Top public elementary with neighborhood feel?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We really like Maury, near Lincoln Park. Ticks all the boxes you mention and easy commute to Pentagon via 695/395. We also wanted small classes and a tight knit feel and it’s been great. Only downside is the feeder pattern - middle school is fine (people vary on this but the number of people from Maury sending kids there is increasingly significantly each year, so would be even better by the time your kid gets there) but high school is a no for almost everyone.

Where do the kids go for HS?

Eastern. It could be a whole different situation by the time OP’s kid gets to 9th grade but right now the zoned MS is finally getting significant buy in but as far as I’m aware very few people are currently seeing Eastern as a viable HS choice.

No chance that Eastern will be seen as a viable HS for UMC families on the Hill by the time OP's kid is in 9th grade. None.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Budget is very important here.

The Capitol Hill elementary schools are great— Ludlow-Taylor, Maury, Chisholm, Payne, Brent (though they’re in a swing space for 2 years), and the neighborhood is wonderful. But your money is not going to go as far as the burbs and you’ll have less space. The trade off (particularly commute/walking/proximity to H, Eastern Market, downtown) is worth it to many but it’s pricey.

No, they aren't great. They're DCPS schools and they're just OK. All you need to do to understand what I'm talking about is visit Mathnasium on Penn. Ave SE after school on a weekday. The place is packed with Ludlow, Maury, Brent and Payne students mainly from families seeking extra math challenge. Nothing was hard enough for my kids at Brent in the upper grades, not math, not English, not social studies, not science. They weren't given remotely acceptable writing instruction. The school was fun and friendly, but great academically it was not. Without a law on GT education in DC or any formal programming for advanced learners in elementary school and lower per capita outlays for schools mainly serving high SES families than Title 1 schools in the District, DCPS ES programs can only be so good. You get sick of fund-raising in DCPS fast. You get tired of inexperienced and not terribly motivated teachers and iffy principals.

[Anonymous]

maybe post on the va public schools forum for more n virginia ideas

[Anonymous]

The best neighborhood schools are in wards 7 and 8. The families actually care about the well being of each other.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:disagree. the capitol hill middle schools are okay (arguably better than upper elementary was in at least some respects). the middle school years go super fast, but people who stayed dcps through 8th mostly ended up at a mix of dcps application and private high schools. buy-in at eastern is slowly growing but its far from the only option.

You made my point and yet "disagree"? Go back and look at what I said. If private is not an option then is it parental malpractice to choose an Eastern inbound house with a 1st grader.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Budget is very important here.

The Capitol Hill elementary schools are great— Ludlow-Taylor, Maury, Chisholm, Payne, Brent (though they’re in a swing space for 2 years), and the neighborhood is wonderful. But your money is not going to go as far as the burbs and you’ll have less space. The trade off (particularly commute/walking/proximity to H, Eastern Market, downtown) is worth it to many but it’s pricey.

No, they aren't great. They're DCPS schools and they're just OK. All you need to do to understand what I'm talking about is visit Mathnasium on Penn. Ave SE after school on a weekday. The place is packed with Ludlow, Maury, Brent and Payne students mainly from families seeking extra math challenge. Nothing was hard enough for my kids at Brent in the upper grades, not math, not English, not social studies, not science. They weren't given remotely acceptable writing instruction. The school was fun and friendly, but great academically it was not. Without a law on GT education in DC or any formal programming for advanced learners in elementary school and lower per capita outlays for schools mainly serving high SES families than Title 1 schools in the District, DCPS ES programs can only be so good. You get sick of fund-raising in DCPS fast. You get tired of inexperienced and not terribly motivated teachers and iffy principals.

I think your experience may have more to do with the situation at Brent that has been discussed a lot on this forum - combining 4th and 5th, lots of attrition in 5th etc.

I think parents do Mathnasium or outside tutoring for a variety of reasons, sometimes bc their kid needs an extra push, sometimes bc their kid is bored, sometimes bc the parents want their kids to be the best. If you drive around the suburbs there are Mathnasium and Kumon centers all over the place so I think they’ll open up wherever a certain type parents with disposable income are living.

All that to say every school is different and every 4th/5th grade team I am sure is different too. I think a lot of it has to do with individual kids, some of whom may not push themselves, regardless of which school they were at, and some of whom would push themselves and sign up for all the things and excel wherever they attend.

Public schools in DC have debate, robotics club, book clubs, music, theater etc. IMO, kids that have good attendance, do all the work, sign up for things etc, they are learning just as much as their suburban counterparts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:disagree. the capitol hill middle schools are okay (arguably better than upper elementary was in at least some respects). the middle school years go super fast, but people who stayed dcps through 8th mostly ended up at a mix of dcps application and private high schools. buy-in at eastern is slowly growing but its far from the only option.

You made my point and yet "disagree"? Go back and look at what I said. If private is not an option then is it parental malpractice to choose an Eastern inbound house with a 1st grader.

This may be true if one envisions their Eastern in-bound house as forever home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Budget is very important here.

The Capitol Hill elementary schools are great— Ludlow-Taylor, Maury, Chisholm, Payne, Brent (though they’re in a swing space for 2 years), and the neighborhood is wonderful. But your money is not going to go as far as the burbs and you’ll have less space. The trade off (particularly commute/walking/proximity to H, Eastern Market, downtown) is worth it to many but it’s pricey.

No, they aren't great. They're DCPS schools and they're just OK. All you need to do to understand what I'm talking about is visit Mathnasium on Penn. Ave SE after school on a weekday. The place is packed with Ludlow, Maury, Brent and Payne students mainly from families seeking extra math challenge. Nothing was hard enough for my kids at Brent in the upper grades, not math, not English, not social studies, not science. They weren't given remotely acceptable writing instruction. The school was fun and friendly, but great academically it was not. Without a law on GT education in DC or any formal programming for advanced learners in elementary school and lower per capita outlays for schools mainly serving high SES families than Title 1 schools in the District, DCPS ES programs can only be so good. You get sick of fund-raising in DCPS fast. You get tired of inexperienced and not terribly motivated teachers and iffy principals.

I think your experience may have more to do with the situation at Brent that has been discussed a lot on this forum - combining 4th and 5th, lots of attrition in 5th etc.

I think parents do Mathnasium or outside tutoring for a variety of reasons, sometimes bc their kid needs an extra push, sometimes bc their kid is bored, sometimes bc the parents want their kids to be the best. If you drive around the suburbs there are Mathnasium and Kumon centers all over the place so I think they’ll open up wherever a certain type parents with disposable income are living.

All that to say every school is different and every 4th/5th grade team I am sure is different too. I think a lot of it has to do with individual kids, some of whom may not push themselves, regardless of which school they were at, and some of whom would push themselves and sign up for all the things and excel wherever they attend.

Public schools in DC have debate, robotics club, book clubs, music, theater etc. IMO, kids that have good attendance, do all the work, sign up for things etc, they are learning just as much as their suburban counterparts.

This is our experience too and does a great job explaining the Mathnasium fad as well as the wide range of options available to the DCPS families in our immediate area. (And yes, I am a Brent parent who will absolutely not send a kid to 5th there as long as the upper school 4/5th model exists. They’ve got to move on from that experiment.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Budget is very important here.

The Capitol Hill elementary schools are great— Ludlow-Taylor, Maury, Chisholm, Payne, Brent (though they’re in a swing space for 2 years), and the neighborhood is wonderful. But your money is not going to go as far as the burbs and you’ll have less space. The trade off (particularly commute/walking/proximity to H, Eastern Market, downtown) is worth it to many but it’s pricey.

No, they aren't great. They're DCPS schools and they're just OK. All you need to do to understand what I'm talking about is visit Mathnasium on Penn. Ave SE after school on a weekday. The place is packed with Ludlow, Maury, Brent and Payne students mainly from families seeking extra math challenge. Nothing was hard enough for my kids at Brent in the upper grades, not math, not English, not social studies, not science. They weren't given remotely acceptable writing instruction. The school was fun and friendly, but great academically it was not. Without a law on GT education in DC or any formal programming for advanced learners in elementary school and lower per capita outlays for schools mainly serving high SES families than Title 1 schools in the District, DCPS ES programs can only be so good. You get sick of fund-raising in DCPS fast. You get tired of inexperienced and not terribly motivated teachers and iffy principals.

I think your experience may have more to do with the situation at Brent that has been discussed a lot on this forum - combining 4th and 5th, lots of attrition in 5th etc.

I think parents do Mathnasium or outside tutoring for a variety of reasons, sometimes bc their kid needs an extra push, sometimes bc their kid is bored, sometimes bc the parents want their kids to be the best. If you drive around the suburbs there are Mathnasium and Kumon centers all over the place so I think they’ll open up wherever a certain type parents with disposable income are living.

All that to say every school is different and every 4th/5th grade team I am sure is different too. I think a lot of it has to do with individual kids, some of whom may not push themselves, regardless of which school they were at, and some of whom would push themselves and sign up for all the things and excel wherever they attend.

Public schools in DC have debate, robotics club, book clubs, music, theater etc. IMO, kids that have good attendance, do all the work, sign up for things etc, they are learning just as much as their suburban counterparts.

I have always been a bit confused by what I read here about so many kids attending Mathnasium. If your child needs extra support, that makes complete sense. But, I'm not sure why elementary students need to work so far ahead--for what? I have two in DCPS (upper elementary and middle), and neither school is considered very highly regarded by DCUM standards, but my kids have had good math instruction and get 5s on CAPE without any outside formalized supplementing. My older is on track to do geometry in 8th, and that feels like plenty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Budget is very important here.

The Capitol Hill elementary schools are great— Ludlow-Taylor, Maury, Chisholm, Payne, Brent (though they’re in a swing space for 2 years), and the neighborhood is wonderful. But your money is not going to go as far as the burbs and you’ll have less space. The trade off (particularly commute/walking/proximity to H, Eastern Market, downtown) is worth it to many but it’s pricey.

No, they aren't great. They're DCPS schools and they're just OK. All you need to do to understand what I'm talking about is visit Mathnasium on Penn. Ave SE after school on a weekday. The place is packed with Ludlow, Maury, Brent and Payne students mainly from families seeking extra math challenge. Nothing was hard enough for my kids at Brent in the upper grades, not math, not English, not social studies, not science. They weren't given remotely acceptable writing instruction. The school was fun and friendly, but great academically it was not. Without a law on GT education in DC or any formal programming for advanced learners in elementary school and lower per capita outlays for schools mainly serving high SES families than Title 1 schools in the District, DCPS ES programs can only be so good. You get sick of fund-raising in DCPS fast. You get tired of inexperienced and not terribly motivated teachers and iffy principals.

Being the parent of a strong student can be challenging at these schools because they can get overlooked. However, we have noticed a bit of an increase in the willingness to differentiate in the last few years but it’s often just about occasional harder worksheets or iready assignments. One instance of pull outs for a group of kids who were way above grade level in math. Re the 4th/5th combo model, the school has been sharing data showing increases in growth and scores for 5th graders compared to the prior model. They definitely believe kids are learning better under this new model even though it’s counterintuitive. I don’t know if it will change our decision when the time comes but it’s interesting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We really like Maury, near Lincoln Park. Ticks all the boxes you mention and easy commute to Pentagon via 695/395. We also wanted small classes and a tight knit feel and it’s been great. Only downside is the feeder pattern - middle school is fine (people vary on this but the number of people from Maury sending kids there is increasingly significantly each year, so would be even better by the time your kid gets there) but high school is a no for almost everyone.

+1. Neighborhood is wonderful too— feels like a small town but is minutes away from H Street, Union Market, etc. I bike to work downtown in 10 min. Highly recommend!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Budget is very important here.

The Capitol Hill elementary schools are great— Ludlow-Taylor, Maury, Chisholm, Payne, Brent (though they’re in a swing space for 2 years), and the neighborhood is wonderful. But your money is not going to go as far as the burbs and you’ll have less space. The trade off (particularly commute/walking/proximity to H, Eastern Market, downtown) is worth it to many but it’s pricey.

No, they aren't great. They're DCPS schools and they're just OK. All you need to do to understand what I'm talking about is visit Mathnasium on Penn. Ave SE after school on a weekday. The place is packed with Ludlow, Maury, Brent and Payne students mainly from families seeking extra math challenge. Nothing was hard enough for my kids at Brent in the upper grades, not math, not English, not social studies, not science. They weren't given remotely acceptable writing instruction. The school was fun and friendly, but great academically it was not. Without a law on GT education in DC or any formal programming for advanced learners in elementary school and lower per capita outlays for schools mainly serving high SES families than Title 1 schools in the District, DCPS ES programs can only be so good. You get sick of fund-raising in DCPS fast. You get tired of inexperienced and not terribly motivated teachers and iffy principals.

I think your experience may have more to do with the situation at Brent that has been discussed a lot on this forum - combining 4th and 5th, lots of attrition in 5th etc.

I think parents do Mathnasium or outside tutoring for a variety of reasons, sometimes bc their kid needs an extra push, sometimes bc their kid is bored, sometimes bc the parents want their kids to be the best. If you drive around the suburbs there are Mathnasium and Kumon centers all over the place so I think they’ll open up wherever a certain type parents with disposable income are living.

All that to say every school is different and every 4th/5th grade team I am sure is different too. I think a lot of it has to do with individual kids, some of whom may not push themselves, regardless of which school they were at, and some of whom would push themselves and sign up for all the things and excel wherever they attend.

Public schools in DC have debate, robotics club, book clubs, music, theater etc. IMO, kids that have good attendance, do all the work, sign up for things etc, they are learning just as much as their suburban counterparts.

I have always been a bit confused by what I read here about so many kids attending Mathnasium. If your child needs extra support, that makes complete sense. But, I'm not sure why elementary students need to work so far ahead--for what? I have two in DCPS (upper elementary and middle), and neither school is considered very highly regarded by DCUM standards, but my kids have had good math instruction and get 5s on CAPE without any outside formalized supplementing. My older is on track to do geometry in 8th, and that feels like plenty.

Most of them are not working that far ahead but doing just enough to not fall behind, which can be fatal in math.

Clearly, your kids have sufficient cognitive ability, exec function, and internal motivation to excel with decent school instruction alone. Many kids are lacking in one or more of these areas and thus need out-of-school structure to stay on track, though perhaps not perpetually.

Now - the folks sending their kids to, e.g., AOPS and/or doing Beast Academy are actually looking to push their kids “ahead,” though with more an emphasis on developing conceptual depth (much of which doesn’t fully manifest on elementary-level math testing, e.g. CAPE or MAP math). This may also apply to folks doing math enrichment via JHU/CTY, But this is generally a different crowd than the folks using Mathnasium or Kumon.

I’d much rather be in your position: kids with inherently strong math skills so no need to supplement out of school, but optionality to do so as desired based on THEIR goals.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We really like Maury, near Lincoln Park. Ticks all the boxes you mention and easy commute to Pentagon via 695/395. We also wanted small classes and a tight knit feel and it’s been great. Only downside is the feeder pattern - middle school is fine (people vary on this but the number of people from Maury sending kids there is increasingly significantly each year, so would be even better by the time your kid gets there) but high school is a no for almost everyone.

Where do the kids go for HS?

Eastern. It could be a whole different situation by the time OP’s kid gets to 9th grade but right now the zoned MS is finally getting significant buy in but as far as I’m aware very few people are currently seeing Eastern as a viable HS choice.

No chance that Eastern will be seen as a viable HS for UMC families on the Hill by the time OP's kid is in 9th grade. None.

But there are UMC CH families at Eastern now, and it seems to be working for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Budget is very important here.

The Capitol Hill elementary schools are great— Ludlow-Taylor, Maury, Chisholm, Payne, Brent (though they’re in a swing space for 2 years), and the neighborhood is wonderful. But your money is not going to go as far as the burbs and you’ll have less space. The trade off (particularly commute/walking/proximity to H, Eastern Market, downtown) is worth it to many but it’s pricey.

No, they aren't great. They're DCPS schools and they're just OK. All you need to do to understand what I'm talking about is visit Mathnasium on Penn. Ave SE after school on a weekday. The place is packed with Ludlow, Maury, Brent and Payne students mainly from families seeking extra math challenge. Nothing was hard enough for my kids at Brent in the upper grades, not math, not English, not social studies, not science. They weren't given remotely acceptable writing instruction. The school was fun and friendly, but great academically it was not. Without a law on GT education in DC or any formal programming for advanced learners in elementary school and lower per capita outlays for schools mainly serving high SES families than Title 1 schools in the District, DCPS ES programs can only be so good. You get sick of fund-raising in DCPS fast. You get tired of inexperienced and not terribly motivated teachers and iffy principals.

I think your experience may have more to do with the situation at Brent that has been discussed a lot on this forum - combining 4th and 5th, lots of attrition in 5th etc.

I think parents do Mathnasium or outside tutoring for a variety of reasons, sometimes bc their kid needs an extra push, sometimes bc their kid is bored, sometimes bc the parents want their kids to be the best. If you drive around the suburbs there are Mathnasium and Kumon centers all over the place so I think they’ll open up wherever a certain type parents with disposable income are living.

All that to say every school is different and every 4th/5th grade team I am sure is different too. I think a lot of it has to do with individual kids, some of whom may not push themselves, regardless of which school they were at, and some of whom would push themselves and sign up for all the things and excel wherever they attend.

Public schools in DC have debate, robotics club, book clubs, music, theater etc. IMO, kids that have good attendance, do all the work, sign up for things etc, they are learning just as much as their suburban counterparts.

I have always been a bit confused by what I read here about so many kids attending Mathnasium. If your child needs extra support, that makes complete sense. But, I'm not sure why elementary students need to work so far ahead--for what? I have two in DCPS (upper elementary and middle), and neither school is considered very highly regarded by DCUM standards, but my kids have had good math instruction and get 5s on CAPE without any outside formalized supplementing. My older is on track to do geometry in 8th, and that feels like plenty.

Most of them are not working that far ahead but doing just enough to not fall behind, which can be fatal in math.

Clearly, your kids have sufficient cognitive ability, exec function, and internal motivation to excel with decent school instruction alone. Many kids are lacking in one or more of these areas and thus need out-of-school structure to stay on track, though perhaps not perpetually.

Now - the folks sending their kids to, e.g., AOPS and/or doing Beast Academy are actually looking to push their kids “ahead,” though with more an emphasis on developing conceptual depth (much of which doesn’t fully manifest on elementary-level math testing, e.g. CAPE or MAP math). This may also apply to folks doing math enrichment via JHU/CTY, But this is generally a different crowd than the folks using Mathnasium or Kumon.

I’d much rather be in your position: kids with inherently strong math skills so no need to supplement out of school, but optionality to do so as desired based on THEIR goals.

NP. I understand getting remedial help for students who are struggling. But the PP literally said that the “Mathnasium on Penn. Ave SE … is packed with Ludlow, Maury, Brent and Payne students … from families seeking extra math challenge” because “Nothing” at the public schools is “hard enough for [their] kids.” That doesn’t sound like remediation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Budget is very important here.

The Capitol Hill elementary schools are great— Ludlow-Taylor, Maury, Chisholm, Payne, Brent (though they’re in a swing space for 2 years), and the neighborhood is wonderful. But your money is not going to go as far as the burbs and you’ll have less space. The trade off (particularly commute/walking/proximity to H, Eastern Market, downtown) is worth it to many but it’s pricey.

No, they aren't great. They're DCPS schools and they're just OK. All you need to do to understand what I'm talking about is visit Mathnasium on Penn. Ave SE after school on a weekday. The place is packed with Ludlow, Maury, Brent and Payne students mainly from families seeking extra math challenge. Nothing was hard enough for my kids at Brent in the upper grades, not math, not English, not social studies, not science. They weren't given remotely acceptable writing instruction. The school was fun and friendly, but great academically it was not. Without a law on GT education in DC or any formal programming for advanced learners in elementary school and lower per capita outlays for schools mainly serving high SES families than Title 1 schools in the District, DCPS ES programs can only be so good. You get sick of fund-raising in DCPS fast. You get tired of inexperienced and not terribly motivated teachers and iffy principals.

I think your experience may have more to do with the situation at Brent that has been discussed a lot on this forum - combining 4th and 5th, lots of attrition in 5th etc.

I think parents do Mathnasium or outside tutoring for a variety of reasons, sometimes bc their kid needs an extra push, sometimes bc their kid is bored, sometimes bc the parents want their kids to be the best. If you drive around the suburbs there are Mathnasium and Kumon centers all over the place so I think they’ll open up wherever a certain type parents with disposable income are living.

All that to say every school is different and every 4th/5th grade team I am sure is different too. I think a lot of it has to do with individual kids, some of whom may not push themselves, regardless of which school they were at, and some of whom would push themselves and sign up for all the things and excel wherever they attend.

Public schools in DC have debate, robotics club, book clubs, music, theater etc. IMO, kids that have good attendance, do all the work, sign up for things etc, they are learning just as much as their suburban counterparts.

I have always been a bit confused by what I read here about so many kids attending Mathnasium. If your child needs extra support, that makes complete sense. But, I'm not sure why elementary students need to work so far ahead--for what? I have two in DCPS (upper elementary and middle), and neither school is considered very highly regarded by DCUM standards, but my kids have had good math instruction and get 5s on CAPE without any outside formalized supplementing. My older is on track to do geometry in 8th, and that feels like plenty.

Most of them are not working that far ahead but doing just enough to not fall behind, which can be fatal in math.

Clearly, your kids have sufficient cognitive ability, exec function, and internal motivation to excel with decent school instruction alone. Many kids are lacking in one or more of these areas and thus need out-of-school structure to stay on track, though perhaps not perpetually.

Now - the folks sending their kids to, e.g., AOPS and/or doing Beast Academy are actually looking to push their kids “ahead,” though with more an emphasis on developing conceptual depth (much of which doesn’t fully manifest on elementary-level math testing, e.g. CAPE or MAP math). This may also apply to folks doing math enrichment via JHU/CTY, But this is generally a different crowd than the folks using Mathnasium or Kumon.

I’d much rather be in your position: kids with inherently strong math skills so no need to supplement out of school, but optionality to do so as desired based on THEIR goals.

NP. I understand getting remedial help for students who are struggling. But the PP literally said that the “Mathnasium on Penn. Ave SE … is packed with Ludlow, Maury, Brent and Payne students … from families seeking extra math challenge” because “Nothing” at the public schools is “hard enough for [their] kids.” That doesn’t sound like remediation.

That’s a fair point, but when I say fall “behind” I don’t mean that those kids are in risk a needing remediation to keep up with DCPS school math, but falling behind the (more national/global) standard they’ll need to meet in order excel in advanced math courses in the out years. I guess that’s “ahead” of DCPS, but not really “ahead” in the same sense as an AOPS-trained, or an (advanced) RSM kid might be.

And understand this to be the case also based on interactions with families that frequent the same Mathnasium center on Penn Ave.