pledge of allegiance in schools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Va public schools recite it. Makes me uncomfortable, too.

Why does pledging allegiance to your nation make you uncomfortable? Part of school responsibility is to teach children how to be good citizens. What's the problem here?

preschoolers!!
they are in pre-school, learning colors and shapes and how to use scissors and to get used to being in a group

What does chanting the pledge of allegience do?
Make them more obedient 3 year olds who go to sleep when mother says so?

Do you really think learning colors and use scissors, etc are all that pre-schoolers are capable of learning, and all that they should learn? They are capable of learning civics and principles on a developmentally appropriate level level and they should do so. The concepts of honesty and fairness, for example are more important for them to learn than the use of scissors. The USA is a country founded on ideas. "Liberty and justice for all" is absolutely a concept that 3 year olds can begin to understand on a certain level. Making them "more obedient" so they will go to sleep is obviously a completely ridiculous statement.

[Anonymous]

Honestly, when I was a kid, I didn't even notice the "under God" part. It was just words. I didn't think about the meaning until I was much older.

Now, the Lord's Prayer, which my first-grade teacher made us recite, I objected to strongly. (It was a Christian school but I am not Christian.) I finally had my mother say something to her to get me excused. Before that, if you didn't say either the prayer or the pledge, you had to march up to the front of the room and say them by yourself!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, when I was a kid, I didn't even notice the "under God" part. It was just words. I didn't think about the meaning until I was much older.

Now, the Lord's Prayer, which my first-grade teacher made us recite, I objected to strongly. (It was a Christian school but I am not Christian.) I finally had my mother say something to her to get me excused. Before that, if you didn't say either the prayer or the pledge, you had to march up to the front of the room and say them by yourself!

Then why on earth did you go to a Christian school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why horrified?

Because it is encouraging a young child to be rude, defiant, confused, entitled, self-conscious, me-centered and much more. Granted, it is a small thing, but parents who are of this mindset are on their way to raising obnoxious brats.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why horrified?

Because it is encouraging a young child to be rude, defiant, confused, entitled, self-conscious, me-centered and much more. Granted, it is a small thing, but parents who are of this mindset are on their way to raising obnoxious brats.

They are raising kids less likely to be sheep.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why horrified?

Because it is encouraging a young child to be rude, defiant, confused, entitled, self-conscious, me-centered and much more. Granted, it is a small thing, but parents who are of this mindset are on their way to raising obnoxious brats.

They are raising kids less likely to be sheep.

"Pumpkins, remember what Mummy told you: some of your friends and teachers, OK probably 90% of the people at your school, may say something about God, and may think you should be respectful and thankful that you live in this country. But my precious shouldn't have to go along with that because Mummy knows more about all of this than they do! So you show them, Snowflake. If you hear your friends chanting something to the flag, you refuse to say the word "God!" Got that???!!! I know you don't understand all of this, but you do this for Mummy, OK?"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why horrified?

Because it is encouraging a young child to be rude, defiant, confused, entitled, self-conscious, me-centered and much more. Granted, it is a small thing, but parents who are of this mindset are on their way to raising obnoxious brats.

They are raising kids less likely to be sheep.

I
"Pumpkins, remember what Mummy told you: some of your friends and teachers, OK probably 90% of the people at your school, may say something about God, and may think you should be respectful and thankful that you live in this country. But my precious shouldn't have to go along with that because Mummy knows more about all of this than they do! So you show them, Snowflake. If you hear your friends chanting something to the flag, you refuse to say the word "God!" Got that???!!! I know you don't understand all of this, but you do this for Mummy, OK?"

Please stop using the term 'snowflake' like that. It's so mean and sarcastic. Not to mention so over-done on this website, and unoriginal. If you are so eager to insult me or make me feel bad, find a way to do it that does not involve insulting my innocent child by sarcastically implying that there's nothing special or unique about him/her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why horrified?

Because it is encouraging a young child to be rude, defiant, confused, entitled, self-conscious, me-centered and much more. Granted, it is a small thing, but parents who are of this mindset are on their way to raising obnoxious brats.

They are raising kids less likely to be sheep.

I
"Pumpkins, remember what Mummy told you: some of your friends and teachers, OK probably 90% of the people at your school, may say something about God, and may think you should be respectful and thankful that you live in this country. But my precious shouldn't have to go along with that because Mummy knows more about all of this than they do! So you show them, Snowflake. If you hear your friends chanting something to the flag, you refuse to say the word "God!" Got that???!!! I know you don't understand all of this, but you do this for Mummy, OK?"

Please stop using the term 'snowflake' like that. It's so mean and sarcastic. Not to mention so over-done on this website, and unoriginal. If you are so eager to insult me or make me feel bad, find a way to do it that does not involve insulting my innocent child by sarcastically implying that there's nothing special or unique about him/her.

That is a fact, not an insult.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:this whole thread makes me sad.

Me too, and I'm not some jingoistic "American! Fuck yeah!" asshole.

What's wrong with children reciting the pledge. Why on earth would it make you feel "uncomfortable?"

If it were, "one nation, under Satan," would you be okay with your kids reciting it every day at school?

Holy straw man argument, batman.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Va public schools recite it. Makes me uncomfortable, too.


Why does pledging allegiance to your nation make you uncomfortable? Part of school responsibility is to teach children how to be good citizens. What's the problem here?

No wonder there are so many anti-America Americans these days......

I don't know if you people are being willfully obtuse, or you aren't understanding the objection: the objection is NOT to the pledge of allegiance in general, and the patriotism behind it, and the love for this country, etc....the objection is purely to the fact that the words UNDER GOD are included in the pledge. Not everybody in this country worships god. The pledge is not being inclusive to all Americans. Now THAT'S anti-American.

Actually, I think there are two conversations happening one.

Some claim that their objection is to the inclusion of the phrase "Under God" in the pledge, which was added 60 years after the Pledge was authored.

Others seem to have an objection to the fact that the pledge is recited at all in either preschool or elementary school, or both.

I have plenty of understanding for those in the first group. I think discomfort with saying "Under God" is legitimate. I have far less understanding of the second group who would object to the recitation of the Pledge in schools, even preschool (where they are learning how to go to elementary school). This is part of the civic education of our children. There's nothing wrong with teaching them to have allegiance to their country. We're not teaching them BLIND allegiance (at least I hope not). But if you go to any government function, they all begin with the Pledge. It's where the government functions (i.e. a city council meeting) include a prayer that I begin to get very queasy. But the Pledge? No. Not in the least.

There is nothing wrong with modeling love of country for your children. Even the most liberal of Americans (like myself) know that. In many countries, the views I have wouldn't be tolerated and I'd be in a prison work camp for having them, so I very much love my country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why horrified?

Because it is encouraging a young child to be rude, defiant, confused, entitled, self-conscious, me-centered and much more. Granted, it is a small thing, but parents who are of this mindset are on their way to raising obnoxious brats.

They are raising kids less likely to be sheep.

I
"Pumpkins, remember what Mummy told you: some of your friends and teachers, OK probably 90% of the people at your school, may say something about God, and may think you should be respectful and thankful that you live in this country. But my precious shouldn't have to go along with that because Mummy knows more about all of this than they do! So you show them, Snowflake. If you hear your friends chanting something to the flag, you refuse to say the word "God!" Got that???!!! I know you don't understand all of this, but you do this for Mummy, OK?"

Please stop using the term 'snowflake' like that. It's so mean and sarcastic. Not to mention so over-done on this website, and unoriginal. If you are so eager to insult me or make me feel bad, find a way to do it that does not involve insulting my innocent child by sarcastically implying that there's nothing special or unique about him/her.

I don't think there is any implication. Clearly you think your child is special and unique. Maybe you take that view to an extreme. In reality, your child is probably not those things and your strong insistence to the contrary puts you squarely in the camp deserving of the "snowflake" derision.

I love how you think "snowflake" is overdone, however. That's really very cute. As if you think you are some arbiter of these things.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why horrified?

Because it is encouraging a young child to be rude, defiant, confused, entitled, self-conscious, me-centered and much more. Granted, it is a small thing, but parents who are of this mindset are on their way to raising obnoxious brats.

They are raising kids less likely to be sheep.

"Pumpkins, remember what Mummy told you: some of your friends and teachers, OK probably 90% of the people at your school, may say something about God, and may think you should be respectful and thankful that you live in this country. But my precious shouldn't have to go along with that because Mummy knows more about all of this than they do! So you show them, Snowflake. If you hear your friends chanting something to the flag, you refuse to say the word "God!" Got that???!!! I know you don't understand all of this, but you do this for Mummy, OK?"

You're way over thinking this.

You don't have to pretend to believe in god to love your country or be respectful of someone else's beliefs. It is not our job to validate your beliefs or practices. Wanna pray? Honor God in a pledge? Go on with your bad self, but don't ask me to pretend and play along for your benefit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why horrified?

Because it is encouraging a young child to be rude, defiant, confused, entitled, self-conscious, me-centered and much more. Granted, it is a small thing, but parents who are of this mindset are on their way to raising obnoxious brats.

They are raising kids less likely to be sheep.

I
"Pumpkins, remember what Mummy told you: some of your friends and teachers, OK probably 90% of the people at your school, may say something about God, and may think you should be respectful and thankful that you live in this country. But my precious shouldn't have to go along with that because Mummy knows more about all of this than they do! So you show them, Snowflake. If you hear your friends chanting something to the flag, you refuse to say the word "God!" Got that???!!! I know you don't understand all of this, but you do this for Mummy, OK?"

Please stop using the term 'snowflake' like that. It's so mean and sarcastic. Not to mention so over-done on this website, and unoriginal. If you are so eager to insult me or make me feel bad, find a way to do it that does not involve insulting my innocent child by sarcastically implying that there's nothing special or unique about him/her.

I don't think there is any implication. Clearly you think your child is special and unique. Maybe you take that view to an extreme. In reality, your child is probably not those things and your strong insistence to the contrary puts you squarely in the camp deserving of the "snowflake" derision.

I love how you think "snowflake" is overdone, however. That's really very cute. As if you think you are some arbiter of these things.

My child IS special and unique. So is yours. So is everyone's.

[Anonymous]

Just curious -- would you feel uncomfortable if the children were told to stand and put their hands over their hearts and sing the Star Spangled Banner every morning?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why horrified?

Because it is encouraging a young child to be rude, defiant, confused, entitled, self-conscious, me-centered and much more. Granted, it is a small thing, but parents who are of this mindset are on their way to raising obnoxious brats.

They are raising kids less likely to be sheep.

"Pumpkins, remember what Mummy told you: some of your friends and teachers, OK probably 90% of the people at your school, may say something about God, and may think you should be respectful and thankful that you live in this country. But my precious shouldn't have to go along with that because Mummy knows more about all of this than they do! So you show them, Snowflake. If you hear your friends chanting something to the flag, you refuse to say the word "God!" Got that???!!! I know you don't understand all of this, but you do this for Mummy, OK?"

You're way over thinking this.

You don't have to pretend to believe in god to love your country or be respectful of someone else's beliefs. It is not our job to validate your beliefs or practices. Wanna pray? Honor God in a pledge? Go on with your bad self, but don't ask me to pretend and play along for your benefit.

+1