If you are rich, not just upper middle class

[Anonymous]

According to our wealth managers, our net worth will end up around $30M when we retire. We are self-made, as in we have no inheritance, we paid for college and wedding on our own, and we saved for the entirety of the downpayment on our first house.
For us, work is not just about money or even joy, it's about having structure to your life and finding satisfaction in contributing to something greater than yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:According to our wealth managers, our net worth will end up around $30M when we retire. We are self-made, as in we have no inheritance, we paid for college and wedding on our own, and we saved for the entirety of the downpayment on our first house.
For us, work is not just about money or even joy, it's about having structure to your life and finding satisfaction in contributing to something greater than yourself.

+1000

Same for us! Our kids understand their privilege. And quite frankly, were never given everything growing up and had no clue of our true wealth. They attend a HS where kids are driving teslas, BMW, sports cars, etc and ours had Hondas. They were just happy to have a car to drive.
They see their friends working to manage paying off student loans post graduation while driving crappy cars and are greatly appreciative of all they have, yet they still budget and live within their means. But realize the reason they can afford their apartment more easily is because they dont' have a car payment (of $400-500/month) like many do.

We do what we enjoy, and are very generous with friends and family. But in our 50s are finally really enjoying all we have and starting to splurge much more

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have 25M, but our HHI is not high. The millions came because we were lucky/savvy in the stock market when we were young, and now we're older.

Our kids know how much we have, and they are preparing for careers in case everything goes south. But our goal is to build family wealth and our kids, having lived a relatively frugal lifestyle like us, will try to build on that for future generations as well.

Me again. Honestly, I feel your question would be valid if we were talking 100M and above. But with our 25M, I don't think our kids can plan on not working.

This is just emblematic of the tendency of people on this board (in the US?) to think it's never enough. Unless you spend a hefty portion, your kids can live off of the earnings from 25 million.

Yes they could, but not a luxurious lifestyle. Whereas if they work (even earning $75-100k, this can nicely supplement that.

Also (dp) we want our kids to have a work ethic, they know they have to have jobs. They both already have their own careers going and are doing well. Sure they don't have to work 80 hour+ jobs but they have meaningful careers at great jobs. (Think $75k for a kid 2 years out of college in Mcola) and $90k as starting salary for engineering kid first year out of college.

By most standards, they are in top 25% already for their age. And live within their means. Our $ supplements their lifestyle. They can mange without it

They can manage without it living with roommates or in your home, driving a car you paid for and enjoying healthcare insurance they still get through you that's free to them. Once they really start paying for all this, they cannot make it on their own unless they get into the top 10% earner bracket at least. The lifestyle kids who have parents able to help them and give them a hand when needed is VASTLY different than lifestyle of kids who don't have any ground under their feet, and where failure to provide for themselves means couch surfing with poor family, driving a clunker, mooching whenever possible or ending up homeless.

You are completely delusional and detached from reality or had never been poor before without any safety net because your family is also broke and has no space to accommodate you.

[Anonymous]

My old CEO made in 10 years I worked for him around 200 million. All four his kids went to state schools, took out loans, he lived in a split level in a 60 by 100 plot, shopped at kohls and drive a beat up minivan. He was donating and plans to donate 100 percent of his wealth to charity and leave zero inheritance. His kids will have less in inheritance than garbage man’s kids. Not all rich people want to leave generational wealth. They rather make a difference. In his case he refuses recognition so will never see him at a banquet or award thing or his name on building

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have 25M, but our HHI is not high. The millions came because we were lucky/savvy in the stock market when we were young, and now we're older.

Our kids know how much we have, and they are preparing for careers in case everything goes south. But our goal is to build family wealth and our kids, having lived a relatively frugal lifestyle like us, will try to build on that for future generations as well.

Me again. Honestly, I feel your question would be valid if we were talking 100M and above. But with our 25M, I don't think our kids can plan on not working.

You've got to be effing kidding me. I could stick $25 million in a 60- month CD at my credit union at 3.8% and pull more than $900k off it a year. No, I would not be working. Hell, if I earned a quarter of that amount off it, I wouldn't work.

This is why you people need to be taxed more. FFS.

DP: why do "we need to be taxed more"? I have that much in cds/cash alternatives, and plenty more in the market. All of it was taxed at 30-50% combined fed and state. I have paid plenty in taxes. The interest dividends are taxed at 40-50% for fed/state. I think we have paid enough and will continue to do so

However 900k per year spread across 2-3 kids is not enough for them to not work. Not if they want their kids to do activities and attend college and grad school and actually retire. Because once you need to start using the principal you ain't getting 900 k per year

If you don't think $900k/3= $300k per year is enough to live a comfortable life, do activities, and send your kids to college, and retire, I don't know what to tell you, but about 95% (literally) of American families are making less than that. Also, with that kind of annual return ( Note: that's the return **if i parked $25m in a CD**--it would average almost 2x that amount in the market) there would be no need to touch the principal, so.

Seriously, get your head out of your a$$.

You have more money than you know what to do with. The income equality in this country is a major public policy failure.

Agree it's more than most have. But $300K is not that much in a HCOLA, if you want your kids to attend college and grad school (that you pay for). If they kids work and earn $100-200K (them and their spouse) and add in the $300K then that is much more comfortable. But I wouldn't have my kids stop working with only $300K/year coming in, not with inflation. That would be stupid. I prefer they use that to supplement their lifestyle. Also, even if it was $5M/year coming in, I'd want them to work/have a passion/goals in life/somehting to do daily that does good for them and society. Not just sitting around

It's also not enough to buy a yacht! So I guess it's not enough.

Honestly, do you even listen to yourself?

[Anonymous]

I think people here don’t consider themselves rich unless they have a driver and a private plane. I have $15 M NW and feel pretty rich but I don’t have three houses, full time staff or vacation in Aspen. My financial advisor seems to think I can quit working and do pretty much whatever I want with this NW. A lot of people seem to spend a lot of money on expensive homes, travel, restaurants and clothing so they just need more than I do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course they will have to work. I’m not planning to leave all my money to charity but I don’t want my kids to turn out as vapid wastrels. They are expected to have a career or trade and be capable of standing on their own feet before they see any substantial gifts from us.

This. I have one who's struggling to find himself in his mid 20s even though he has a master's degree. I believe even gifting him the annual gift limit would hamper this, much less millions.

We waited until our children were fully launched and succeeding on their own before we started giving them cash gifts. Now they are smart enough to invest those gifts or put them into 529 plans. If we had given it to them right out of college that would have just been subsidizing them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have 25M, but our HHI is not high. The millions came because we were lucky/savvy in the stock market when we were young, and now we're older.

Our kids know how much we have, and they are preparing for careers in case everything goes south. But our goal is to build family wealth and our kids, having lived a relatively frugal lifestyle like us, will try to build on that for future generations as well.

Me again. Honestly, I feel your question would be valid if we were talking 100M and above. But with our 25M, I don't think our kids can plan on not working.

This is just emblematic of the tendency of people on this board (in the US?) to think it's never enough. Unless you spend a hefty portion, your kids can live off of the earnings from 25 million.

Yes they could, but not a luxurious lifestyle. Whereas if they work (even earning $75-100k, this can nicely supplement that.

Also (dp) we want our kids to have a work ethic, they know they have to have jobs. They both already have their own careers going and are doing well. Sure they don't have to work 80 hour+ jobs but they have meaningful careers at great jobs. (Think $75k for a kid 2 years out of college in Mcola) and $90k as starting salary for engineering kid first year out of college.

By most standards, they are in top 25% already for their age. And live within their means. Our $ supplements their lifestyle. They can mange without it

They can manage without it living with roommates or in your home, driving a car you paid for and enjoying healthcare insurance they still get through you that's free to them. Once they really start paying for all this, they cannot make it on their own unless they get into the top 10% earner bracket at least. The lifestyle kids who have parents able to help them and give them a hand when needed is VASTLY different than lifestyle of kids who don't have any ground under their feet, and where failure to provide for themselves means couch surfing with poor family, driving a clunker, mooching whenever possible or ending up homeless.

You are completely delusional and detached from reality or had never been poor before without any safety net because your family is also broke and has no space to accommodate you.

I grew up LMC/poor, often eating free lunches as my main meal for the day. I drove a clunker I had to work to pay for. I came out of college with lots of loans, so did my spouse. we worked hard and paid them off within 3 years by living frugally in a 1 bedroom place.

My kid has their own health insurance and is saving a lot. All we have given them is money for the vehicle, otherwise they can pay their bills without us, and they could afford the car, they just wouldn't be saving as much.
Point is they are living within their means. Yes the main perk is no student loans and a new car. Beyond that, they are living within their means. They save a portion of each paycheck, budget and don't spend if it's not worthwhile.

My kids recognize their privilege, especially having college paid for. They work hard and live reasonably. Yes they are not poor, but they are not living in the best place and uber eating/dining out multiple times per week. They cook most of their meals and budget for entertainment monthly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My old CEO made in 10 years I worked for him around 200 million. All four his kids went to state schools, took out loans, he lived in a split level in a 60 by 100 plot, shopped at kohls and drive a beat up minivan. He was donating and plans to donate 100 percent of his wealth to charity and leave zero inheritance. His kids will have less in inheritance than garbage man’s kids. Not all rich people want to leave generational wealth. They rather make a difference. In his case he refuses recognition so will never see him at a banquet or award thing or his name on building

And some of us donate to charity and still leave some generational wealth. Good if that's what he wants to do. But I cannot imagine keeping some for kids/grandkids, along with gifting millions to our favorite local charities.

[Anonymous]

I read through this thread and there is a lot of good thinking about wealth in terms of building it and then dealing with it once you have it, especially regarding adult children.

My husband and I are long retired and we have a very high net worth. While I pay all the bills he manages all of our investments and once a year or so he provides me with a detailed update for estate planning purposes in case something happens to him. It's a crazy number likely approaching $100 million and that includes homes, irrevocable trusts, 529's, donor advised funds.... everything so a lot of it is now technically outside of our estate for tax purposes. But we don't live like that. We didn't grow up with money and we've always been conservative so we save a lot and invest wisely. We certainly live very comfortably but we don't fly private, drive $100,000 cars and I'm not dripping with jewelry. What we have will ultimately go first to charity, then our kids and now our many grandkids. While our children are doing great on their own we are very concerned about what the economic future will be for our grandchildren and ultimately their children. We are pretty generous with our kids but they, especially our sons-in-law, want to build their own net worth and not rely on us. I'm sure if our friends knew what we have they'd think we are crazy. Maybe we are!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have 25M, but our HHI is not high. The millions came because we were lucky/savvy in the stock market when we were young, and now we're older.

Our kids know how much we have, and they are preparing for careers in case everything goes south. But our goal is to build family wealth and our kids, having lived a relatively frugal lifestyle like us, will try to build on that for future generations as well.

Me again. Honestly, I feel your question would be valid if we were talking 100M and above. But with our 25M, I don't think our kids can plan on not working.

You've got to be effing kidding me. I could stick $25 million in a 60- month CD at my credit union at 3.8% and pull more than $900k off it a year. No, I would not be working. Hell, if I earned a quarter of that amount off it, I wouldn't work.

This is why you people need to be taxed more. FFS.

DP: why do "we need to be taxed more"? I have that much in cds/cash alternatives, and plenty more in the market. All of it was taxed at 30-50% combined fed and state. I have paid plenty in taxes. The interest dividends are taxed at 40-50% for fed/state. I think we have paid enough and will continue to do so

However 900k per year spread across 2-3 kids is not enough for them to not work. Not if they want their kids to do activities and attend college and grad school and actually retire. Because once you need to start using the principal you ain't getting 900 k per year

If you don't think $900k/3= $300k per year is enough to live a comfortable life, do activities, and send your kids to college, and retire, I don't know what to tell you, but about 95% (literally) of American families are making less than that. Also, with that kind of annual return ( Note: that's the return **if i parked $25m in a CD**--it would average almost 2x that amount in the market) there would be no need to touch the principal, so.

Seriously, get your head out of your a$$.

You have more money than you know what to do with. The income equality in this country is a major public policy failure.

Agree it's more than most have. But $300K is not that much in a HCOLA, if you want your kids to attend college and grad school (that you pay for). If they kids work and earn $100-200K (them and their spouse) and add in the $300K then that is much more comfortable. But I wouldn't have my kids stop working with only $300K/year coming in, not with inflation. That would be stupid. I prefer they use that to supplement their lifestyle. Also, even if it was $5M/year coming in, I'd want them to work/have a passion/goals in life/somehting to do daily that does good for them and society. Not just sitting around

It's also not enough to buy a yacht! So I guess it's not enough.

Honestly, do you even listen to yourself?

So you'd want your kids to quit their jobs if they had $300K coming in from a trust? You wouldnt' require them to still have a job/contribute to society? You wouldn't want your grandkids to have a better lifestyle?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course they will have to work. I’m not planning to leave all my money to charity but I don’t want my kids to turn out as vapid wastrels. They are expected to have a career or trade and be capable of standing on their own feet before they see any substantial gifts from us.

This. I have one who's struggling to find himself in his mid 20s even though he has a master's degree. I believe even gifting him the annual gift limit would hamper this, much less millions.

We waited until our children were fully launched and succeeding on their own before we started giving them cash gifts. Now they are smart enough to invest those gifts or put them into 529 plans. If we had given it to them right out of college that would have just been subsidizing them.

Well some of us have kids who took that money, right out of college and funneled it into their ROTH iras and 401Ks and future home downpayment, and still have good jobs and are advancing just as if they didnt' have "funds coming in". They want to make something of themselves and don't want handouts. We are happy they are saving well for their future.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course they will have to work. I’m not planning to leave all my money to charity but I don’t want my kids to turn out as vapid wastrels. They are expected to have a career or trade and be capable of standing on their own feet before they see any substantial gifts from us.

This. I have one who's struggling to find himself in his mid 20s even though he has a master's degree. I believe even gifting him the annual gift limit would hamper this, much less millions.

We waited until our children were fully launched and succeeding on their own before we started giving them cash gifts. Now they are smart enough to invest those gifts or put them into 529 plans. If we had given it to them right out of college that would have just been subsidizing them.

Well some of us have kids who took that money, right out of college and funneled it into their ROTH iras and 401Ks and future home downpayment, and still have good jobs and are advancing just as if they didnt' have "funds coming in". They want to make something of themselves and don't want handouts. We are happy they are saving well for their future.

You are very lucky! Right out of college most kids, like mine, are concerned about their onerous education loans and not thinking about retirement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course they will have to work. I’m not planning to leave all my money to charity but I don’t want my kids to turn out as vapid wastrels. They are expected to have a career or trade and be capable of standing on their own feet before they see any substantial gifts from us.

This. I have one who's struggling to find himself in his mid 20s even though he has a master's degree. I believe even gifting him the annual gift limit would hamper this, much less millions.

We waited until our children were fully launched and succeeding on their own before we started giving them cash gifts. Now they are smart enough to invest those gifts or put them into 529 plans. If we had given it to them right out of college that would have just been subsidizing them.

Well some of us have kids who took that money, right out of college and funneled it into their ROTH iras and 401Ks and future home downpayment, and still have good jobs and are advancing just as if they didnt' have "funds coming in". They want to make something of themselves and don't want handouts. We are happy they are saving well for their future.

You are very lucky! Right out of college most kids, like mine, are concerned about their onerous education loans and not thinking about retirement.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course they will have to work. I’m not planning to leave all my money to charity but I don’t want my kids to turn out as vapid wastrels. They are expected to have a career or trade and be capable of standing on their own feet before they see any substantial gifts from us.

This. I have one who's struggling to find himself in his mid 20s even though he has a master's degree. I believe even gifting him the annual gift limit would hamper this, much less millions.

We waited until our children were fully launched and succeeding on their own before we started giving them cash gifts. Now they are smart enough to invest those gifts or put them into 529 plans. If we had given it to them right out of college that would have just been subsidizing them.

Absolutely!