Muslim and Arab Killings in the US

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

You mean this guy?

"“And then this kid just rocks me in the face as hard as he can. My glasses flew off. After a two-second blur I had no clue what had happened. I couldn’t believe the kid actually hit me,” said Vessal who added that he needs to obtain a new pair of glasses due to the extensive damage."

I guess getting hit in the face once and having to buy a new pair of glasses is "within an inch of your life"...Lol, I just love when people misrepresent events to support their narrative.

Also, it was in 2014, but why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against it?

NP, but Lynch wasn't confirmed as AG until 2015.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Daughter of two extremely unreligious Muslims here who immigrated to the US. While we are not religious, we have a very clear religious last name. As September 11th was happening, one of my dad's coworkers walked up to him in front of everyone and slapped him blaming him for the attacks. Someone else defaced and vandalized his car. My dad is the sweetest man in the world with zero hate in his heart. He's a proud American who loves this country and his worked tirelessly his entire life here in support of it. My youngest sister was 5 when 9/11 happened and I can't even begin to tell you how badly she was bullied at school after the attacks—physically, mentally, and emotionally. My parents had to pull her out of school for a bit until things settled down. And this was in the first grade, with a lot of the hate towards her being taught by parents to their kids at home.

Fast forward to this year and Trump's candidacy. I'm legitimately (and extremely) worried that what happened after 9/11 will happen to our family again any day now. These two latest attacks on Muslim Americans terrify me to my core and as an American citizen, as a human being, I should not be made to feel this way in my own home country.

Jeff, thank you for doing your part and for deleting the hate filled threads. It makes this little corner of the Internet feel a lot more safe and I for one am grateful of all you do to keep it that way.

Some people are assholes, even some people in the US. I've been bullied, punched, picked on, laughed at, but I see it clearly that these are the actions of individuals here in the US.

Fast forward to Trump's candidacy, I don't see how his proposed policies will make your life harder or more dangerous. While two attacks on Muslim Americans is sad, lets not blow this out of proportion - there is no epidemic of violence against Muslim Americans in the US. Based on hate crime statistics, Jewish hate crime victims out-number Muslim hate crime victims by over 3 times. There were in fact more Asian hate crime victims than Muslim hate crime victims. Your fears are irrational, and it's sad that you see fit to leverage your fears to silence others.

PP here. It's people like you who make me afraid of what the future holds. How dare you attempt to trivialize my experiences and my feelings without walking even half a step in my shoes. My fears are very rational and are rooted in real events and experiences that have happened to my family. Despite your repeated ignorant posts, I don't wish any of my experiences on you and I hope you never have to hear or witness the things I have. Enjoy life in your bubble but don't ever try to diminish what another person has gone through and how they feel.

It really seems you are not reading what you are replying to. As I said "I've been bullied, punched, picked on, laughed at..." It was tough growing up as a kid from a communist country here in the states in the early 80's. Even people who looked like me didn't tolerate me: South Korean kids picked on me because China supported the wrong side in the Korean war, Taiwanese kids didn't like me because they are the one true China, Hongkong/Cantonese people looked down on us because they considered themselves a part of UK. There were very very few other mainland Chinese kids in the US back then. So while I have not walked any steps in your shoes, neither have you mine. But the point here is not about our individual experiences because those are anecdotal. Fact of the matter is, there is no evidence of widespread systemic problem of hate crimes against Muslims or Asians here in the US. The data simply does not support that claim. You are free to feel as you wish, and I am free to point out that your fears are irrational. I hope we can have a constructive dialogue rather than let this devolve into a dismissive exchange of "you don't understand because you are not one of us".

More I think about it, there are parallels to be drawn here. Reagan lead a presidency of anti-communism. He was largely responsible for the fall of the USSR and pursued foreign policies of aiding nations/groups that fought against communism. The threat of communism throughout the cold war was tangible just as the current threat of Muslim terrorism. Remember that kids used to go through exercises in school of what to do in a nuclear attack. People built fall out shelters in their yards. That was real. The US worked through that, I never once thought that Reagan was a bad president for taking a strong line against communism even though that meant that I might become guilty-by-association in the eyes of certain individuals. Instead, I've seen first hand the evils of communism and am for one glad to see it fail all over the world.

So you're ok with the bullying you endured? And you don't think it's a problem that instead of Communists, the hatred is directed at Muslims?

No I am not okay with the bullying I endured. But I saw it for what it was: acts by the ignorant few, individuals like that exist in any society. Second, I realized that the government or Reagan wasn't out to get me in particular when they take such a strong stance against communism, such as when they scrutinized my family far more due to our background. As long as I did not hold a position against the US government or the American way of life, they welcomed me as a US citizen. There was no systemic attempt to oppress those of us who came from a communist country. Instead my family enjoyed the benefits of living and flourishing in a free society, subscribing fully to the ideals that makes America great. The American Indians, black slaves, and Japanese Americans during WWII knew a different America, that's not the America that exists today. I am not living in fear of hate crimes against my children because of their Chinese heritage, even though China is still a "communist" country.

I also want to clarify something, what I don't agree with is certain ideals held by certain people from Muslim countries. Similarly, Reagan and the US government was against ideals held by certain people from communist countries, not people from communist countries in general.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

We are in a situation in which a major political figure is actually engaging in anti-Muslim behavior and you are asking why other politicians are not speaking out against a different kind of prejudice? I would settle for Trump not speaking out against anti-Muslim and anti-Arab sentiment, but he actually flames the fires. If there is any doubt in your mind that both Obama and Lynch strongly oppose anti-Semitism, you are delusional.

What student are you referring to at Temple?

I meant Arizona State. (There was a less violent incident at Temole, and got the two mixed up. The one at Arizona State was beat badly. I'll get a link. In the meantime, here's a horrible incident against a 12-year-old.
http://www.liberalamerica.org/2016/05/24/jewish-student-violently-attacked-classmates-shouted-kill-jew/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Daughter of two extremely unreligious Muslims here who immigrated to the US. While we are not religious, we have a very clear religious last name. As September 11th was happening, one of my dad's coworkers walked up to him in front of everyone and slapped him blaming him for the attacks. Someone else defaced and vandalized his car. My dad is the sweetest man in the world with zero hate in his heart. He's a proud American who loves this country and his worked tirelessly his entire life here in support of it. My youngest sister was 5 when 9/11 happened and I can't even begin to tell you how badly she was bullied at school after the attacks—physically, mentally, and emotionally. My parents had to pull her out of school for a bit until things settled down. And this was in the first grade, with a lot of the hate towards her being taught by parents to their kids at home.

Fast forward to this year and Trump's candidacy. I'm legitimately (and extremely) worried that what happened after 9/11 will happen to our family again any day now. These two latest attacks on Muslim Americans terrify me to my core and as an American citizen, as a human being, I should not be made to feel this way in my own home country.

Jeff, thank you for doing your part and for deleting the hate filled threads. It makes this little corner of the Internet feel a lot more safe and I for one am grateful of all you do to keep it that way.

Some people are assholes, even some people in the US. I've been bullied, punched, picked on, laughed at, but I see it clearly that these are the actions of individuals here in the US.

Fast forward to Trump's candidacy, I don't see how his proposed policies will make your life harder or more dangerous. While two attacks on Muslim Americans is sad, lets not blow this out of proportion - there is no epidemic of violence against Muslim Americans in the US. Based on hate crime statistics, Jewish hate crime victims out-number Muslim hate crime victims by over 3 times. There were in fact more Asian hate crime victims than Muslim hate crime victims. Your fears are irrational, and it's sad that you see fit to leverage your fears to silence others.

PP here. It's people like you who make me afraid of what the future holds. How dare you attempt to trivialize my experiences and my feelings without walking even half a step in my shoes. My fears are very rational and are rooted in real events and experiences that have happened to my family. Despite your repeated ignorant posts, I don't wish any of my experiences on you and I hope you never have to hear or witness the things I have. Enjoy life in your bubble but don't ever try to diminish what another person has gone through and how they feel.

It really seems you are not reading what you are replying to. As I said "I've been bullied, punched, picked on, laughed at..." It was tough growing up as a kid from a communist country here in the states in the early 80's. Even people who looked like me didn't tolerate me: South Korean kids picked on me because China supported the wrong side in the Korean war, Taiwanese kids didn't like me because they are the one true China, Hongkong/Cantonese people looked down on us because they considered themselves a part of UK. There were very very few other mainland Chinese kids in the US back then. So while I have not walked any steps in your shoes, neither have you mine. But the point here is not about our individual experiences because those are anecdotal. Fact of the matter is, there is no evidence of widespread systemic problem of hate crimes against Muslims or Asians here in the US. The data simply does not support that claim. You are free to feel as you wish, and I am free to point out that your fears are irrational. I hope we can have a constructive dialogue rather than let this devolve into a dismissive exchange of "you don't understand because you are not one of us".

More I think about it, there are parallels to be drawn here. Reagan lead a presidency of anti-communism. He was largely responsible for the fall of the USSR and pursued foreign policies of aiding nations/groups that fought against communism. The threat of communism throughout the cold war was tangible just as the current threat of Muslim terrorism. Remember that kids used to go through exercises in school of what to do in a nuclear attack. People built fall out shelters in their yards. That was real. The US worked through that, I never once thought that Reagan was a bad president for taking a strong line against communism even though that meant that I might become guilty-by-association in the eyes of certain individuals. Instead, I've seen first hand the evils of communism and am for one glad to see it fail all over the world.

So you're ok with the bullying you endured? And you don't think it's a problem that instead of Communists, the hatred is directed at Muslims?

No I am not okay with the bullying I endured. But I saw it for what it was: acts by the ignorant few, individuals like that exist in any society. Second, I realized that the government or Reagan wasn't out to get me in particular when they take such a strong stance against communism, such as when they scrutinized my family far more due to our background. As long as I did not hold a position against the US government or the American way of life, they welcomed me as a US citizen. There was no systemic attempt to oppress those of us who came from a communist country. Instead my family enjoyed the benefits of living and flourishing in a free society, subscribing fully to the ideals that makes America great. The American Indians, black slaves, and Japanese Americans during WWII knew a different America, that's not the America that exists today. I am not living in fear of hate crimes against my children because of their Chinese heritage, even though China is still a "communist" country.

I also want to clarify something, what I don't agree with is certain ideals held by certain people from Muslim countries. Similarly, Reagan and the US government was against ideals held by certain people from communist countries, not people from communist countries in general.

I'm pretty sure that even right now, we try to thoroughly vet refugees and immigrants coming from Muslim countries. Trump's litmus test is not very well thought out. People can easily lie. I'm betting plenty of pro-USSR/Chinese communists got through the vetting process and legally immigrated to the US.

You may not know or remember about McCarthyism. It was a pretty terrible part of our history. Random people were accused of being communists, and the mere mention of communism and your name together in a sentence was enough to cause suspicion and damage your reputation.. Not a great part of our history.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

You mean this guy?

"“And then this kid just rocks me in the face as hard as he can. My glasses flew off. After a two-second blur I had no clue what had happened. I couldn’t believe the kid actually hit me,” said Vessal who added that he needs to obtain a new pair of glasses due to the extensive damage."

I guess getting hit in the face once and having to buy a new pair of glasses is "within an inch of your life"...Lol, I just love when people misrepresent events to support their narrative.

Also, it was in 2014, but why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against it?

NP, but Lynch wasn't confirmed as AG until 2015.

That was my, perhaps not very clear, point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

We are in a situation in which a major political figure is actually engaging in anti-Muslim behavior and you are asking why other politicians are not speaking out against a different kind of prejudice? I would settle for Trump not speaking out against anti-Muslim and anti-Arab sentiment, but he actually flames the fires. If there is any doubt in your mind that both Obama and Lynch strongly oppose anti-Semitism, you are delusional.

What student are you referring to at Temple?

I meant Arizona State. (There was a less violent incident at Temole, and got the two mixed up. The one at Arizona State was beat badly. I'll get a link. In the meantime, here's a horrible incident against a 12-year-old.
http://www.liberalamerica.org/2016/05/24/jewish-student-violently-attacked-classmates-shouted-kill-jew/

PP. OK, this is the one I was thinking of. It was Michigan State. (There was also a lesser one at Arizona, and I'm getting mixed up which hate crime occurred where.) This is the one I am thinking of. My point is that I haven't heard Obama speak out against antisemitic attacks on college campuses.
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/08/28/msu-student-knocked-unconscious-mouth-stapled-shut-in-alleged-hate-crime/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

We are in a situation in which a major political figure is actually engaging in anti-Muslim behavior and you are asking why other politicians are not speaking out against a different kind of prejudice? I would settle for Trump not speaking out against anti-Muslim and anti-Arab sentiment, but he actually flames the fires. If there is any doubt in your mind that both Obama and Lynch strongly oppose anti-Semitism, you are delusional.

What student are you referring to at Temple?

I meant Arizona State. (There was a less violent incident at Temole, and got the two mixed up. The one at Arizona State was beat badly. I'll get a link. In the meantime, here's a horrible incident against a 12-year-old.
http://www.liberalamerica.org/2016/05/24/jewish-student-violently-attacked-classmates-shouted-kill-jew/

PP. OK, this is the one I was thinking of. It was Michigan State. (There was also a lesser one at Arizona, and I'm getting mixed up which hate crime occurred where.) This is the one I am thinking of. My point is that I haven't heard Obama speak out against antisemitic attacks on college campuses.
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/08/28/msu-student-knocked-unconscious-mouth-stapled-shut-in-alleged-hate-crime/

So, you don't mean the one in 2014. You mean to cite a more relevant one from 2012.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

We are in a situation in which a major political figure is actually engaging in anti-Muslim behavior and you are asking why other politicians are not speaking out against a different kind of prejudice? I would settle for Trump not speaking out against anti-Muslim and anti-Arab sentiment, but he actually flames the fires. If there is any doubt in your mind that both Obama and Lynch strongly oppose anti-Semitism, you are delusional.

What student are you referring to at Temple?

I meant Arizona State. (There was a less violent incident at Temole, and got the two mixed up. The one at Arizona State was beat badly. I'll get a link. In the meantime, here's a horrible incident against a 12-year-old.
http://www.liberalamerica.org/2016/05/24/jewish-student-violently-attacked-classmates-shouted-kill-jew/

PP. OK, this is the one I was thinking of. It was Michigan State. (There was also a lesser one at Arizona, and I'm getting mixed up which hate crime occurred where.) This is the one I am thinking of. My point is that I haven't heard Obama speak out against antisemitic attacks on college campuses.
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/08/28/msu-student-knocked-unconscious-mouth-stapled-shut-in-alleged-hate-crime/

The incidents that you cites are of course horrific. Obama has spoken out strongly against anti-Semitism:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/obamas-powerful-condemnation-of-anti-semitism-we-are-all-jews/2016/01/29/9b32233c-c611-11e5-a4aa-f25866ba0dc6_story.html

The difference between anti-Semitism and the anti-Muslim and anti-Arab prejudice is that all American politicians routinely and categorically condemn anti-Semitism. Anti-Muslim and anti-Arab prejudice, on the other hand, is being promoted by the Republican nominee for president. Surely you can acknowledge that difference?

Ironically, if there is any tolerance of anti-Semitism within American politics at all, it exists among the white nationalists/neo-Nazis supporting Trump. You may recall the infamous "sheriff's badge" or six-pointed star that Trump tweeted regarding Clinton. That originated on an anti-Semitic website.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Sigh...

Based on 2014 statistics:

Jewish victims: 647
Muslim victims: 183
Asian victims: 200

Again, fears of widespread systemic violence against Muslims is unfounded. If we want to use FBI statistics, we should be far more concerned about hate crimes against Jews. Yes, hate crimes against Muslims is increasing as a percentage, most likely due to repeated terrorist attacks all over the world committed by Muslims - even Slate points to this causal relationship; blaming Trump's rhetoric for crime statics in 2014 is stretching it quite a bit.

I can't tell if you're being deliberately obtuse or whether it comes easy.

The difference between Jewish and Muslim victims of hate crimes is that there is no one (nor has there been someone for a very long time) calling for increased scrutiny of Jews, rousing suspicion in their American-ness, advocating for more screening of potential Jewish immigrants, or pointing fingers at Jewish majority countries. There is no political climate supporting exclusion and other-ness of American Jews, nor are any attempts in this direction tolerated. There are hate crimes, yes, but there is no authorizing environment for them.

In contrast, exclusion, more intense screening and suspicion of Muslims are currently very much on the agenda, and you seem to be saying that's this is quite all right as they had it coming.

I'd say there's be rather more scrutiny of immigration and travelers associated with Muslim countries since 9/11. Surely you've heard of the no fly list and the terrorist watch list. Yet in spite of this increased level of scrutiny post 9/11, the US does not currently have a widespread systemic problem of hate crimes against Muslims. Again the fears that the US will devolve into some type of a nightmarish state for Muslims in the future due to increased immigration scrutiny simply has no basis in reality.

Yes, exclusion, more intense screening and suspicion of Muslims is very much warranted due to what we are observing in the world. The US does not have an open border policy so this necessarily means that we exclude some people. We give visas easily to Canadians but not Russians so obviously some people are subject to more intense screening due to suspicion. The US doesn't let in just anyone for the same reason you don't invite just anyone into your home. For example, you may not like me as a person and are suspicious of me due to what I've expressed here, and would exclude me from coming into your home after intensive screening. That's your prerogative. It is also our prerogative as Americans to treat Non-Americans with the same degree of caution - there is nothing wrong with that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

We are in a situation in which a major political figure is actually engaging in anti-Muslim behavior and you are asking why other politicians are not speaking out against a different kind of prejudice? I would settle for Trump not speaking out against anti-Muslim and anti-Arab sentiment, but he actually flames the fires. If there is any doubt in your mind that both Obama and Lynch strongly oppose anti-Semitism, you are delusional.

What student are you referring to at Temple?

I meant Arizona State. (There was a less violent incident at Temole, and got the two mixed up. The one at Arizona State was beat badly. I'll get a link. In the meantime, here's a horrible incident against a 12-year-old.
http://www.liberalamerica.org/2016/05/24/jewish-student-violently-attacked-classmates-shouted-kill-jew/

PP. OK, this is the one I was thinking of. It was Michigan State. (There was also a lesser one at Arizona, and I'm getting mixed up which hate crime occurred where.) This is the one I am thinking of. My point is that I haven't heard Obama speak out against antisemitic attacks on college campuses.
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/08/28/msu-student-knocked-unconscious-mouth-stapled-shut-in-alleged-hate-crime/

So, you don't mean the one in 2014. You mean to cite a more relevant one from 2012.

Any chance you might acknowledge the attack was wrong?
That's my point. The majority of religious hate crimes are against Jews - and particularly on campuses - and Obama doesn't say a word to discourage the rise in antisemitism while speaking out (rightly) against bigotry toward Muslims and blacks.
https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2015/03/03/ucla-student-government-questions-judicial-board-nominee-being-jewish

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:Any chance you might acknowledge the attack was wrong?
That's my point. The majority of religious hate crimes are against Jews - and particularly on campuses - and Obama doesn't say a word to discourage the rise in antisemitism while speaking out (rightly) against bigotry toward Muslims and blacks.
https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2015/03/03/ucla-student-government-questions-judicial-board-nominee-being-jewish

Have you commented on the actual killings that I mentioned when starting this thread? Before you complain about a lack of acknowledgement about off-topic incidents, maybe you should do that first? Also, as I pointed out Obama has spoken out against anti-Semitism. No major American politician has spoken in favor of anti-Semitism. However, Trump does openly espouse anti-Muslim and anti-Arab policies. Might you stop your Google searches long enough to acknowledge that difference?

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

We are in a situation in which a major political figure is actually engaging in anti-Muslim behavior and you are asking why other politicians are not speaking out against a different kind of prejudice? I would settle for Trump not speaking out against anti-Muslim and anti-Arab sentiment, but he actually flames the fires. If there is any doubt in your mind that both Obama and Lynch strongly oppose anti-Semitism, you are delusional.

What student are you referring to at Temple?

I meant Arizona State. (There was a less violent incident at Temole, and got the two mixed up. The one at Arizona State was beat badly. I'll get a link. In the meantime, here's a horrible incident against a 12-year-old.
http://www.liberalamerica.org/2016/05/24/jewish-student-violently-attacked-classmates-shouted-kill-jew/

PP. OK, this is the one I was thinking of. It was Michigan State. (There was also a lesser one at Arizona, and I'm getting mixed up which hate crime occurred where.) This is the one I am thinking of. My point is that I haven't heard Obama speak out against antisemitic attacks on college campuses.
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/08/28/msu-student-knocked-unconscious-mouth-stapled-shut-in-alleged-hate-crime/

The incidents that you cites are of course horrific. Obama has spoken out strongly against anti-Semitism:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/obamas-powerful-condemnation-of-anti-semitism-we-are-all-jews/2016/01/29/9b32233c-c611-11e5-a4aa-f25866ba0dc6_story.html

The difference between anti-Semitism and the anti-Muslim and anti-Arab prejudice is that all American politicians routinely and categorically condemn anti-Semitism. Anti-Muslim and anti-Arab prejudice, on the other hand, is being promoted by the Republican nominee for president. Surely you can acknowledge that difference?

Ironically, if there is any tolerance of anti-Semitism within American politics at all, it exists among the white nationalists/neo-Nazis supporting Trump. You may recall the infamous "sheriff's badge" or six-pointed star that Trump tweeted regarding Clinton. That originated on an anti-Semitic website.

Well, Israel is an ideological and strategic ally. Meanwhile a not-insignificant portion of the Muslim population wants us to be subject to their religious laws even if we are non-believers. I believe it's important to draw a distinction between being against a set of ideals versus being against a population that may be associated with regional practice of those ideals. Saying that we need to subject Muslim immigrants to more scrutiny is not the same as saying that we are anti-Muslim. That's a straw-man. Again, I don't particularly like Trump and his exact position on this is quite foggy. I'd rather not assume the most extremist thing he has ever said is representative of where he is at on this issue. I know I've said some pretty stupid things in the past and if people always judged me by my worst behavior, I'd be marked as a pretty horrible person. I mean I used snakes as an example for stereotyping Muslims - in the name of all things secular, where was my decency?

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

We are in a situation in which a major political figure is actually engaging in anti-Muslim behavior and you are asking why other politicians are not speaking out against a different kind of prejudice? I would settle for Trump not speaking out against anti-Muslim and anti-Arab sentiment, but he actually flames the fires. If there is any doubt in your mind that both Obama and Lynch strongly oppose anti-Semitism, you are delusional.

What student are you referring to at Temple?

Also, if Trump spoke about Jews the way he does about Muslims, he would never have gotten the Republican nomination. Fortunately that kind of bigotry against Jews is no longer accepted by the majority of Americans but bigotry against Muslims is still quite acceptable - thus Trump's popularity.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

We are in a situation in which a major political figure is actually engaging in anti-Muslim behavior and you are asking why other politicians are not speaking out against a different kind of prejudice? I would settle for Trump not speaking out against anti-Muslim and anti-Arab sentiment, but he actually flames the fires. If there is any doubt in your mind that both Obama and Lynch strongly oppose anti-Semitism, you are delusional.

What student are you referring to at Temple?

I meant Arizona State. (There was a less violent incident at Temole, and got the two mixed up. The one at Arizona State was beat badly. I'll get a link. In the meantime, here's a horrible incident against a 12-year-old.
http://www.liberalamerica.org/2016/05/24/jewish-student-violently-attacked-classmates-shouted-kill-jew/

PP. OK, this is the one I was thinking of. It was Michigan State. (There was also a lesser one at Arizona, and I'm getting mixed up which hate crime occurred where.) This is the one I am thinking of. My point is that I haven't heard Obama speak out against antisemitic attacks on college campuses.
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/08/28/msu-student-knocked-unconscious-mouth-stapled-shut-in-alleged-hate-crime/

The incidents that you cites are of course horrific. Obama has spoken out strongly against anti-Semitism:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/obamas-powerful-condemnation-of-anti-semitism-we-are-all-jews/2016/01/29/9b32233c-c611-11e5-a4aa-f25866ba0dc6_story.html

The difference between anti-Semitism and the anti-Muslim and anti-Arab prejudice is that all American politicians routinely and categorically condemn anti-Semitism. Anti-Muslim and anti-Arab prejudice, on the other hand, is being promoted by the Republican nominee for president. Surely you can acknowledge that difference?

Ironically, if there is any tolerance of anti-Semitism within American politics at all, it exists among the white nationalists/neo-Nazis supporting Trump. You may recall the infamous "sheriff's badge" or six-pointed star that Trump tweeted regarding Clinton. That originated on an anti-Semitic website.

I was answering another poster before I saw your response, and I am glad (if one can be "glad" about anything when speaking of hate crimes) that you do acknowledge how horrific these antisemitic attacks were. I also read your link to the WP and am "glad" that Obama has indeed condemned this anti-Jewish sentiment. do feel, though, that the degree to which anntisemitism exists in this country is brushed under the rug, as people always seem surprised that the majority of hate crimes are perpetrated against Jews.

(All that said, Muslim and black bigotry are of course also unacceptable and should be condemned.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
True. Given that the majority of religious hate groups are against Jews, why isn't Obama condemning antisemitic sentiment (which is on the rise not only in Europe but here in America - on college campuses particularly). Why didn't Loretta Lynch speak out against the violence perpetrated against the Temple University Jewish student who was beaten within an inch of his life?

We are in a situation in which a major political figure is actually engaging in anti-Muslim behavior and you are asking why other politicians are not speaking out against a different kind of prejudice? I would settle for Trump not speaking out against anti-Muslim and anti-Arab sentiment, but he actually flames the fires. If there is any doubt in your mind that both Obama and Lynch strongly oppose anti-Semitism, you are delusional.

What student are you referring to at Temple?

I meant Arizona State. (There was a less violent incident at Temole, and got the two mixed up. The one at Arizona State was beat badly. I'll get a link. In the meantime, here's a horrible incident against a 12-year-old.
http://www.liberalamerica.org/2016/05/24/jewish-student-violently-attacked-classmates-shouted-kill-jew/

PP. OK, this is the one I was thinking of. It was Michigan State. (There was also a lesser one at Arizona, and I'm getting mixed up which hate crime occurred where.) This is the one I am thinking of. My point is that I haven't heard Obama speak out against antisemitic attacks on college campuses.
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2012/08/28/msu-student-knocked-unconscious-mouth-stapled-shut-in-alleged-hate-crime/

The incidents that you cites are of course horrific. Obama has spoken out strongly against anti-Semitism:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/obamas-powerful-condemnation-of-anti-semitism-we-are-all-jews/2016/01/29/9b32233c-c611-11e5-a4aa-f25866ba0dc6_story.html

The difference between anti-Semitism and the anti-Muslim and anti-Arab prejudice is that all American politicians routinely and categorically condemn anti-Semitism. Anti-Muslim and anti-Arab prejudice, on the other hand, is being promoted by the Republican nominee for president. Surely you can acknowledge that difference?

Ironically, if there is any tolerance of anti-Semitism within American politics at all, it exists among the white nationalists/neo-Nazis supporting Trump. You may recall the infamous "sheriff's badge" or six-pointed star that Trump tweeted regarding Clinton. That originated on an anti-Semitic website.

Well, Israel is an ideological and strategic ally. Meanwhile a not-insignificant portion of the Muslim population wants us to be subject to their religious laws even if we are non-believers. I believe it's important to draw a distinction between being against a set of ideals versus being against a population that may be associated with regional practice of those ideals. Saying that we need to subject Muslim immigrants to more scrutiny is not the same as saying that we are anti-Muslim. That's a straw-man. Again, I don't particularly like Trump and his exact position on this is quite foggy. I'd rather not assume the most extremist thing he has ever said is representative of where he is at on this issue. I know I've said some pretty stupid things in the past and if people always judged me by my worst behavior, I'd be marked as a pretty horrible person. I mean I used snakes as an example for stereotyping Muslims - in the name of all things secular, where was my decency?

A not-insignificant portion of Americans support unconstitutional policies restricting first amendment rights, not to mention other civil rights. I guarantee there are more of those than the hypothetical Muslims plotting to subject you to "religious laws". Talk about a straw man.