Do you need a college 4.0 at for a strong finance internship? (From an Ivy)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kid is a drama queen

OP here. No, kid isn't. Quite the opposite.
I know about this because he was grumpy about a test and I was like, 'chill out, you're doing great" and he shared that the upperclassmen talk about how "you need a 4.0 if you want XYZ internship" which may just be a very top finance internship but my kid heard as being any good econ/finance internship.
And I can share further that my DC is not even sure he wants to go into finance. But the social pressure to consider this career path is SO HIGH at the Ivies. It's all anyone is doing. My son is bright, naturally a STEM brain, doesn't want to be an engineer so he's considering it.

OP it takes what it takes, each ivy is different with regard to being top 1/4 or better.
At Brown, as A- and A are both counted 4.0, and 45-60% of any given class gets A range, yielding a median graduating GPA of 3.9, thus yes a 4.0 is needed for top finance, top law, top med, every "top".
At my kid's grade deflated ivy, Jane St and other top finance, or MBB, or top law/med, goes to 3.9+ all the time. Less than 15% of stem courses receive true A(4.0), thus having some A- or an occasional B+ are common. Median overall is around 3.7; 3.9 is quite impressive there. The engineers often get top (quant) finance over others even if a little below 3.9.

Similar experience at a public ivy. Lower gpa 3.7+ but took a lot of advanced math classes got quant finance. offers. But they cared less about gpa more about getting past the assessments and.interview rounds. Now pe, hedge funds and long short are reaching out since quant internships are well regarded and they didn’t even care about gpa were more interested in their experiences at the firm.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kid is a drama queen

OP here. No, kid isn't. Quite the opposite.
I know about this because he was grumpy about a test and I was like, 'chill out, you're doing great" and he shared that the upperclassmen talk about how "you need a 4.0 if you want XYZ internship" which may just be a very top finance internship but my kid heard as being any good econ/finance internship.
And I can share further that my DC is not even sure he wants to go into finance. But the social pressure to consider this career path is SO HIGH at the Ivies. It's all anyone is doing. My son is bright, naturally a STEM brain, doesn't want to be an engineer so he's considering it.

OP it takes what it takes, each ivy is different with regard to being top 1/4 or better.
At Brown, as A- and A are both counted 4.0, and 45-60% of any given class gets A range, yielding a median graduating GPA of 3.9, thus yes a 4.0 is needed for top finance, top law, top med, every "top".
At my kid's grade deflated ivy, Jane St and other top finance, or MBB, or top law/med, goes to 3.9+ all the time. Less than 15% of stem courses receive true A(4.0), thus having some A- or an occasional B+ are common. Median overall is around 3.7; 3.9 is quite impressive there. The engineers often get top (quant) finance over others even if a little below 3.9.

Similar experience at a public ivy. Lower gpa 3.7+ but took a lot of advanced math classes got quant finance. offers. But they cared less about gpa more about getting past the assessments and.interview rounds. Now pe, hedge funds and long short are reaching out since quant internships are well regarded and they didn’t even care about gpa were more interested in their experiences at the firm.

At hypsm DC and members of their club got internships in traditional ib , and consulting firms had higher gpa’s, then others who got more buy side internships which are similar but more technical in roles

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kid is a drama queen

OP here. No, kid isn't. Quite the opposite.
I know about this because he was grumpy about a test and I was like, 'chill out, you're doing great" and he shared that the upperclassmen talk about how "you need a 4.0 if you want XYZ internship" which may just be a very top finance internship but my kid heard as being any good econ/finance internship.
And I can share further that my DC is not even sure he wants to go into finance. But the social pressure to consider this career path is SO HIGH at the Ivies. It's all anyone is doing. My son is bright, naturally a STEM brain, doesn't want to be an engineer so he's considering it.

OP it takes what it takes, each ivy is different with regard to being top 1/4 or better.
At Brown, as A- and A are both counted 4.0, and 45-60% of any given class gets A range, yielding a median graduating GPA of 3.9, thus yes a 4.0 is needed for top finance, top law, top med, every "top".
At my kid's grade deflated ivy, Jane St and other top finance, or MBB, or top law/med, goes to 3.9+ all the time. Less than 15% of stem courses receive true A(4.0), thus having some A- or an occasional B+ are common. Median overall is around 3.7; 3.9 is quite impressive there. The engineers often get top (quant) finance over others even if a little below 3.9.

Similar experience at a public ivy. Lower gpa 3.7+ but took a lot of advanced math classes got quant finance. offers. But they cared less about gpa more about getting past the assessments and.interview rounds. Now pe, hedge funds and long short are reaching out since quant internships are well regarded and they didn’t even care about gpa were more interested in their experiences at the firm.

At hypsm DC and members of their club got internships in traditional ib , and consulting firms had higher gpa’s, then others who got more buy side internships which are similar but more technical in roles

Because the IB and consultants internships are in soft majors?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Darn. It was a slog to get into the Ivy and now the reward is.... more slogging. Great. I guess he had the summer before college as a break.

It's not easy to get a perfect GPA at his school. He's working his a$$ off.

Well he’s going into a grinding career path, so….get used to it, I guess.

There’s a recurring theme on DCUM- “when does the easy part start.”

If you have committed to the top score/T20/IB & Consulting path THERE IS NEVER A REST. You never “win”. It’s just competition for everything forever.

There’s no “secret trick” to Ivy admits, just grinding and luck.

There’s no “good enough” grade for bulge bracket IB, you are in constant competition for everything all the time. Be the best or get out.

If your kid is already unhappy with the high pressure top HS grind why on earth would they want to sign up for FIVE MORE DECADES of this?

“Why is it so hard to get into extracurriculars”, it’s not at 99.9% of schools. Don’t pick the 0.01% and complain or look for shortcuts.

There’s no shortcut, you just have to win all the time at everything, forever. And everything you encounter will be a competition.

Kids need to go into this with open eyes. If they legit want the “prestige” path, it comes with costs and benefits.

There are lots of things to do in finance that aren’t Goldman. There are lots of things to do in law that aren’t Biglaw.

You want to be a winner? Start winning and stop complaining.

Or, you could just choose not to play.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kid is a drama queen

OP here. No, kid isn't. Quite the opposite.
I know about this because he was grumpy about a test and I was like, 'chill out, you're doing great" and he shared that the upperclassmen talk about how "you need a 4.0 if you want XYZ internship" which may just be a very top finance internship but my kid heard as being any good econ/finance internship.
And I can share further that my DC is not even sure he wants to go into finance. But the social pressure to consider this career path is SO HIGH at the Ivies. It's all anyone is doing. My son is bright, naturally a STEM brain, doesn't want to be an engineer so he's considering it.

OP, I have two kids at Ivies right now. One is pre-med (it's own hell) and the other is IR. I can assure you that finance is not all anyone is doing.

[Anonymous]

*its

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Darn. It was a slog to get into the Ivy and now the reward is.... more slogging. Great. I guess he had the summer before college as a break.

It's not easy to get a perfect GPA at his school. He's working his a$$ off.

Well he’s going into a grinding career path, so….get used to it, I guess.

There’s a recurring theme on DCUM- “when does the easy part start.”

If you have committed to the top score/T20/IB & Consulting path THERE IS NEVER A REST. You never “win”. It’s just competition for everything forever.

There’s no “secret trick” to Ivy admits, just grinding and luck.

There’s no “good enough” grade for bulge bracket IB, you are in constant competition for everything all the time. Be the best or get out.

If your kid is already unhappy with the high pressure top HS grind why on earth would they want to sign up for FIVE MORE DECADES of this?

“Why is it so hard to get into extracurriculars”, it’s not at 99.9% of schools. Don’t pick the 0.01% and complain or look for shortcuts.

There’s no shortcut, you just have to win all the time at everything, forever. And everything you encounter will be a competition.

Kids need to go into this with open eyes. If they legit want the “prestige” path, it comes with costs and benefits.

There are lots of things to do in finance that aren’t Goldman. There are lots of things to do in law that aren’t Biglaw.

You want to be a winner? Start winning and stop complaining.

Or, you could just choose not to play.

This post should be pinned. Not only to the top of the College forum but starting every DCUM forum.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Darn. It was a slog to get into the Ivy and now the reward is.... more slogging. Great. I guess he had the summer before college as a break.

It's not easy to get a perfect GPA at his school. He's working his a$$ off.

Well he’s going into a grinding career path, so….get used to it, I guess.

There’s a recurring theme on DCUM- “when does the easy part start.”

If you have committed to the top score/T20/IB & Consulting path THERE IS NEVER A REST. You never “win”. It’s just competition for everything forever.

There’s no “secret trick” to Ivy admits, just grinding and luck.

There’s no “good enough” grade for bulge bracket IB, you are in constant competition for everything all the time. Be the best or get out.

If your kid is already unhappy with the high pressure top HS grind why on earth would they want to sign up for FIVE MORE DECADES of this?

“Why is it so hard to get into extracurriculars”, it’s not at 99.9% of schools. Don’t pick the 0.01% and complain or look for shortcuts.

There’s no shortcut, you just have to win all the time at everything, forever. And everything you encounter will be a competition.

Kids need to go into this with open eyes. If they legit want the “prestige” path, it comes with costs and benefits.

There are lots of things to do in finance that aren’t Goldman. There are lots of things to do in law that aren’t Biglaw.

You want to be a winner? Start winning and stop complaining.

Or, you could just choose not to play.

This, OP. I went to an Ivy and I went into one of these career paths. If he feels like "getting into an Ivy" was a slog and that he's miserable "working his a$$ off" to get good grades, then "a strong finance internship" and the job that leads to are NOT for him. And it doesn't get easier, it only gets WAY harder once you start that job. Mentally, emotionally, physically, and socially harder.

And there are plenty of other paths that are rewarding that are not like this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Darn. It was a slog to get into the Ivy and now the reward is.... more slogging. Great. I guess he had the summer before college as a break.

It's not easy to get a perfect GPA at his school. He's working his a$$ off.

Well he’s going into a grinding career path, so….get used to it, I guess.

There’s a recurring theme on DCUM- “when does the easy part start.”

If you have committed to the top score/T20/IB & Consulting path THERE IS NEVER A REST. You never “win”. It’s just competition for everything forever.

There’s no “secret trick” to Ivy admits, just grinding and luck.

There’s no “good enough” grade for bulge bracket IB, you are in constant competition for everything all the time. Be the best or get out.

If your kid is already unhappy with the high pressure top HS grind why on earth would they want to sign up for FIVE MORE DECADES of this?

“Why is it so hard to get into extracurriculars”, it’s not at 99.9% of schools. Don’t pick the 0.01% and complain or look for shortcuts.

There’s no shortcut, you just have to win all the time at everything, forever. And everything you encounter will be a competition.

Kids need to go into this with open eyes. If they legit want the “prestige” path, it comes with costs and benefits.

There are lots of things to do in finance that aren’t Goldman. There are lots of things to do in law that aren’t Biglaw.

You want to be a winner? Start winning and stop complaining.

Or, you could just choose not to play.

This, OP. I went to an Ivy and I went into one of these career paths. If he feels like "getting into an Ivy" was a slog and that he's miserable "working his a$$ off" to get good grades, then "a strong finance internship" and the job that leads to are NOT for him. And it doesn't get easier, it only gets WAY harder once you start that job. Mentally, emotionally, physically, and socially harder.

And there are plenty of other paths that are rewarding that are not like this.

Here is where folks should hop over to the Jobs and Money boards for perspective on life choices.

You will see many people "regretting" going into rewarding professions like NPOs or teaching or Fed other similar jobs, only to find that these jobs aren't necessarily fulfilling and now they aren't stable either.

Many are of the perspective that they should have just gone into finance or another high paying line of work.

The point is that the world changes and many jobs that seem "rewarding" from the outside can prove to be just as toxic or unrewarding. Some people go into finance and legitimately kind of really like it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Kid is a drama queen

OP here. No, kid isn't. Quite the opposite.
I know about this because he was grumpy about a test and I was like, 'chill out, you're doing great" and he shared that the upperclassmen talk about how "you need a 4.0 if you want XYZ internship" which may just be a very top finance internship but my kid heard as being any good econ/finance internship.
And I can share further that my DC is not even sure he wants to go into finance. But the social pressure to consider this career path is SO HIGH at the Ivies. It's all anyone is doing. My son is bright, naturally a STEM brain, doesn't want to be an engineer so he's considering it.

OP, I have two kids at Ivies right now. One is pre-med (it's own hell) and the other is IR. I can assure you that finance is not all anyone is doing.

Finance is like a near majority of what most ivy grads do out of college.

[Anonymous]

Article in WSJ about Wall Street recruitment at top schools.

https://www.wsj.com/us-news/education/a-campus-backlash-is-brewing-over-wall-streets-ivy-league-recruitment-drive-c7e6cda9?mod=Searchresults&pos=6&page=1

Many students arrive at prestigious colleges with little idea of what an investment banker or consultant does, but roughly a third of them who enter the workforce wind up in finance or consulting jobs after graduation—and another chunk joins big technology companies.

Sociologist Amy Binder coined the term “career funneling” a decade ago to describe how schools tend to lead students down particular career paths. In a series of papers, she and other academics outlined how universities had created “corporate partnership programs,” through which companies could pay a fee in exchange for the school’s assistance in identifying top talent. “These schools,” Cieslikowski said, “are essentially selling their students’ attention to the highest bidder.”

The early stages of Binder’s latest research indicate that career funneling is happening earlier, she said. Students in some cases are joining consulting clubs in high school, and being scouted during their freshman year of college.

According to data posted on Yale’s website, around one in five members of the class of 2024 who entered the workforce reported working in finance. A Harvard Crimson survey from the spring indicated that more than half of workforce-bound members of the class of 2025 were entering careers in technology, consulting and finance—though fewer than 1% said they expected to be consultants 10 years down the line.

Top banks and consulting firms blanket campuses with recruiting events. That process can start during students’ freshman and sophomore years: A postgraduate position may necessitate a junior-year internship, and a junior-year internship may require a sophomore-year application. “If you are a freshman at Penn or you’re a freshman at Yale or a freshman at Harvard, as soon as you move into your dorm room, you might get pinged by McKinsey,” Binder said.

Around 9% of Yale’s first-year class recently applied to the Yale Undergraduate Consulting Group, the school’s largest consulting club. The group hosts office visits and exclusive events with major management-consulting firms, according to President Pol Berger Romeu.