Is 'job-hopping' really that bad if I continue to receive promotions & raises?

[Anonymous]

Moving for 25-50 isn’t work it. You need to consider your next move carefully. The market is extremely hot. Take advantage but carefully.

[Anonymous]

In tech job hopping every 2-3 years is normal and nobody cares.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Moving for 25-50 isn’t work it. You need to consider your next move carefully. The market is extremely hot. Take advantage but carefully.

While moving from 60k to 80k is a lot, the marginal utility kicks in. 150k to 170k is going to be meh. And that’s when people start stabilizing into one employer for a longer period of time. I wouldn’t worry too much about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Follow up question. What if company did try and retain you as evidenced by resume? Like, got promotion to next rung and you left 2 months later because opportunity was too good to pass up/new job counter offered to beat promotion.

If it's truly just a rungs/title promotion, not a problem for me, although I'd be pushing you hard on judgement (what made you want to leave, what made you decide to stay, what made you change your mind and be talking to me now, what are the chances you're about to use my offer to do the same thing again?)

Leaving immediately after a substantial promotion (e.g. something like taking on a team) would be a yellow flag I would want explained.

I should add... I can't think of a reason to tell anyone you took a retention promotion (vs. just a regular promotion).

Sorry, I was a little too theoretical there. Promotion wasn’t retention-based but regular but I was pretty far down the road with another company unbeknownst to current employer. Took the promotion as I figured I earned it but gave notice as soon as background check cleared 2 weeks later and stayed another six to help transition. Let new employer know in passing and they offered additional RSUs worth about $200K over 3 years. Smart of new employer tbh since it incentivizes me to stay.

But it sounds like the gist is that’s still a yellow flag, which is really helpful to know. I tend to keep getting better offers (many unsolicited) but I agree that gravy train ends at some point.

$200K over three years isn't very much. Some of the big tech companies offer much more a year in RSU's.

[Anonymous]

I have read several of these responses but I stopped, so I am not sure if anyone has point out yet that if this didn’t appear as an issue on a resume, you’d not have asked the question.

If your resume is turning into something you’re negatively judging in yourself, it will likely be viewed that way from other people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Follow up question. What if company did try and retain you as evidenced by resume? Like, got promotion to next rung and you left 2 months later because opportunity was too good to pass up/new job counter offered to beat promotion.

If it's truly just a rungs/title promotion, not a problem for me, although I'd be pushing you hard on judgement (what made you want to leave, what made you decide to stay, what made you change your mind and be talking to me now, what are the chances you're about to use my offer to do the same thing again?)

Leaving immediately after a substantial promotion (e.g. something like taking on a team) would be a yellow flag I would want explained.

I should add... I can't think of a reason to tell anyone you took a retention promotion (vs. just a regular promotion).

Sorry, I was a little too theoretical there. Promotion wasn’t retention-based but regular but I was pretty far down the road with another company unbeknownst to current employer. Took the promotion as I figured I earned it but gave notice as soon as background check cleared 2 weeks later and stayed another six to help transition. Let new employer know in passing and they offered additional RSUs worth about $200K over 3 years. Smart of new employer tbh since it incentivizes me to stay.

But it sounds like the gist is that’s still a yellow flag, which is really helpful to know. I tend to keep getting better offers (many unsolicited) but I agree that gravy train ends at some point.

$200K over three years isn't very much. Some of the big tech companies offer much more a year in RSU's.

I was already taking the job. But lol, thanks for the helpful comment. And my husband is a big law partner so this is my mommy track position. I’m well aware what FAANG (I guess MAANG) pay…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Change jobs to increase salary. Companies will hire a new person into a position for more money than the people already there. This shows no appreciation for the people already in the job.

By changing jobs, I increased my income by tens of thousands. That helped my retirement accounts a lot. During recessions, I was laid off. After all that, I decided I’m basically a free agent.

Save as much as you can and you can have financial freedoms in 10-15 years.

That’s a farce, as I’m assuming you are not properly calculating 3.2 percent inflation on average each year on your current spend levels nor assuming reasonable and sustainable market gains. If you save 15 years of salary, you can spend 60-70 percent of that after taxes. And then a portion Ian needed to sustain your expenses for this 15 years. Even if you could magically save 40% of the gross, you could only sustain your current living for no more than 15 years, without any surprise expenses, etc.

FIRE is a dangerous game and it’s called that because most will get burnt. If you don’t have at least $5M in invested assets, you can’t retire before age 40. It’s simple math and historical analysis.

Without having a single detail about this person's income or expenses, you sound like a bitter Betty.

[Anonymous]

If you are not planning to stay at a position for at least a year don’t take it. This includes promotions.
I would be wary to hire someone who had been with 4 companies in 3 yrs unless it was completed project work

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:It will bite you when it becomes excessive. Eventually, companies won’t hire you when you become a serial job hopper, or at least a lot of doors will close.

I wouldn’t give you a chance at my firm. 4 jobs in 3 years? I’d assume you got let go.

Definitely my fear. When i interviewed with my current company they didn't even bring it up as a negative in the interview. It was more like 'wow you've had a lot of really good experiences across the industry' and that was the extent of it.

I would not want to work for a close minded person who would not give a chance. Sounds old fashioned to me. I agree that all the jobs give you a wide range of experience. You see what is done with competitors, different industries and so on. I see it no differently than a business with their constant laying off of people, merges, acquisitions, retirement buyouts. Well, an employee can “lay off” an employer. Why not?

I worked for a place that laid people off in 2-3 rounds. I was round 2. Then they hired a bunch back. They fired all those people to make their reports look better to a buyer. Where is the loyalty to the humans they employed?

You’ll be fine, OP.

Those who fear a recession probably live above their means or paycheck to paycheck. Save for a rainy say. Make hay while the sun shines.

I’m the guy who said I wouldn’t give him a chance. It’s not old fashioned, I get people leave jobs for a lot of reasons but there’s really not a ton of good ones after a long string of them, so why take the risk? Maybe the guy got unlucky and picked a dud? Sure. But not 4 in a row. Its likely that he probably got pushed out of at least one, if not two. And if so, why? I can hire anyone I want because I pay top dollar, why even take the risk on someone who either is actually a low performer and can’t last at a company, or has a real attitude problem and cuts and runs the second they have to roll up their sleeves, or just doesn’t give a crap about his boss and his company and will immediately leave as soon as I’ve trained them?

I pay my team very well. I give them unlimited time off and I encourage them to take it. I let them set their own hours. I let them work remotely. They have full autonomy and trust. In return I expect two things: one, never let me get surprised by something in front of my boss. We need honesty and trust or it won’t work. Two, I expect you to do your job and do it really well. Do that, and I’ll shower you with money and praise.

I have the lowest turnover of any group at my company. No one leaves. Because I go to the matt for the team. I protect, I elevate and I reward.

But a guy who just leaves for the next thing as fast as possible? Meh. That’s not who I need on my team. I need the guy (or gal) who will accept that, hey, maybe, sometimes, I gotta call you on Sunday. And I need that person not to throw a hissy fit if I need 15 minutes of help. And the flipside is, 3 or 4 years with me and I’ll help you land a high 6 maybe even 7 figure job. But I want people who are in it with me, not those looking to get a pound of flesh, stir the pot and run for the nearest exit.

Someone who job hops has greater risk of being the latter. There’s no upside for me to taking that risk, only downside.

Gotcha, so it's OK when you make it all about you and how you'll "maybe" help someone who was soooo loyal to you, but you look down on people who make it all about them when choosing a job. Makes perfect sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In my experience, every hiring manager will have personal preferences. One HM disliked the fact that I did a role in a different area for 3 years. Another one disliked for not knowing who the Fed chair was. If they don't like you first impression, they will find something to pick on. If you can establish a solid work-chemistry, then everything is negotiable.

Once you get into your mid-30s, you will be offered a wide range of salaries, some HM will want to offer you 60k and another may offer you 260k. While some of the executives here are great leaders, the average hiring managers are not. In FACT, some are so pathetic, they can't keep anyone decent for longer than 10 month, then they recruit whoever is desperate to take their lowly paid job, fail and PIP the employee only to repeat. don't let their bias define you.

+100

There are more toxic situations than people are comfortable talking about. I don't hold it against people who see it for what it is and get out as soon as possible. I have HMs telling me that they "can afford to be picky" and have had job postings open for 1+ years, in some cases. Why can't candidates do the same?

[Anonymous]

A resume MIGHT show if the positions were promotions, but the resume won't show if you left for more more money. If I see lateral moves after a short period of time (<2 years) I view that negatively absent additional information. A departure for a promotion after a short period of time is more likely to be viewed positively. But a track record of 1 year per job, even with promotions, would be a big red flag for me and hard to overcome to even get to an screening interview stage.

[Anonymous]

I would never hire anyone who had a trend of less than 2 years in every job. Past age 27 or so moving jobs that frequently suggests a candidate is flaky, shortsighted and unprofessional.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would never hire anyone who had a trend of less than 2 years in every job. Past age 27 or so moving jobs that frequently suggests a candidate is flaky, shortsighted and unprofessional.

Lol so if someone got a 20 percent raise they shouldn’t take it because someone that has no influence over them might think it is flakey!? I think it is a red flag when someone is in a job for to long. Means they are not desirable

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would never hire anyone who had a trend of less than 2 years in every job. Past age 27 or so moving jobs that frequently suggests a candidate is flaky, shortsighted and unprofessional.

Lol so if someone got a 20 percent raise they shouldn’t take it because someone that has no influence over them might think it is flakey!? I think it is a red flag when someone is in a job for to long. Means they are not desirable

DP, but as a manager, I agree with the PP. While some people may be job hopping for more money, I think far more job hop because they *are* flakey and get bored as soon as the newness of the job wears off. When I look at the most competitive people from my undergrad and professional school, they got the good jobs out of school and have tended to hop every 3-5 years. The people who have moved more were weaker performers in school, and that has likely translated to the workplace too.

Not the end of the world, truly, but another reasonable perspective.

[Anonymous]

Also as you get older job hunting is also frequent as care less about your resume.

Plus you could be a start up type person. Around 54 I became a start up person. Not by choice.

A start company has a desperate need to start a department ASAP and pass regulator approval and could set whole thing up quick and fully staff.

I took job with big sign on bonus. Great salary and great bonus. Amazed last 3 years before fired. Once set up they don’t need me.

Next job they did not want to hire me. But hired me direct as a contractor with really food pay but it was a six month gig. Got canned at month five. Was 95 percent don’t and budget ran dry.

Next job a start up. Got a pile of worthless options that luckily are in the money. Salary sucks. Stock price slowing so new grants not attractive so I have to move. At this point I can set up the function in under one year.

I am getting close to retirement, (7 years away) so I care way less about hopping. I care more about salary and jumping before the ax swings

plus my resume has three jobs between 8-10 years each. My hopping was in early 20s and now on back end. The middle 30 pretty secure