Anyone following the viral Harvard University *Extension School* controversy?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am currently a Harvard Extension School student and I Must say, IT IS NOT EASY and not for everyone. The reason I chose this program, is because I liked Harvard’s case study method from a certificate I took at Harvard Business School Online.

As a full time professional, a father and with a busy life, it fits my schedule and I get the learning method that fits me. I agree on being honest clarifying the origin of your degree. Nothing wrong with disclosing your degree is from the Extension School. However, I do not agree with the common belief that Anyone can get it. It is very challenging and requires a lot of commitment, focus and time management.

It’s open enrollment so people assume it’s not as good as the day program but that’s not true. The difference between the Harvard open extension school and many others is that you can’t get into an actual degree program until you take the courses Harvard requires and you have to have certain grades in those classes.

A degree program in the Yard? Or one of the professional programs? What do you mean?

So while people can sign up for some of the classes without a problem, being accepted to a degree program and completing it is very difficult. And impressive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am currently a Harvard Extension School student and I Must say, IT IS NOT EASY and not for everyone. The reason I chose this program, is because I liked Harvard’s case study method from a certificate I took at Harvard Business School Online.

As a full time professional, a father and with a busy life, it fits my schedule and I get the learning method that fits me. I agree on being honest clarifying the origin of your degree. Nothing wrong with disclosing your degree is from the Extension School. However, I do not agree with the common belief that Anyone can get it. It is very challenging and requires a lot of commitment, focus and time management.

It’s open enrollment so people assume it’s not as good as the day program but that’s not true. The difference between the Harvard open extension school and many others is that you can’t get into an actual degree program until you take the courses Harvard requires and you have to have certain grades in those classes.

So while people can sign up for some of the classes without a problem, being accepted to a degree program and completing it is very difficult. And impressive.

Are you talking about a degree program in the Yard? A professional program?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reminds me of a public servant I know who went to what appeared to be a 2 to 4 week Harvard summer course. Afterwards he began wearing Harvard sweatshirts and added Harvard to his social media accounts and LinkedIn. His Facebook avatar was changed to him in a Harvard sweatshirt. His bachelor’s degree was from an open enrollment regional degree mill.

Thats understandable, but completing an entire Master's degree from HEC gives you the right to be proud about it.

No. An online master's or doctorate degree from any university is a joke. These are cash cow degree mill programs with basically zero admissions standards and just pointless busywork to push you through. Everyone knows it.

[Anonymous]

The origin of Harvard Extension School can be traced back to 1835, when American philanthropist and businessman John Lowell Jr. founded the Lowell Institute. In his will, Lowell Jr. funded an organization that provided Boston with free public lectures on a variety of subjects.

https://dce.harvard.edu/about/history/#

Wow that Lowell Jr. guy sure knew how to set up a cash grab almost 200 years in advance!

[Anonymous]

I’m an alum of an in-person Harvard extension program Japanese class. It was an excellent class. People shouldn’t misrepresent the nature of degrees they earn from the program, but it’s a great program for people who just want to learn something.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reminds me of a public servant I know who went to what appeared to be a 2 to 4 week Harvard summer course. Afterwards he began wearing Harvard sweatshirts and added Harvard to his social media accounts and LinkedIn. His Facebook avatar was changed to him in a Harvard sweatshirt. His bachelor’s degree was from an open enrollment regional degree mill.

Thats understandable, but completing an entire Master's degree from HEC gives you the right to be proud about it.

No. An online master's or doctorate degree from any university is a joke. These are cash cow degree mill programs with basically zero admissions standards and just pointless busywork to push you through. Everyone knows it.

I hate to break it to you, but Graduate Programs at even the very best schools are online for a large portion of the program - even in programs with labs. It's the wave of the future.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reminds me of a public servant I know who went to what appeared to be a 2 to 4 week Harvard summer course. Afterwards he began wearing Harvard sweatshirts and added Harvard to his social media accounts and LinkedIn. His Facebook avatar was changed to him in a Harvard sweatshirt. His bachelor’s degree was from an open enrollment regional degree mill.

Thats understandable, but completing an entire Master's degree from HEC gives you the right to be proud about it.

No. An online master's or doctorate degree from any university is a joke. These are cash cow degree mill programs with basically zero admissions standards and just pointless busywork to push you through. Everyone knows it.

I hate to break it to you, but Graduate Programs at even the very best schools are online for a large portion of the program - even in programs with labs. It's the wave of the future.

No, the worthless box checking programs for nitwits are all online. The high value programs with admissions standards are still on campus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reminds me of a public servant I know who went to what appeared to be a 2 to 4 week Harvard summer course. Afterwards he began wearing Harvard sweatshirts and added Harvard to his social media accounts and LinkedIn. His Facebook avatar was changed to him in a Harvard sweatshirt. His bachelor’s degree was from an open enrollment regional degree mill.

Thats understandable, but completing an entire Master's degree from HEC gives you the right to be proud about it.

No. An online master's or doctorate degree from any university is a joke. These are cash cow degree mill programs with basically zero admissions standards and just pointless busywork to push you through. Everyone knows it.

I hate to break it to you, but Graduate Programs at even the very best schools are online for a large portion of the program - even in programs with labs. It's the wave of the future.

No, the worthless box checking programs for nitwits are all online. The high value programs with admissions standards are still on campus.

The on campus programs are largely online, nitwit.

[Anonymous]

I mean this whole thread is full of people who don't understand HES, its mission, FAS, or Harvard University.

1. There are undergraduate and graduate degrees offered at HES.
2. Until about 15 years ago, ALB and ALM degrees were offered only in-person.
3. There are two types of extension students: 1) those who are matriculated, and 2) those who are not. Matriculated students generally make up about 20% of extension learners. Only matriculated students earn degrees.
4. Of the non-matriculated students who have no desire to matriculate, many, if not most, are high achievers with impressive credentials. Places like Harvard and Yale are addictive, and some people (believe it or not) want to learn and interact with cerebral people even after their four years of study are up.
5. To matriculate, you need to pass a gatekeeper class. On average, only about 30% succeed in the gatekeeper course. This is because Harvard guards the grades in these classes to ensure it picks the students it wants to admit.
6. There is a lot of self-selection. On average, for many students, the work can take 10 to 15 hours per week per class. It is not uncommon to have to read 1,000 pages and be ready to be called upon to discuss during class. This is beyond the requirements of most state school undergraduate expectations.
7. GSAS, the college, and the extension school are all run by FAS, which regulates the programs and degrees. By and large, undergraduate credit is equivalent to the college, with the graduate credit being slightly more advanced but different from GSAS, which tends to have a mission to be deeper and not as 'broad' (or wide) in a field.
8. The reason extension credit is not accepted by the college is to stop ambitious college students from taking extension credit -- the syllabus/coursework is often the same; they just want to separate the non-traditional students from the college students.
9. On the same vein, the summer school DOES allow college students to enroll for credit and is functionally the same as the extension school but just in the summer. Thus, the aforementioned prohibition is not a lack of quality; it's a function of student management.
10. They offer cross-school courses where extension and college students are taking the same course. I have noticed no dip in quality between these courses and the ones offered only to extension students. This is also true with Kennedy and GSAS courses.
11. Matriculated students have IDs, join clubs, and I personally know a few who are just as 'Harvard' as anyone else here. They do research, work as TFs, write a thesis or research papers, and participate in University life.
12. It is true that the quality of the student body per class is somewhat less. But people who don't fit in are usually rejected before they matriculate or quickly realize they don't fit in.
13. For matriculated students, the resources and access to campus are equivalent. Harvard is transformational if you let it be. And while I acknowledge that someone could complete their degree while only stepping foot onto campus a handful of times -- why would you? Many extension students take the opportunity to learn from the best scholars, be around amazing students, and interact with CEOs, politicians, research, and startups.

Thus:
The work required to complete an extension degree at Harvard is rigorous and can be completed (mostly) online or in-person. It is generally considered academically equivalent to Harvard College in difficulty for each sister course, with the graduate work sometimes held to a higher standard. It is generally not as deep as a similar master's degree from GSAS, as those degrees tend to be much more narrow to the field (hence the 'Liberal Arts' in the degree name).

Overall, I find the association with the University of Phoenix, Trump University, and comparable allegations to be absurd and unreasonably prejudiced against non-traditional learners. The New Republic article was factually inaccurate, contained numerous errors, and was a hit piece designed to burn thousands of students' degrees in an effort to stick it to one man.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I mean this whole thread is full of people who don't understand HES, its mission, FAS, or Harvard University.

1. There are undergraduate and graduate degrees offered at HES.
2. Until about 15 years ago, ALB and ALM degrees were offered only in-person.
3. There are two types of extension students: 1) those who are matriculated, and 2) those who are not. Matriculated students generally make up about 20% of extension learners. Only matriculated students earn degrees.
4. Of the non-matriculated students who have no desire to matriculate, many, if not most, are high achievers with impressive credentials. Places like Harvard and Yale are addictive, and some people (believe it or not) want to learn and interact with cerebral people even after their four years of study are up.
5. To matriculate, you need to pass a gatekeeper class. On average, only about 30% succeed in the gatekeeper course. This is because Harvard guards the grades in these classes to ensure it picks the students it wants to admit.
6. There is a lot of self-selection. On average, for many students, the work can take 10 to 15 hours per week per class. It is not uncommon to have to read 1,000 pages and be ready to be called upon to discuss during class. This is beyond the requirements of most state school undergraduate expectations.
7. GSAS, the college, and the extension school are all run by FAS, which regulates the programs and degrees. By and large, undergraduate credit is equivalent to the college, with the graduate credit being slightly more advanced but different from GSAS, which tends to have a mission to be deeper and not as 'broad' (or wide) in a field.
8. The reason extension credit is not accepted by the college is to stop ambitious college students from taking extension credit -- the syllabus/coursework is often the same; they just want to separate the non-traditional students from the college students.
9. On the same vein, the summer school DOES allow college students to enroll for credit and is functionally the same as the extension school but just in the summer. Thus, the aforementioned prohibition is not a lack of quality; it's a function of student management.
10. They offer cross-school courses where extension and college students are taking the same course. I have noticed no dip in quality between these courses and the ones offered only to extension students. This is also true with Kennedy and GSAS courses.
11. Matriculated students have IDs, join clubs, and I personally know a few who are just as 'Harvard' as anyone else here. They do research, work as TFs, write a thesis or research papers, and participate in University life.
12. It is true that the quality of the student body per class is somewhat less. But people who don't fit in are usually rejected before they matriculate or quickly realize they don't fit in.
13. For matriculated students, the resources and access to campus are equivalent. Harvard is transformational if you let it be. And while I acknowledge that someone could complete their degree while only stepping foot onto campus a handful of times -- why would you? Many extension students take the opportunity to learn from the best scholars, be around amazing students, and interact with CEOs, politicians, research, and startups.

Thus:
The work required to complete an extension degree at Harvard is rigorous and can be completed (mostly) online or in-person. It is generally considered academically equivalent to Harvard College in difficulty for each sister course, with the graduate work sometimes held to a higher standard. It is generally not as deep as a similar master's degree from GSAS, as those degrees tend to be much more narrow to the field (hence the 'Liberal Arts' in the degree name).

Overall, I find the association with the University of Phoenix, Trump University, and comparable allegations to be absurd and unreasonably prejudiced against non-traditional learners. The New Republic article was factually inaccurate, contained numerous errors, and was a hit piece designed to burn thousands of students' degrees in an effort to stick it to one man.

I don’t disagree with your logic and arguments but these count for very little. Perception-wise, nobody will ever think that a degree from Harvard extension is equivalent to one from Harvard College. We all know this.

Harvard College alums will never consider people who have gone to Harvard Extension as fellow alums.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Harvard’s extension school website is perfectly clear on how to write the degree on your resume and CV. Always include Extension School or Extension Studies. You’re obviously purposely being deceptive when you strike Extension School from your resume, bio, and/or verbal communication. It’s shady and teases out you’re a liar with serious issues.

I would never pay for Harvard extension school. To me, it sounds like someone buying a degree to put Harvard on their resume. What’s the point?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harvard’s extension school website is perfectly clear on how to write the degree on your resume and CV. Always include Extension School or Extension Studies. You’re obviously purposely being deceptive when you strike Extension School from your resume, bio, and/or verbal communication. It’s shady and teases out you’re a liar with serious issues.

I would never pay for Harvard extension school. To me, it sounds like someone buying a degree to put Harvard on their resume. What’s the point?

The point, for people who couldn’t gain admission, is to try to fool people into thinking they were admitted to Harvard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harvard’s extension school website is perfectly clear on how to write the degree on your resume and CV. Always include Extension School or Extension Studies. You’re obviously purposely being deceptive when you strike Extension School from your resume, bio, and/or verbal communication. It’s shady and teases out you’re a liar with serious issues.

I would never pay for Harvard extension school. To me, it sounds like someone buying a degree to put Harvard on their resume. What’s the point?

The point, for people who couldn’t gain admission, is to try to fool people into thinking they were admitted to Harvard.

+ 1,000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Plenty of non-grifters attend extension schools. You seem like you have a screw loose to paint those people with a broad brush.

Why exactly would a non-local choose open-admit HARVARD extension school over a perfectly fine local program, where they can drive to campus if need be, meet classmates, chat with professors, use university resources, and tap the network? At its core it’s attracting insecure status-seeking frauds seeking to dupe people.

I'd prefer online any day than having to spend all that time commuting and parking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harvard’s extension school website is perfectly clear on how to write the degree on your resume and CV. Always include Extension School or Extension Studies. You’re obviously purposely being deceptive when you strike Extension School from your resume, bio, and/or verbal communication. It’s shady and teases out you’re a liar with serious issues.

I would never pay for Harvard extension school. To me, it sounds like someone buying a degree to put Harvard on their resume. What’s the point?

The point, for people who couldn’t gain admission, is to try to fool people into thinking they were admitted to Harvard.

or maybe they had other motives