Early PK3 via Early Stages question

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think the differences are:

Early Stages is the Part B coordinator for the transfer from IDEA Part C FOR DCPS. Early Stages would not know anything about enrollment in charters, they are a DCPS entity that is responsible for part C to B transfer. Early Stages C to B transfer process will either develop an IEP and place you at DCPS, agree to extend your IFSP, or drop you once you show proof of enrollment at a charter.

Part C is run by Strong Start.

For Strong Start Part C to charter Part B transfer, the student would already have to be enrolled in the charter. In this case, Early Stages would not be invoked at all. The only way to be enrolled in a Charter is via My School DC lottery between April 1-October 5 for the following school year, for a child turning 3 before Sept 30. There is no way for a charter to enroll a child who didn’t make the cutoff and isn’t in My School DC.

So put together that means that only kids who are on an IFSP, have been accepted into a charter and have enrolled via the regular lottery, and are still 2 at that time, could engage in a C to B transfer with a charter. So we are talking about kids with summer birthdays. They wouldn’t be placed into a charter “early” because school isn’t in session. They could attend ESY though.

This is the kind of knowledge base that made this board so great.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:*Mid year entry
*Younger than all other classmates by ~1-18 months
*Socially and/or academically delayed

Does DC really put these kids in PK3 general education classrooms? On paper it seems like that would be a disaster for them. I had always thought this program was intended for self-contained environments.

Yes. Research supports that early placement is actually particularly good for kids needing SLP and OT therapy, in addition to the obvious benefit of being able to easily access the specific services needed.

[Anonymous]

If this bilingual charter school is lamb pcs than I would absolutely go to your dcps. Lamb has one of the worst special needs programs in dc.

The “new to dc” executive director loves to play dumb.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If this bilingual charter school is lamb pcs than I would absolutely go to your dcps. Lamb has one of the worst special needs programs in dc.

The “new to dc” executive director loves to play dumb.

Anecdotal here, but our experience with special needs at LAMB has been great. We transferred into LAMB primary over the past few years after doing some time in DCPS (keeping it a big vague for anonymity) and have been very happy. Way, way, way better than what we experienced at a DCPS school that was trying to push our kiddo off their IEP. So to each their own.

That being said, I DO agree that I wouldn't put an early stage kid in a charter that wasn't specially set up for that specific situation. I'm not sure if LAMB is or not. All I can say is that that for our specific kid who transferrered into LAMB, we had a great experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:*Mid year entry
*Younger than all other classmates by ~1-18 months
*Socially and/or academically delayed

Does DC really put these kids in PK3 general education classrooms? On paper it seems like that would be a disaster for them. I had always thought this program was intended for self-contained environments.

Yes. Research supports that early placement is actually particularly good for kids needing SLP and OT therapy, in addition to the obvious benefit of being able to easily access the specific services needed.

Research supports early SLP and OT. Does it support classroom placements where the child is significantly younger than the rest of the class?

I would probably choose a community daycare or preschool classroom where they are with same-age peers, plus Speech and OT through DCPS.

If the child couldn't function in an inclusive setting, and the options were to be at home, or to be in a self contained class, I might choose differently.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If this bilingual charter school is lamb pcs than I would absolutely go to your dcps. Lamb has one of the worst special needs programs in dc.

The “new to dc” executive director loves to play dumb.

Anecdotal here, but our experience with special needs at LAMB has been great. We transferred into LAMB primary over the past few years after doing some time in DCPS (keeping it a big vague for anonymity) and have been very happy. Way, way, way better than what we experienced at a DCPS school that was trying to push our kiddo off their IEP. So to each their own.

That being said, I DO agree that I wouldn't put an early stage kid in a charter that wasn't specially set up for that specific situation. I'm not sure if LAMB is or not. All I can say is that that for our specific kid who transferrered into LAMB, we had a great experience.

I understand that a lot has changed with the special ed program at lamb. So your mileage may vary depending on the age of your child. But our recent experience was very, very bad and I know we weren’t the only family to deal with the disorganization, high turnover of special ed staff and gaslighting we encountered.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If this bilingual charter school is lamb pcs than I would absolutely go to your dcps. Lamb has one of the worst special needs programs in dc.

The “new to dc” executive director loves to play dumb.

Anecdotal here, but our experience with special needs at LAMB has been great. We transferred into LAMB primary over the past few years after doing some time in DCPS (keeping it a big vague for anonymity) and have been very happy. Way, way, way better than what we experienced at a DCPS school that was trying to push our kiddo off their IEP. So to each their own.

That being said, I DO agree that I wouldn't put an early stage kid in a charter that wasn't specially set up for that specific situation. I'm not sure if LAMB is or not. All I can say is that that for our specific kid who transferrered into LAMB, we had a great experience.

I understand that a lot has changed with the special ed program at lamb. So your mileage may vary depending on the age of your child. But our recent experience was very, very bad and I know we weren’t the only family to deal with the disorganization, high turnover of special ed staff and gaslighting we encountered.

Our experience was very recent and very positive! Sorry yours wasn’t good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If this bilingual charter school is lamb pcs than I would absolutely go to your dcps. Lamb has one of the worst special needs programs in dc.

The “new to dc” executive director loves to play dumb.

The charter in question has PK3 seats available so presumably couldn't be LAMB.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If this bilingual charter school is lamb pcs than I would absolutely go to your dcps. Lamb has one of the worst special needs programs in dc.

The “new to dc” executive director loves to play dumb.

Anecdotal here, but our experience with special needs at LAMB has been great. We transferred into LAMB primary over the past few years after doing some time in DCPS (keeping it a big vague for anonymity) and have been very happy. Way, way, way better than what we experienced at a DCPS school that was trying to push our kiddo off their IEP. So to each their own.

That being said, I DO agree that I wouldn't put an early stage kid in a charter that wasn't specially set up for that specific situation. I'm not sure if LAMB is or not. All I can say is that that for our specific kid who transferrered into LAMB, we had a great experience.

Our experience (also recent) with the sped team at LAMB has also been great. They have been proactive and thoughtful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the differences are:

Early Stages is the Part B coordinator for the transfer from IDEA Part C FOR DCPS. Early Stages would not know anything about enrollment in charters, they are a DCPS entity that is responsible for part C to B transfer. Early Stages C to B transfer process will either develop an IEP and place you at DCPS, agree to extend your IFSP, or drop you once you show proof of enrollment at a charter.

Part C is run by Strong Start.

For Strong Start Part C to charter Part B transfer, the student would already have to be enrolled in the charter. In this case, Early Stages would not be invoked at all. The only way to be enrolled in a Charter is via My School DC lottery between April 1-October 5 for the following school year, for a child turning 3 before Sept 30. There is no way for a charter to enroll a child who didn’t make the cutoff and isn’t in My School DC.

So put together that means that only kids who are on an IFSP, have been accepted into a charter and have enrolled via the regular lottery, and are still 2 at that time, could engage in a C to B transfer with a charter. So we are talking about kids with summer birthdays. They wouldn’t be placed into a charter “early” because school isn’t in session. They could attend ESY though.

This is the kind of knowledge base that made this board so great.

Except that they’re wrong. The OSSE regulations specifically state that a child who receives an IEP on their third birthday but misses the birthday cutoff can still enroll in PK3 any LEA that accepts midyear transfers - and they explicitly state that this applies to both DCPS and charter schools. Using those exact words.

The wrinkle is that Early Stages was created to serve the (giant) DCPS LEA before charter schools even existed, and no individual charter school LEA can functionally replicate it. So the retcon is that Early Stages performs the assessments and issues the IEP … and while they can’t list any specific school on the document except a DCPS school, OSSE is quite clear in their only public guidance that the same document could also be used to enroll at any charter that is willing to accept that student.

Is it a perfect workaround? No. But it’s a way of making reality match the policy, even in the absence of funding and personnel.

[Anonymous]

fine if a charter with zero waitlist is willing to accept the student mid-year. but they are not obligated to take anyone outside the lottery and they dont receuve funds after october so it doesnt happen in practice x

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the differences are:

Early Stages is the Part B coordinator for the transfer from IDEA Part C FOR DCPS. Early Stages would not know anything about enrollment in charters, they are a DCPS entity that is responsible for part C to B transfer. Early Stages C to B transfer process will either develop an IEP and place you at DCPS, agree to extend your IFSP, or drop you once you show proof of enrollment at a charter.

Part C is run by Strong Start.

For Strong Start Part C to charter Part B transfer, the student would already have to be enrolled in the charter. In this case, Early Stages would not be invoked at all. The only way to be enrolled in a Charter is via My School DC lottery between April 1-October 5 for the following school year, for a child turning 3 before Sept 30. There is no way for a charter to enroll a child who didn’t make the cutoff and isn’t in My School DC.

So put together that means that only kids who are on an IFSP, have been accepted into a charter and have enrolled via the regular lottery, and are still 2 at that time, could engage in a C to B transfer with a charter. So we are talking about kids with summer birthdays. They wouldn’t be placed into a charter “early” because school isn’t in session. They could attend ESY though.

This is the kind of knowledge base that made this board so great.

Except that they’re wrong. The OSSE regulations specifically state that a child who receives an IEP on their third birthday but misses the birthday cutoff can still enroll in PK3 any LEA that accepts midyear transfers - and they explicitly state that this applies to both DCPS and charter schools. Using those exact words.

The wrinkle is that Early Stages was created to serve the (giant) DCPS LEA before charter schools even existed, and no individual charter school LEA can functionally replicate it. So the retcon is that Early Stages performs the assessments and issues the IEP … and while they can’t list any specific school on the document except a DCPS school, OSSE is quite clear in their only public guidance that the same document could also be used to enroll at any charter that is willing to accept that student.

Is it a perfect workaround? No. But it’s a way of making reality match the policy, even in the absence of funding and personnel.

Are they wrong? OSSE's policy does not match My School DC requirements nor does it match Early Stages policies.

From Early Stages -- "The Early Stages process ends with an offer to enroll at a DCPS school... Early Stages can only
offer enrollment with DCPS. If you enroll your child in a public charter school, you can transfer the IEP. If you enroll your child in a private or religious school, you can request a services plan instead."

My School DC legal agreements with charter schools state that "schools participating in My School DC are required to use a September 30th age cutoff for PK3, PK4 and Kindergarten. In other words, schools may not accept applicants younger than these cutoffs in those grades." There is no exception listed for students with IEPs or for students referred from Early Stages.

My School DC also prohibits enrollment outside of their process. "All participating schools opt-in to use the MSDC application and common lottery, and MSDC collects applications from new students on behalf of participating schools. Participating schools may not collect
applications from new students outside of the MSDC process."

My School DC also says that schools that they will "take appropriate next steps" for schools that break their rules including "referral to the Office of the Inspector General or other governmental authority, limiting future participation, censure, report to chartering authority or other oversight body."

OSSE, My School DC and Early Stages need to get together and align their policies and rules.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If this bilingual charter school is lamb pcs than I would absolutely go to your dcps. Lamb has one of the worst special needs programs in dc.

The “new to dc” executive director loves to play dumb.

Anecdotal here, but our experience with special needs at LAMB has been great. We transferred into LAMB primary over the past few years after doing some time in DCPS (keeping it a big vague for anonymity) and have been very happy. Way, way, way better than what we experienced at a DCPS school that was trying to push our kiddo off their IEP. So to each their own.

That being said, I DO agree that I wouldn't put an early stage kid in a charter that wasn't specially set up for that specific situation. I'm not sure if LAMB is or not. All I can say is that that for our specific kid who transferrered into LAMB, we had a great experience.

Our experience (also recent) with the sped team at LAMB has also been great. They have been proactive and thoughtful.

We had a wonderful sped experience with lamb until we hit upper el. Upper el is pretty bad but the sped team was worse. Our experience was definitely not unique. We got what our child needed but only because we did our own outside evaluation and hired a lawyer. Very unpleasant people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the differences are:

Early Stages is the Part B coordinator for the transfer from IDEA Part C FOR DCPS. Early Stages would not know anything about enrollment in charters, they are a DCPS entity that is responsible for part C to B transfer. Early Stages C to B transfer process will either develop an IEP and place you at DCPS, agree to extend your IFSP, or drop you once you show proof of enrollment at a charter.

Part C is run by Strong Start.

For Strong Start Part C to charter Part B transfer, the student would already have to be enrolled in the charter. In this case, Early Stages would not be invoked at all. The only way to be enrolled in a Charter is via My School DC lottery between April 1-October 5 for the following school year, for a child turning 3 before Sept 30. There is no way for a charter to enroll a child who didn’t make the cutoff and isn’t in My School DC.

So put together that means that only kids who are on an IFSP, have been accepted into a charter and have enrolled via the regular lottery, and are still 2 at that time, could engage in a C to B transfer with a charter. So we are talking about kids with summer birthdays. They wouldn’t be placed into a charter “early” because school isn’t in session. They could attend ESY though.

This is the kind of knowledge base that made this board so great.

Except that they’re wrong. The OSSE regulations specifically state that a child who receives an IEP on their third birthday but misses the birthday cutoff can still enroll in PK3 any LEA that accepts midyear transfers - and they explicitly state that this applies to both DCPS and charter schools. Using those exact words.

The wrinkle is that Early Stages was created to serve the (giant) DCPS LEA before charter schools even existed, and no individual charter school LEA can functionally replicate it. So the retcon is that Early Stages performs the assessments and issues the IEP … and while they can’t list any specific school on the document except a DCPS school, OSSE is quite clear in their only public guidance that the same document could also be used to enroll at any charter that is willing to accept that student.

Is it a perfect workaround? No. But it’s a way of making reality match the policy, even in the absence of funding and personnel.

Are they wrong? OSSE's policy does not match My School DC requirements nor does it match Early Stages policies.

From Early Stages -- "The Early Stages process ends with an offer to enroll at a DCPS school... Early Stages can only
offer enrollment with DCPS. If you enroll your child in a public charter school, you can transfer the IEP. If you enroll your child in a private or religious school, you can request a services plan instead."

My School DC legal agreements with charter schools state that "schools participating in My School DC are required to use a September 30th age cutoff for PK3, PK4 and Kindergarten. In other words, schools may not accept applicants younger than these cutoffs in those grades." There is no exception listed for students with IEPs or for students referred from Early Stages.

My School DC also prohibits enrollment outside of their process. "All participating schools opt-in to use the MSDC application and common lottery, and MSDC collects applications from new students on behalf of participating schools. Participating schools may not collect
applications from new students outside of the MSDC process."

My School DC also says that schools that they will "take appropriate next steps" for schools that break their rules including "referral to the Office of the Inspector General or other governmental authority, limiting future participation, censure, report to chartering authority or other oversight body."

OSSE, My School DC and Early Stages need to get together and align their policies and rules.

Yes. They are wrong. For the reasons outlined above.
The OSSE guidance, which you can read here for yourself https://osse.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/osse/publication/attachments/Early%20Childhood%20Transition%20FAQ%20July%202020.pdf - is that "To be eligible for Pre-Kindergarten 3 (PK3), a child must turn age three by September 30. However, three-year-old children with active IEPs are entitled to enroll in DCPS or public charter LEAs with available seats that accept midyear transfer students at any time once the child is three years old, regardless of when in the year they turn three."

An IEP without any placement option whatsoever, even a non-binding one based on a pool of only some of the available options, would be pretty useless in this city. And Early Stages - the only official assessment process and personnel funded by the city - is an arm of the DCPS LEA, so they can only direct a DCPS placement for a child, even if that recommendation does not represent the full range of available options. Of course it is unlikely that a charter would accept a midyear special ed PK3 placement - but it is by no means impossible...most PK3s in the city are fairly good, most charters have PK3s, and there are more than a few charters who are otherwise struggling for enrollment and would like to be able to get a new kid in the system anytime, looking ahead to the following year when the kid would be fully funded.

I agree that OSSE, Early Stages and MySchoolDC should get on the same page. For many reasons, there can't be a separate charter version of Early Stages. Nor can Early Stages dictate any actions (such as individual enrollment decisions) to charter schools. That said, it's also not possible for charter schools to just not be in the business of serving an entire group of special ed students for whom they already have the personnel and city mandate to do so. So the best workaround is actually the current imperfect policy. All that's necessary is for everyone who deals with OSSE enrollment policies at MySchool to, you know...be aware of the actual OSSE enrollment policies. Maybe read OSSE's posted guidance on existing policy once in a while, just for kicks. The end.

[Anonymous]

All true - to which I'd add, that (conservatively) hundreds or even thousands of students have enrolled at lottery schools across the city under this policy over the past 20 years. There are many children across the city who are enrolled under this policy right at this very moment, or planning to enroll during the current academic year, and receive city services to which they are entitled by law via this enrollment. Is the idea to just expel them all, in violation of OSSE's only public guidance? Because that seems like it would be a hot mess of a decision - especially given that it runs counter to the only directions for this specific group offered in writing, which is happens to be the policy long conducted in practice by the city's sole agency of special ed assessment professionals serving this age group.

Either charter lottery schools are governed by the same policies as public lottery schools or they are not. If DCPS schools serve PK3 students with IEPs - and again, we're not talking about every 3-year-old, just this specific class of 3-year-old with special needs - regardless of whether or not they meet the birthday cutoff, then charter schools should not only be free to do the same...they should be expected to do so.