Beauvoir PreK vs GDS PreK

[Anonymous]

Do you know what age you want to talk with your child about race? This is not to be funny, but you may want to stay clear of some schools. My DC school has been discussing race since K. I don't believe DC will be ahead of other blacks on dealing with race no more than I believe a kid starting reading earlier has any advantages.....but we do start pretty early with reading in this country.

[Anonymous]

While it is true that black children are less biased than white children, it is also true that they still seem to prefer whiteness and lighter skin color than dark skin color.

Also, given that white kids are more racist than black kids, why would you want to surround your black child with white children who aren't being educated about race?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do you know what age you want to talk with your child about race? This is not to be funny, but you may want to stay clear of some schools. My DC school has been discussing race since K. I don't believe DC will be ahead of other blacks on dealing with race no more than I believe a kid starting reading earlier has any advantages.....but we do start pretty early with reading in this country.

We started talking about race from the time DC was maybe 3? Not directly with deep and profound discussions, of course, but intentionally pointing out girls and boys with brown skin and saying, oh, what a beautiful baby! Look at those lovely chocolate eyes! Things like that. Because we are in a mixed-race family, we also talk about skin color and how daddy has pinker skin and mommy has browner skin (we use the word "golden" to describe our kids' skin color). I don't know what you mean exactly when you say that DC will be "ahead" of other kids in dealing with race, but it certainly seems that my children are much more comfortable in their skin than I ever was growing up in large part due to conversations about race they have at school and at home.

[Anonymous]

Getting ahead was maybe a poor choice of words. PP sounds like you are doing a great job with your child. Starting at the age 3 to purposely make your child feel more comfortable in his/her skin is an excellent idea. I just love the fact its not just my kid getting these lessons at home but attend a school that emphasizes these lessons seamlessly in the school day.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:NP: we applied to GDS, Sidwell and Beauvoir. Didn't get great results. Denied at Sidwell and wait listed at both Beauvoir and GDS. We liked all three schools. Found them all to be very different but in a good way. I can't think of anything negative about any of the three, though we did find it puzzling that for the same tuition GDS does not provide lunch. Apparently that will change when they move to their new facilities though. OP congrats to you. Your DC is lucky to have options. Fingers crossed we will be offered the spot at either school you decline. Do you mind sharing your child's gender?

Male (Biracial - AA/Asian)

My son is AA prek and I chose Beauvoir for some of the reasons highlighted (structured environment, not a real need to focus education on social justice for primary years, ability for child to play and learn). In my opinion, GDS is better for upper grades. I had many parents who children attended GDS that Beauvoir is a better choice of you are looking for a school that is geared towards early education.

GDS has a great early education program. Besides personal preferences, as a PP has said, research has shown how important is to introduce social justice concepts at an early age.

At GDS PK-K play, explore, analyze.... Teachers are truly nurturing and professional, and use an age appropriate induction method.

Beauvoir playgroup is amazing, yes, but it is huge as well. Not necessarily the best alternative for every 4-5 year old (there are a lot of not so "easy" spots, hard surfaces, etc... that might be challenging for the most little ones).

One of GDS's classrooms has a nice porch. It is full of light and the favorite spots for kids in that classroom. It has a direct access to the Big Toy -a very nice playground of a reduce and more manageable size. Certainly not as astonishing as Beauvoir's (at all), but in my opinion good enough.

Finally, I like to cook for my kid every day, and plan my DC lunch box is nice. As I am the one preparing the meals I am certain that what he/she is eating is healthy and good, I can customize his/her meals to our cultural preferences, and I can be sure it is a fresh balanced meal. I thought that the fact that GDS was not providing lunch was going to be a big logistic nightmare for us. So far it has not been like that.

This is hilarious. Whose "research?"

Only "hilarious" if you are unconcerned about racism and other forms of discrimination. FYI:
http://www.newsweek.com/even-babies-discriminate-nurtureshock-excerpt-79233
http://www.safeschoolscoalition.org/Racism&YoungChildren-byTheresaLee.pdf
https://www.bostonglobe.com/business/2012/06/09/harvard-researcher-says-children-learn-racism-quickly/gWuN1ZG3M40WihER2kAfdK/story.html
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/on-parenting/we-need-to-deal-with-our-discomfort-and-talk-to-our-kids-about-racism/2015/06/30/ec6db7e8-1a9a-11e5-ab92-c75ae6ab94b5_story.html
http://eric.ed.gov/?id=ED415027
https://www.naeyc.org/files/naeyc/file/Publications/Voices_GossFINAL.pdf

Many of these pieces have direct links to peer-reviewed articles. Please educate yourself.

As I suspected these articles confirm that starting the conversation early is good for White children and not so much for minority children. Specifically, one article found: "A group of black children tested in the study revealed equal favorability and negativity biases, regardless of whether they perceived the test faces to be black or white. In other words, the black children showed no pro-black or pro-white bias."

So as I said I don't think my Black child needs to be taught racism at the age of 4 or 5. My Black child will have an entire lifetime to contend with issues surrounding their race. My 4 year old has no concept race and I would to preserve that innocence.

You are sorely mistaken if you believe that your 4 year old has no concept of race. If anything, it is even more important if you have a child of color (as I do--two mixed-race children) to be surrounded by a culture that intentionally and purposefully surrounds your child with positive messages, images, and people of color. Your child is indirectly absorbing ideas about race and authority, race and expectations, race and discrimination, and race and privilege. You might find this piece interesting: http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2015/05/can-fieldston-un-teach-racism.html

I'm not mistaken. My DC doesn't. That's not to say that won't change soon. However, as of today zero concept of it. Maybe other children of color do, but my child wouldn't know to distinguish someone based on race. DC has never referred to
Someone by race, only gender.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do you know what age you want to talk with your child about race? This is not to be funny, but you may want to stay clear of some schools. My DC school has been discussing race since K. I don't believe DC will be ahead of other blacks on dealing with race no more than I believe a kid starting reading earlier has any advantages.....but we do start pretty early with reading in this country.

I don't have a hardline cutoff. In fact I don't have hard line cutt offs for most things and I prefer that we allow the need for the discussion to progress naturally. I wouldn't balk at my kid learning about it in K I'm just not convinced my DC is worse for wear because the school isn't introducing it at such an early age. I think compassion, equality, accepting others as they are, etc. should absolutely be taught early. However the idea of having hard core discussions about race relations with a 4 year old who may not have a concept of race yet seems like a lot. I know there are plenty of 4 year olds who may very well have that concept, But I know for certain my kid doesn't even realize they are of a particular race.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:While it is true that black children are less biased than white children, it is also true that they still seem to prefer whiteness and lighter skin color than dark skin color.

Also, given that white kids are more racist than black kids, why would you want to surround your black child with white children who aren't being educated about race?

This is a valid point, and I hadn't thought of it from that perspective...I don't have a response YET. I'll have to think about this a bit. Though again, I think what I have issue with it forcing a conversation children may not be ready for moreso than me being against it if children are ready to absorb all of what that means.

[Anonymous]

This is a sensitive topic for me. My nephew attended local private and no one wanted to talk about race like it didn't exist. They thought everything was great, he had lots of friends mostly white. He complained the black kids didn't think he was black enough. Fast forward today....he said he is not attracted to black girls. He simply won't date them. I don't care if my child dates outside his race, but please, please don't do it because you don't have love for yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:While it is true that black children are less biased than white children, it is also true that they still seem to prefer whiteness and lighter skin color than dark skin color.

Also, given that white kids are more racist than black kids, why would you want to surround your black child with white children who aren't being educated about race?

Different philosophies. My children don't see color and never have and have always thought of all kids as equal. They have friends of all races and religions. We never discussed race until recently because I think by pointing out differences and making an issue where there want one before. Now that they are older we have discussed it more and I wish we had not as I think it taints them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While it is true that black children are less biased than white children, it is also true that they still seem to prefer whiteness and lighter skin color than dark skin color.

Also, given that white kids are more racist than black kids, why would you want to surround your black child with white children who aren't being educated about race?

Different philosophies. My children don't see color and never have and have always thought of all kids as equal. They have friends of all races and religions. We never discussed race until recently because I think by pointing out differences and making an issue where there want one before. Now that they are older we have discussed it more and I wish we had not as I think it taints them.

This is maybe what you desperately want to believe, but unless your child is literally blind and not particularly observant, impossible.

http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2015/08/when-minority-kids-are-taught-color-blindness.html ("When Minority Kids Are Taught Color Blindness")
Racial color-blindness sounds pretty good in theory. After all, aren’t we supposed to be judging people based only on the contents of their character, rather than the color of their skin? But critics of the idea say it has some serious downsides. They argue that since race is a major contributing factor in all sorts of societal outcomes, from who goes to jail to what educational opportunities a child has, to adopt color-blindness as an ideology is to ignore important discrepancies, thereby allowing them to fester. If you can’t really even talk about racism, in other words, how are you supposed to address it?

https://www4dev.uwm.edu/letsci/africology/faculty/upload/children_colorblind.pdf ("Children Are Not Colorblind")
"There is a myth in popular culture that young children are “colorblind” or don’t notice race. By this logic, children are “blank slates” who cannot develop racial prejudices until they are explicitly taught
to do so.... In fact, research clearly shows that children not only recognize race from a very young age, but also develop racial biases by ages three to five that do not necessarily resemble the racial attitudes of adults in their lives."


http://www.nais.org/Magazines-Newsletters/ISMagazine/Pages/What-White-Children-Need-to-Know-About-Race.aspx ("What White Children Need to Know About Race")
"In particular, the research suggests that for fear of perpetuating racial misunderstandings, being seen as a racist, making children feel badly, or simply not knowing what to say, many white parents tend to believe that there is never a right time to initiate a conversation about race.1 They talk to their children about race if it becomes relevant in their lives (mostly in negative contexts). Otherwise, they tell their children that people are all the same and that they should not see race.
While white parents’ intention is to convey to their children the belief that race shouldn’t matter, the message their children receive is that race, in fact, doesn’t matter. The intent and aim are noble, but in order for race not to matter in the long run, we have to acknowledge that, currently, it does matter a great deal. If white parents want their children to contribute to what researchers Matthew Desmond and Mustafa Emirbayer describe as a “racially just America”2 in which race does not unjustly influence one’s life opportunities, their children will need to learn awareness and skills that they cannot acquire through silence and omission."

[Anonymous]

To all PP who shared their views and specially to those who have shared articles and researxh papers: thanks! That is so useful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:While it is true that black children are less biased than white children, it is also true that they still seem to prefer whiteness and lighter skin color than dark skin color.

Also, given that white kids are more racist than black kids, why would you want to surround your black child with white children who aren't being educated about race?

This statement in of itself is racist and unfounded. Kids notice differences but are not inherently racist--racism is taught. My child has friends of all races, and choses friends based on personality and similar interests, i.e. star wars, etc. In fact, he has even said that he wishes he was black! Now, should I feel bad about this? I don't at all the whole point is that you should not make blanket statements about race, everyone has their own personal experiences with race and discrimination or a lack thereof and it's unfair to assume that a non-white child will be subjected to racism if he is at a predominately white school. Racism runs the gemmate from race to race and it's not just the AA community who is affected, let's just look at the how Asian's were singled out at the Oscar's, that was disgraceful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While it is true that black children are less biased than white children, it is also true that they still seem to prefer whiteness and lighter skin color than dark skin color.

Also, given that white kids are more racist than black kids, why would you want to surround your black child with white children who aren't being educated about race?

This statement in of itself is racist and unfounded. Kids notice differences but are not inherently racist--racism is taught. My child has friends of all races, and choses friends based on personality and similar interests, i.e. star wars, etc. In fact, he has even said that he wishes he was black! Now, should I feel bad about this? I don't at all the whole point is that you should not make blanket statements about race, everyone has their own personal experiences with race and discrimination or a lack thereof and it's unfair to assume that a non-white child will be subjected to racism if he is at a predominately white school. Racism runs the gemmate from race to race and it's not just the AA community who is affected, let's just look at the how Asian's were singled out at the Oscar's, that was disgraceful.

Spoken like a white person. If you were black (or Asian) and living in the United States, there is *no way* you would say that it's possible for a child to escape racism in a predominantly white school. Race pervades everything, every institution, media, books, movies, films, etc. Is your head of school a person of color? The admissions director? What color is the cleaning staff? What about the teachers? Does one color dominate in different roles in the school--and how does that compare to the demographics of the city? How is it possible to have a majority white school in DC without that in and of itself being a product of race and class? There are a number of thought-provoking articles and research that have been posted on this thread. I suggest you read them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:While it is true that black children are less biased than white children, it is also true that they still seem to prefer whiteness and lighter skin color than dark skin color.

Also, given that white kids are more racist than black kids, why would you want to surround your black child with white children who aren't being educated about race?

This statement in of itself is racist and unfounded. Kids notice differences but are not inherently racist--racism is taught. My child has friends of all races, and choses friends based on personality and similar interests, i.e. star wars, etc. In fact, he has even said that he wishes he was black! Now, should I feel bad about this? I don't at all the whole point is that you should not make blanket statements about race, everyone has their own personal experiences with race and discrimination or a lack thereof and it's unfair to assume that a non-white child will be subjected to racism if he is at a predominately white school. Racism runs the gemmate from race to race and it's not just the AA community who is affected, let's just look at the how Asian's were singled out at the Oscar's, that was disgraceful.

Spoken like a white person. If you were black (or Asian) and living in the United States, there is *no way* you would say that it's possible for a child to escape racism in a predominantly white school. Race pervades everything, every institution, media, books, movies, films, etc. Is your head of school a person of color? The admissions director? What color is the cleaning staff? What about the teachers? Does one color dominate in different roles in the school--and how does that compare to the demographics of the city? How is it possible to have a majority white school in DC without that in and of itself being a product of race and class? There are a number of thought-provoking articles and research that have been posted on this thread. I suggest you read them.

First, I'm non white, but thanks for assuming that. A sign of some white racism perhaps? I'm Hispanic as a matter of fact. Next, our private school is compromised of 40 percent minorities--but whatever hold on to your one sided ideas about race relations. Of course their is racism but it goes all ways and it's harmful to all to suggest that it just predominately impacts one set of minorities. Should I look for a school where the teachers are mostly male because I don't want my son to feel marginalized or think that because he is male he should not be a teacher? While this may be a valid issue its not a defining one and I think the same could be said for race and private school.

[Anonymous]

I should also add our cleaning staff is mostly Hispanic and we have lots of teacher's of color and high ranking, no not head of school, of color.