Neither AC wants kids. I can't help feeling like I failed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This reminds me of when I got no help from my parents after my first was born and my DH and I struggled so much. Then when DC started preschool and we went from paying $30k a year to $22k for childcare, my mom acted all shocked and disappointed that we had decided not to have more. Having kids in this country is too hard, expensive, and dangerous. The younger generations have realized this and are opting out. I don't blame them.

Well I am amazed I am still alive after I told my cousin who had a similar complaint that maybe if your husband got a better job you could stay home with kids and that would solve your day care issue.

You're still alive because that's too idiotic to even argue about. One parent leaving the workforce and doing long-term damage to their career and retirement savings isn't a solution.

Yes, I did this, left the workforce several times for the kids and let the spouse continue their career. It set me back about 20 years but I got back in. I am behind, and stressed me in the event anything ever went south in our relationship as over time in years life stress has strained it. But here we are. Can’t see the future at the beginning.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are their decisions final? You could gently ask them why they don't want kids--all of my childfree friends are happy to explain if asked politely. If they cite financial reasons, you could offer to help out. If they cite career or time constraints, you could offer free babysitting or even being a free full-time nanny. If you live too far away, you could offer to move closer to provide the free babysitting. If it's space in their homes they're worried about, you could offer to help them find and afford a larger place. You can promise to take care of they kids while they go on 1-2 childfree vacations a year. Obviously, don't do any of this without your children's approval.

I know it seems excessive, but my parents/in-laws offered most of the above to us. We did not take them up on everything, of course.

People who don't want kids really don't want kids. Stop trying to get them to change their minds!

People who have kids tend to adore them and cannot understand others not wanting to experience the joy, even if it comes with challenges. I also think most parents correctly believe that non-parents would have a different feeling if they just had that first kid.

Having said all that, just leave the non-parents alone. People should want kids before having them.

I have kids and can absolutely understand that others don’t want them and would never think they should be convinced otherwise.

Some PPs on this thread are crazy like JD Vance, thinking people without kids are somehow less than.

Agreed. It's a personal choice to not have kids and just as valid as wanting to have kids. It's also a worldwide phenomenon, and I think it's sending a message that we should at least be open to listening to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This reminds me of when I got no help from my parents after my first was born and my DH and I struggled so much. Then when DC started preschool and we went from paying $30k a year to $22k for childcare, my mom acted all shocked and disappointed that we had decided not to have more. Having kids in this country is too hard, expensive, and dangerous. The younger generations have realized this and are opting out. I don't blame them.

What kind of help did you expect from your parents?

I would love it if somebody got on a plane whenever there is a hospitalization. Over the years we've had vasoepididyomotomy, 3 babies (2 Csecs), 1 laparoscopic Csec isthmocele revision, an emergency gallbladder due to pancreatitis and toddler w/ bronchiolitid has resulted in ZERO parental help.

Did you move away from them? Or did you stay to be near them but then they moved away?

I have no extended family in the state where I grew up because my mom moved us for her career.
I moved a 7hr drive to marry my husband
My husband's mom moved out of his city for 2nd husband, 7hr plane ride
My dad is disabled, my FIL dead from opiate OD.
Both of the moms remarried, late in life career reboots. My mom has a dumb@ss 100lb dog. She can barely walk it due to overweight and hip replacement. Both too busy for their grandkids due to 2nd families. MIL had a second set of kids late in life, the youngest is still in middle school.

I was just talking to my husband about this, the first 80% of childcare is easy. The last 20% sucks. We can never go on a romantic vacation. If my husband was to come to a prenatal appt, he would have to take off work and we would have to spend $100 on a babysitter. I endured horrific obstetric violence my last pregnancy, because my husband was never there and they are like sharks to unaccompanied women, and am closing up shop as a result.

Really not a nice feeling to be texting your DH on handing off hospital duties, how many diapers does he need to bring to the hospital, etc. He's working and watching kids all the while.

I can't blame people for not having kids. Parents get zero respect or help.

[Anonymous]

My mother told me repeatedly if she had to do it over again she would not have kids.

None of the 3 of us have kids and we are all over 40. I think my mom is jealous of our easygoing lives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are their decisions final? You could gently ask them why they don't want kids--all of my childfree friends are happy to explain if asked politely. If they cite financial reasons, you could offer to help out. If they cite career or time constraints, you could offer free babysitting or even being a free full-time nanny. If you live too far away, you could offer to move closer to provide the free babysitting. If it's space in their homes they're worried about, you could offer to help them find and afford a larger place. You can promise to take care of they kids while they go on 1-2 childfree vacations a year. Obviously, don't do any of this without your children's approval.

I know it seems excessive, but my parents/in-laws offered most of the above to us. We did not take them up on everything, of course.

People who don't want kids really don't want kids. Stop trying to get them to change their minds!

People who have kids tend to adore them and cannot understand others not wanting to experience the joy, even if it comes with challenges. I also think most parents correctly believe that non-parents would have a different feeling if they just had that first kid.

Having said all that, just leave the non-parents alone. People should want kids before having them.

I have kids and can absolutely understand that others don’t want them and would never think they should be convinced otherwise.

Some PPs on this thread are crazy like JD Vance, thinking people without kids are somehow less than.

Agreed. It's a personal choice to not have kids and just as valid as wanting to have kids. It's also a worldwide phenomenon, and I think it's sending a message that we should at least be open to listening to.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD has said she was a teen that she didn't want kids. Ha-ha ok you will change your mind is what everyone always told her. No, she's never wavered. She's in her late 20s and has been married for 3 years now (with her husband for 8 years total). She just told me that she found a doctor who was willing to do a tubal ligation so she could be done with birth control. It felt like a gut punch when she told me.

DS is in his early 30s and is getting married this fall. He's been with his fiancée for 4 years and they too have told us they have zero desire for kids. I thought for sure they would have kids as she's an elementary teacher and works at a kids camp in the summer.

How do I get over these feelings of failure? I know I raised great kids but at the same time, I feel like both are being selfish and it makes me angry. Is this something therapy helps with?

Well OP you can hope that your daughter gets raped by some Vance loving incel and she’s forced to give birth. You can hope that birth control fails for your DS and his fiancé and they are forced to have kids. Yes this will be horrible and traumatic for them but you’ll get what you want.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD has said she was a teen that she didn't want kids. Ha-ha ok you will change your mind is what everyone always told her. No, she's never wavered. She's in her late 20s and has been married for 3 years now (with her husband for 8 years total). She just told me that she found a doctor who was willing to do a tubal ligation so she could be done with birth control. It felt like a gut punch when she told me.

DS is in his early 30s and is getting married this fall. He's been with his fiancée for 4 years and they too have told us they have zero desire for kids. I thought for sure they would have kids as she's an elementary teacher and works at a kids camp in the summer.

How do I get over these feelings of failure? I know I raised great kids but at the same time, I feel like both are being selfish and it makes me angry. Is this something therapy helps with?

Well OP you can hope that your daughter gets raped by some Vance loving incel and she’s forced to give birth. You can hope that birth control fails for your DS and his fiancé and they are forced to have kids. Yes this will be horrible and traumatic for them but you’ll get what you want.

Or--hear me out--she could hope her kids wake up to the reality that the most important and best thing people will ever do with their lives is raise their children in a loving marriage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DD has said she was a teen that she didn't want kids. Ha-ha ok you will change your mind is what everyone always told her. No, she's never wavered. She's in her late 20s and has been married for 3 years now (with her husband for 8 years total). She just told me that she found a doctor who was willing to do a tubal ligation so she could be done with birth control. It felt like a gut punch when she told me.

DS is in his early 30s and is getting married this fall. He's been with his fiancée for 4 years and they too have told us they have zero desire for kids. I thought for sure they would have kids as she's an elementary teacher and works at a kids camp in the summer.

How do I get over these feelings of failure? I know I raised great kids but at the same time, I feel like both are being selfish and it makes me angry. Is this something therapy helps with?

this is just gross. "a gut punch" that your daughter doesn't want children?? Are you serious? Your ADULT children's decisions are their decisions. It's hardly being selfish, they do not OWE you children. You definitely need therapy. I would not say you are a failure for this but you might be if you are having these reactions to your children and/or pressuring them to have kids. Please do better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD has said she was a teen that she didn't want kids. Ha-ha ok you will change your mind is what everyone always told her. No, she's never wavered. She's in her late 20s and has been married for 3 years now (with her husband for 8 years total). She just told me that she found a doctor who was willing to do a tubal ligation so she could be done with birth control. It felt like a gut punch when she told me.

DS is in his early 30s and is getting married this fall. He's been with his fiancée for 4 years and they too have told us they have zero desire for kids. I thought for sure they would have kids as she's an elementary teacher and works at a kids camp in the summer.

How do I get over these feelings of failure? I know I raised great kids but at the same time, I feel like both are being selfish and it makes me angry. Is this something therapy helps with?

Well OP you can hope that your daughter gets raped by some Vance loving incel and she’s forced to give birth. You can hope that birth control fails for your DS and his fiancé and they are forced to have kids. Yes this will be horrible and traumatic for them but you’ll get what you want.

Or--hear me out--she could hope her kids wake up to the reality that the most important and best thing people will ever do with their lives is raise their children in a loving marriage.

Where is the puke emoji

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD has said she was a teen that she didn't want kids. Ha-ha ok you will change your mind is what everyone always told her. No, she's never wavered. She's in her late 20s and has been married for 3 years now (with her husband for 8 years total). She just told me that she found a doctor who was willing to do a tubal ligation so she could be done with birth control. It felt like a gut punch when she told me.

DS is in his early 30s and is getting married this fall. He's been with his fiancée for 4 years and they too have told us they have zero desire for kids. I thought for sure they would have kids as she's an elementary teacher and works at a kids camp in the summer.

How do I get over these feelings of failure? I know I raised great kids but at the same time, I feel like both are being selfish and it makes me angry. Is this something therapy helps with?

Well OP you can hope that your daughter gets raped by some Vance loving incel and she’s forced to give birth. You can hope that birth control fails for your DS and his fiancé and they are forced to have kids. Yes this will be horrible and traumatic for them but you’ll get what you want.

Or--hear me out--she could hope her kids wake up to the reality that the most important and best thing people will ever do with their lives is raise their children in a loving marriage.

Where is the puke emoji

Sorry you haven't enjoyed the blessings described in that post. It's truly a miracle and everyone should experience it. A life of service to others surpasses a life of self-interest, and there is no better service than that for your family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD has said she was a teen that she didn't want kids. Ha-ha ok you will change your mind is what everyone always told her. No, she's never wavered. She's in her late 20s and has been married for 3 years now (with her husband for 8 years total). She just told me that she found a doctor who was willing to do a tubal ligation so she could be done with birth control. It felt like a gut punch when she told me.

DS is in his early 30s and is getting married this fall. He's been with his fiancée for 4 years and they too have told us they have zero desire for kids. I thought for sure they would have kids as she's an elementary teacher and works at a kids camp in the summer.

How do I get over these feelings of failure? I know I raised great kids but at the same time, I feel like both are being selfish and it makes me angry. Is this something therapy helps with?

Well OP you can hope that your daughter gets raped by some Vance loving incel and she’s forced to give birth. You can hope that birth control fails for your DS and his fiancé and they are forced to have kids. Yes this will be horrible and traumatic for them but you’ll get what you want.

Or--hear me out--she could hope her kids wake up to the reality that the most important and best thing people will ever do with their lives is raise their children in a loving marriage.

Where is the puke emoji

Sorry you haven't enjoyed the blessings described in that post. It's truly a miracle and everyone should experience it. A life of service to others surpasses a life of self-interest, and there is no better service than that for your family.

So since over 50% of marriages end in divorce - aka not a "happy marriage" - they shouldn't have had children, according to you?

[Anonymous]

This chain is just bizarre to me. I am in my upper 40s and have been married about 15 years with no children, and it was a choice. We didn't get married saying we don't want children, but were both on the fence. Ultimately we decided that we love our life as it is. Never once did I think about anyone else when we made this decision.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Are their decisions final? You could gently ask them why they don't want kids--all of my childfree friends are happy to explain if asked politely. If they cite financial reasons, you could offer to help out. If they cite career or time constraints, you could offer free babysitting or even being a free full-time nanny. If you live too far away, you could offer to move closer to provide the free babysitting. If it's space in their homes they're worried about, you could offer to help them find and afford a larger place. You can promise to take care of they kids while they go on 1-2 childfree vacations a year. Obviously, don't do any of this without your children's approval.

Dp Sorry but I would refuse to answer if you gently asked my personal business. Ulrimately it is up to them, not you. Even with all the help they have to want it.

I know it seems excessive, but my parents/in-laws offered most of the above to us. We did not take them up on everything, of course.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DD has said she was a teen that she didn't want kids. Ha-ha ok you will change your mind is what everyone always told her. No, she's never wavered. She's in her late 20s and has been married for 3 years now (with her husband for 8 years total). She just told me that she found a doctor who was willing to do a tubal ligation so she could be done with birth control. It felt like a gut punch when she told me.

DS is in his early 30s and is getting married this fall. He's been with his fiancée for 4 years and they too have told us they have zero desire for kids. I thought for sure they would have kids as she's an elementary teacher and works at a kids camp in the summer.

How do I get over these feelings of failure? I know I raised great kids but at the same time, I feel like both are being selfish and it makes me angry. Is this something therapy helps with?

Well OP you can hope that your daughter gets raped by some Vance loving incel and she’s forced to give birth. You can hope that birth control fails for your DS and his fiancé and they are forced to have kids. Yes this will be horrible and traumatic for them but you’ll get what you want.

Or--hear me out--she could hope her kids wake up to the reality that the most important and best thing people will ever do with their lives is raise their children in a loving marriage.

Where is the puke emoji

Sorry you haven't enjoyed the blessings described in that post. It's truly a miracle and everyone should experience it. A life of service to others surpasses a life of self-interest, and there is no better service than that for your family.

So since over 50% of marriages end in divorce - aka not a "happy marriage" - they shouldn't have had children, according to you?

That's an old data point. Less than 50% end in divorce because fewer people are getting married in the first place. Happy marriages are there for those with a healthy sense of self and a willingness to put marriage first. In my world, few couples get divorced. The divorces I know tend to involve one spouse behaving badly (either infidelity or general selfishness). To the folks who marry lemons, I say get smarter and pick a better spouse (e.g., someone who will put the marriage first).

I know DCUM has a lot of divorces, but it's actually uncommon for the demographic of your average poster (UMC). This is an interesting insulated echo chamber detached from peers in other areas.

[Anonymous]

The problem is most people have more than one child. They cannot afford more than one in the long term but just want to reproduce themselves.

8 billion people. The world does not need more of you.