When people refer to top 20 and top 25 schools what are they?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

You may be correct…but it’s whatever USNews ranks as top 25.

Correct.

Everyone has their own opinion.

USNews pretty much is the source despite some detractors who don’t like where their college is ranked.

Many people dislike US News because they think the methodology is bad. For those people, it has nothing to do with not liking where their college is ranked.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

T15 as defined above makes a lot of sense, even though it doesn't match US News every year. 15-25 you can argue about some of the candidates. Is Emory in or out of T25? UVa? Of course, Emory, UVa, and the other schools people argue about are all excellent. So in that sense it doesn't really matter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

You may be correct…but it’s whatever USNews ranks as top 25.

Correct.

Everyone has their own opinion.

USNews pretty much is the source despite some detractors who don’t like where their college is ranked.

Many people dislike US News because they think the methodology is bad. For those people, it has nothing to do with not liking where their college is ranked.

DP. The only people who grouse about USNWR are a tiny, tiny group who are obsessed with things like rankings. No one else cares. They look at USNWR for rankings and that's that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:These are the 30 universities that make up the top 20

MIT
Stanford
Harvard
Yale
Princeton
Penn
Duke
Northwestern
Cornell
Vanderbilt
Dartmouth
Chicago
Rice
CalTech
Brown
Columbia
Johns Hopkins
Notre Dame
Michigan
Berkeley
Georgetown
UVA
UCLA
Emory
Texas
Carnegie Mellon
WashU
USC
NYU
Georgia Tech

Some people also include LACs and service academies. Those would include

West Point
Annapolis
Williams
Pomona
Amherst
Swarthmore
Harvey Mudd
Bowdoin
Claremont McKenna
Air Force

Collectively, these are the 40 colleges that constitute the top 20

Nice try the top 30 are
MIT
Stanford
Harvard
Yale
Princeton
Penn
Duke
Northwestern
Cornell
Vanderbilt
Dartmouth
Chicago
Rice
CalTech
Brown
Columbia
Johns Hopkins
Notre Dame
Michigan
Berkeley
Georgetown
UVA
UCLA
Emory
Carnegie Mellon
WashU
Williams
Amherst
Swarthmore
Pomona

Texas? Georgia tech? Absolutely not.

agree

Not a single Public should be in the top 20. Need to swap out all three probably for LACs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

You may be correct…but it’s whatever USNews ranks as top 25.

Correct.

Everyone has their own opinion.

USNews pretty much is the source despite some detractors who don’t like where their college is ranked.

Bingo!

Many people dislike US News because they think the methodology is bad. For those people, it has nothing to do with not liking where their college is ranked.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

There are no large public’s in the top 25 schools. USNWR adjusted the ranking criteria to make some float to the top.

For undergraduate education SLACs are better than any of these schools outside of engineering/CS.

Only the top 5 SLACs seem worth it. When ranked against national universities, you have Williams at 18 and the other 4 in the top 30…and then they drop off a cliff.

The SLACs don't do well against the very top universities. But I'm not sure anyone at Pomona College wishes they were at Northwestern, Hopkins, Rice, Vanderbilt, or Chicago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

There are no large public’s in the top 25 schools. USNWR adjusted the ranking criteria to make some float to the top.

For undergraduate education SLACs are better than any of these schools outside of engineering/CS.

Only the top 5 SLACs seem worth it. When ranked against national universities, you have Williams at 18 and the other 4 in the top 30…and then they drop off a cliff.

The SLACs don't do well against the very top universities. But I'm not sure anyone at Pomona College wishes they were at Northwestern, Hopkins, Rice, Vanderbilt, or Chicago.

SLACs have a very different objective and purpose. They are more focussed towards undergraduate teaching, if looking at undergraduate teaching, its best to look at following:

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/undergrad-research-programs

This has all National Univ and SLACs ranked together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

You may be correct…but it’s whatever USNews ranks as top 25.

Correct.

Everyone has their own opinion.

USNews pretty much is the source despite some detractors who don’t like where their college is ranked.

Many people dislike US News because they think the methodology is bad. For those people, it has nothing to do with not liking where their college is ranked.

Of course it does. The purported "bad" methodology knocked their (private) college down a tier, otherwise they wouldn't be bellyaching about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

You may be correct…but it’s whatever USNews ranks as top 25.

Correct.

Everyone has their own opinion.

USNews pretty much is the source despite some detractors who don’t like where their college is ranked.

Many people dislike US News because they think the methodology is bad. For those people, it has nothing to do with not liking where their college is ranked.

Of course it does. The purported "bad" methodology knocked their (private) college down a tier, otherwise they wouldn't be bellyaching about it.

Have you looked at the methodology? I did and wasn't impressed because it doesn't track what I think is important. (My school went up slightly btw.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

You may be correct…but it’s whatever USNews ranks as top 25.

Correct.

Everyone has their own opinion.

USNews pretty much is the source despite some detractors who don’t like where their college is ranked.

Many people dislike US News because they think the methodology is bad. For those people, it has nothing to do with not liking where their college is ranked.

Of course it does. The purported "bad" methodology knocked their (private) college down a tier, otherwise they wouldn't be bellyaching about it.

Have you looked at the methodology? I did and wasn't impressed because it doesn't track what I think is important. (My school went up slightly btw.)

Yes I did. The USNews methodology is fine. People will take from it what they want.

[Anonymous]

USNWR obviously. ask any public or private collegd counselor

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

There are no large public’s in the top 25 schools. USNWR adjusted the ranking criteria to make some float to the top.

For undergraduate education SLACs are better than any of these schools outside of engineering/CS.

Don’t do well? How so?

Only the top 5 SLACs seem worth it. When ranked against national universities, you have Williams at 18 and the other 4 in the top 30…and then they drop off a cliff.

The SLACs don't do well against the very top universities. But I'm not sure anyone at Pomona College wishes they were at Northwestern, Hopkins, Rice, Vanderbilt, or Chicago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

There are no large public’s in the top 25 schools. USNWR adjusted the ranking criteria to make some float to the top.

For undergraduate education SLACs are better than any of these schools outside of engineering/CS.

Only the top 5 SLACs seem worth it. When ranked against national universities, you have Williams at 18 and the other 4 in the top 30…and then they drop off a cliff.

The SLACs don't do well against the very top universities. But I'm not sure anyone at Pomona College wishes they were at Northwestern, Hopkins, Rice, Vanderbilt, or Chicago.

Some of the faculty in the Pomona English Department might.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:These are the 30 universities that make up the top 20

MIT
Stanford
Harvard
Yale
Princeton
Penn
Duke
Northwestern
Cornell
Vanderbilt
Dartmouth
Chicago
Rice
CalTech
Brown
Columbia
Johns Hopkins
Notre Dame
Michigan
Berkeley
Georgetown
UVA
UCLA
Emory
Texas
Carnegie Mellon
WashU
USC
NYU
Georgia Tech

Some people also include LACs and service academies. Those would include

West Point
Annapolis
Williams
Pomona
Amherst
Swarthmore
Harvey Mudd
Bowdoin
Claremont McKenna
Air Force

Collectively, these are the 40 colleges that constitute the top 20

Nice try the top 30 are
MIT
Stanford
Harvard
Yale
Princeton
Penn
Duke
Northwestern
Cornell
Vanderbilt
Dartmouth
Chicago
Rice
CalTech
Brown
Columbia
Johns Hopkins
Notre Dame
Michigan
Berkeley
Georgetown
UVA
UCLA
Emory
Carnegie Mellon
WashU
Williams
Amherst
Swarthmore
Pomona

Texas? Georgia tech? Absolutely not.

Williams
Amherst
Swarthmore
Pomona

These are not universities

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is asked over and over every week.
Ivy+ has a fairly consistent definition based on studies using that term and defining it as The 8 ivies plusMIT Stanford Duke Uchicago. Most people would add the perennial T10 schools Caltech, Northwestern, Hopkins. Thats the T-15. After that using traditional strength of student body ranking the rest of the T25 are:
UCB, WashU, Rice, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Vanderbilt, CMU, UCLA, Mich, UVa, ordered variously based on personal preference and bias but basically everyone agrees these are the 16-25 group of schools.

No we don't, Emory is T25, UVA (and maybe Umich) are not. Emory has been Top 20 for years while UVA has never been.

Emory? lol no

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/emory-university-1564
Currently ranked 24
https://www.aronfrishberg.com/projects/usnehas historically been ranked higher than UVA for 30 years.