Mclean vs. Vienna

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:McLean has about a dozen schools as does Vienna. Which ones are you talking about? The only school named "Mclean" is McLean High School. And the only school named "Vienna" is Vienna Elementary school, so I assume you are not comparing those two.

Actually there is another McLean school - The McLean School in Potomac. We sent DS there during middle years. It was excellent.

I don't like Vienna because of the traffic down Maple. Also, I don't like the clutter of old shopping malls running the entire length of Maple. The area is too congested and it is difficult to get anywhere quickly.

I don't think the high schools in Vienna compare with McLean High or Langley High, but could be wrong. I live over here for 20 years and have never heard anything stellar about the Vienna Schools.

Do you think the McLean School in Potomac and the Potomac School in McLean could arrange to swap names? It might make life easier.

I think McLean HS is similar to Madison HS in Vienna and Marshall HS in Falls Church, which a lot of Vienna kids attend. Langley HS is unique among NoVa public high schools in the wealth of its student body, which some people may view positively and others negatively.

When we were at The McLean School (Potomac) my husband made a similar joke all the time "not to be confused with the Langley school in McLean"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Town of Vienna charges a town tax...which covers trash and leaf removal. Still not worth it though.

...and snow removal (timely, not waiting on VDOT for 2 days), instantaneous police response, maintenance and captial $$ for street and sidewalk improvements, free mulch from those leaves, parks and recreation programs and site maintenance...

Very much worth it

And since it is a tax, it is deductible on state and federal income. Trash removal costs about $400 per year. My Vienna taxes are $600 per year. but I get about $200 back in tax refunds. For that I also get big item pickup, leaf removal, etc.

And a local government that responds to the people: we know many of the town council and the mayor. It is small town america.

It's deductible, but you're not getting 100% back.

People in the town are essentially paying twice for town services. Once to the town, once to the county.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can trust you, most houses in the town of vienna do not approach 1 million. Probably between 500K and 600K.

And they are dumpy.

the nice homes in the town are those on center st. amongst others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can trust you, most houses in the town of vienna do not approach 1 million. Probably between 500K and 600K.

And they are dumpy.

the nice homes in the town are those on center st. amongst others.

Thanks. I live in one of those houses. Glad to hear that it's dumpy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can trust you, most houses in the town of vienna do not approach 1 million. Probably between 500K and 600K.

And they are dumpy.

the nice homes in the town are those on center st. amongst others.

I think the quality of new construction in the Town of Vienna has gone down in the last 2-3 years, but there are nice houses all over the town. I can't think of any reason to single out Center Street for nice homes, as opposed to Windover, Park, Cottage, Kingsley or Moore, among many other streets.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can trust you, most houses in the town of vienna do not approach 1 million. Probably between 500K and 600K.

And they are dumpy.

the nice homes in the town are those on center st. amongst others.

I think the quality of new construction in the Town of Vienna has gone down in the last 2-3 years, but there are nice houses all over the town. I can't think of any reason to single out Center Street for nice homes, as opposed to Windover, Park, Cottage, Kingsley or Moore, among many other streets.

yeah, but the dumpy old houses are quickly being torn-down and replaced with $1.5M nice houses. that is all over. so it is better to live surrounded by shitty $500k houses in Vienna than live in a shitty but more expensive area in Vienna (say, barristers place off Lawyers) that cost $700K but will never be a target for tear-downs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Town of Vienna charges a town tax...which covers trash and leaf removal. Still not worth it though.

...and snow removal (timely, not waiting on VDOT for 2 days), instantaneous police response, maintenance and captial $$ for street and sidewalk improvements, free mulch from those leaves, parks and recreation programs and site maintenance...

Very much worth it

And since it is a tax, it is deductible on state and federal income. Trash removal costs about $400 per year. My Vienna taxes are $600 per year. but I get about $200 back in tax refunds. For that I also get big item pickup, leaf removal, etc.

And a local government that responds to the people: we know many of the town council and the mayor. It is small town america.

It's deductible, but you're not getting 100% back.

People in the town are essentially paying twice for town services. Once to the town, once to the county.

I am not paying twice for trash pickup. I pay it in my taxes. If I lived out of the town, my after tax expense for trash pickup would be about $400. In town, my after tax expense for trash pickup is $400 ($600 taxes - $200 tax deduction from income tax). The remaining services are effectively free. And I have a responsive government that maintains the streets, keeps the roads clear in snow, facilitates family friendly activities.

The think about Vienna, is the people who do not live in vienna think the heart of Vienna is 123 (Maple Avenue). The people that live here know the heart is on Church Street, which is populated mostly by locally owned businesses. Before dissing Vienna's congestion, take a stroll down Church Street. Stop and get a cup of coffee at Caffe Amouri. Notice how the area is not just a series of strip malls, nor is it an artificial town center (ala Reston). From there, you can walk to Whole foods, the community center, the library, the town green for the concerts on Fri and Sun during the summer, and much of the town.

The town government has been proactive in creating these concepts and spaces. Is Vienna perfect? no. But, it is a nice place to call home.

[Anonymous]

The challenge in Vienna is that the main commuting artery through the town is also the primary commercial artery, so Maple/123 is very congested. You cannot live in Vienna and not be seriously affected by it the traffic at times, the occasional stroll to Nielsen's, Caffe Amouri and Bazan's notwithstanding.

In McLean, the main commercial area is set off from 123, so Dolley Madison/123 is far less congested. But, because the retail areas near Chain Bridge and Old Dominion are less visible, they get less traffic and depend more on locals for business, and there's not as much to choose from as in Vienna.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The challenge in Vienna is that the main commuting artery through the town is also the primary commercial artery, so Maple/123 is very congested. You cannot live in Vienna and not be seriously affected by it the traffic at times, the occasional stroll to Nielsen's, Caffe Amouri and Bazan's notwithstanding.

In McLean, the main commercial area is set off from 123, so Dolley Madison/123 is far less congested. But, because the retail areas near Chain Bridge and Old Dominion are less visible, they get less traffic and depend more on locals for business, and there's not as much to choose from as in Vienna.

123 is the main commuting artery for those that don't live in town. No one I know that lives here ever goes all the way down Maple to get anywhere. Some parts of it, yes, but not all the way down. I have neighbors that commute to Arlington, Alexandria, Maryland, DC, Reston and of course Tysons, none have to go all the way down Maple during their rush hour commutes. Some merely cross it, some don't go in that direction at all.

Between Thanksgiving and Christmas it definitely was more congested due to the incoming droves shopping at Tyson's Mall, but the only time I felt it was when I was actually at the mall trying to park. I'm not trying to debate whether Vienna trumps Mclean or vice versa, I don't really care as I love my town either way and I'm sure there are those that love Mclean. The congestion others feel on 123 does little to impact my life here and I know my neighbors wouldn't trade this place for anywhere else either. There is a reason you always hear about people loving Town of Vienna..

[Anonymous]

PP: +1. I rarely get stuck in maple ave traffic.

[Anonymous]

Yes, I lived in Vienna for years, and mostly avoided 123 entirely for commuting. But when it came time to run errands on the weekends, it was impossible to avoid Maple and the traffic was very bad. Unless you live within a few blocks of Maple, walk everywhere, and have no need to run errands on weekends, I can't see how one would not be affected by the traffic there.

I now live in McLean and one of the benefits is no longer having to deal with the congestion on Maple. I think people who live there get so used to it that they don't realize how bad it may strike others. But we miss some of the places in Vienna, so we do come back and, sadly, contribute to the aforementioned traffic. There really is no place in McLean comparable to Cenan's Bakery or Amma Vegetarian, to pick just two places.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP: +1. I rarely get stuck in maple ave traffic.

85-90% of the retail/commercial in Vienna is off of Maple. Of course you can live in many parts of Vienna and avoid Maple entirely, but if you do that it kind of begs the question as to why you'd want to live there in the first place.

I never personally viewed the traffic in Vienna as a deal-killer when considering it as a place to live, but most people would consider it a negative. Only a subset of people who live there can really arrange their lives so that it becomes a non-issue. SAHMs who run all their errands during non-rush hour times on weekdays may have a different experience than people who need to grocery shop or run other errands on weekends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP: +1. I rarely get stuck in maple ave traffic.

85-90% of the retail/commercial in Vienna is off of Maple. Of course you can live in many parts of Vienna and avoid Maple entirely, but if you do that it kind of begs the question as to why you'd want to live there in the first place.

I never personally viewed the traffic in Vienna as a deal-killer when considering it as a place to live, but most people would consider it a negative. Only a subset of people who live there can really arrange their lives so that it becomes a non-issue. SAHMs who run all their errands during non-rush hour times on weekdays may have a different experience than people who need to grocery shop or run other errands on weekends.

If you work in Tysons but live in Vienna, near the town, it sucks that Maple is the primary road to get to Tysons. For McLean, there are no such limitations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, I lived in Vienna for years, and mostly avoided 123 entirely for commuting. But when it came time to run errands on the weekends, it was impossible to avoid Maple and the traffic was very bad. Unless you live within a few blocks of Maple, walk everywhere, and have no need to run errands on weekends, I can't see how one would not be affected by the traffic there.

I now live in McLean and one of the benefits is no longer having to deal with the congestion on Maple. I think people who live there get so used to it that they don't realize how bad it may strike others. But we miss some of the places in Vienna, so we do come back and, sadly, contribute to the aforementioned traffic. There really is no place in McLean comparable to Cenan's Bakery or Amma Vegetarian, to pick just two places.

It's better to deal with Vienna WRT Maple Ave. when you want to vice deal with it always b/c you live there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Town of Vienna charges a town tax...which covers trash and leaf removal. Still not worth it though.

...and snow removal (timely, not waiting on VDOT for 2 days), instantaneous police response, maintenance and captial $$ for street and sidewalk improvements, free mulch from those leaves, parks and recreation programs and site maintenance...

Very much worth it

And since it is a tax, it is deductible on state and federal income. Trash removal costs about $400 per year. My Vienna taxes are $600 per year. but I get about $200 back in tax refunds. For that I also get big item pickup, leaf removal, etc.

And a local government that responds to the people: we know many of the town council and the mayor. It is small town america.

It's deductible, but you're not getting 100% back.

People in the town are essentially paying twice for town services. Once to the town, once to the county.

I am not paying twice for trash pickup. I pay it in my taxes. If I lived out of the town, my after tax expense for trash pickup would be about $400. In town, my after tax expense for trash pickup is $400 ($600 taxes - $200 tax deduction from income tax). The remaining services are effectively free. And I have a responsive government that maintains the streets, keeps the roads clear in snow, facilitates family friendly activities.

The think about Vienna, is the people who do not live in vienna think the heart of Vienna is 123 (Maple Avenue). The people that live here know the heart is on Church Street, which is populated mostly by locally owned businesses. Before dissing Vienna's congestion, take a stroll down Church Street. Stop and get a cup of coffee at Caffe Amouri. Notice how the area is not just a series of strip malls, nor is it an artificial town center (ala Reston). From there, you can walk to Whole foods, the community center, the library, the town green for the concerts on Fri and Sun during the summer, and much of the town.

The town government has been proactive in creating these concepts and spaces. Is Vienna perfect? no. But, it is a nice place to call home.

Vienna is a nice place to live, but the strip malls that you dismiss are the ones right next to the whole foods that you shop at. You pay FFX Cty property taxes which covers snow removal, and then you pay town taxes that actually perform the snow removal. You get no extra writeoff from your county property taxes just b/c you pay town taxes also.