MCPS ending Loiderman/Parkland/Argyle magnets?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think they SHOULD end this program. Why would only a small area of the county have middle school choice? And why are we paying for bussing to multiple schools for one area.

I am an elementary school teacher at a school that feeds into this consortia. Many of the 5th graders do not like being forced to choose a program. They do not like leaving their friends. And when I drive to school it is absolutely ridiculous that one intersection has 3 bus stops- one for each school. The kids are told to wait on opposite corners for their bus. What a waste of transportation money.

Any child in the county can apply to the MSMC middle schools. Its a lottery.

I’m so tired of all the lotteries. I think it’s a way for MCPS to give the appearance of having both quality programming and equality but it actually works against that. They ration opportunities. They split kids up, and yes, I can’t imagine what they must be spending on wasteful transportation costs. Why can’t they just provide the same programs at all schools?

This exactly. They really need to focus on ensuring that home schools have good programming -- kids shouldn't have to lottery into another school to get a good basic education. But that is happening in way too much of the county.

These schools have the same academic curriculum as every other middle school. They add speciality focus classes to pull out of boundary students so the schools arent so poverty concentrated. If you did this in every school, it would not help balance FARMS rates because the rich kids would stay at their rich schools.

Right, that isn’t equal to other schools. Also, they pull wealthier students out of less wealthy schools, so it works both ways. I’ve seen this with the criteria magnets as well. It’s a shell game. MCPS could provide an equal education at local schools but chooses not to for some reason. Maybe because the small number of people who benefit from these programs are louder, I don’t know.

When you have populations with significantly higher needs but the same amount of funding at lower income schools, the education is not going to be "equal"

I’m not sure what your point is. My point is that I object to the false sense that MCPS provides equal opportunity for programming (criteria or choice programs) via lotteries, instead of providing the same programs at all schools. It’s an out for them, and it results in unequal access for students. Why can’t each elementary school have the CES curriculum? Why can’t each middle school have a STEM class? And put on a school play?

It sounds like you want every school to be the same even though the student populations they serve are vastly different. Why do you think this is going to work?

I don’t know why it wouldn’t work. It would certainly be fair. There are smart and high performing students at all schools, or did you not know that? My kids attend a title I elementary school. The school sends roughly 10 kids to the CES housed at a higher income school, leaving behind kids who qualified but didn’t get a seat. Why should MCPS take away from the peer cohort at a lower income school to put these kids at a higher income school? And why should the kids who didn’t get a seat not have access to the same curriculum? If MCPS would just offer the curriculum at the local school, then everyone who qualified could have access to the program (fairness), which would also be good for the school community. Instead they take from one school and give to another. Similar machinations happen at the middle school level through the lottery programs.

Starting at the elementary school level would be more beneficial than trying to bring different SES populations together at age 12. Growing up together in the same environment is important, but DCUM is against those type of boundary changes. It's so much more difficult to do starting in 6th grade.

I’m the PP you quoted, and I don’t particularly care where they draw the boundaries, I just want them to provide equality in curriculum and programming. I like my kids’ school, I just hate that MCPS has decided to lottery off their supposed best programs and create a really unfair system. I want the programming to come to my kids’ school, not for my kids to have to 1. win a lottery and 2. have to go to another school to access what should just be in all the schools anyway.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Middle school is already a steaming pile of dog poo for most kids. Enrichment is the only way out for smart kids and in-school enrichment is nonexistent in most schools.

High school and elementary school were significantly better experiences for my kid, and they were with essentially the same group of kids the whole time -- some very bright and motivated, ELLs, kids receiving FARMs, some special ed, etc.

I hope you don't think these categories are mutually exclusive

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Middle school is already a steaming pile of dog poo for most kids. Enrichment is the only way out for smart kids and in-school enrichment is nonexistent in most schools.

High school and elementary school were significantly better experiences for my kid, and they were with essentially the same group of kids the whole time -- some very bright and motivated, ELLs, kids receiving FARMs, some special ed, etc.

I hope you don't think these categories are mutually exclusive

PP - not mutually exclusive, just me typing too quickly. I should have put the word "including" after motivated. They are great kids and come from a lot of different circumstances.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think they SHOULD end this program. Why would only a small area of the county have middle school choice? And why are we paying for bussing to multiple schools for one area.

I am an elementary school teacher at a school that feeds into this consortia. Many of the 5th graders do not like being forced to choose a program. They do not like leaving their friends. And when I drive to school it is absolutely ridiculous that one intersection has 3 bus stops- one for each school. The kids are told to wait on opposite corners for their bus. What a waste of transportation money.

Any child in the county can apply to the MSMC middle schools. Its a lottery.

I’m so tired of all the lotteries. I think it’s a way for MCPS to give the appearance of having both quality programming and equality but it actually works against that. They ration opportunities. They split kids up, and yes, I can’t imagine what they must be spending on wasteful transportation costs. Why can’t they just provide the same programs at all schools?

This exactly. They really need to focus on ensuring that home schools have good programming -- kids shouldn't have to lottery into another school to get a good basic education. But that is happening in way too much of the county.

These schools have the same academic curriculum as every other middle school. They add speciality focus classes to pull out of boundary students so the schools arent so poverty concentrated. If you did this in every school, it would not help balance FARMS rates because the rich kids would stay at their rich schools.

Right, that isn’t equal to other schools. Also, they pull wealthier students out of less wealthy schools, so it works both ways. I’ve seen this with the criteria magnets as well. It’s a shell game. MCPS could provide an equal education at local schools but chooses not to for some reason. Maybe because the small number of people who benefit from these programs are louder, I don’t know.

When you have populations with significantly higher needs but the same amount of funding at lower income schools, the education is not going to be "equal"

I’m not sure what your point is. My point is that I object to the false sense that MCPS provides equal opportunity for programming (criteria or choice programs) via lotteries, instead of providing the same programs at all schools. It’s an out for them, and it results in unequal access for students. Why can’t each elementary school have the CES curriculum? Why can’t each middle school have a STEM class? And put on a school play?

All the middle schools Im aware of put on school plays - does yours not?

Our DCC MS does not and probably never will. Staff are barely willing to do a few weak afterschool fluff clubs like crochet club.

Our NEC MS doesn't either, and same: very few clubs. One of my kids got into Takoma Park, the other won't so they'll likely be stuck at our home school. The thing is, although my kids loves Takoma Park, all of the driving has put a strain on our family and with our weekend schedule, my kid cannot interact with their friends as much as they would like. I wish she would have been able to get her need for enrichment met at our home school. I'm at least interested in hearing what they have to say about changes, because the current system clearly doesn't work for many.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think they SHOULD end this program. Why would only a small area of the county have middle school choice? And why are we paying for bussing to multiple schools for one area.

I am an elementary school teacher at a school that feeds into this consortia. Many of the 5th graders do not like being forced to choose a program. They do not like leaving their friends. And when I drive to school it is absolutely ridiculous that one intersection has 3 bus stops- one for each school. The kids are told to wait on opposite corners for their bus. What a waste of transportation money.

Any child in the county can apply to the MSMC middle schools. Its a lottery.

I’m so tired of all the lotteries. I think it’s a way for MCPS to give the appearance of having both quality programming and equality but it actually works against that. They ration opportunities. They split kids up, and yes, I can’t imagine what they must be spending on wasteful transportation costs. Why can’t they just provide the same programs at all schools?

This exactly. They really need to focus on ensuring that home schools have good programming -- kids shouldn't have to lottery into another school to get a good basic education. But that is happening in way too much of the county.

These schools have the same academic curriculum as every other middle school. They add speciality focus classes to pull out of boundary students so the schools arent so poverty concentrated. If you did this in every school, it would not help balance FARMS rates because the rich kids would stay at their rich schools.

Right, that isn’t equal to other schools. Also, they pull wealthier students out of less wealthy schools, so it works both ways. I’ve seen this with the criteria magnets as well. It’s a shell game. MCPS could provide an equal education at local schools but chooses not to for some reason. Maybe because the small number of people who benefit from these programs are louder, I don’t know.

When you have populations with significantly higher needs but the same amount of funding at lower income schools, the education is not going to be "equal"

I’m not sure what your point is. My point is that I object to the false sense that MCPS provides equal opportunity for programming (criteria or choice programs) via lotteries, instead of providing the same programs at all schools. It’s an out for them, and it results in unequal access for students. Why can’t each elementary school have the CES curriculum? Why can’t each middle school have a STEM class? And put on a school play?

It sounds like you want every school to be the same even though the student populations they serve are vastly different. Why do you think this is going to work?

I don’t know why it wouldn’t work. It would certainly be fair. There are smart and high performing students at all schools, or did you not know that? My kids attend a title I elementary school. The school sends roughly 10 kids to the CES housed at a higher income school, leaving behind kids who qualified but didn’t get a seat. Why should MCPS take away from the peer cohort at a lower income school to put these kids at a higher income school? And why should the kids who didn’t get a seat not have access to the same curriculum? If MCPS would just offer the curriculum at the local school, then everyone who qualified could have access to the program (fairness), which would also be good for the school community. Instead they take from one school and give to another. Similar machinations happen at the middle school level through the lottery programs.

Starting at the elementary school level would be more beneficial than trying to bring different SES populations together at age 12. Growing up together in the same environment is important, but DCUM is against those type of boundary changes. It's so much more difficult to do starting in 6th grade.

MCPS does bring different SES populations together at ES through HS in some areas as much as they can. Some low SES areas are too isolated from areas where there are higher academically performing students and those are where there would need to be incentive to bring in these higher SES students. Hence the MSMC and other magnets.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think they SHOULD end this program. Why would only a small area of the county have middle school choice? And why are we paying for bussing to multiple schools for one area.

I am an elementary school teacher at a school that feeds into this consortia. Many of the 5th graders do not like being forced to choose a program. They do not like leaving their friends. And when I drive to school it is absolutely ridiculous that one intersection has 3 bus stops- one for each school. The kids are told to wait on opposite corners for their bus. What a waste of transportation money.

Any child in the county can apply to the MSMC middle schools. Its a lottery.

I’m so tired of all the lotteries. I think it’s a way for MCPS to give the appearance of having both quality programming and equality but it actually works against that. They ration opportunities. They split kids up, and yes, I can’t imagine what they must be spending on wasteful transportation costs. Why can’t they just provide the same programs at all schools?

This exactly. They really need to focus on ensuring that home schools have good programming -- kids shouldn't have to lottery into another school to get a good basic education. But that is happening in way too much of the county.

These schools have the same academic curriculum as every other middle school. They add speciality focus classes to pull out of boundary students so the schools arent so poverty concentrated. If you did this in every school, it would not help balance FARMS rates because the rich kids would stay at their rich schools.

Right, that isn’t equal to other schools. Also, they pull wealthier students out of less wealthy schools, so it works both ways. I’ve seen this with the criteria magnets as well. It’s a shell game. MCPS could provide an equal education at local schools but chooses not to for some reason. Maybe because the small number of people who benefit from these programs are louder, I don’t know.

When you have populations with significantly higher needs but the same amount of funding at lower income schools, the education is not going to be "equal"

I’m not sure what your point is. My point is that I object to the false sense that MCPS provides equal opportunity for programming (criteria or choice programs) via lotteries, instead of providing the same programs at all schools. It’s an out for them, and it results in unequal access for students. Why can’t each elementary school have the CES curriculum? Why can’t each middle school have a STEM class? And put on a school play?

It sounds like you want every school to be the same even though the student populations they serve are vastly different. Why do you think this is going to work?

I don’t know why it wouldn’t work. It would certainly be fair. There are smart and high performing students at all schools, or did you not know that? My kids attend a title I elementary school. The school sends roughly 10 kids to the CES housed at a higher income school, leaving behind kids who qualified but didn’t get a seat. Why should MCPS take away from the peer cohort at a lower income school to put these kids at a higher income school? And why should the kids who didn’t get a seat not have access to the same curriculum? If MCPS would just offer the curriculum at the local school, then everyone who qualified could have access to the program (fairness), which would also be good for the school community. Instead they take from one school and give to another. Similar machinations happen at the middle school level through the lottery programs.

Starting at the elementary school level would be more beneficial than trying to bring different SES populations together at age 12. Growing up together in the same environment is important, but DCUM is against those type of boundary changes. It's so much more difficult to do starting in 6th grade.

MCPS does bring different SES populations together at ES through HS in some areas as much as they can. Some low SES areas are too isolated from areas where there are higher academically performing students and those are where there would need to be incentive to bring in these higher SES students. Hence the MSMC and other magnets.

Locked behind lotteries! And two points. There are higher academically performing students at all schools. Even lower income schools have some higher income families (MC or UMC), so there is an SES mix already. In my experience, the magnets specifically take higher income families out of these schools when they would otherwise stay.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think they SHOULD end this program. Why would only a small area of the county have middle school choice? And why are we paying for bussing to multiple schools for one area.

I am an elementary school teacher at a school that feeds into this consortia. Many of the 5th graders do not like being forced to choose a program. They do not like leaving their friends. And when I drive to school it is absolutely ridiculous that one intersection has 3 bus stops- one for each school. The kids are told to wait on opposite corners for their bus. What a waste of transportation money.

Any child in the county can apply to the MSMC middle schools. Its a lottery.

Correct, but students in that part of the county are required to rank their choices and don’t feed into 1 middle school.

My DC welcomed the chance to join the MSMC and get _away_ from people from their ES.

+100

[Anonymous]

Loiderman is a joke. One in 25 kids in any class is interested in the arts. One in 25 kids doodles. Most of them are there to get away from their home schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Loiderman is a joke. One in 25 kids in any class is interested in the arts. One in 25 kids doodles. Most of them are there to get away from their home schools.

Their home schools are better. That's the joke.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Loiderman is a joke. One in 25 kids in any class is interested in the arts. One in 25 kids doodles. Most of them are there to get away from their home schools.

Their home schools are better. That's the joke.

Some schools have no "home" middle school. All students at Viers Mill choose from one of the 3 schools. Buses pick up students for all 3 schools in the neighborhood. It is nice that they have a choice, but I do wonder if this is the best use of county transportation money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Loiderman is a joke. One in 25 kids in any class is interested in the arts. One in 25 kids doodles. Most of them are there to get away from their home schools.

Totally disagree. My avid learner is thriving there with their arts focus and arts woven into academic classes. Direct quote: "kids want to be at Loiederman, unlike X school where I was before."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Loiderman is a joke. One in 25 kids in any class is interested in the arts. One in 25 kids doodles. Most of them are there to get away from their home schools.

Not our experience either. DC has had an absolutely extraordinary experience and a great MS education, including getting better at things they were not good at before. Teachers are _terrific_. We'd do it all over again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Loiderman is a joke. One in 25 kids in any class is interested in the arts. One in 25 kids doodles. Most of them are there to get away from their home schools.

P.S. you misspelled "Loiederman." Are you sure you've been connected there?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think they SHOULD end this program. Why would only a small area of the county have middle school choice? And why are we paying for bussing to multiple schools for one area.

I am an elementary school teacher at a school that feeds into this consortia. Many of the 5th graders do not like being forced to choose a program. They do not like leaving their friends. And when I drive to school it is absolutely ridiculous that one intersection has 3 bus stops- one for each school. The kids are told to wait on opposite corners for their bus. What a waste of transportation money.

Any child in the county can apply to the MSMC middle schools. Its a lottery.

I’m so tired of all the lotteries. I think it’s a way for MCPS to give the appearance of having both quality programming and equality but it actually works against that. They ration opportunities. They split kids up, and yes, I can’t imagine what they must be spending on wasteful transportation costs. Why can’t they just provide the same programs at all schools?

This exactly. They really need to focus on ensuring that home schools have good programming -- kids shouldn't have to lottery into another school to get a good basic education. But that is happening in way too much of the county.

These schools have the same academic curriculum as every other middle school. They add speciality focus classes to pull out of boundary students so the schools arent so poverty concentrated. If you did this in every school, it would not help balance FARMS rates because the rich kids would stay at their rich schools.

Why should parts of the county be receiving focused instruction when not everyone is? They need to make sure every middle school in Montgomery County is providing a sound education rather than focusing on making just a few superior. It is time for these programs to go.

Busing in kids who come from families that prioritize academics provides a good influence to lower SES kids who would not normally be exposed to such students. If MCPS really wants to help URM/lower SES students, they would continue these programs. You are who you surround yourself with.

Otherwise these academically talented students will stay within their higher SES bubble and continue their success there, no problem.

Guess who else also prioritizes education when they fully understand the stakes and have high expectations? URM and lower SES students/families.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Loiderman is a joke. One in 25 kids in any class is interested in the arts. One in 25 kids doodles. Most of them are there to get away from their home schools.

Loiederman has the best teachers and principal in mcps and it is truly an arts school. In these posts people mostly talk about the theater program, but what other mcps middle school has multiple, leveled dance classes, digital music, a capella groups etc. The kids absolutely choose Loiederman and it brings together a strong cohort of artsy kids. It would be a huge shame to get rid of it.

My child thrived there with other high achieving arts focused peers.