2E parent of a 2E child

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Welcome to my world. My 2E ADHD/ASD/etc kid is 21 and he blew his chances at finding an internship this summer. He literally forgot to check his email for a week, and did not respond to an offer for an interview. While he's worked and improved on a lot of issues, he still has so many.

It's a long, hard, road, OP. I have episodes of leaning in, then pulling back, because I need to take care of my own health. My blood pressure rises to deeply unhealthy levels when I have to deal with his problems... however, the goal is financial independence for him, which means not presenting like a clown, acceptable personal hygiene, a minimum of social skills, and you know... checking his bloody email!

Big hugs, OP. It's in your interest to not have a failure-to-launch kid. This is what I'm trying to avoid.

Thank you. I will keep this in mind. He was SUCH an amazing promising younger kid and everyone expcted hi to be the most successful. At this point with his grades we are looking at community college.

My ADHD/ASD son is going to go to community college and there is nothing wrong with that. Please consider who your audience is in this forum. You're coming off and less and less sympathetic.

With respect, the title of the thread is 2E. That means they have high intellect and it is not unreasonable to think they had, at one point, high expectations and/or dreams. Achievement is all relative but one of the pain points in 2E is knowing that your kid is extremely intelligent and yet, floundering. Personally I do not see much point in a community college education for a smart but low achieving kid. Might as well just go to professional/trade school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Welcome to my world. My 2E ADHD/ASD/etc kid is 21 and he blew his chances at finding an internship this summer. He literally forgot to check his email for a week, and did not respond to an offer for an interview. While he's worked and improved on a lot of issues, he still has so many.

It's a long, hard, road, OP. I have episodes of leaning in, then pulling back, because I need to take care of my own health. My blood pressure rises to deeply unhealthy levels when I have to deal with his problems... however, the goal is financial independence for him, which means not presenting like a clown, acceptable personal hygiene, a minimum of social skills, and you know... checking his bloody email!

Big hugs, OP. It's in your interest to not have a failure-to-launch kid. This is what I'm trying to avoid.

Thank you. I will keep this in mind. He was SUCH an amazing promising younger kid and everyone expcted hi to be the most successful. At this point with his grades we are looking at community college.

My ADHD/ASD son is going to go to community college and there is nothing wrong with that. Please consider who your audience is in this forum. You're coming off and less and less sympathetic.

With respect, the title of the thread is 2E. That means they have high intellect and it is not unreasonable to think they had, at one point, high expectations and/or dreams. Achievement is all relative but one of the pain points in 2E is knowing that your kid is extremely intelligent and yet, floundering. Personally I do not see much point in a community college education for a smart but low achieving kid. Might as well just go to professional/trade school.

Well you would think that since you're also "high intellect 2E" person, you'd be able to figure out how to help your son be just like you. I'm out.

[Anonymous]

Seeing that you are 2E too, maybe you should unpack why you think some of this is “laziness”. I’ll bet you’re too hard on yourself and you’re doing the same thing to your kid.

Were you medicated as a kid? Or did you develop your own strategies to cope? If so, can you teach him some of the things you did to get by? These kids feel so much shame around their struggles that compassion and empathy go a long way.

[Anonymous]

I was unmedicated ad undiagnosed at his age. I just worked a lot harder for less results than people around me. I was much more vested than he is in the outcome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was unmedicated ad undiagnosed at his age. I just worked a lot harder for less results than people around me. I was much more vested than he is in the outcome.

Same. I'm not OP. Also, my work ethic improved over time. I was a lazy, average student in high school, a good student in undergrad, and a great student in grad school. But now I have a 2E boy, and I don't know if it's a gender thing or what, but he struggles in ways that I never did. Part of it is just the world is different now with phones and laptops in school. But my strategies alone don't work. The hardest part is trying to motivate him to want to do well in school. Their generation of boys believe that AI is going to replace knowledge jobs, so what's the point?

[Anonymous]

AI is not going to replace earning a living and having a work ethic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Are you getting the kid any help or just criticizing?

Maybe Dad is getting the kid help and tutoring

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The clothing and hygiene thing suggests sensory issues. Have you had that looked into?

He has some sensory issues, mostly around sounds. When he was younger he wanted fabrics to be soft like a lot of boys but that is better now.

I suspect sensory is driving the clothes and the hygiene.

You need to de-escalate your relationship by picking the highest priorities and dropping the rope on others. Stop hassling him constantly. Stop crying, punishing, yelling, begging, etc. Do that for a few weeks and then see if he's willing to explain to you his reasoning for wearing dirty clothes. There may be a reason!

Have you ever lived with someone with this sort of voluntary or voluntary refusal?
You don’t have months and years to reteach the same basic stuff. It’s never ending. So you end it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The clothing and hygiene thing suggests sensory issues. Have you had that looked into?

He has some sensory issues, mostly around sounds. When he was younger he wanted fabrics to be soft like a lot of boys but that is better now.

I suspect sensory is driving the clothes and the hygiene.

You need to de-escalate your relationship by picking the highest priorities and dropping the rope on others. Stop hassling him constantly. Stop crying, punishing, yelling, begging, etc. Do that for a few weeks and then see if he's willing to explain to you his reasoning for wearing dirty clothes. There may be a reason!

Have you ever lived with someone with this sort of voluntary or voluntary refusal?
You don’t have months and years to reteach the same basic stuff. It’s never ending. So you end it.

Uh, what?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The clothing and hygiene thing suggests sensory issues. Have you had that looked into?

He has some sensory issues, mostly around sounds. When he was younger he wanted fabrics to be soft like a lot of boys but that is better now.

I suspect sensory is driving the clothes and the hygiene.

You need to de-escalate your relationship by picking the highest priorities and dropping the rope on others. Stop hassling him constantly. Stop crying, punishing, yelling, begging, etc. Do that for a few weeks and then see if he's willing to explain to you his reasoning for wearing dirty clothes. There may be a reason!

Sensory is not driving any of it. It is all cognitive and character. He does not see anything or any obvious areas of low function.

I definitely do not believe that. Who would want to be stinky if they could easily avoid it?

Is he on the spectrum?

He is not stinky yet. But, you do not seem to understand the type of person he is. Who would want to be wearing pants that are too short, jackets that are too big, collars that aren't buttoned, clothes from the dirty hamper, jackets and ties that have food stains on them? Who wants to show up with greasy hair and smelly feet? Him. He would. He simply has no internal standards or sense or self-presentation.

Well, does he actually have a sense of smell? Start there. Some people are born without it.

He sounds on the spectrum. This is a social behavior issue and if he cannot understand the social reasons and social consequences, he has a social skills problem.

Look, you sound nice and I know you are trying to be helpful, but you don't get it. Yes, he has a sense of smell (better than mine). He has a self-esteem problem in the sense that he does not think he has a problem. He thinks this is all fine and I am the one being unreasonable.

Does he really believe that, or is that what he's saying to you?

In any case, I don't think hygiene is a priority at the moment so I suggest you stop working on it. Let him be disgusting and take whatever consequences arise.

NP here. She can stop working on it until the school calls social services and she’s treated like a criminal. If he’s still considered a minor she will be the bad guy who society will scream at.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you getting the kid any help or just criticizing?

Closet: he has a school uniform. There are brand new shirts in his size lined up in his closet by size and color. A rack for ties (that he instead loses). All his socks are the same. There is a separate dresser in his closet just for athletic clothes organized by athletic socks (top drawer), tops, bottom, and white vs colored. He has a hamper and a separate basket to accept things he has outgrown. Instead he reaches into the laundry to pull out dirty things, won’t accept that things don’t fit (thinks everything is “fine”) and won’t alert me when he needs something (and also refuses to come shopping).

School: he has a math tutor who comes twice a week. I force him to visit his teachers, who he blames for his missing work. There is a resource room at school that I have been begging him to make an appointment with for months. Nothing happens.

He isn’t even trying.

It's not working because the math tutor and teachers are not teaching him executive functioning. That's what he really needs.

He's not going to go to the resource room because he's overwhelmed and he's avoiding the issue. Stop begging him. Find a new way. The outside coaches are better if the kid is embarrassed to seek help at school.

You need to look at yourself here. You've done a lot of things. You're really trying super-hard! But you know your approach is not working. So you need to change your approach. It seems like you feel entitled to a neurotypical kid or a kid who isn't so hard for you to parent. But nobody is entitled to any type of kid, and this is what you got. So you need to find a new way. And it starts with accepting your child who has very poor executive functioning.

As for the outgrown clothes, take them away. Take the dirty clothes too. What would he do if his hamper were empty?

My ADHD 2E kid can’t do closets and drawers - out of sight, out of mind. The compromise is open baskets for clean clothes and a different hamper for dirty. Maybe a system like that could help for at least this problem?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The clothing and hygiene thing suggests sensory issues. Have you had that looked into?

He has some sensory issues, mostly around sounds. When he was younger he wanted fabrics to be soft like a lot of boys but that is better now.

I suspect sensory is driving the clothes and the hygiene.

You need to de-escalate your relationship by picking the highest priorities and dropping the rope on others. Stop hassling him constantly. Stop crying, punishing, yelling, begging, etc. Do that for a few weeks and then see if he's willing to explain to you his reasoning for wearing dirty clothes. There may be a reason!

Sensory is not driving any of it. It is all cognitive and character. He does not see anything or any obvious areas of low function.

I definitely do not believe that. Who would want to be stinky if they could easily avoid it?

Is he on the spectrum?

He is not stinky yet. But, you do not seem to understand the type of person he is. Who would want to be wearing pants that are too short, jackets that are too big, collars that aren't buttoned, clothes from the dirty hamper, jackets and ties that have food stains on them? Who wants to show up with greasy hair and smelly feet? Him. He would. He simply has no internal standards or sense or self-presentation.

People who do not want to be talked to during the day dress and look like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And no, he is not on the spectrum. He has a major league executive dysfunction problem combined with a laissez faire/ "who, me?" attitude.And it's always external forces, always someone else's problem/responsibility/mistake. Not him.

Are you like this?

Is the other parent like this?

The lying, deflecting, blaming others, avoidance. Is there a role model in his life that does exactly that to successfully avoid accountability?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And no, he is not on the spectrum. He has a major league executive dysfunction problem combined with a laissez faire/ "who, me?" attitude.And it's always external forces, always someone else's problem/responsibility/mistake. Not him.

It sounds like he is trying to avoid shame and preserve his dignity in the face of an overwhelming problem. Kids say they don't care, but really they do, they just don't know how to solve the problem and they are ashamed and try to save face.

I never bought into this “shame” theory. I think it was introduced by therapists as a way for victims to feel ok about bad things happening.

It’s self-sabotage and everyone sees through it except the saboteur.

Yes he wants to avoid admitting he screwed up, but to attempt to preserve his (fake) image and ego. Not to go improve and set up states so things improve. Ultimately it’s delusional. But we all play along so he doesn’t get depressed (more) and spiral.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This morning I absolutely lost it and told him point blank that he is the reason at the center of his problems. If he is experiencing negativity, it is because he is behaving in ways that generate that reaction in me and others. He isn't entitled to endless understanding; at a certain point he has to look in the mirror.

I assume he has a 2E father and he is 2E.

Father does the same and zero parenting? Doesn’t try to manage his symptoms either?