play on the grade down A team. So where does this leave you? Playing on the grade down B team?
Clubs and coaches wont want to waste their time with young Aug/Sept birthdays playing on grade down A teams.
Clubs want kids to play on age, great get to play up and squeaky wheels sometimes get to play up. Clubs aren't wasting their time with anyone. They are taking $3,000 more or less for a 10 month youth sport regardless of age or team level where they can cut you the next year or you can leave on your own or you can come back the next year and start the process over again. No loyalty on either side.
Its way easier to say players in X grade go over there and Y grade come with us during tryouts.
Exactly, group everyone with the correct grade player pool from the beginning. Then clubs wont need to address it later when players are looking to get recruited to play in college.
Oh crazy August guy you are at least predictable.
There's already been one commenter saying this is what they're club plans to do. More will announce this policy. Also in a couple of years parents will get the hint that clubs are grouping players by grade even if they dont say it outloud. The more competitive a club is the more likely they'll be grouping players by grade.
What does competitiveness have to do with school grade?
Competitiveness is based on team and individual skills with coaching that matches the opponents to a certain level
Sigh... Obviously your kid doesnt play on a top team.
When clubs are more competitive it means they will field better teams. More wins brings more competition for positions and roster spots. If a club across the board has 5-10 possibilities for every position they wont waste their time with grade older players playing down. The less competitive clubs will see what the more competitive clubs are doing and follow suit. Eventually all that will be left are the bottom of the barrel clubs that are just looking for bodies and will have no issues with players playing down a grade. Mostly because they have no other options.
Sigh, ugh, sigh ugh. Your kid obviously doesn't play on a top team in a top league in a top area at a top position. These teams want wins and trophies, they will have half the team as August kids whatever grade as long as they are the oldest. Welcome to the real world.
Sorry to be the one that shines the light of reality into your world. Unfortunately some people you just cant reach.
I'd say we don't have "a failure to communicate." We just disagree about what will happen. This thread is more useful when we give it room to allow people to share what's actually happening. Our round and round about this just makes it not helpful for people trying to learn anything new.
Anonymous wrote:The one part I am not sure how it will plan out are kid who are young for their team but a grade older than the other Q4s. For example, a September birthday who is in 6th grade. Do they stay with the 6th graders or have an option to play with 5th graders? If the intent is for school year alignment then it seems that there is two cascading criteria, but I am not sure if this is a hard or soft rule. Birthday and then school year or is really only based on your birthday.
Clubs that want to set their players up for being recruited and playing in college will put young Aug/Sept birthday players on the team thats their grade in school.
So you are saying it is a soft rule (ie at the discretion of each club) vs hard. Does anyone know that for fact? I think this has a big part in the spirit of the conversation you are having with your kid.
The way it worked pre 2017 (went clubs switched to BY) was the "better" higher level of competition clubs would always roster younger than the eligibility window players with their grade in school team. Other not as competitive clubs would let players play down a grade but everyone knew that if this player wanted to get recruited and play in college that they'd have to play up with their grade eventually. When this happens its usually easiest to switch clubs. So in the end it just makes more sense to roster young grade up players on the A or B team thats their grade in school.
One other thing, ten years ago there wasnt such a push by parents to redshirt and play down. In fact it was the opposite everyone wanted to play up which is sonehting US Soccer exploited to implement BY.
Wasn't true for my kids teams. All age based in SY.
Were your clubs top teams DA at the time?
Can you point to a doc or website where DA played on grade instead of age?
People weren't interested in playing down back then. It just wasnt something you ran into very often. If anything you'd hear about players playing up a grade and graduating HS early to play at some super college.
If this was true, it was a flaw in the system, because it put some kids at a disadvantage, making them the youngest on the team, younger than other states. A very few may have battled through and became tremendous players as a result (known as the underdog effect), but it was at the cost of others who may have been decent prospects but cycled out of the sport as a result. Leaving it up to the clubs and families makes a lot of sense.
If all players played on the same team this would be true. But because there's B team it doesn't make sense. You need to look more closely at all the RAE "proof" you cant live without. Almost all of it is geared to National Team selection only. Which means it doesn't consider B teams.
Not true, nice try.
Very true. Go ahead try and find a RAE paper or website that considers B teams as an alternate for youger players that aren't big/good enough for the A team. It doesn't exist because if you bring B teams into the discussion RAE doesnt work.
If players are young and not good enough for the A team playing on the B team will let them get more touches and develop more as a player. When they get older being younger evens out but the B team player has had the opportunity to be the top player on the team for multiple seasons. Once they jump up to the A team they'll be primed to work for a top position on the A team becasue thats what theyre used to.
RAE doesn't go away when kids get older. Top teams are over indexed on older kids in the age cohort. Period. Has nothing to do with your B team mumbo jumbo. Your Horatio Alger tale of B team to A team is a silly myth.
Go ahead try to find a RAE publication that includes B teams in the assessment. It doesnt exist because RAE falls appart if you include B teams. With the assumption that B team players will become A team players when they're older and the same size as everyone else on the team.
You are arguing that top teams will have a relatively even distribution after puberty presumably as B team players move to the top team. But the data doesn't back this up. The top teams remain skewed toward the older side of the age cohort. Essentially, the definition of RAE.
Do you admit that B team players if they're good will find their way to the A team as they ger older?
My experience has been that this happens with about half the team. Some of the B team players are older and some are younger. It's been about even.
If you think about it the younger aug/sept players that could play on a grade down A team would probabaly be the leaders on a correct grade B team. These are the ones most likely to be moved up to correct grade A team. Keep in mind that just because you want to play on a grade down A team doesnt mean that your kid will make the team.
2nd team players get labelled 2nd players via coach lock and the fact that clubs want to increase revenue by bringing in players to the first team rather than promoting within. Second team players are younger than first team players in an age cohort, again by RAE definition. Being on the first team is crucial to maximizing one's youth soccer outcome.
PP is exactly right. I am a data scientist. RAE is real. It's meant to be interpreted at a population level but you can see it play out on teams in the area, including ours. And coach bias is real too. Once a B team player by HS, it is next to impossible to move up. Your coaching has been worse, your teammates are worse, and the field competition has been worse. You have had fewer practices, games, and showcases. You are trying to play catch-up to kids that have had the top of all of this probably for several years. It can happen, but odds are not in your favor. That's RAE and coach bias in action.
As a Molecular Rocket Engineer/Scientist you are wrong. As has been stated multiple times top players will find an A team to play on. It might not be at your club it also might also be at your club. Coaches are always looking for a way to win (believe it or not). What do you think woukd happen if an A team player guested with the B team and tried their hardest at a game. Most likely if they were a forward they would score at will. If they were a mid or defender they would win every 1on1 and control the field. This is why they play on the A team and this is also why B team players play on the B team. By the time players get to HS players have been sorted by physical ability. It has nothing to do with coaching.
if you want to see the reason A team players are on the A team and B team players are on the B team. Watch High School soccer tryouts. They all play each other and Its obvious which players are better and which are worse.
This is sorta true, except the part where half the B team has the youngest players in the player pool AND those kids are the ones more likely to play on varsity as freshmen, at least under the BY system. (Also, some A team players skip HS altogether).
This is the problem with RAE its a super excuse that can be used to justify anything.
Are there winners / losers in the birthday lottery? Yes
Does complaining about RAE change anything? No
Everyone has natural talent and abilities. For some its going to be playing soccer. Some will get lucky and be the oldest. Some will be natualy talented and the youngest. Either way both of these players will need to work their butts off to maintain their spot on the A team. I think its disingenuous to say that players are only on the A team because of when they were born. Everyone has opportunities its what you make of them that sets players appart.
RAE isn't being used as an excuse. It is a factor in understanding the development of individual players relative to their status on the age distribution of players in their player pool.
It is like the oldest are starting to ride a bike with a push while the youngest have to start with the brakes continually rubbing the tire. The youngest may get stronger but most find another sport instead.
I am sure that hearing that certain kids got opportunities not available to others can bother you because it undermines your belief that everyone has the same chances in life, unfortunately this simply isn't true. Shockingly youth sports ignores RAE unless you realize that the system was setup by babyboomers who tend to ignore science so here we are. Those in winning side don't want to change the rules and those on the losing side do but nobody is trying for fairness, they all want an edge.
If RAE didn't exist would anybody care about the age change? Hell, no.
I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand.
No matter what my kid was going to make the A team. We did futsal, arena/indoor, rec, latin leagues, etc. They were the one dragging my to sign them up. They were the one getting asked by friends to guest with their team. This was all as a Sept birthday. Which is ironic because now with the BY to SY change they're going to be an absolute beast. I feel sorry for the younger players because they dont have a chance.
This is very understood by everyone who has read your attempts at cyberbullying while ruining multiple threads, "I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand."
The only person ruining threads is you.
RAE is BS because theres nothing you can do about it.
Playing on a grade down team has repercussions and is detrimental to being recruited for playing in college.
Go have your pity party somewhere else. I can show you how to get your kid on an A team. But it takes work and dedication and even with all the hard work your kid might not make it. Sorry thats just how it works. Wait until you see that A team players who dont have to work out or even train and they're naturally better than everyone on the team. What excuse will you bring out then?
Everyone here agrees that no matter how talented your kid is OR when they were born, they still have to work their tail off to achieve their best.
That said, there's plenty to do, especially now that the age groups are changing and savvy parents will be looking to maximize their kid's chances where that hard work may pay off beyond just the fun and privilege of playing a sport. Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage, in youth sports.
You keep saying RAE type things. "Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage" Again, you cant change your kids birthday so why does it matter? Using your logic if your kid is not the oldest they might as well not play.
No, but now there's a bunch of kids who might be the oldest unless their forced to play with their grade -- your big thing in this and every thread. Look, if you're right and its a burden not to play at showcases with their grad class (others here have disagreed), let those families and clubs decide that this is challenging path they want to take, instead of forcing them to be the youngest on teams -- which also is challenging in its own right.
Here's the thing if your kid isnt good enough to play on their grade A or B teams 99% chance theyre also not good enough to play on the grade down A team. So where does this leave you? Playing on the grade down B team?
Clubs and coaches wont want to waste their time with young Aug/Sept birthdays playing on grade down A teams.
Clubs want kids to play on age, great get to play up and squeaky wheels sometimes get to play up. Clubs aren't wasting their time with anyone. They are taking $3,000 more or less for a 10 month youth sport regardless of age or team level where they can cut you the next year or you can leave on your own or you can come back the next year and start the process over again. No loyalty on either side.
Its way easier to say players in X grade go over there and Y grade come with us during tryouts.
Exactly, group everyone with the correct grade player pool from the beginning. Then clubs wont need to address it later when players are looking to get recruited to play in college.
Oh crazy August guy you are at least predictable.
There's already been one commenter saying this is what they're club plans to do. More will announce this policy. Also in a couple of years parents will get the hint that clubs are grouping players by grade even if they dont say it outloud. The more competitive a club is the more likely they'll be grouping players by grade.
What does competitiveness have to do with school grade?
Competitiveness is based on team and individual skills with coaching that matches the opponents to a certain level
Sigh... Obviously your kid doesnt play on a top team.
When clubs are more competitive it means they will field better teams. More wins brings more competition for positions and roster spots. If a club across the board has 5-10 possibilities for every position they wont waste their time with grade older players playing down. The less competitive clubs will see what the more competitive clubs are doing and follow suit. Eventually all that will be left are the bottom of the barrel clubs that are just looking for bodies and will have no issues with players playing down a grade. Mostly because they have no other options.
Sigh, ugh, sigh ugh. Your kid obviously doesn't play on a top team in a top league in a top area at a top position. These teams want wins and trophies, they will have half the team as August kids whatever grade as long as they are the oldest. Welcome to the real world.
Sorry to be the one that shines the light of reality into your world. Unfortunately some people you just cant reach.
Dude, you are trying to convince random strangers of a written rule that you can't cite when everyone is telling you to take off the rose colored glasses you are trying to use protect your DD from competition. Not going to work.
Anonymous wrote:The one part I am not sure how it will plan out are kid who are young for their team but a grade older than the other Q4s. For example, a September birthday who is in 6th grade. Do they stay with the 6th graders or have an option to play with 5th graders? If the intent is for school year alignment then it seems that there is two cascading criteria, but I am not sure if this is a hard or soft rule. Birthday and then school year or is really only based on your birthday.
Clubs that want to set their players up for being recruited and playing in college will put young Aug/Sept birthday players on the team thats their grade in school.
So you are saying it is a soft rule (ie at the discretion of each club) vs hard. Does anyone know that for fact? I think this has a big part in the spirit of the conversation you are having with your kid.
The way it worked pre 2017 (went clubs switched to BY) was the "better" higher level of competition clubs would always roster younger than the eligibility window players with their grade in school team. Other not as competitive clubs would let players play down a grade but everyone knew that if this player wanted to get recruited and play in college that they'd have to play up with their grade eventually. When this happens its usually easiest to switch clubs. So in the end it just makes more sense to roster young grade up players on the A or B team thats their grade in school.
One other thing, ten years ago there wasnt such a push by parents to redshirt and play down. In fact it was the opposite everyone wanted to play up which is sonehting US Soccer exploited to implement BY.
Wasn't true for my kids teams. All age based in SY.
Were your clubs top teams DA at the time?
Can you point to a doc or website where DA played on grade instead of age?
People weren't interested in playing down back then. It just wasnt something you ran into very often. If anything you'd hear about players playing up a grade and graduating HS early to play at some super college.
If this was true, it was a flaw in the system, because it put some kids at a disadvantage, making them the youngest on the team, younger than other states. A very few may have battled through and became tremendous players as a result (known as the underdog effect), but it was at the cost of others who may have been decent prospects but cycled out of the sport as a result. Leaving it up to the clubs and families makes a lot of sense.
If all players played on the same team this would be true. But because there's B team it doesn't make sense. You need to look more closely at all the RAE "proof" you cant live without. Almost all of it is geared to National Team selection only. Which means it doesn't consider B teams.
Not true, nice try.
Very true. Go ahead try and find a RAE paper or website that considers B teams as an alternate for youger players that aren't big/good enough for the A team. It doesn't exist because if you bring B teams into the discussion RAE doesnt work.
If players are young and not good enough for the A team playing on the B team will let them get more touches and develop more as a player. When they get older being younger evens out but the B team player has had the opportunity to be the top player on the team for multiple seasons. Once they jump up to the A team they'll be primed to work for a top position on the A team becasue thats what theyre used to.
RAE doesn't go away when kids get older. Top teams are over indexed on older kids in the age cohort. Period. Has nothing to do with your B team mumbo jumbo. Your Horatio Alger tale of B team to A team is a silly myth.
Go ahead try to find a RAE publication that includes B teams in the assessment. It doesnt exist because RAE falls appart if you include B teams. With the assumption that B team players will become A team players when they're older and the same size as everyone else on the team.
You are arguing that top teams will have a relatively even distribution after puberty presumably as B team players move to the top team. But the data doesn't back this up. The top teams remain skewed toward the older side of the age cohort. Essentially, the definition of RAE.
Do you admit that B team players if they're good will find their way to the A team as they ger older?
My experience has been that this happens with about half the team. Some of the B team players are older and some are younger. It's been about even.
If you think about it the younger aug/sept players that could play on a grade down A team would probabaly be the leaders on a correct grade B team. These are the ones most likely to be moved up to correct grade A team. Keep in mind that just because you want to play on a grade down A team doesnt mean that your kid will make the team.
2nd team players get labelled 2nd players via coach lock and the fact that clubs want to increase revenue by bringing in players to the first team rather than promoting within. Second team players are younger than first team players in an age cohort, again by RAE definition. Being on the first team is crucial to maximizing one's youth soccer outcome.
PP is exactly right. I am a data scientist. RAE is real. It's meant to be interpreted at a population level but you can see it play out on teams in the area, including ours. And coach bias is real too. Once a B team player by HS, it is next to impossible to move up. Your coaching has been worse, your teammates are worse, and the field competition has been worse. You have had fewer practices, games, and showcases. You are trying to play catch-up to kids that have had the top of all of this probably for several years. It can happen, but odds are not in your favor. That's RAE and coach bias in action.
As a Molecular Rocket Engineer/Scientist you are wrong. As has been stated multiple times top players will find an A team to play on. It might not be at your club it also might also be at your club. Coaches are always looking for a way to win (believe it or not). What do you think woukd happen if an A team player guested with the B team and tried their hardest at a game. Most likely if they were a forward they would score at will. If they were a mid or defender they would win every 1on1 and control the field. This is why they play on the A team and this is also why B team players play on the B team. By the time players get to HS players have been sorted by physical ability. It has nothing to do with coaching.
if you want to see the reason A team players are on the A team and B team players are on the B team. Watch High School soccer tryouts. They all play each other and Its obvious which players are better and which are worse.
This is sorta true, except the part where half the B team has the youngest players in the player pool AND those kids are the ones more likely to play on varsity as freshmen, at least under the BY system. (Also, some A team players skip HS altogether).
This is the problem with RAE its a super excuse that can be used to justify anything.
Are there winners / losers in the birthday lottery? Yes
Does complaining about RAE change anything? No
Everyone has natural talent and abilities. For some its going to be playing soccer. Some will get lucky and be the oldest. Some will be natualy talented and the youngest. Either way both of these players will need to work their butts off to maintain their spot on the A team. I think its disingenuous to say that players are only on the A team because of when they were born. Everyone has opportunities its what you make of them that sets players appart.
RAE isn't being used as an excuse. It is a factor in understanding the development of individual players relative to their status on the age distribution of players in their player pool.
It is like the oldest are starting to ride a bike with a push while the youngest have to start with the brakes continually rubbing the tire. The youngest may get stronger but most find another sport instead.
I am sure that hearing that certain kids got opportunities not available to others can bother you because it undermines your belief that everyone has the same chances in life, unfortunately this simply isn't true. Shockingly youth sports ignores RAE unless you realize that the system was setup by babyboomers who tend to ignore science so here we are. Those in winning side don't want to change the rules and those on the losing side do but nobody is trying for fairness, they all want an edge.
If RAE didn't exist would anybody care about the age change? Hell, no.
I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand.
No matter what my kid was going to make the A team. We did futsal, arena/indoor, rec, latin leagues, etc. They were the one dragging my to sign them up. They were the one getting asked by friends to guest with their team. This was all as a Sept birthday. Which is ironic because now with the BY to SY change they're going to be an absolute beast. I feel sorry for the younger players because they dont have a chance.
This is very understood by everyone who has read your attempts at cyberbullying while ruining multiple threads, "I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand."
The only person ruining threads is you.
RAE is BS because theres nothing you can do about it.
Playing on a grade down team has repercussions and is detrimental to being recruited for playing in college.
Go have your pity party somewhere else. I can show you how to get your kid on an A team. But it takes work and dedication and even with all the hard work your kid might not make it. Sorry thats just how it works. Wait until you see that A team players who dont have to work out or even train and they're naturally better than everyone on the team. What excuse will you bring out then?
Everyone here agrees that no matter how talented your kid is OR when they were born, they still have to work their tail off to achieve their best.
That said, there's plenty to do, especially now that the age groups are changing and savvy parents will be looking to maximize their kid's chances where that hard work may pay off beyond just the fun and privilege of playing a sport. Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage, in youth sports.
You keep saying RAE type things. "Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage" Again, you cant change your kids birthday so why does it matter? Using your logic if your kid is not the oldest they might as well not play.
New entrant to the discussion. I acknowledge RAE exists but I don’t pay attention to it because I can’t control it. If people studied more sports psychology about belief and why you can achieve something, you would be more successful than believing in some theory of why your child is bound to fail.
My kid is a Q4 2014. I never paid attention to her birthday at all until this fall when we were doing middle school shopping and noticed all of her old teammates were already in middle school. I then began to process that she is technically a 2015 per the school classes.
While she is middle of the pack, 1st team on a big club, she will be the number #1 or #2 if she repeats U12. Her skill is the same but she is simply at the top of the band and not the bottom.
Now, it will not matter just like I never accepted excuses that she was younger in our current system. When she played bigger girls, I taught her to scan and play with anticipation. She can’t change being slight. She can learn how to beat Goliath. I imagine my daughter will now be the Goliath if we repeat U12 and there will be Q2 2015’s coming after her if she does not continue to develop.
Since you are happy with your club, sure, it won't impact your Q4. But for Q4s at smaller clubs or one of the 2nd teams, it may allow them the opportunity to play on better teams and/or in better leagues. And that absolutely matters for recruiting purposes (if that is their goal). Playing in a higher league is the difference between a college coach reading your email and one just deleting it (even if the players are exactly the same). The difference between a coach coming to your showcase game or not.
Everything you mentioned is passive. That’s why my kid is where she is. We control it and are proactive.
We don’t wait for anything. My kids spot for next year will be known by February. We don’t like our club and are moving. The Q2 kids should spend more time on the pitch this winter than complaining about the rules and they could have similar options.
Recruiting will be similar to the club process. If a college coach is not responding to my kids email and videos, I can see when the schools games are. I have easily met D1 players after games and their parents. If I am not getting a response from a school, it is easy to get a USB drive with my highlights, get it in someone’s hands or simply a card with a website with my kids CV. If a school doubts the level my kids plays at, bring them to an ID event or invite them to a practice. My kid is okay with being embarrassed. Even if my kid is a high school sophomore competing against college sophomores, a coach will like my kids gonads over your ivory tower approach. Colleges want kids who are hungry and tenacious. They are the leaders of the future. Not the child of a kid making excuses on an anonymous board. This is a peak into how level kids and families operate. I have learned in business and speaking with families of high level players who have come before me. What are you going to do with this information?
Yeah, pretty sedintary attitude accepting Feb. They need to be more proactive to get ahead. Gotta have a CV ready for a kindergarten if you expect them to ever work.
The really ambitious parents already sent their kids to play club in Europe!
Lazy. Talk to me when they give birth to their kid in Europe and come back without them. LOL
Anonymous wrote:The one part I am not sure how it will plan out are kid who are young for their team but a grade older than the other Q4s. For example, a September birthday who is in 6th grade. Do they stay with the 6th graders or have an option to play with 5th graders? If the intent is for school year alignment then it seems that there is two cascading criteria, but I am not sure if this is a hard or soft rule. Birthday and then school year or is really only based on your birthday.
Clubs that want to set their players up for being recruited and playing in college will put young Aug/Sept birthday players on the team thats their grade in school.
So you are saying it is a soft rule (ie at the discretion of each club) vs hard. Does anyone know that for fact? I think this has a big part in the spirit of the conversation you are having with your kid.
The way it worked pre 2017 (went clubs switched to BY) was the "better" higher level of competition clubs would always roster younger than the eligibility window players with their grade in school team. Other not as competitive clubs would let players play down a grade but everyone knew that if this player wanted to get recruited and play in college that they'd have to play up with their grade eventually. When this happens its usually easiest to switch clubs. So in the end it just makes more sense to roster young grade up players on the A or B team thats their grade in school.
One other thing, ten years ago there wasnt such a push by parents to redshirt and play down. In fact it was the opposite everyone wanted to play up which is sonehting US Soccer exploited to implement BY.
Wasn't true for my kids teams. All age based in SY.
Were your clubs top teams DA at the time?
Can you point to a doc or website where DA played on grade instead of age?
People weren't interested in playing down back then. It just wasnt something you ran into very often. If anything you'd hear about players playing up a grade and graduating HS early to play at some super college.
If this was true, it was a flaw in the system, because it put some kids at a disadvantage, making them the youngest on the team, younger than other states. A very few may have battled through and became tremendous players as a result (known as the underdog effect), but it was at the cost of others who may have been decent prospects but cycled out of the sport as a result. Leaving it up to the clubs and families makes a lot of sense.
If all players played on the same team this would be true. But because there's B team it doesn't make sense. You need to look more closely at all the RAE "proof" you cant live without. Almost all of it is geared to National Team selection only. Which means it doesn't consider B teams.
Not true, nice try.
Very true. Go ahead try and find a RAE paper or website that considers B teams as an alternate for youger players that aren't big/good enough for the A team. It doesn't exist because if you bring B teams into the discussion RAE doesnt work.
If players are young and not good enough for the A team playing on the B team will let them get more touches and develop more as a player. When they get older being younger evens out but the B team player has had the opportunity to be the top player on the team for multiple seasons. Once they jump up to the A team they'll be primed to work for a top position on the A team becasue thats what theyre used to.
RAE doesn't go away when kids get older. Top teams are over indexed on older kids in the age cohort. Period. Has nothing to do with your B team mumbo jumbo. Your Horatio Alger tale of B team to A team is a silly myth.
Go ahead try to find a RAE publication that includes B teams in the assessment. It doesnt exist because RAE falls appart if you include B teams. With the assumption that B team players will become A team players when they're older and the same size as everyone else on the team.
You are arguing that top teams will have a relatively even distribution after puberty presumably as B team players move to the top team. But the data doesn't back this up. The top teams remain skewed toward the older side of the age cohort. Essentially, the definition of RAE.
Do you admit that B team players if they're good will find their way to the A team as they ger older?
My experience has been that this happens with about half the team. Some of the B team players are older and some are younger. It's been about even.
If you think about it the younger aug/sept players that could play on a grade down A team would probabaly be the leaders on a correct grade B team. These are the ones most likely to be moved up to correct grade A team. Keep in mind that just because you want to play on a grade down A team doesnt mean that your kid will make the team.
2nd team players get labelled 2nd players via coach lock and the fact that clubs want to increase revenue by bringing in players to the first team rather than promoting within. Second team players are younger than first team players in an age cohort, again by RAE definition. Being on the first team is crucial to maximizing one's youth soccer outcome.
PP is exactly right. I am a data scientist. RAE is real. It's meant to be interpreted at a population level but you can see it play out on teams in the area, including ours. And coach bias is real too. Once a B team player by HS, it is next to impossible to move up. Your coaching has been worse, your teammates are worse, and the field competition has been worse. You have had fewer practices, games, and showcases. You are trying to play catch-up to kids that have had the top of all of this probably for several years. It can happen, but odds are not in your favor. That's RAE and coach bias in action.
As a Molecular Rocket Engineer/Scientist you are wrong. As has been stated multiple times top players will find an A team to play on. It might not be at your club it also might also be at your club. Coaches are always looking for a way to win (believe it or not). What do you think woukd happen if an A team player guested with the B team and tried their hardest at a game. Most likely if they were a forward they would score at will. If they were a mid or defender they would win every 1on1 and control the field. This is why they play on the A team and this is also why B team players play on the B team. By the time players get to HS players have been sorted by physical ability. It has nothing to do with coaching.
if you want to see the reason A team players are on the A team and B team players are on the B team. Watch High School soccer tryouts. They all play each other and Its obvious which players are better and which are worse.
This is sorta true, except the part where half the B team has the youngest players in the player pool AND those kids are the ones more likely to play on varsity as freshmen, at least under the BY system. (Also, some A team players skip HS altogether).
This is the problem with RAE its a super excuse that can be used to justify anything.
Are there winners / losers in the birthday lottery? Yes
Does complaining about RAE change anything? No
Everyone has natural talent and abilities. For some its going to be playing soccer. Some will get lucky and be the oldest. Some will be natualy talented and the youngest. Either way both of these players will need to work their butts off to maintain their spot on the A team. I think its disingenuous to say that players are only on the A team because of when they were born. Everyone has opportunities its what you make of them that sets players appart.
RAE isn't being used as an excuse. It is a factor in understanding the development of individual players relative to their status on the age distribution of players in their player pool.
It is like the oldest are starting to ride a bike with a push while the youngest have to start with the brakes continually rubbing the tire. The youngest may get stronger but most find another sport instead.
I am sure that hearing that certain kids got opportunities not available to others can bother you because it undermines your belief that everyone has the same chances in life, unfortunately this simply isn't true. Shockingly youth sports ignores RAE unless you realize that the system was setup by babyboomers who tend to ignore science so here we are. Those in winning side don't want to change the rules and those on the losing side do but nobody is trying for fairness, they all want an edge.
If RAE didn't exist would anybody care about the age change? Hell, no.
I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand.
No matter what my kid was going to make the A team. We did futsal, arena/indoor, rec, latin leagues, etc. They were the one dragging my to sign them up. They were the one getting asked by friends to guest with their team. This was all as a Sept birthday. Which is ironic because now with the BY to SY change they're going to be an absolute beast. I feel sorry for the younger players because they dont have a chance.
This is very understood by everyone who has read your attempts at cyberbullying while ruining multiple threads, "I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand."
The only person ruining threads is you.
RAE is BS because theres nothing you can do about it.
Playing on a grade down team has repercussions and is detrimental to being recruited for playing in college.
Go have your pity party somewhere else. I can show you how to get your kid on an A team. But it takes work and dedication and even with all the hard work your kid might not make it. Sorry thats just how it works. Wait until you see that A team players who dont have to work out or even train and they're naturally better than everyone on the team. What excuse will you bring out then?
Everyone here agrees that no matter how talented your kid is OR when they were born, they still have to work their tail off to achieve their best.
That said, there's plenty to do, especially now that the age groups are changing and savvy parents will be looking to maximize their kid's chances where that hard work may pay off beyond just the fun and privilege of playing a sport. Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage, in youth sports.
You keep saying RAE type things. "Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage" Again, you cant change your kids birthday so why does it matter? Using your logic if your kid is not the oldest they might as well not play.
New entrant to the discussion. I acknowledge RAE exists but I don’t pay attention to it because I can’t control it. If people studied more sports psychology about belief and why you can achieve something, you would be more successful than believing in some theory of why your child is bound to fail.
My kid is a Q4 2014. I never paid attention to her birthday at all until this fall when we were doing middle school shopping and noticed all of her old teammates were already in middle school. I then began to process that she is technically a 2015 per the school classes.
While she is middle of the pack, 1st team on a big club, she will be the number #1 or #2 if she repeats U12. Her skill is the same but she is simply at the top of the band and not the bottom.
Now, it will not matter just like I never accepted excuses that she was younger in our current system. When she played bigger girls, I taught her to scan and play with anticipation. She can’t change being slight. She can learn how to beat Goliath. I imagine my daughter will now be the Goliath if we repeat U12 and there will be Q2 2015’s coming after her if she does not continue to develop.
Since you are happy with your club, sure, it won't impact your Q4. But for Q4s at smaller clubs or one of the 2nd teams, it may allow them the opportunity to play on better teams and/or in better leagues. And that absolutely matters for recruiting purposes (if that is their goal). Playing in a higher league is the difference between a college coach reading your email and one just deleting it (even if the players are exactly the same). The difference between a coach coming to your showcase game or not.
Everything you mentioned is passive. That’s why my kid is where she is. We control it and are proactive.
We don’t wait for anything. My kids spot for next year will be known by February. We don’t like our club and are moving. The Q2 kids should spend more time on the pitch this winter than complaining about the rules and they could have similar options.
Recruiting will be similar to the club process. If a college coach is not responding to my kids email and videos, I can see when the schools games are. I have easily met D1 players after games and their parents. If I am not getting a response from a school, it is easy to get a USB drive with my highlights, get it in someone’s hands or simply a card with a website with my kids CV. If a school doubts the level my kids plays at, bring them to an ID event or invite them to a practice. My kid is okay with being embarrassed. Even if my kid is a high school sophomore competing against college sophomores, a coach will like my kids gonads over your ivory tower approach. Colleges want kids who are hungry and tenacious. They are the leaders of the future. Not the child of a kid making excuses on an anonymous board. This is a peak into how level kids and families operate. I have learned in business and speaking with families of high level players who have come before me. What are you going to do with this information?
Yeah, pretty sedintary attitude accepting Feb. They need to be more proactive to get ahead. Gotta have a CV ready for a kindergarten if you expect them to ever work.
Seminary attitude Homework was done this fall. We know who we want to play for and will train with the clubs over the winter and early spring for free. Your kid will be looking over their shoulder and questioning why clubs allow this to happen. Only question is whether they give us what we want. I actually tried to help you but you are either too arrogant or so far from worthwhile in this soccer world to heed the advice. I knew nothing at one time but am humble enough to ask questions of successful people in this space and learn. Once you reach the top, the coaches call you, not the other way around. You have 3 months to try and help your kid achieve their goals going the traditional route. That is plenty of time to improve one aspect of their game. Get to work. People are obsessed with the scandals at VRSC. Judging from the mental weak-sauce on this board, I know what those poor spouses are dealing with at home and are searching for wherever they can find it.
Anonymous wrote:The one part I am not sure how it will plan out are kid who are young for their team but a grade older than the other Q4s. For example, a September birthday who is in 6th grade. Do they stay with the 6th graders or have an option to play with 5th graders? If the intent is for school year alignment then it seems that there is two cascading criteria, but I am not sure if this is a hard or soft rule. Birthday and then school year or is really only based on your birthday.
Clubs that want to set their players up for being recruited and playing in college will put young Aug/Sept birthday players on the team thats their grade in school.
So you are saying it is a soft rule (ie at the discretion of each club) vs hard. Does anyone know that for fact? I think this has a big part in the spirit of the conversation you are having with your kid.
The way it worked pre 2017 (went clubs switched to BY) was the "better" higher level of competition clubs would always roster younger than the eligibility window players with their grade in school team. Other not as competitive clubs would let players play down a grade but everyone knew that if this player wanted to get recruited and play in college that they'd have to play up with their grade eventually. When this happens its usually easiest to switch clubs. So in the end it just makes more sense to roster young grade up players on the A or B team thats their grade in school.
One other thing, ten years ago there wasnt such a push by parents to redshirt and play down. In fact it was the opposite everyone wanted to play up which is sonehting US Soccer exploited to implement BY.
Wasn't true for my kids teams. All age based in SY.
Were your clubs top teams DA at the time?
Can you point to a doc or website where DA played on grade instead of age?
People weren't interested in playing down back then. It just wasnt something you ran into very often. If anything you'd hear about players playing up a grade and graduating HS early to play at some super college.
If this was true, it was a flaw in the system, because it put some kids at a disadvantage, making them the youngest on the team, younger than other states. A very few may have battled through and became tremendous players as a result (known as the underdog effect), but it was at the cost of others who may have been decent prospects but cycled out of the sport as a result. Leaving it up to the clubs and families makes a lot of sense.
If all players played on the same team this would be true. But because there's B team it doesn't make sense. You need to look more closely at all the RAE "proof" you cant live without. Almost all of it is geared to National Team selection only. Which means it doesn't consider B teams.
Not true, nice try.
Very true. Go ahead try and find a RAE paper or website that considers B teams as an alternate for youger players that aren't big/good enough for the A team. It doesn't exist because if you bring B teams into the discussion RAE doesnt work.
If players are young and not good enough for the A team playing on the B team will let them get more touches and develop more as a player. When they get older being younger evens out but the B team player has had the opportunity to be the top player on the team for multiple seasons. Once they jump up to the A team they'll be primed to work for a top position on the A team becasue thats what theyre used to.
RAE doesn't go away when kids get older. Top teams are over indexed on older kids in the age cohort. Period. Has nothing to do with your B team mumbo jumbo. Your Horatio Alger tale of B team to A team is a silly myth.
Go ahead try to find a RAE publication that includes B teams in the assessment. It doesnt exist because RAE falls appart if you include B teams. With the assumption that B team players will become A team players when they're older and the same size as everyone else on the team.
You are arguing that top teams will have a relatively even distribution after puberty presumably as B team players move to the top team. But the data doesn't back this up. The top teams remain skewed toward the older side of the age cohort. Essentially, the definition of RAE.
Do you admit that B team players if they're good will find their way to the A team as they ger older?
My experience has been that this happens with about half the team. Some of the B team players are older and some are younger. It's been about even.
If you think about it the younger aug/sept players that could play on a grade down A team would probabaly be the leaders on a correct grade B team. These are the ones most likely to be moved up to correct grade A team. Keep in mind that just because you want to play on a grade down A team doesnt mean that your kid will make the team.
2nd team players get labelled 2nd players via coach lock and the fact that clubs want to increase revenue by bringing in players to the first team rather than promoting within. Second team players are younger than first team players in an age cohort, again by RAE definition. Being on the first team is crucial to maximizing one's youth soccer outcome.
PP is exactly right. I am a data scientist. RAE is real. It's meant to be interpreted at a population level but you can see it play out on teams in the area, including ours. And coach bias is real too. Once a B team player by HS, it is next to impossible to move up. Your coaching has been worse, your teammates are worse, and the field competition has been worse. You have had fewer practices, games, and showcases. You are trying to play catch-up to kids that have had the top of all of this probably for several years. It can happen, but odds are not in your favor. That's RAE and coach bias in action.
As a Molecular Rocket Engineer/Scientist you are wrong. As has been stated multiple times top players will find an A team to play on. It might not be at your club it also might also be at your club. Coaches are always looking for a way to win (believe it or not). What do you think woukd happen if an A team player guested with the B team and tried their hardest at a game. Most likely if they were a forward they would score at will. If they were a mid or defender they would win every 1on1 and control the field. This is why they play on the A team and this is also why B team players play on the B team. By the time players get to HS players have been sorted by physical ability. It has nothing to do with coaching.
if you want to see the reason A team players are on the A team and B team players are on the B team. Watch High School soccer tryouts. They all play each other and Its obvious which players are better and which are worse.
This is sorta true, except the part where half the B team has the youngest players in the player pool AND those kids are the ones more likely to play on varsity as freshmen, at least under the BY system. (Also, some A team players skip HS altogether).
This is the problem with RAE its a super excuse that can be used to justify anything.
Are there winners / losers in the birthday lottery? Yes
Does complaining about RAE change anything? No
Everyone has natural talent and abilities. For some its going to be playing soccer. Some will get lucky and be the oldest. Some will be natualy talented and the youngest. Either way both of these players will need to work their butts off to maintain their spot on the A team. I think its disingenuous to say that players are only on the A team because of when they were born. Everyone has opportunities its what you make of them that sets players appart.
RAE isn't being used as an excuse. It is a factor in understanding the development of individual players relative to their status on the age distribution of players in their player pool.
It is like the oldest are starting to ride a bike with a push while the youngest have to start with the brakes continually rubbing the tire. The youngest may get stronger but most find another sport instead.
I am sure that hearing that certain kids got opportunities not available to others can bother you because it undermines your belief that everyone has the same chances in life, unfortunately this simply isn't true. Shockingly youth sports ignores RAE unless you realize that the system was setup by babyboomers who tend to ignore science so here we are. Those in winning side don't want to change the rules and those on the losing side do but nobody is trying for fairness, they all want an edge.
If RAE didn't exist would anybody care about the age change? Hell, no.
I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand.
No matter what my kid was going to make the A team. We did futsal, arena/indoor, rec, latin leagues, etc. They were the one dragging my to sign them up. They were the one getting asked by friends to guest with their team. This was all as a Sept birthday. Which is ironic because now with the BY to SY change they're going to be an absolute beast. I feel sorry for the younger players because they dont have a chance.
This is very understood by everyone who has read your attempts at cyberbullying while ruining multiple threads, "I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand."
The only person ruining threads is you.
RAE is BS because theres nothing you can do about it.
Playing on a grade down team has repercussions and is detrimental to being recruited for playing in college.
Go have your pity party somewhere else. I can show you how to get your kid on an A team. But it takes work and dedication and even with all the hard work your kid might not make it. Sorry thats just how it works. Wait until you see that A team players who dont have to work out or even train and they're naturally better than everyone on the team. What excuse will you bring out then?
Everyone here agrees that no matter how talented your kid is OR when they were born, they still have to work their tail off to achieve their best.
That said, there's plenty to do, especially now that the age groups are changing and savvy parents will be looking to maximize their kid's chances where that hard work may pay off beyond just the fun and privilege of playing a sport. Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage, in youth sports.
You keep saying RAE type things. "Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage" Again, you cant change your kids birthday so why does it matter? Using your logic if your kid is not the oldest they might as well not play.
New entrant to the discussion. I acknowledge RAE exists but I don’t pay attention to it because I can’t control it. If people studied more sports psychology about belief and why you can achieve something, you would be more successful than believing in some theory of why your child is bound to fail.
My kid is a Q4 2014. I never paid attention to her birthday at all until this fall when we were doing middle school shopping and noticed all of her old teammates were already in middle school. I then began to process that she is technically a 2015 per the school classes.
While she is middle of the pack, 1st team on a big club, she will be the number #1 or #2 if she repeats U12. Her skill is the same but she is simply at the top of the band and not the bottom.
Now, it will not matter just like I never accepted excuses that she was younger in our current system. When she played bigger girls, I taught her to scan and play with anticipation. She can’t change being slight. She can learn how to beat Goliath. I imagine my daughter will now be the Goliath if we repeat U12 and there will be Q2 2015’s coming after her if she does not continue to develop.
Since you are happy with your club, sure, it won't impact your Q4. But for Q4s at smaller clubs or one of the 2nd teams, it may allow them the opportunity to play on better teams and/or in better leagues. And that absolutely matters for recruiting purposes (if that is their goal). Playing in a higher league is the difference between a college coach reading your email and one just deleting it (even if the players are exactly the same). The difference between a coach coming to your showcase game or not.
Everything you mentioned is passive. That’s why my kid is where she is. We control it and are proactive.
We don’t wait for anything. My kids spot for next year will be known by February. We don’t like our club and are moving. The Q2 kids should spend more time on the pitch this winter than complaining about the rules and they could have similar options.
Recruiting will be similar to the club process. If a college coach is not responding to my kids email and videos, I can see when the schools games are. I have easily met D1 players after games and their parents. If I am not getting a response from a school, it is easy to get a USB drive with my highlights, get it in someone’s hands or simply a card with a website with my kids CV. If a school doubts the level my kids plays at, bring them to an ID event or invite them to a practice. My kid is okay with being embarrassed. Even if my kid is a high school sophomore competing against college sophomores, a coach will like my kids gonads over your ivory tower approach. Colleges want kids who are hungry and tenacious. They are the leaders of the future. Not the child of a kid making excuses on an anonymous board. This is a peak into how level kids and families operate. I have learned in business and speaking with families of high level players who have come before me. What are you going to do with this information?
Yeah, pretty sedintary attitude accepting Feb. They need to be more proactive to get ahead. Gotta have a CV ready for a kindergarten if you expect them to ever work.
Seminary attitude Homework was done this fall. We know who we want to play for and will train with the clubs over the winter and early spring for free. Your kid will be looking over their shoulder and questioning why clubs allow this to happen. Only question is whether they give us what we want. I actually tried to help you but you are either too arrogant or so far from worthwhile in this soccer world to heed the advice. I knew nothing at one time but am humble enough to ask questions of successful people in this space and learn. Once you reach the top, the coaches call you, not the other way around. You have 3 months to try and help your kid achieve their goals going the traditional route. That is plenty of time to improve one aspect of their game. Get to work. People are obsessed with the scandals at VRSC. Judging from the mental weak-sauce on this board, I know what those poor spouses are dealing with at home and are searching for wherever they can find it.
Yea baby! This is this kind of parent I want on my kinds team.
Anonymous wrote:The one part I am not sure how it will plan out are kid who are young for their team but a grade older than the other Q4s. For example, a September birthday who is in 6th grade. Do they stay with the 6th graders or have an option to play with 5th graders? If the intent is for school year alignment then it seems that there is two cascading criteria, but I am not sure if this is a hard or soft rule. Birthday and then school year or is really only based on your birthday.
Clubs that want to set their players up for being recruited and playing in college will put young Aug/Sept birthday players on the team thats their grade in school.
So you are saying it is a soft rule (ie at the discretion of each club) vs hard. Does anyone know that for fact? I think this has a big part in the spirit of the conversation you are having with your kid.
The way it worked pre 2017 (went clubs switched to BY) was the "better" higher level of competition clubs would always roster younger than the eligibility window players with their grade in school team. Other not as competitive clubs would let players play down a grade but everyone knew that if this player wanted to get recruited and play in college that they'd have to play up with their grade eventually. When this happens its usually easiest to switch clubs. So in the end it just makes more sense to roster young grade up players on the A or B team thats their grade in school.
One other thing, ten years ago there wasnt such a push by parents to redshirt and play down. In fact it was the opposite everyone wanted to play up which is sonehting US Soccer exploited to implement BY.
Wasn't true for my kids teams. All age based in SY.
Were your clubs top teams DA at the time?
Can you point to a doc or website where DA played on grade instead of age?
People weren't interested in playing down back then. It just wasnt something you ran into very often. If anything you'd hear about players playing up a grade and graduating HS early to play at some super college.
If this was true, it was a flaw in the system, because it put some kids at a disadvantage, making them the youngest on the team, younger than other states. A very few may have battled through and became tremendous players as a result (known as the underdog effect), but it was at the cost of others who may have been decent prospects but cycled out of the sport as a result. Leaving it up to the clubs and families makes a lot of sense.
If all players played on the same team this would be true. But because there's B team it doesn't make sense. You need to look more closely at all the RAE "proof" you cant live without. Almost all of it is geared to National Team selection only. Which means it doesn't consider B teams.
Not true, nice try.
Very true. Go ahead try and find a RAE paper or website that considers B teams as an alternate for youger players that aren't big/good enough for the A team. It doesn't exist because if you bring B teams into the discussion RAE doesnt work.
If players are young and not good enough for the A team playing on the B team will let them get more touches and develop more as a player. When they get older being younger evens out but the B team player has had the opportunity to be the top player on the team for multiple seasons. Once they jump up to the A team they'll be primed to work for a top position on the A team becasue thats what theyre used to.
RAE doesn't go away when kids get older. Top teams are over indexed on older kids in the age cohort. Period. Has nothing to do with your B team mumbo jumbo. Your Horatio Alger tale of B team to A team is a silly myth.
Go ahead try to find a RAE publication that includes B teams in the assessment. It doesnt exist because RAE falls appart if you include B teams. With the assumption that B team players will become A team players when they're older and the same size as everyone else on the team.
You are arguing that top teams will have a relatively even distribution after puberty presumably as B team players move to the top team. But the data doesn't back this up. The top teams remain skewed toward the older side of the age cohort. Essentially, the definition of RAE.
Do you admit that B team players if they're good will find their way to the A team as they ger older?
My experience has been that this happens with about half the team. Some of the B team players are older and some are younger. It's been about even.
If you think about it the younger aug/sept players that could play on a grade down A team would probabaly be the leaders on a correct grade B team. These are the ones most likely to be moved up to correct grade A team. Keep in mind that just because you want to play on a grade down A team doesnt mean that your kid will make the team.
2nd team players get labelled 2nd players via coach lock and the fact that clubs want to increase revenue by bringing in players to the first team rather than promoting within. Second team players are younger than first team players in an age cohort, again by RAE definition. Being on the first team is crucial to maximizing one's youth soccer outcome.
PP is exactly right. I am a data scientist. RAE is real. It's meant to be interpreted at a population level but you can see it play out on teams in the area, including ours. And coach bias is real too. Once a B team player by HS, it is next to impossible to move up. Your coaching has been worse, your teammates are worse, and the field competition has been worse. You have had fewer practices, games, and showcases. You are trying to play catch-up to kids that have had the top of all of this probably for several years. It can happen, but odds are not in your favor. That's RAE and coach bias in action.
As a Molecular Rocket Engineer/Scientist you are wrong. As has been stated multiple times top players will find an A team to play on. It might not be at your club it also might also be at your club. Coaches are always looking for a way to win (believe it or not). What do you think woukd happen if an A team player guested with the B team and tried their hardest at a game. Most likely if they were a forward they would score at will. If they were a mid or defender they would win every 1on1 and control the field. This is why they play on the A team and this is also why B team players play on the B team. By the time players get to HS players have been sorted by physical ability. It has nothing to do with coaching.
if you want to see the reason A team players are on the A team and B team players are on the B team. Watch High School soccer tryouts. They all play each other and Its obvious which players are better and which are worse.
This is sorta true, except the part where half the B team has the youngest players in the player pool AND those kids are the ones more likely to play on varsity as freshmen, at least under the BY system. (Also, some A team players skip HS altogether).
This is the problem with RAE its a super excuse that can be used to justify anything.
Are there winners / losers in the birthday lottery? Yes
Does complaining about RAE change anything? No
Everyone has natural talent and abilities. For some its going to be playing soccer. Some will get lucky and be the oldest. Some will be natualy talented and the youngest. Either way both of these players will need to work their butts off to maintain their spot on the A team. I think its disingenuous to say that players are only on the A team because of when they were born. Everyone has opportunities its what you make of them that sets players appart.
RAE isn't being used as an excuse. It is a factor in understanding the development of individual players relative to their status on the age distribution of players in their player pool.
It is like the oldest are starting to ride a bike with a push while the youngest have to start with the brakes continually rubbing the tire. The youngest may get stronger but most find another sport instead.
I am sure that hearing that certain kids got opportunities not available to others can bother you because it undermines your belief that everyone has the same chances in life, unfortunately this simply isn't true. Shockingly youth sports ignores RAE unless you realize that the system was setup by babyboomers who tend to ignore science so here we are. Those in winning side don't want to change the rules and those on the losing side do but nobody is trying for fairness, they all want an edge.
If RAE didn't exist would anybody care about the age change? Hell, no.
I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand.
No matter what my kid was going to make the A team. We did futsal, arena/indoor, rec, latin leagues, etc. They were the one dragging my to sign them up. They were the one getting asked by friends to guest with their team. This was all as a Sept birthday. Which is ironic because now with the BY to SY change they're going to be an absolute beast. I feel sorry for the younger players because they dont have a chance.
This is very understood by everyone who has read your attempts at cyberbullying while ruining multiple threads, "I don't care who got an opportunity that my kid didnt. This is what you don't understand."
The only person ruining threads is you.
RAE is BS because theres nothing you can do about it.
Playing on a grade down team has repercussions and is detrimental to being recruited for playing in college.
Go have your pity party somewhere else. I can show you how to get your kid on an A team. But it takes work and dedication and even with all the hard work your kid might not make it. Sorry thats just how it works. Wait until you see that A team players who dont have to work out or even train and they're naturally better than everyone on the team. What excuse will you bring out then?
Everyone here agrees that no matter how talented your kid is OR when they were born, they still have to work their tail off to achieve their best.
That said, there's plenty to do, especially now that the age groups are changing and savvy parents will be looking to maximize their kid's chances where that hard work may pay off beyond just the fun and privilege of playing a sport. Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage, in youth sports.
You keep saying RAE type things. "Being the oldest, on average, is a built-in advantage" Again, you cant change your kids birthday so why does it matter? Using your logic if your kid is not the oldest they might as well not play.
New entrant to the discussion. I acknowledge RAE exists but I don’t pay attention to it because I can’t control it. If people studied more sports psychology about belief and why you can achieve something, you would be more successful than believing in some theory of why your child is bound to fail.
My kid is a Q4 2014. I never paid attention to her birthday at all until this fall when we were doing middle school shopping and noticed all of her old teammates were already in middle school. I then began to process that she is technically a 2015 per the school classes.
While she is middle of the pack, 1st team on a big club, she will be the number #1 or #2 if she repeats U12. Her skill is the same but she is simply at the top of the band and not the bottom.
Now, it will not matter just like I never accepted excuses that she was younger in our current system. When she played bigger girls, I taught her to scan and play with anticipation. She can’t change being slight. She can learn how to beat Goliath. I imagine my daughter will now be the Goliath if we repeat U12 and there will be Q2 2015’s coming after her if she does not continue to develop.
Since you are happy with your club, sure, it won't impact your Q4. But for Q4s at smaller clubs or one of the 2nd teams, it may allow them the opportunity to play on better teams and/or in better leagues. And that absolutely matters for recruiting purposes (if that is their goal). Playing in a higher league is the difference between a college coach reading your email and one just deleting it (even if the players are exactly the same). The difference between a coach coming to your showcase game or not.
Everything you mentioned is passive. That’s why my kid is where she is. We control it and are proactive.
We don’t wait for anything. My kids spot for next year will be known by February. We don’t like our club and are moving. The Q2 kids should spend more time on the pitch this winter than complaining about the rules and they could have similar options.
Recruiting will be similar to the club process. If a college coach is not responding to my kids email and videos, I can see when the schools games are. I have easily met D1 players after games and their parents. If I am not getting a response from a school, it is easy to get a USB drive with my highlights, get it in someone’s hands or simply a card with a website with my kids CV. If a school doubts the level my kids plays at, bring them to an ID event or invite them to a practice. My kid is okay with being embarrassed. Even if my kid is a high school sophomore competing against college sophomores, a coach will like my kids gonads over your ivory tower approach. Colleges want kids who are hungry and tenacious. They are the leaders of the future. Not the child of a kid making excuses on an anonymous board. This is a peak into how level kids and families operate. I have learned in business and speaking with families of high level players who have come before me. What are you going to do with this information?
Yeah, pretty sedintary attitude accepting Feb. They need to be more proactive to get ahead. Gotta have a CV ready for a kindergarten if you expect them to ever work.
Seminary attitude Homework was done this fall. We know who we want to play for and will train with the clubs over the winter and early spring for free. Your kid will be looking over their shoulder and questioning why clubs allow this to happen. Only question is whether they give us what we want. I actually tried to help you but you are either too arrogant or so far from worthwhile in this soccer world to heed the advice. I knew nothing at one time but am humble enough to ask questions of successful people in this space and learn. Once you reach the top, the coaches call you, not the other way around. You have 3 months to try and help your kid achieve their goals going the traditional route. That is plenty of time to improve one aspect of their game. Get to work. People are obsessed with the scandals at VRSC. Judging from the mental weak-sauce on this board, I know what those poor spouses are dealing with at home and are searching for wherever they can find it.
Seminary attitude is the way to go, stay mental. Good to put the work now to get on the right team next year after not putting in the work and being on the wrong team this year. Not a great feeling that you put off the summer homework until fall, but you can catch up. Just keep asking yourself, am I doing enough? When you say yes, you know that you have given up and definitely haven't done enough. Have faith.
Anonymous wrote:Reading these comments and knowing these folks are the ones molding their kids mentality is scary
Can't get good teammates out of this batch
I agree! The people saying that is ok to play down and that college coaches wont care if your kid is playing on a grade down tean are ridiculious. Its scary thinking about the excuses they must be telling their kids.
Anonymous wrote:Reading these comments and knowing these folks are the ones molding their kids mentality is scary
Can't get good teammates out of this batch
I agree! The people saying that is ok to play down and that college coaches wont care if your kid is playing on a grade down tean are ridiculious. Its scary thinking about the excuses they must be telling their kids.
Oh crazy August guy. So cute. Why do you care so much at this point? We've all heard you.
Anonymous wrote:Reading these comments and knowing these folks are the ones molding their kids mentality is scary
Can't get good teammates out of this batch
I agree! The people saying that is ok to play down and that college coaches wont care if your kid is playing on a grade down tean are ridiculious. Its scary thinking about the excuses they must be telling their kids.
The only school element college coaches care about is your graduation year and your GPA
Travel soccer goes by age, not school grade.
College coaches select and recruit based on performance and potential, not labels.
![[Post New]](/jforum/templates/default/images/icon_minipost_new.gif){kind=icon}
Homework was done this fall. We know who we want to play for and will train with the clubs over the winter and early spring for free. Your kid will be looking over their shoulder and questioning why clubs allow this to happen. Only question is whether they give us what we want. I actually tried to help you but you are either too arrogant or so far from worthwhile in this soccer world to heed the advice. I knew nothing at one time but am humble enough to ask questions of successful people in this space and learn. Once you reach the top, the coaches call you, not the other way around. You have 3 months to try and help your kid achieve their goals going the traditional route. That is plenty of time to improve one aspect of their game. Get to work. People are obsessed with the scandals at VRSC. Judging from the mental weak-sauce on this board, I know what those poor spouses are dealing with at home and are searching for wherever they can find it.