Badlands. Why is it just getting more expensive?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
The issues you're talking about are applicable to literally any play place anywhere. If they didn't know about the cyclical nature of their business, that would mean they wouldn't have done the MOST basic research into the space -- or sat and thought about how this would work for 15 minutes.

10:45 here. I think it was hubris, and I see this in other business areas too. Rich people think if you do something slightly different and more premium, then all the past rules about that business/industry are off the table.

I bet they thought that the reason the other play spaces are empty during the week is they are not nice enough, but if they build a high-end place with a cafe with decent food, etc. then people will flock to it. It ignores the realities, but you see it all the time with rich wives running some boutique shop that is basically a hobby not a business. They think all the other small boutiques failed just because they weren't offering a good enough selection or something like that.

The problem with going premium is it's in Rockville. It would need to be in Bethesda or possibly Potomac to really make that work. We live in Bethesda, and no way I'm taking my kids after preschool on a weekday to Rockville to play -- that would be crazy traffic going back home at 5pm.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
The issues you're talking about are applicable to literally any play place anywhere. If they didn't know about the cyclical nature of their business, that would mean they wouldn't have done the MOST basic research into the space -- or sat and thought about how this would work for 15 minutes.

10:45 here. I think it was hubris, and I see this in other business areas too. Rich people think if you do something slightly different and more premium, then all the past rules about that business/industry are off the table.

I bet they thought that the reason the other play spaces are empty during the week is they are not nice enough, but if they build a high-end place with a cafe with decent food, etc. then people will flock to it. It ignores the realities, but you see it all the time with rich wives running some boutique shop that is basically a hobby not a business. They think all the other small boutiques failed just because they weren't offering a good enough selection or something like that.

The problem with going premium is it's in Rockville. It would need to be in Bethesda or possibly Potomac to really make that work. We live in Bethesda, and no way I'm taking my kids after preschool on a weekday to Rockville to play -- that would be crazy traffic going back home at 5pm.

You had me until you basically said Rockville is for the poors.

We're up in Gaithersburg and you'd be shocked to know we've been to Badlands a bunch of times and only go to other places more because DD is still a tad young for Badlands. The price is not an obstacle for us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
The issues you're talking about are applicable to literally any play place anywhere. If they didn't know about the cyclical nature of their business, that would mean they wouldn't have done the MOST basic research into the space -- or sat and thought about how this would work for 15 minutes.

10:45 here. I think it was hubris, and I see this in other business areas too. Rich people think if you do something slightly different and more premium, then all the past rules about that business/industry are off the table.

I bet they thought that the reason the other play spaces are empty during the week is they are not nice enough, but if they build a high-end place with a cafe with decent food, etc. then people will flock to it. It ignores the realities, but you see it all the time with rich wives running some boutique shop that is basically a hobby not a business. They think all the other small boutiques failed just because they weren't offering a good enough selection or something like that.

The problem with going premium is it's in Rockville. It would need to be in Bethesda or possibly Potomac to really make that work. We live in Bethesda, and no way I'm taking my kids after preschool on a weekday to Rockville to play -- that would be crazy traffic going back home at 5pm.

You had me until you basically said Rockville is for the poors.

We're up in Gaithersburg and you'd be shocked to know we've been to Badlands a bunch of times and only go to other places more because DD is still a tad young for Badlands. The price is not an obstacle for us.

I didn't say Rockville is for the poors, but rather meant there are more families who are less concerned about price in Bethesda vs Rockville or Gaithersburg. The census data and home sale data bears this out -- average home sale price and median HHI are higher in Bethesda than in Rockville and Gaithersburg. I'm just looking at this from a business perspective, not making a social commentary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A friend and I (who both run businesses) looked at the finances of play places in general because we were asked to invest in one. Badlands is owned by the wife of David Blair, who ran for MoCo county exec in the last election and lost to Elrich in the primary by only 77 votes. He is a successful businessman, and I know he has his hands in Badlands since I've seen him there.

Their lease probably isn't too bad since that mall is sort of dying, and they spot there were in was vacant for a while, They did have a lot of expenses on build-out -- my guess would be $500k-1mln but I don't know how much it costs to bring in and assemble all that rock stuff.

They are making money on weekends and do a brisk birthday party buisness. The issue is mid-week. Take a day like today, right now (ok, tomrrow.. they're closed on Mondays). They are open 10am-2pm, but I bet the place is nearly empty. Only kids not in preschool/school yet would go, yet they need a certain minimum of staff there to keep it running. I bet the'yre lucky to bring in $200/day in revenue on a day like that. Summer is better -- they contract with camps and the kids come in during the day, but that's only 2.5 months of the year.

So they make nearly all their money on the weekends, and there's a limit to how many people can be in there at once. I guess they are having revenue issues, so they raise the prices since they can't raise the number of people who can be in there.. so get more money without increasing who is in there, since they have no more space. I bet they didn't count on how very cyclical this business is - -you make nearly all your money for the week during just 2 days with a little revenue boost during the 2.5 months of summer due to summer camps. Also since they have in-house food service and all that crazy rock stuff, they have higher staffing needs than most play places. You need some spotters for the rock stuff, and 1-2 people to run the cafe (and at least one must be a certified food handler).

If I were getting into this business, I'd do it like BounceU in Rockville, which any parent of a MoCo K-2nd grader knows well. They paid < $100k for all the bounce houses, and they are in a warehouse in the industrial district on Gude Drive = cheap rent. They are pretty much only open on weekends, and only when they have birthday parties. Most of the staff is high schoolers. Very low costs, and fairly stable revenue (kids always have birthdays).

Do you honestly think that they didn't think of all those points you have stated?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A friend and I (who both run businesses) looked at the finances of play places in general because we were asked to invest in one. Badlands is owned by the wife of David Blair, who ran for MoCo county exec in the last election and lost to Elrich in the primary by only 77 votes. He is a successful businessman, and I know he has his hands in Badlands since I've seen him there.

Their lease probably isn't too bad since that mall is sort of dying, and they spot there were in was vacant for a while, They did have a lot of expenses on build-out -- my guess would be $500k-1mln but I don't know how much it costs to bring in and assemble all that rock stuff.

They are making money on weekends and do a brisk birthday party buisness. The issue is mid-week. Take a day like today, right now (ok, tomrrow.. they're closed on Mondays). They are open 10am-2pm, but I bet the place is nearly empty. Only kids not in preschool/school yet would go, yet they need a certain minimum of staff there to keep it running. I bet the'yre lucky to bring in $200/day in revenue on a day like that. Summer is better -- they contract with camps and the kids come in during the day, but that's only 2.5 months of the year.

So they make nearly all their money on the weekends, and there's a limit to how many people can be in there at once. I guess they are having revenue issues, so they raise the prices since they can't raise the number of people who can be in there.. so get more money without increasing who is in there, since they have no more space. I bet they didn't count on how very cyclical this business is - -you make nearly all your money for the week during just 2 days with a little revenue boost during the 2.5 months of summer due to summer camps. Also since they have in-house food service and all that crazy rock stuff, they have higher staffing needs than most play places. You need some spotters for the rock stuff, and 1-2 people to run the cafe (and at least one must be a certified food handler).

If I were getting into this business, I'd do it like BounceU in Rockville, which any parent of a MoCo K-2nd grader knows well. They paid < $100k for all the bounce houses, and they are in a warehouse in the industrial district on Gude Drive = cheap rent. They are pretty much only open on weekends, and only when they have birthday parties. Most of the staff is high schoolers. Very low costs, and fairly stable revenue (kids always have birthdays).

Do you honestly think that they didn't think of all those points you have stated?

No, I don't. This is a case of "we can do it better by offering a more premium product" where decisions are driven more by emotions and that doesn't always work. The owner's husband has deep pockets so they can run at a loss for a few years, but let's see where they are in 5 years.

[Anonymous]

We love Badlands but I am not going to pay close to $50 for a family of 4. It is too costly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We love Badlands but I am not going to pay close to $50 for a family of 4. It is too costly.

It's more than that now for a family of 4 since the parents have to pay. Closer to $60 now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A friend and I (who both run businesses) looked at the finances of play places in general because we were asked to invest in one. Badlands is owned by the wife of David Blair, who ran for MoCo county exec in the last election and lost to Elrich in the primary by only 77 votes. He is a successful businessman, and I know he has his hands in Badlands since I've seen him there.

Their lease probably isn't too bad since that mall is sort of dying, and they spot there were in was vacant for a while, They did have a lot of expenses on build-out -- my guess would be $500k-1mln but I don't know how much it costs to bring in and assemble all that rock stuff.

They are making money on weekends and do a brisk birthday party buisness. The issue is mid-week. Take a day like today, right now (ok, tomrrow.. they're closed on Mondays). They are open 10am-2pm, but I bet the place is nearly empty. Only kids not in preschool/school yet would go, yet they need a certain minimum of staff there to keep it running. I bet the'yre lucky to bring in $200/day in revenue on a day like that. Summer is better -- they contract with camps and the kids come in during the day, but that's only 2.5 months of the year.

So they make nearly all their money on the weekends, and there's a limit to how many people can be in there at once. I guess they are having revenue issues, so they raise the prices since they can't raise the number of people who can be in there.. so get more money without increasing who is in there, since they have no more space. I bet they didn't count on how very cyclical this business is - -you make nearly all your money for the week during just 2 days with a little revenue boost during the 2.5 months of summer due to summer camps. Also since they have in-house food service and all that crazy rock stuff, they have higher staffing needs than most play places. You need some spotters for the rock stuff, and 1-2 people to run the cafe (and at least one must be a certified food handler).

If I were getting into this business, I'd do it like BounceU in Rockville, which any parent of a MoCo K-2nd grader knows well. They paid < $100k for all the bounce houses, and they are in a warehouse in the industrial district on Gude Drive = cheap rent. They are pretty much only open on weekends, and only when they have birthday parties. Most of the staff is high schoolers. Very low costs, and fairly stable revenue (kids always have birthdays).

Do you honestly think that they didn't think of all those points you have stated?

No, I don't. This is a case of "we can do it better by offering a more premium product" where decisions are driven more by emotions and that doesn't always work. The owner's husband has deep pockets so they can run at a loss for a few years, but let's see where they are in 5 years.

I've been to Bounce U. I've been to Badlands. Both are fun in their own way, but Badlands offers a higher end experience. Bounce U is all flashing lights and loud music and crowds, while Badlands has that nature theme. There are parents willing to pay that.

[Anonymous]

My kids are 8 and 5, and I have to drag them outback of there. They love it. It’s $60 basically to get in plus food. Pretty ridiculous, but we keep going back.

[Anonymous]

Great space. Under utilized rooms and activities. Poorly trained staff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We love Badlands but I am not going to pay close to $50 for a family of 4. It is too costly.

It's more than that now for a family of 4 since the parents have to pay. Closer to $60 now.

Huh? Nope. It's $20 for my 3 year old, $10 for the adults and $12.50 for the toddler under 3. It's $42.50 for me.

[Anonymous]

My kids and I prefer Hyper Kidz in Columbia. Badlands is just ok (and I agree with a PP that it's getting run down), and I don't like paying that kind of money for just ok.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We love Badlands but I am not going to pay close to $50 for a family of 4. It is too costly.

It's more than that now for a family of 4 since the parents have to pay. Closer to $60 now.

Huh? Nope. It's $20 for my 3 year old, $10 for the adults and $12.50 for the toddler under 3. It's $42.50 for me.

You have obviously only Gone on weekdays. It's more on weekends.

Weekend prices are: 22.50 for over 3 and $15 for toddlers. So still cheaper for you now until the younger one turns 3.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We love Badlands but I am not going to pay close to $50 for a family of 4. It is too costly.

It's more than that now for a family of 4 since the parents have to pay. Closer to $60 now.

Huh? Nope. It's $20 for my 3 year old, $10 for the adults and $12.50 for the toddler under 3. It's $42.50 for me.

You have obviously only Gone on weekdays. It's more on weekends.

Weekend prices are: 22.50 for over 3 and $15 for toddlers. So still cheaper for you now until the younger one turns 3.

I’ve never been but $22.50 + adult admission is ridiculous. I’m in Virginia and as far as I know, none of our play places charge for the adult too. Not even Scramble, which I believe is $20 or $22 for weekend admission but you get one free adult with a child.

[Anonymous]

Funny that we are talking about how expensive this place is and there is a Certifikid deal now. Hmmmm, maybe the new pricing is not working out?