Obese BMI

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I want to like Ellyn Satter, but I think the idea that children sneak and overeat sugary/caloric foods if you don’t regularly serve them as part of healthy meals is BULLLLLLLLLL. BULL. SO MUCH BULL.

Picture a small hill. This is the contribution of making something “forbidden.”

Picture Mount Everest. This is the contribution of the foods being highly palatable and the body being biologically wired to want them.

As someone who struggled with binge eating and overcame it in adulthood, I can tell you you’re wrong! The reason is that things like Cheetos, cookies, etc actually dont taste that great and they don’t make you feel good, if you pay attention. So learning to tune into your body is what makes all the difference in the world.

Op I think you’re doing things right in terms of her eating but I’d be on the lookout for PCOS or high insulin. If her insulin is high, that’s what needs to be checked - not her weight - and that can be managed through meds, or more exercise, or other strategies. I still think you need to be very careful because you don’t want a kid to be obsessing about diabetes prevention either. But just food for thought that I think you have a good perspective but you still aren’t wrong that your instincts are saying something might be off here.

Binge eating is a physiological disorder. You likely would have been a binge eater regardless of what type of foods your parents had at home

this is mostly true and does not contradict anything in my post. It is more about the restriction aspect.

Parents don’t cause binge eating by telling their kid they can only have one piece piece of cake and not two or three. Or by not buying Cheetos except on road trips or whatever

Yes, that can cause binge eating.

No, that is learning to regulate sugary desserts, something no one needs any of. Eating 3 pieces of case is ENGAGING IN BINGE EATING and that is not something parents should be enabling.

Agree. I think there is a lot of good to the Satter approach but some people erroneously take away that you shouldn't limit food at all. Of course that's ridiculous. I think where this can get hung up is if a person with a tiny appetite decides that "one serving" for their child is way smaller than is realistic. Or treating children differently because of their size -- the one you aren't worried about doesn't get much attention around food but the other one gets a lot of "are you sure you need that" comments or disapproving looks when they take a cupcake at a party. Serving reasonable amount of a varied diet at regular mealtimes and including "treat" foods as dessert of snacks occasionally to ALL is healthy. Your skinny kid doesn't need to binge on cookies anymore than your chubby one does.

The most important part of the Satter approach IMO is the structure. No snacks all the dang time. My kids get a snack at 3pm and then they have to wait until dinner. Then they are reasonably hungry, will eat most of what's served without issues, are satisfied and move on with the evening.

Occasionally when I'm serving something they really love and they scarf it down fast and want more, we'll ask them to pause and finish their salad. We explain that it takes a little while for their stomach and brain to communicate so it's important to give them time to talk. They both have ADHD and have difficulty with impulse control (as can DH who has impulsive eating issues) so we're always working on that. If they are still hungry for that food after they've paused and had some salad, and we have enough, then I will let them have a small 2nd serving. I want them to be tuned into and respectful of their appetites. On the flip side, if they tell me they are not hungry and only take a couple bites of dinner I don't argue with them about that. But, again with the structure, that means they won't eat until breakfast.

Sattler’s philosophy is you don’t limit food at meal or snack time. This is her mantra:

• The parent is responsible for what, when, and where.
• The child is responsible for how much and whether

I think this is ridiculous advice. Some kids when presented with food at mealtime will overeat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I want to like Ellyn Satter, but I think the idea that children sneak and overeat sugary/caloric foods if you don’t regularly serve them as part of healthy meals is BULLLLLLLLLL. BULL. SO MUCH BULL.

Picture a small hill. This is the contribution of making something “forbidden.”

Picture Mount Everest. This is the contribution of the foods being highly palatable and the body being biologically wired to want them.

As someone who struggled with binge eating and overcame it in adulthood, I can tell you you’re wrong! The reason is that things like Cheetos, cookies, etc actually dont taste that great and they don’t make you feel good, if you pay attention. So learning to tune into your body is what makes all the difference in the world.

Op I think you’re doing things right in terms of her eating but I’d be on the lookout for PCOS or high insulin. If her insulin is high, that’s what needs to be checked - not her weight - and that can be managed through meds, or more exercise, or other strategies. I still think you need to be very careful because you don’t want a kid to be obsessing about diabetes prevention either. But just food for thought that I think you have a good perspective but you still aren’t wrong that your instincts are saying something might be off here.

Binge eating is a physiological disorder. You likely would have been a binge eater regardless of what type of foods your parents had at home

this is mostly true and does not contradict anything in my post. It is more about the restriction aspect.

Parents don’t cause binge eating by telling their kid they can only have one piece piece of cake and not two or three. Or by not buying Cheetos except on road trips or whatever

Yes, that can cause binge eating.

No, that is learning to regulate sugary desserts, something no one needs any of. Eating 3 pieces of case is ENGAGING IN BINGE EATING and that is not something parents should be enabling.

Agree. I think there is a lot of good to the Satter approach but some people erroneously take away that you shouldn't limit food at all. Of course that's ridiculous. I think where this can get hung up is if a person with a tiny appetite decides that "one serving" for their child is way smaller than is realistic. Or treating children differently because of their size -- the one you aren't worried about doesn't get much attention around food but the other one gets a lot of "are you sure you need that" comments or disapproving looks when they take a cupcake at a party. Serving reasonable amount of a varied diet at regular mealtimes and including "treat" foods as dessert of snacks occasionally to ALL is healthy. Your skinny kid doesn't need to binge on cookies anymore than your chubby one does.

The most important part of the Satter approach IMO is the structure. No snacks all the dang time. My kids get a snack at 3pm and then they have to wait until dinner. Then they are reasonably hungry, will eat most of what's served without issues, are satisfied and move on with the evening.

Occasionally when I'm serving something they really love and they scarf it down fast and want more, we'll ask them to pause and finish their salad. We explain that it takes a little while for their stomach and brain to communicate so it's important to give them time to talk. They both have ADHD and have difficulty with impulse control (as can DH who has impulsive eating issues) so we're always working on that. If they are still hungry for that food after they've paused and had some salad, and we have enough, then I will let them have a small 2nd serving. I want them to be tuned into and respectful of their appetites. On the flip side, if they tell me they are not hungry and only take a couple bites of dinner I don't argue with them about that. But, again with the structure, that means they won't eat until breakfast.

Sattler’s philosophy is you don’t limit food at meal or snack time. This is her mantra:

• The parent is responsible for what, when, and where.
• The child is responsible for how much and whether

I think this is ridiculous advice. Some kids when presented with food at mealtime will overeat.

It's been a while since I read her but what I recall from "how much" was not that you have to provide unlimited amounts of everything on the table. Naturally in life you will only serve a certain amount that needs to be shared among all at the table. So if you made 4 pieces of chicken and everyone had one Satter's guidance is not that you should then be cooking more chicken because that is what the kid wants more of but that he should feel free to eat more of what else is being served.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I want to like Ellyn Satter, but I think the idea that children sneak and overeat sugary/caloric foods if you don’t regularly serve them as part of healthy meals is BULLLLLLLLLL. BULL. SO MUCH BULL.

Picture a small hill. This is the contribution of making something “forbidden.”

Picture Mount Everest. This is the contribution of the foods being highly palatable and the body being biologically wired to want them.

As someone who struggled with binge eating and overcame it in adulthood, I can tell you you’re wrong! The reason is that things like Cheetos, cookies, etc actually dont taste that great and they don’t make you feel good, if you pay attention. So learning to tune into your body is what makes all the difference in the world.

Op I think you’re doing things right in terms of her eating but I’d be on the lookout for PCOS or high insulin. If her insulin is high, that’s what needs to be checked - not her weight - and that can be managed through meds, or more exercise, or other strategies. I still think you need to be very careful because you don’t want a kid to be obsessing about diabetes prevention either. But just food for thought that I think you have a good perspective but you still aren’t wrong that your instincts are saying something might be off here.

Binge eating is a physiological disorder. You likely would have been a binge eater regardless of what type of foods your parents had at home

this is mostly true and does not contradict anything in my post. It is more about the restriction aspect.

Parents don’t cause binge eating by telling their kid they can only have one piece piece of cake and not two or three. Or by not buying Cheetos except on road trips or whatever

Yes, that can cause binge eating.

It doesn’t. No kids are truly deprived of junk food. Between friends, relatives, birthday parties, other parties and gatherings, the numerous school celebrations and just school in general..they are all getting plenty of junk food, whether parents have it at home or not.

Great logical answer and also completely wrong.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is her body size and shape drastically different from everyone in your family? Some people put on weight as adults through lifestyle factors and hormonal changes, but other people are just born into bigger bodies and will always be larger than other people.

The fact that she is also 97% for height implies she has a large frame. Even for heavier kids, isn’t the goal to keep them roughly on their growth curve? If her weight % keeps increasing relative to her height, that would seem more concerning than her height and weight increasing in the same proportion as her prior growth.

Height and weight have both moved higher than the curve recently to 98th and 99th. DH's family has weight and diabetes struggles and she basically looks like him in a wig.

This is your answer. What did he look like as a kid? Does he have sisters? The question is not “how do I turn my child born into a larger than average body into an average size or slim child?” Your question to the Dr or a dietitian should be “how do I help my child grow into a healthy adult who doesn’t yo yo diet or have an eating disorder”

Plus one thousand million

Ditto. I recommend reading Ellyn Satter's book "Your Child's Weight: Helping Without Harming" which directly addresses this.

Thank you. I just requested it from the library.

I think Ellyn Sattler gives out terrible advice for kids who have a tendency to gain weight in families that have obesity.

You have to restrict food if you want your child to be a normal weight and the sooner you do it the better. You can’t leave it up to your child to listen to their hunger cues because it’s messed up. Knowing both my DH and I have obesity on both sides and we both struggle with weight when our kids were little we never allowed extra servings of food. We ordered pizza but as a preschooler you just get one slice. If you are still hungry we had our kids go do something else or took them to walk the dogs.

If your child is obese eating the food you posted then it comes down to portion size. Don’t listen to Sattler, she just believes some kids are going to be fat. That kids can eat unlimited amounts of food you present to them for dinner if they are eating a balanced diet. Every year you prevent your kid from being overweight /obese is a win. I realize at least one of my kids will be overweight/obese eventually but I am trying to do all I can to prevent it.

So serve smaller portions then go do something else. Many kids aren’t even that hungry for breakfast. Start cutting back breakfast proportions. On the weekends we moved back the time we eat breakfast until 10 or 11 am so then we eat an early dinner. That means one meal less and we eat airpopped popcorn while watching a movie or go out for one scoop of ice cream at night. That is way less calories than a whole meal.

Restricting food absolutely leads to binging and ignoring hunger cues and a future of yo-yo dieting and food issues. The key thing with Satter's approach is that you decide what is served for meals and when they happen. The child chooses how much but that doesn't mean it has to be totally unlimited. It's OK that there may be limited amounts of some things, e.g. I only made x amount of macaroni and cheese or one piece of chicken per person and everyone has to share what's available. If you are still hungry there are other things on the table to eat. So if dinner is pizza, it's going to be served with salad and fruit. Still hungry after your slice, you have other things to eat. Nobody should be getting told that going around hungry should be the normal course of life.

When you are obese your hunger cues are already disordered. There is nothing wrong with feeling a little hunger. Up until the last 40 years or so unless you were ultra wealthy there wasn’t an unlimited amount of food at meals. Everyone got one serving and that was it. There wasn’t an endless supply of snacks including fresh fruit and salads. All those extra servings a child -who has a family history of obesity -eats gets their body used to eating a lot of food and then they gain weight and keep gaining weight.

OP’s kid is eating too much during meals of healthy food. That means portion sizes are too big and/or the child is eating multiple portions.

My family is unfortunately fat. My sister is a big proponent of Sattler and her kids eat huge amounts at meals. They are eating healthy things but are never told they can’t have seconds or thirds. So now they are used to eating more than they should. When I visit family members in another country I noticed there weren’t endless servings. You got one serving and that was it. Kids from that side of the family are all normal weight.

Maybe obesity is predominantly a genetic tendency—in which case your kid’s hunger signals came installed in a screwed up way, but then no amount of dietary restriction will lead to the outcome you seem to want, which is a thin child.

Or maybe obesity is the result of poor learned responses to hunger signals, in which case what you are doing is underlining that poor learned response and will have bad outcomes.

Pretty much no matter how you slice it, telling a hungry preschooler to walk a dog instead of eating is a form of child neglect. I am sorry that our culture is so whacked that you apparently feel it is both necessary and something you can get away with.

But letting a child be obese is not child neglect? This is insane!
I am not PP, and I am so happy my parents did not let me eat all I wanted at meals and I turned out normal weight (thin by American standards).
My kids are definitely not eating as much as they want of anything (healthy food and treats). Bar medical issues, I will not let my kids be obese and live a life of full of health issues (not to mention the emotional ones obese people unfortunately face in this world).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I want to like Ellyn Satter, but I think the idea that children sneak and overeat sugary/caloric foods if you don’t regularly serve them as part of healthy meals is BULLLLLLLLLL. BULL. SO MUCH BULL.

Picture a small hill. This is the contribution of making something “forbidden.”

Picture Mount Everest. This is the contribution of the foods being highly palatable and the body being biologically wired to want them.

As someone who struggled with binge eating and overcame it in adulthood, I can tell you you’re wrong! The reason is that things like Cheetos, cookies, etc actually dont taste that great and they don’t make you feel good, if you pay attention. So learning to tune into your body is what makes all the difference in the world.

Op I think you’re doing things right in terms of her eating but I’d be on the lookout for PCOS or high insulin. If her insulin is high, that’s what needs to be checked - not her weight - and that can be managed through meds, or more exercise, or other strategies. I still think you need to be very careful because you don’t want a kid to be obsessing about diabetes prevention either. But just food for thought that I think you have a good perspective but you still aren’t wrong that your instincts are saying something might be off here.

Binge eating is a physiological disorder. You likely would have been a binge eater regardless of what type of foods your parents had at home

this is mostly true and does not contradict anything in my post. It is more about the restriction aspect.

Parents don’t cause binge eating by telling their kid they can only have one piece piece of cake and not two or three. Or by not buying Cheetos except on road trips or whatever

Yes, that can cause binge eating.

No, that is learning to regulate sugary desserts, something no one needs any of. Eating 3 pieces of case is ENGAGING IN BINGE EATING and that is not something parents should be enabling.

Agree. I think there is a lot of good to the Satter approach but some people erroneously take away that you shouldn't limit food at all. Of course that's ridiculous. I think where this can get hung up is if a person with a tiny appetite decides that "one serving" for their child is way smaller than is realistic. Or treating children differently because of their size -- the one you aren't worried about doesn't get much attention around food but the other one gets a lot of "are you sure you need that" comments or disapproving looks when they take a cupcake at a party. Serving reasonable amount of a varied diet at regular mealtimes and including "treat" foods as dessert of snacks occasionally to ALL is healthy. Your skinny kid doesn't need to binge on cookies anymore than your chubby one does.

The most important part of the Satter approach IMO is the structure. No snacks all the dang time. My kids get a snack at 3pm and then they have to wait until dinner. Then they are reasonably hungry, will eat most of what's served without issues, are satisfied and move on with the evening.

Occasionally when I'm serving something they really love and they scarf it down fast and want more, we'll ask them to pause and finish their salad. We explain that it takes a little while for their stomach and brain to communicate so it's important to give them time to talk. They both have ADHD and have difficulty with impulse control (as can DH who has impulsive eating issues) so we're always working on that. If they are still hungry for that food after they've paused and had some salad, and we have enough, then I will let them have a small 2nd serving. I want them to be tuned into and respectful of their appetites. On the flip side, if they tell me they are not hungry and only take a couple bites of dinner I don't argue with them about that. But, again with the structure, that means they won't eat until breakfast.

Sattler’s philosophy is you don’t limit food at meal or snack time. This is her mantra:

• The parent is responsible for what, when, and where.
• The child is responsible for how much and whether

I think this is ridiculous advice. Some kids when presented with food at mealtime will overeat.

It's been a while since I read her but what I recall from "how much" was not that you have to provide unlimited amounts of everything on the table. Naturally in life you will only serve a certain amount that needs to be shared among all at the table. So if you made 4 pieces of chicken and everyone had one Satter's guidance is not that you should then be cooking more chicken because that is what the kid wants more of but that he should feel free to eat more of what else is being served.

Except that is impossible to do for every item on the table every time; cooking exact portions for everyone for everything. You have to and should say no if they are asking for too much. This is subjective but it is the only way if you have a child with a tendency to overeat. Since their brain isn’t getting the right signal from their stomach, their brain just has to learn through practice and guidance with portion size how much is “enough”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I want to like Ellyn Satter, but I think the idea that children sneak and overeat sugary/caloric foods if you don’t regularly serve them as part of healthy meals is BULLLLLLLLLL. BULL. SO MUCH BULL.

Picture a small hill. This is the contribution of making something “forbidden.”

Picture Mount Everest. This is the contribution of the foods being highly palatable and the body being biologically wired to want them.

As someone who struggled with binge eating and overcame it in adulthood, I can tell you you’re wrong! The reason is that things like Cheetos, cookies, etc actually dont taste that great and they don’t make you feel good, if you pay attention. So learning to tune into your body is what makes all the difference in the world.

Op I think you’re doing things right in terms of her eating but I’d be on the lookout for PCOS or high insulin. If her insulin is high, that’s what needs to be checked - not her weight - and that can be managed through meds, or more exercise, or other strategies. I still think you need to be very careful because you don’t want a kid to be obsessing about diabetes prevention either. But just food for thought that I think you have a good perspective but you still aren’t wrong that your instincts are saying something might be off here.

Binge eating is a physiological disorder. You likely would have been a binge eater regardless of what type of foods your parents had at home

this is mostly true and does not contradict anything in my post. It is more about the restriction aspect.

Parents don’t cause binge eating by telling their kid they can only have one piece piece of cake and not two or three. Or by not buying Cheetos except on road trips or whatever

Yes, that can cause binge eating.

It doesn’t. No kids are truly deprived of junk food. Between friends, relatives, birthday parties, other parties and gatherings, the numerous school celebrations and just school in general..they are all getting plenty of junk food, whether parents have it at home or not.

Great logical answer and also completely wrong.

Nope. Your kid is getting processed snack/sugary foods at least weekly between all the above sources. Now also add family ice cream stops, cookie at a coffee shop ajd whatever treats you get them occasionally. Between all this, you are really trying to say if you don’t also stock the house with Oreos and oatmeal creme pies your child is living a deprived life and will be a binge eater?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I want to like Ellyn Satter, but I think the idea that children sneak and overeat sugary/caloric foods if you don’t regularly serve them as part of healthy meals is BULLLLLLLLLL. BULL. SO MUCH BULL.

Picture a small hill. This is the contribution of making something “forbidden.”

Picture Mount Everest. This is the contribution of the foods being highly palatable and the body being biologically wired to want them.

As someone who struggled with binge eating and overcame it in adulthood, I can tell you you’re wrong! The reason is that things like Cheetos, cookies, etc actually dont taste that great and they don’t make you feel good, if you pay attention. So learning to tune into your body is what makes all the difference in the world.

Op I think you’re doing things right in terms of her eating but I’d be on the lookout for PCOS or high insulin. If her insulin is high, that’s what needs to be checked - not her weight - and that can be managed through meds, or more exercise, or other strategies. I still think you need to be very careful because you don’t want a kid to be obsessing about diabetes prevention either. But just food for thought that I think you have a good perspective but you still aren’t wrong that your instincts are saying something might be off here.

Binge eating is a physiological disorder. You likely would have been a binge eater regardless of what type of foods your parents had at home

this is mostly true and does not contradict anything in my post. It is more about the restriction aspect.

Parents don’t cause binge eating by telling their kid they can only have one piece piece of cake and not two or three. Or by not buying Cheetos except on road trips or whatever

Yes, that can cause binge eating.

No, that is learning to regulate sugary desserts, something no one needs any of. Eating 3 pieces of case is ENGAGING IN BINGE EATING and that is not something parents should be enabling.

Agree. I think there is a lot of good to the Satter approach but some people erroneously take away that you shouldn't limit food at all. Of course that's ridiculous. I think where this can get hung up is if a person with a tiny appetite decides that "one serving" for their child is way smaller than is realistic. Or treating children differently because of their size -- the one you aren't worried about doesn't get much attention around food but the other one gets a lot of "are you sure you need that" comments or disapproving looks when they take a cupcake at a party. Serving reasonable amount of a varied diet at regular mealtimes and including "treat" foods as dessert of snacks occasionally to ALL is healthy. Your skinny kid doesn't need to binge on cookies anymore than your chubby one does.

The most important part of the Satter approach IMO is the structure. No snacks all the dang time. My kids get a snack at 3pm and then they have to wait until dinner. Then they are reasonably hungry, will eat most of what's served without issues, are satisfied and move on with the evening.

Occasionally when I'm serving something they really love and they scarf it down fast and want more, we'll ask them to pause and finish their salad. We explain that it takes a little while for their stomach and brain to communicate so it's important to give them time to talk. They both have ADHD and have difficulty with impulse control (as can DH who has impulsive eating issues) so we're always working on that. If they are still hungry for that food after they've paused and had some salad, and we have enough, then I will let them have a small 2nd serving. I want them to be tuned into and respectful of their appetites. On the flip side, if they tell me they are not hungry and only take a couple bites of dinner I don't argue with them about that. But, again with the structure, that means they won't eat until breakfast.

Sattler’s philosophy is you don’t limit food at meal or snack time. This is her mantra:

• The parent is responsible for what, when, and where.
• The child is responsible for how much and whether

I think this is ridiculous advice. Some kids when presented with food at mealtime will overeat.

It's been a while since I read her but what I recall from "how much" was not that you have to provide unlimited amounts of everything on the table. Naturally in life you will only serve a certain amount that needs to be shared among all at the table. So if you made 4 pieces of chicken and everyone had one Satter's guidance is not that you should then be cooking more chicken because that is what the kid wants more of but that he should feel free to eat more of what else is being served.

Except that is impossible to do for every item on the table every time; cooking exact portions for everyone for everything. You have to and should say no if they are asking for too much. This is subjective but it is the only way if you have a child with a tendency to overeat. Since their brain isn’t getting the right signal from their stomach, their brain just has to learn through practice and guidance with portion size how much is “enough”

I would add the average kid who goes to school and sees friends and family regularly has treats and such at minimum 2-3 times per week from outside their house.

[Anonymous]

You all are enablers of OP's endangering her child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You all are enablers of OP's endangering her child.

What, by trying to help with child not be fat?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is her body size and shape drastically different from everyone in your family? Some people put on weight as adults through lifestyle factors and hormonal changes, but other people are just born into bigger bodies and will always be larger than other people.

The fact that she is also 97% for height implies she has a large frame. Even for heavier kids, isn’t the goal to keep them roughly on their growth curve? If her weight % keeps increasing relative to her height, that would seem more concerning than her height and weight increasing in the same proportion as her prior growth.

Height and weight have both moved higher than the curve recently to 98th and 99th. DH's family has weight and diabetes struggles and she basically looks like him in a wig.

This is your answer. What did he look like as a kid? Does he have sisters? The question is not “how do I turn my child born into a larger than average body into an average size or slim child?” Your question to the Dr or a dietitian should be “how do I help my child grow into a healthy adult who doesn’t yo yo diet or have an eating disorder”

Plus one thousand million

Ditto. I recommend reading Ellyn Satter's book "Your Child's Weight: Helping Without Harming" which directly addresses this.

Thank you. I just requested it from the library.

I think Ellyn Sattler gives out terrible advice for kids who have a tendency to gain weight in families that have obesity.

You have to restrict food if you want your child to be a normal weight and the sooner you do it the better. You can’t leave it up to your child to listen to their hunger cues because it’s messed up. Knowing both my DH and I have obesity on both sides and we both struggle with weight when our kids were little we never allowed extra servings of food. We ordered pizza but as a preschooler you just get one slice. If you are still hungry we had our kids go do something else or took them to walk the dogs.

If your child is obese eating the food you posted then it comes down to portion size. Don’t listen to Sattler, she just believes some kids are going to be fat. That kids can eat unlimited amounts of food you present to them for dinner if they are eating a balanced diet. Every year you prevent your kid from being overweight /obese is a win. I realize at least one of my kids will be overweight/obese eventually but I am trying to do all I can to prevent it.

So serve smaller portions then go do something else. Many kids aren’t even that hungry for breakfast. Start cutting back breakfast proportions. On the weekends we moved back the time we eat breakfast until 10 or 11 am so then we eat an early dinner. That means one meal less and we eat airpopped popcorn while watching a movie or go out for one scoop of ice cream at night. That is way less calories than a whole meal.

Restricting food absolutely leads to binging and ignoring hunger cues and a future of yo-yo dieting and food issues. The key thing with Satter's approach is that you decide what is served for meals and when they happen. The child chooses how much but that doesn't mean it has to be totally unlimited. It's OK that there may be limited amounts of some things, e.g. I only made x amount of macaroni and cheese or one piece of chicken per person and everyone has to share what's available. If you are still hungry there are other things on the table to eat. So if dinner is pizza, it's going to be served with salad and fruit. Still hungry after your slice, you have other things to eat. Nobody should be getting told that going around hungry should be the normal course of life.

When you are obese your hunger cues are already disordered. There is nothing wrong with feeling a little hunger. Up until the last 40 years or so unless you were ultra wealthy there wasn’t an unlimited amount of food at meals. Everyone got one serving and that was it. There wasn’t an endless supply of snacks including fresh fruit and salads. All those extra servings a child -who has a family history of obesity -eats gets their body used to eating a lot of food and then they gain weight and keep gaining weight.

OP’s kid is eating too much during meals of healthy food. That means portion sizes are too big and/or the child is eating multiple portions.

My family is unfortunately fat. My sister is a big proponent of Sattler and her kids eat huge amounts at meals. They are eating healthy things but are never told they can’t have seconds or thirds. So now they are used to eating more than they should. When I visit family members in another country I noticed there weren’t endless servings. You got one serving and that was it. Kids from that side of the family are all normal weight.

I agree with this poster that prior to 40 years ago food was expensive part of a family's budget and it was not unusual for kids to have a little hunger between meals. There was not the extreme level of snacking that you see today. Prior to 40 years ago you never saw toddlers eating in church (being fed snacks). Prior to 40 years ago kids were not fed snacks at other family's homes. Everyone ate 3 meals a day. Because food was an expensive part of the family's budget a child would get one portion and that was that.

[Anonymous]

I have been struggling with this too. My eldest, now almost 14, started getting heavier around age 7/8. My side of the family is quite slim, although I struggled with being heavy as a tween thanks to a medical condition and then developed anorexia as a teen. Now I try very hard to have a healthy relationship with food - and I LOVE food - but I would be lying if I didn’t admit that I think about my weight/food intake every single day. Mostly I just don’t weigh myself, I move my body every day a reasonable amount and I don’t overeat.
My daughter is now a teen and what I had thought was typical pre-teen chubbiness is now definitely an overweight kid. She’s not obese and never has been close but she is heavy for her height. My husband’s family is almost all overweight so I do think there is a genetic predisposition towards heaviness. My daughter is generally a good eater, and probably eats the least of my 3 kids (the younger 2 are both quite slim, my son is borderline too skinny) but she does like sweets and I am fearful of being overly restrictive because of my own history with eating disorder. We eat healthily as a family over 80% of the time but I can’t police what she eats at school or after school now that she’s old enough to go out with her friends. I do talk with her a lot about the hidden sugar in Starbucks and bubble tea and that kind of thing and she only has sugary drinks about once a week. She’s active and walks a ton (we live in the city) and dances multiple times a week. She is somewhat unhappy about her size but doesn’t seem overly motivated to do anything about it and again I don’t want to push her into an eating disorder. I’m encouraging her to do more exercise in the form of “working out” because it’s important for her health but beyond that I don’t really know what to do. She’s never going to be a thin person but she can still be healthy. She just surpassed me in height at a bit over 5’7 and I think she weights about 160 which makes her just in the overweight category for bmi (which I do not think is the best tool for measuring health). But she’s in the middle of her growth spurt, 6 months ago she was probably 5’3 and weighed the same.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have been struggling with this too. My eldest, now almost 14, started getting heavier around age 7/8. My side of the family is quite slim, although I struggled with being heavy as a tween thanks to a medical condition and then developed anorexia as a teen. Now I try very hard to have a healthy relationship with food - and I LOVE food - but I would be lying if I didn’t admit that I think about my weight/food intake every single day. Mostly I just don’t weigh myself, I move my body every day a reasonable amount and I don’t overeat.
My daughter is now a teen and what I had thought was typical pre-teen chubbiness is now definitely an overweight kid. She’s not obese and never has been close but she is heavy for her height. My husband’s family is almost all overweight so I do think there is a genetic predisposition towards heaviness. My daughter is generally a good eater, and probably eats the least of my 3 kids (the younger 2 are both quite slim, my son is borderline too skinny) but she does like sweets and I am fearful of being overly restrictive because of my own history with eating disorder. We eat healthily as a family over 80% of the time but I can’t police what she eats at school or after school now that she’s old enough to go out with her friends. I do talk with her a lot about the hidden sugar in Starbucks and bubble tea and that kind of thing and she only has sugary drinks about once a week. She’s active and walks a ton (we live in the city) and dances multiple times a week. She is somewhat unhappy about her size but doesn’t seem overly motivated to do anything about it and again I don’t want to push her into an eating disorder. I’m encouraging her to do more exercise in the form of “working out” because it’s important for her health but beyond that I don’t really know what to do. She’s never going to be a thin person but she can still be healthy. She just surpassed me in height at a bit over 5’7 and I think she weights about 160 which makes her just in the overweight category for bmi (which I do not think is the best tool for measuring health). But she’s in the middle of her growth spurt, 6 months ago she was probably 5’3 and weighed the same.

You sound like you’re doing a great job! I think it’s important to get kids used to moving and getting exercise outside of organized sports (eg walking/biking to get places, working out or going on runs or swimming as a family, stuff like that) because it’s really easy to stop doing organized sports as a young adult and that can mess up a previously healthy diet/exercise balance. This happened to me when I was in college and then again after having kids, both things which distrusted a previously very active life.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I want to like Ellyn Satter, but I think the idea that children sneak and overeat sugary/caloric foods if you don’t regularly serve them as part of healthy meals is BULLLLLLLLLL. BULL. SO MUCH BULL.

Picture a small hill. This is the contribution of making something “forbidden.”

Picture Mount Everest. This is the contribution of the foods being highly palatable and the body being biologically wired to want them.

As someone who struggled with binge eating and overcame it in adulthood, I can tell you you’re wrong! The reason is that things like Cheetos, cookies, etc actually dont taste that great and they don’t make you feel good, if you pay attention. So learning to tune into your body is what makes all the difference in the world.

Op I think you’re doing things right in terms of her eating but I’d be on the lookout for PCOS or high insulin. If her insulin is high, that’s what needs to be checked - not her weight - and that can be managed through meds, or more exercise, or other strategies. I still think you need to be very careful because you don’t want a kid to be obsessing about diabetes prevention either. But just food for thought that I think you have a good perspective but you still aren’t wrong that your instincts are saying something might be off here.

Binge eating is a physiological disorder. You likely would have been a binge eater regardless of what type of foods your parents had at home

this is mostly true and does not contradict anything in my post. It is more about the restriction aspect.

Parents don’t cause binge eating by telling their kid they can only have one piece piece of cake and not two or three. Or by not buying Cheetos except on road trips or whatever

Yes, that can cause binge eating.

It doesn’t. No kids are truly deprived of junk food. Between friends, relatives, birthday parties, other parties and gatherings, the numerous school celebrations and just school in general..they are all getting plenty of junk food, whether parents have it at home or not.

Great logical answer and also completely wrong.

Nope. Your kid is getting processed snack/sugary foods at least weekly between all the above sources. Now also add family ice cream stops, cookie at a coffee shop ajd whatever treats you get them occasionally. Between all this, you are really trying to say if you don’t also stock the house with Oreos and oatmeal creme pies your child is living a deprived life and will be a binge eater?

I am saying that the thing that matters most in terms of long term impact is the degree of parental restriction. How much junk is available to a kid overall is not really relevant. If your parents approach food from a place of fear, control, and/or restriction then it will affect the kid. Some kids will be more affected than others (eg, an adhd kid). You can HAVE the Oreo and still be messed up by your parents if they say “oh we will have to do some exercise tonight and work that off.” So the access to the food is not the be all, end all that you make it out to be. It is the messaging around the food. I could explain further but you really need to read a book or two to understand.

[Anonymous]

BMI for kids is ridiculous. It's just a snapshot in time. My DD has been flagged for being overweight in the past, but she absolutely does not look overweight. She's VERY active and eats moderately. Now she's not a stick, don't get me wrong, but she looks just fine to me. She does have very muscular legs though, not sure if that's causing her to weight more than she "should"? We found a new pediatrician and they never bring up BMI to us. Not sure if they do to other families.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Jumping in to say i have normal weight/skinny kids and I also limit them to one piece of cake/one serving of food most of the time because... they are each one person. Like, whatever is made is divided by the number of people there. Everyone gets a reasonable/generous amount and no one is asking for seconds because they are ready to go play when they are done eating. Not giving extra meals to people is in no way as neglectful as some people are making it out to be.

This. I wonder if it is people nuking extra nuggets for kids or what bc if you make say a roast chicken and some sides, when it is gone, it is gone.

Food can become a major source of dopamine (esp sugar and starch), serotonin (the stretch receptors, stuffed feeling) and other endorphins. I see it as part of our job as parents to model and have the family engage in other ways to seek pleasure and relaxation besides the mouth, esp past infant age. Hobbies, creativity, movement (dancing around to music/family dance parties), walking and playing with pets, etc. Google will give many suggestions.

Food should really be deemphasized, esp with a family history of obesity, diabetes, etc. It's important to teach portion size (using smaller plates helps) and engage in an active lifestyle, just like teaching brushing teeth and adequate sleep.

OP, while eating a diet very much like you outlined, I was diagnosed with PCOS. In addition to belly weight gain, I developed thinning hair and hirsutism. It was just way too much starch for my body. On a whole foods diet heavy on meat, fish and eggs, those symptoms reversed. I was a distance runner at the time, metabolic health and weight really hinges on diet. Starches are chains of sugar and many fruits now are bred to be super sweet - I avoid tropical fruits and grapes in particular, I also used to be a big smoothy drinker but food like that drives hunger not satiety. Desserts in our home are on weekends and holidays. So far so good that none of my kids has developed PCOS.