My neighbor’s aggressive dog

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've actually moved for less, when we had a neighboring pit bull that was terrifying for a number of reasons, and we had small kids who loved to play in the yard (neighbor didn't keep the dog contained so it came over to our yard all the time, despite our attempts to dissuade it and ask owners to contain it). We were absolutely not interested in waiting around to see if this dog escalated with us or worse, our kids, and we sold our house and moved. I realize it could sound like an overreaction to some people, but I really dont want my kids to be the next tragic news story and this dog was dangerous.

This is the OP. Thanks for telling your story.

That sounds very scary and upsetting.

I am ready to move out at this point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Nothing you describe shows that this is a dog that will attack you, OP. I work with dogs.

The dangerous ones are usually the ones who SNARL, with lips curled back, showing teeth. That's an immediate danger sign. And then the truly lethal ones who attack silently without warning and go for the kill. Barking and lunging outside means this dog is poorly socialized, training has been non-existent or has not worked. The couple this dog belongs to seems to keep it leashed, which is a good sign. Barking and pressing on the window is nothing - a lot of perfectly safe dogs with a full view outside do this because they're bored, want to engage, but are frustrated by being cooped up.

However, this being a Malinois or GDS, who can literally rip your throat out, better safe than sorry, you can always carry mace or a stick. Practice in the mirror drawing it out and pretending to use it, because a loose dog is faster than you ever imagine possible. Don't get too close, or you won't have time to draw. I doubt you'll ever need it, however.

I would talk to these neighbors and officially relay your concerns, before contacting whichever authorities in your locale. There are prong collars, e-collars and special "military" trainings they can explore. The collars are especially effective for petite persons walking out of control dogs. I've used them myself to great effect.

This is the OP. I found your post very interesting.

I learned some of the nuances about the dog’s behaviors from your post. I will be more cautious on my walks. Due to the neighborhood layout, I often pass them on the walking trail and when opening my townhouse door. It usually barks and lunges, however, one time it growled at me in a frightening manner. I will pay attention to its behavior and act accordingly.

Thanks.

[Anonymous]

OP, I have fostered dogs for years. The behavior you describe is called fear reactivity. I don't think you're in any danger, but I understand why you find the behavior so disconcerting. I have small dogs that will lunge and bark in a similar manner, but they are 10 pounds and under so they just look silly, whereas a much larger dog with a high prey drive and a powerful jaw will seem menacing--and has the potential to do more harm. The neighbors should consult an animal behaviorist/trainer and work on changing the behavior but it can take months of training to address the behavior and frankly most people just won't put in the time or effort. Since no-one can compel your neighbor to do anything about the situation, I don't think it's unreasonable that you feel like moving.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've actually moved for less, when we had a neighboring pit bull that was terrifying for a number of reasons, and we had small kids who loved to play in the yard (neighbor didn't keep the dog contained so it came over to our yard all the time, despite our attempts to dissuade it and ask owners to contain it). We were absolutely not interested in waiting around to see if this dog escalated with us or worse, our kids, and we sold our house and moved. I realize it could sound like an overreaction to some people, but I really dont want my kids to be the next tragic news story and this dog was dangerous.

This is where I am. We now have a neighboring pitbull, adopted during the pandemic, whose owner does not keep the dog well-contained or well-controlled. We are looking to move. Everyone thinks we're crazy to leave our wonderful townhouse community over a dog, but, as PP said, "I really don't want my kids to be the next tragic news story." I have young kids and the dog has already chased one of them through our parking lot. (It was off-leash, enough said).

[Anonymous]

I would absolutely carry mace or bear spray.

I can't stand bad dog owners. Don't get these dangerous dogs if you can't control and train them. Ugh.

[Anonymous]

I would contact the local police department and ask them to talk to the owners. I would ask for a record of our conversation and tell them why - because I fully expect there to be dog attack in the near future and I want everyone to suffer higher penalties than they otherwise would since I’ve given them notice and they didn’t do enough to prevent it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I have fostered dogs for years. The behavior you describe is called fear reactivity. I don't think you're in any danger, but I understand why you find the behavior so disconcerting. I have small dogs that will lunge and bark in a similar manner, but they are 10 pounds and under so they just look silly, whereas a much larger dog with a high prey drive and a powerful jaw will seem menacing--and has the potential to do more harm. The neighbors should consult an animal behaviorist/trainer and work on changing the behavior but it can take months of training to address the behavior and frankly most people just won't put in the time or effort. Since no-one can compel your neighbor to do anything about the situation, I don't think it's unreasonable that you feel like moving.

This is the OP. Thanks for the background on fear reactivity. I have learned a lot from these posts.

I do hope they try to get help/training for it.

I am considering my options now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would contact the local police department and ask them to talk to the owners. I would ask for a record of our conversation and tell them why - because I fully expect there to be dog attack in the near future and I want everyone to suffer higher penalties than they otherwise would since I’ve given them notice and they didn’t do enough to prevent it.

This is the OP. Thank you for the advice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Nothing you describe shows that this is a dog that will attack you, OP. I work with dogs.

The dangerous ones are usually the ones who SNARL, with lips curled back, showing teeth. That's an immediate danger sign. And then the truly lethal ones who attack silently without warning and go for the kill. Barking and lunging outside means this dog is poorly socialized, training has been non-existent or has not worked. The couple this dog belongs to seems to keep it leashed, which is a good sign. Barking and pressing on the window is nothing - a lot of perfectly safe dogs with a full view outside do this because they're bored, want to engage, but are frustrated by being cooped up.

However, this being a Malinois or GDS, who can literally rip your throat out, better safe than sorry, you can always carry mace or a stick. Practice in the mirror drawing it out and pretending to use it, because a loose dog is faster than you ever imagine possible. Don't get too close, or you won't have time to draw. I doubt you'll ever need it, however.

I would talk to these neighbors and officially relay your concerns, before contacting whichever authorities in your locale. There are prong collars, e-collars and special "military" trainings they can explore. The collars are especially effective for petite persons walking out of control dogs. I've used them myself to great effect.

I was with you until you suggested inhumane treatments like prong ,e-collar etc. They are cruel and should never be used. You are most likely causing greater harm but you don't care because results is all you are after.

If you beat a child you will have a well behaved child but with lots of psychological problems

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would contact the local police department and ask them to talk to the owners. I would ask for a record of our conversation and tell them why - because I fully expect there to be dog attack in the near future and I want everyone to suffer higher penalties than they otherwise would since I’ve given them notice and they didn’t do enough to prevent it.[/quote

The police will laugh at you. They barely can handle crime and mental illness. You think they have time to talk to dog owners whose dog has never bitten anyone?

Do you know how expensive animal behaviorist cost? It can be $400 or more for one hour!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nothing you describe shows that this is a dog that will attack you, OP. I work with dogs.

The dangerous ones are usually the ones who SNARL, with lips curled back, showing teeth. That's an immediate danger sign. And then the truly lethal ones who attack silently without warning and go for the kill. Barking and lunging outside means this dog is poorly socialized, training has been non-existent or has not worked. The couple this dog belongs to seems to keep it leashed, which is a good sign. Barking and pressing on the window is nothing - a lot of perfectly safe dogs with a full view outside do this because they're bored, want to engage, but are frustrated by being cooped up.

However, this being a Malinois or GDS, who can literally rip your throat out, better safe than sorry, you can always carry mace or a stick. Practice in the mirror drawing it out and pretending to use it, because a loose dog is faster than you ever imagine possible. Don't get too close, or you won't have time to draw. I doubt you'll ever need it, however.

I would talk to these neighbors and officially relay your concerns, before contacting whichever authorities in your locale. There are prong collars, e-collars and special "military" trainings they can explore. The collars are especially effective for petite persons walking out of control dogs. I've used them myself to great effect.

I was with you until you suggested inhumane treatments like prong ,e-collar etc. They are cruel and should never be used. You are most likely causing greater harm but you don't care because results is all you are after.

If you beat a child you will have a well behaved child but with lots of psychological problems

Dogs trained for the police/military wear those collars. They are not inhumane at all, since they're not designed to hurt. The setting has to be calibrated to the individual dog and is set to the lowest possible level. Malinois and short-haired GDS dogs are preferred army and police breeds and are temperamentally and physically suited to wear them.

The myth that prong and e-collars are inhumane and should never be used has caused many reactive dogs with a potential for re-training and rehab to be euthanized, since positive-only training does not work on them.

So please don't pretend to know when you so clearly do not - your ignorance and the spread of such disinformation costs lives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nothing you describe shows that this is a dog that will attack you, OP. I work with dogs.

The dangerous ones are usually the ones who SNARL, with lips curled back, showing teeth. That's an immediate danger sign. And then the truly lethal ones who attack silently without warning and go for the kill. Barking and lunging outside means this dog is poorly socialized, training has been non-existent or has not worked. The couple this dog belongs to seems to keep it leashed, which is a good sign. Barking and pressing on the window is nothing - a lot of perfectly safe dogs with a full view outside do this because they're bored, want to engage, but are frustrated by being cooped up.

However, this being a Malinois or GDS, who can literally rip your throat out, better safe than sorry, you can always carry mace or a stick. Practice in the mirror drawing it out and pretending to use it, because a loose dog is faster than you ever imagine possible. Don't get too close, or you won't have time to draw. I doubt you'll ever need it, however.

I would talk to these neighbors and officially relay your concerns, before contacting whichever authorities in your locale. There are prong collars, e-collars and special "military" trainings they can explore. The collars are especially effective for petite persons walking out of control dogs. I've used them myself to great effect.

I was with you until you suggested inhumane treatments like prong ,e-collar etc. They are cruel and should never be used. You are most likely causing greater harm but you don't care because results is all you are after.

If you beat a child you will have a well behaved child but with lots of psychological problems

Dogs trained for the police/military wear those collars. They are not inhumane at all, since they're not designed to hurt. The setting has to be calibrated to the individual dog and is set to the lowest possible level. Malinois and short-haired GDS dogs are preferred army and police breeds and are temperamentally and physically suited to wear them.

The myth that prong and e-collars are inhumane and should never be used has caused many reactive dogs with a potential for re-training and rehab to be euthanized, since positive-only training does not work on them.

So please don't pretend to know when you so clearly do not - your ignorance and the spread of such disinformation costs lives.

Actually you are the ignorant one. You have no idea what training I have done or what I know. This neighbor's dog is NOT a police dog and you are very wrong about prong collars and e-collars. Many organizations have come out against them. Maybe you will take their opinion seriously: Or you going to accuse them of not knowing anything?

https://www.bsava.com/position-statement/aversive-training-methods/


Here is an article that explains why in simple terms for you to understand. If you are bold enough to read it. https://smartdoguniversity.com/a-surprising-look-at-balanced-training/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nothing you describe shows that this is a dog that will attack you, OP. I work with dogs.

The dangerous ones are usually the ones who SNARL, with lips curled back, showing teeth. That's an immediate danger sign. And then the truly lethal ones who attack silently without warning and go for the kill. Barking and lunging outside means this dog is poorly socialized, training has been non-existent or has not worked. The couple this dog belongs to seems to keep it leashed, which is a good sign. Barking and pressing on the window is nothing - a lot of perfectly safe dogs with a full view outside do this because they're bored, want to engage, but are frustrated by being cooped up.

However, this being a Malinois or GDS, who can literally rip your throat out, better safe than sorry, you can always carry mace or a stick. Practice in the mirror drawing it out and pretending to use it, because a loose dog is faster than you ever imagine possible. Don't get too close, or you won't have time to draw. I doubt you'll ever need it, however.

I would talk to these neighbors and officially relay your concerns, before contacting whichever authorities in your locale. There are prong collars, e-collars and special "military" trainings they can explore. The collars are especially effective for petite persons walking out of control dogs. I've used them myself to great effect.

I was with you until you suggested inhumane treatments like prong ,e-collar etc. They are cruel and should never be used. You are most likely causing greater harm but you don't care because results is all you are after.

If you beat a child you will have a well behaved child but with lots of psychological problems

Dogs trained for the police/military wear those collars. They are not inhumane at all, since they're not designed to hurt. The setting has to be calibrated to the individual dog and is set to the lowest possible level. Malinois and short-haired GDS dogs are preferred army and police breeds and are temperamentally and physically suited to wear them.

The myth that prong and e-collars are inhumane and should never be used has caused many reactive dogs with a potential for re-training and rehab to be euthanized, since positive-only training does not work on them.

So please don't pretend to know when you so clearly do not - your ignorance and the spread of such disinformation costs lives.

Actually you are the ignorant one. You have no idea what training I have done or what I know. This neighbor's dog is NOT a police dog and you are very wrong about prong collars and e-collars. Many organizations have come out against them. Maybe you will take their opinion seriously: Or you going to accuse them of not knowing anything?

https://www.bsava.com/position-statement/aversive-training-methods/


Here is an article that explains why in simple terms for you to understand. If you are bold enough to read it. https://smartdoguniversity.com/a-surprising-look-at-balanced-training/

NP. My highly trained dog gets SUPER SUPER excited, like steak level excited to see the e-collar come out. It means we are going on an adventure where she will be able to run long distances away from me. A quick buzz is the recall to come back; it's a way to communicate. I've put it on my own neck at the level we use and it's less uncomfortable than the TENS unit my chiropractor uses on my back though feels very similar. It feels a little weird, it's not painful.

As to the bolded, if you get a Mal, you had better damned well train it like a police dog. They'll basically accept nothing less, which is why I think most responsible people who own them don't think they should be pets getting time in the yard and a walk a day. They thrive on structure and working and they're incredibly tough-willed. This owner is failing. While I wouldn't look at the tool itself as the answer (e-collar, prong collar) in the hands of an unequipped owner, I also wouldn't trust a positive only trainer to work for a problematic Mal. It's the equivalent of having a kid who killed two family cats, attacks his siblings and set the house on fire and only being open to Gentle Parenting solutions where you can't use the word "No."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nothing you describe shows that this is a dog that will attack you, OP. I work with dogs.

The dangerous ones are usually the ones who SNARL, with lips curled back, showing teeth. That's an immediate danger sign. And then the truly lethal ones who attack silently without warning and go for the kill. Barking and lunging outside means this dog is poorly socialized, training has been non-existent or has not worked. The couple this dog belongs to seems to keep it leashed, which is a good sign. Barking and pressing on the window is nothing - a lot of perfectly safe dogs with a full view outside do this because they're bored, want to engage, but are frustrated by being cooped up.

However, this being a Malinois or GDS, who can literally rip your throat out, better safe than sorry, you can always carry mace or a stick. Practice in the mirror drawing it out and pretending to use it, because a loose dog is faster than you ever imagine possible. Don't get too close, or you won't have time to draw. I doubt you'll ever need it, however.

I would talk to these neighbors and officially relay your concerns, before contacting whichever authorities in your locale. There are prong collars, e-collars and special "military" trainings they can explore. The collars are especially effective for petite persons walking out of control dogs. I've used them myself to great effect.

I was with you until you suggested inhumane treatments like prong ,e-collar etc. They are cruel and should never be used. You are most likely causing greater harm but you don't care because results is all you are after.

If you beat a child you will have a well behaved child but with lots of psychological problems

Dogs trained for the police/military wear those collars. They are not inhumane at all, since they're not designed to hurt. The setting has to be calibrated to the individual dog and is set to the lowest possible level. Malinois and short-haired GDS dogs are preferred army and police breeds and are temperamentally and physically suited to wear them.

The myth that prong and e-collars are inhumane and should never be used has caused many reactive dogs with a potential for re-training and rehab to be euthanized, since positive-only training does not work on them.

So please don't pretend to know when you so clearly do not - your ignorance and the spread of such disinformation costs lives.

Actually you are the ignorant one. You have no idea what training I have done or what I know. This neighbor's dog is NOT a police dog and you are very wrong about prong collars and e-collars. Many organizations have come out against them. Maybe you will take their opinion seriously: Or you going to accuse them of not knowing anything?

https://www.bsava.com/position-statement/aversive-training-methods/


Here is an article that explains why in simple terms for you to understand. If you are bold enough to read it. https://smartdoguniversity.com/a-surprising-look-at-balanced-training/

NP. "Bold enough to read it?" lol. This article written by a trainer who owns two Labradors and whose second sentence in her "About Me" is:

"I don’t work with dogs of all ages. I don’t work with aggressive dogs. I specialize in puppies. I work with puppies that are 10 weeks to 5 ½ months old."

Yeah, I think we all can agree we don't need to use anything even remotely aversive on docile breed PUPPIES. Citing someone who won't even get a dog through the teenage phase and specifically only takes puppies with a low risk profile is not some kinda "gotcha" you think it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nothing you describe shows that this is a dog that will attack you, OP. I work with dogs.

The dangerous ones are usually the ones who SNARL, with lips curled back, showing teeth. That's an immediate danger sign. And then the truly lethal ones who attack silently without warning and go for the kill. Barking and lunging outside means this dog is poorly socialized, training has been non-existent or has not worked. The couple this dog belongs to seems to keep it leashed, which is a good sign. Barking and pressing on the window is nothing - a lot of perfectly safe dogs with a full view outside do this because they're bored, want to engage, but are frustrated by being cooped up.

However, this being a Malinois or GDS, who can literally rip your throat out, better safe than sorry, you can always carry mace or a stick. Practice in the mirror drawing it out and pretending to use it, because a loose dog is faster than you ever imagine possible. Don't get too close, or you won't have time to draw. I doubt you'll ever need it, however.

I would talk to these neighbors and officially relay your concerns, before contacting whichever authorities in your locale. There are prong collars, e-collars and special "military" trainings they can explore. The collars are especially effective for petite persons walking out of control dogs. I've used them myself to great effect.

I was with you until you suggested inhumane treatments like prong ,e-collar etc. They are cruel and should never be used. You are most likely causing greater harm but you don't care because results is all you are after.

If you beat a child you will have a well behaved child but with lots of psychological problems

Dogs trained for the police/military wear those collars. They are not inhumane at all, since they're not designed to hurt. The setting has to be calibrated to the individual dog and is set to the lowest possible level. Malinois and short-haired GDS dogs are preferred army and police breeds and are temperamentally and physically suited to wear them.

The myth that prong and e-collars are inhumane and should never be used has caused many reactive dogs with a potential for re-training and rehab to be euthanized, since positive-only training does not work on them.

So please don't pretend to know when you so clearly do not - your ignorance and the spread of such disinformation costs lives.

+1