How much extra academic work do your children do...

[Anonymous]

I’ve never seen someone keep it a secret- almost everyone I know (and I talk to a lot of parents) has their kid do some kind of academic enrichment or tutoring. It’s just part of the culture here combined with the fact that everyone is looking to accelerate their kids (chapter books in kindergarten, algebra in 6th grade, DE classes in high school). No matter how smart your child is they can’t do that without a lot of outside help.

The more interesting question is why are we in such a rush (my eldest was taking math classes in HS that my engineer brother was taking in his Junior year of college). We’re all locked in a weird arms race.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’ve never seen someone keep it a secret- almost everyone I know (and I talk to a lot of parents) has their kid do some kind of academic enrichment or tutoring. It’s just part of the culture here combined with the fact that everyone is looking to accelerate their kids (chapter books in kindergarten, algebra in 6th grade, DE classes in high school). No matter how smart your child is they can’t do that without a lot of outside help.

The more interesting question is why are we in such a rush (my eldest was taking math classes in HS that my engineer brother was taking in his Junior year of college). We’re all locked in a weird arms race.

And you’re a part of it 🤡

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If kids are ranked, even informally, nobody wants to share resources. And if rankings are real and affect outcomes further down the line, then people are much more hush hush about it.

Also, there is the phenomenon where a school gets a reputation for being "good" because of high test scores, but it is all because of the work that parents do on the side. The academics in the classroom are weak, which surprises newcomers to the school who are unaware of the secret supplementing.

This is exactly how our private prek-8th school is. We’re on the west coast so it’s not just a dmv thing. We have test-in gifted private schools as well as some very difficult to access private HSs. Families join our school and then complain about the academics after 1-2 years.

There’s an entire culture of secret supplementing to ensure that your kid will either do well enough on standardized tests to get into gifted private school or competitive 5/6-12 schools, or to ensure that your kid will get one of the 3-4 (or less) slots that our school typically maxes out at at each of the selective private HSs. That also requires getting into the top math track for 6th grade.

Some people will move away or switch as early as 3rd or 4th grade when they realize their cohort has too many smart kids or sports recruits of their kid’s gender.

Anyway, through “no” RSVPs for parties, cancelled outings, missed scout meetings, and failed carpools, plus chatty kids, I realized that 75-80% of kids my in kid’s grade do private tutors, RSM, mathnasium, Kumon, etc. There’s even a not-so-secret market of summer teacher tutoring that parents pass from one to the other, with the end result that one clique of parents always magically has access to our school’s teachers for private tutoring at home.

To me this pretty wild because my children's teachers are thoroughly average and not people I would hire for tutoring to get my children ahead. They are competent enough during the school year but never differentiate for the smart kids and are too focused on the slow kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If kids are ranked, even informally, nobody wants to share resources. And if rankings are real and affect outcomes further down the line, then people are much more hush hush about it.

Also, there is the phenomenon where a school gets a reputation for being "good" because of high test scores, but it is all because of the work that parents do on the side. The academics in the classroom are weak, which surprises newcomers to the school who are unaware of the secret supplementing.

This is exactly how our private prek-8th school is. We’re on the west coast so it’s not just a dmv thing. We have test-in gifted private schools as well as some very difficult to access private HSs. Families join our school and then complain about the academics after 1-2 years.

There’s an entire culture of secret supplementing to ensure that your kid will either do well enough on standardized tests to get into gifted private school or competitive 5/6-12 schools, or to ensure that your kid will get one of the 3-4 (or less) slots that our school typically maxes out at at each of the selective private HSs. That also requires getting into the top math track for 6th grade.

Some people will move away or switch as early as 3rd or 4th grade when they realize their cohort has too many smart kids or sports recruits of their kid’s gender.

Anyway, through “no” RSVPs for parties, cancelled outings, missed scout meetings, and failed carpools, plus chatty kids, I realized that 75-80% of kids my in kid’s grade do private tutors, RSM, mathnasium, Kumon, etc. There’s even a not-so-secret market of summer teacher tutoring that parents pass from one to the other, with the end result that one clique of parents always magically has access to our school’s teachers for private tutoring at home.

To me this pretty wild because my children's teachers are thoroughly average and not people I would hire for tutoring to get my children ahead. They are competent enough during the school year but never differentiate for the smart kids and are too focused on the slow kids.

It’s a big thing for reading for summers before grades K-2 and for math for grades 2-5. What I’ve seen happen is that kids who the teachers have worked with get out in the “advanced” groups for those topics in the next year, and because the teachers know the kids well, they consistently make sure the kids are placed with the “good” teacher the next year.

I think it confers the greatest advantage to parents whose kids wouldn’t be in the high reading group or advanced math track based on the previous year, but who are close. The teachers tutor exactly to the next year’s curriculum and also give familiar kids the benefit of the doubt when leveling conversations happen.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If kids are ranked, even informally, nobody wants to share resources. And if rankings are real and affect outcomes further down the line, then people are much more hush hush about it.

Also, there is the phenomenon where a school gets a reputation for being "good" because of high test scores, but it is all because of the work that parents do on the side. The academics in the classroom are weak, which surprises newcomers to the school who are unaware of the secret supplementing.

This is exactly how our private prek-8th school is. We’re on the west coast so it’s not just a dmv thing. We have test-in gifted private schools as well as some very difficult to access private HSs. Families join our school and then complain about the academics after 1-2 years.

There’s an entire culture of secret supplementing to ensure that your kid will either do well enough on standardized tests to get into gifted private school or competitive 5/6-12 schools, or to ensure that your kid will get one of the 3-4 (or less) slots that our school typically maxes out at at each of the selective private HSs. That also requires getting into the top math track for 6th grade.

Some people will move away or switch as early as 3rd or 4th grade when they realize their cohort has too many smart kids or sports recruits of their kid’s gender.

Anyway, through “no” RSVPs for parties, cancelled outings, missed scout meetings, and failed carpools, plus chatty kids, I realized that 75-80% of kids my in kid’s grade do private tutors, RSM, mathnasium, Kumon, etc. There’s even a not-so-secret market of summer teacher tutoring that parents pass from one to the other, with the end result that one clique of parents always magically has access to our school’s teachers for private tutoring at home.

To me this pretty wild because my children's teachers are thoroughly average and not people I would hire for tutoring to get my children ahead. They are competent enough during the school year but never differentiate for the smart kids and are too focused on the slow kids.

It’s a big thing for reading for summers before grades K-2 and for math for grades 2-5. What I’ve seen happen is that kids who the teachers have worked with get out in the “advanced” groups for those topics in the next year, and because the teachers know the kids well, they consistently make sure the kids are placed with the “good” teacher the next year.

I think it confers the greatest advantage to parents whose kids wouldn’t be in the high reading group or advanced math track based on the previous year, but who are close. The teachers tutor exactly to the next year’s curriculum and also give familiar kids the benefit of the doubt when leveling conversations happen.

Wow, that sounds like a very toxic school environment. I'm sorry you had to navigate that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If kids are ranked, even informally, nobody wants to share resources. And if rankings are real and affect outcomes further down the line, then people are much more hush hush about it.

Also, there is the phenomenon where a school gets a reputation for being "good" because of high test scores, but it is all because of the work that parents do on the side. The academics in the classroom are weak, which surprises newcomers to the school who are unaware of the secret supplementing.

This is exactly how our private prek-8th school is. We’re on the west coast so it’s not just a dmv thing. We have test-in gifted private schools as well as some very difficult to access private HSs. Families join our school and then complain about the academics after 1-2 years.

There’s an entire culture of secret supplementing to ensure that your kid will either do well enough on standardized tests to get into gifted private school or competitive 5/6-12 schools, or to ensure that your kid will get one of the 3-4 (or less) slots that our school typically maxes out at at each of the selective private HSs. That also requires getting into the top math track for 6th grade.

Some people will move away or switch as early as 3rd or 4th grade when they realize their cohort has too many smart kids or sports recruits of their kid’s gender.

Anyway, through “no” RSVPs for parties, cancelled outings, missed scout meetings, and failed carpools, plus chatty kids, I realized that 75-80% of kids my in kid’s grade do private tutors, RSM, mathnasium, Kumon, etc. There’s even a not-so-secret market of summer teacher tutoring that parents pass from one to the other, with the end result that one clique of parents always magically has access to our school’s teachers for private tutoring at home.

To me this pretty wild because my children's teachers are thoroughly average and not people I would hire for tutoring to get my children ahead. They are competent enough during the school year but never differentiate for the smart kids and are too focused on the slow kids.

It’s a big thing for reading for summers before grades K-2 and for math for grades 2-5. What I’ve seen happen is that kids who the teachers have worked with get out in the “advanced” groups for those topics in the next year, and because the teachers know the kids well, they consistently make sure the kids are placed with the “good” teacher the next year.

I think it confers the greatest advantage to parents whose kids wouldn’t be in the high reading group or advanced math track based on the previous year, but who are close. The teachers tutor exactly to the next year’s curriculum and also give familiar kids the benefit of the doubt when leveling conversations happen.

Wow, that sounds like a very toxic school environment. I'm sorry you had to navigate that.

The school has its positives so we’re trying to stay out of the rest of it and just run our own race. It’s a private school and the publics near us are absolutely cutthroat so it could be worse. We’re slightly sheltered from the most competitive parenting in our area- which includes plenty of crazy nnat/cogat/tutoring/hi-cap drama.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I thought the stereotype was that "old money" people had to make their academic achievement appear effortless and that "trying to hard" was declasse.

Who the F are these old money people and why would anyone care ? Who even uses that term anymore?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None. My kids are above grade level and in advanced programming at school. If I heard your kid had a tutor I would assume it is because they are behind.

The problem is not all schools have advanced programming. The outside supplementing is because some families want more from their school, academically, but can't get it. It's easy to scoff at people in this situation and tell them to change schools, but that's not always an option.

Our schools offer pretty much everything, they are top notch schools. The only ones who use tutors are kids who are behind or having difficulties. My son had a tutor to help finish his homework. The school allowed the tutor to come into the high school during my son’s free time 3 days a week and use space there so when the school day was over he was done.

Some of my friends had their kids use a tutor together to make it more fun. Most had difficulty with math. If people hid this I think it’s weird.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’ve never seen someone keep it a secret- almost everyone I know (and I talk to a lot of parents) has their kid do some kind of academic enrichment or tutoring. It’s just part of the culture here combined with the fact that everyone is looking to accelerate their kids (chapter books in kindergarten, algebra in 6th grade, DE classes in high school). No matter how smart your child is they can’t do that without a lot of outside help.

The more interesting question is why are we in such a rush (my eldest was taking math classes in HS that my engineer brother was taking in his Junior year of college). We’re all locked in a weird arms race.

No we aren’t. Those are some poorly educated parents if they think that pushing chapter books on 5 year olds makes any difference long term. Pushing math faster than necessary will guarantee that the slow but steady smart kids who followed the guidelines will be much more proficient than the ones who sped through the necessary basics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve never seen someone keep it a secret- almost everyone I know (and I talk to a lot of parents) has their kid do some kind of academic enrichment or tutoring. It’s just part of the culture here combined with the fact that everyone is looking to accelerate their kids (chapter books in kindergarten, algebra in 6th grade, DE classes in high school). No matter how smart your child is they can’t do that without a lot of outside help.

The more interesting question is why are we in such a rush (my eldest was taking math classes in HS that my engineer brother was taking in his Junior year of college). We’re all locked in a weird arms race.

No we aren’t. Those are some poorly educated parents if they think that pushing chapter books on 5 year olds makes any difference long term. Pushing math faster than necessary will guarantee that the slow but steady smart kids who followed the guidelines will be much more proficient than the ones who sped through the necessary basics.

Smart kids will become behavior cases in "slow and steady" classes.

[Anonymous]

My oldest has gotten tutoring on and off since 3rd, now she is in 8th. She has an auditory processing disorder and ADHD (well controlled). I am going to put a pause on math tutor until it gets close to testing.

She is taking Math 1 ( freshman math in my state) and I've found enough resources on IXL and Khan Academy to help her myself.

I bought both of my kids IXL workbooks and I've bought Kumon workbooks also. Those are the best math workbooks I've found and I've bought several of them.

I'm also a public school teacher and I agree with the PP that is a teacher-not enough emphasis on memorization, vocabulary, etc. Basically those drill and kill skills that kids really need to be able to absorb and learn the tougher material.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve never seen someone keep it a secret- almost everyone I know (and I talk to a lot of parents) has their kid do some kind of academic enrichment or tutoring. It’s just part of the culture here combined with the fact that everyone is looking to accelerate their kids (chapter books in kindergarten, algebra in 6th grade, DE classes in high school). No matter how smart your child is they can’t do that without a lot of outside help.

The more interesting question is why are we in such a rush (my eldest was taking math classes in HS that my engineer brother was taking in his Junior year of college). We’re all locked in a weird arms race.

No we aren’t. Those are some poorly educated parents if they think that pushing chapter books on 5 year olds makes any difference long term. Pushing math faster than necessary will guarantee that the slow but steady smart kids who followed the guidelines will be much more proficient than the ones who sped through the necessary basics.

Smart kids will become behavior cases in "slow and steady" classes.

Children either have behavior problems or they don’t. Smart kids don’t exhibit bad behavior unless they have a behavior issue. Parent claim their kids are bored but that very small amount of super smart kids know how to use their time wisely.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None. My kids are above grade level and in advanced programming at school. If I heard your kid had a tutor I would assume it is because they are behind.

The problem is not all schools have advanced programming. The outside supplementing is because some families want more from their school, academically, but can't get it. It's easy to scoff at people in this situation and tell them to change schools, but that's not always an option.

Our schools offer pretty much everything, they are top notch schools. The only ones who use tutors are kids who are behind or having difficulties. My son had a tutor to help finish his homework. The school allowed the tutor to come into the high school during my son’s free time 3 days a week and use space there so when the school day was over he was done.

Some of my friends had their kids use a tutor together to make it more fun. Most had difficulty with math. If people hid this I think it’s weird.

That's nice dear but that's not what the thread is about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve never seen someone keep it a secret- almost everyone I know (and I talk to a lot of parents) has their kid do some kind of academic enrichment or tutoring. It’s just part of the culture here combined with the fact that everyone is looking to accelerate their kids (chapter books in kindergarten, algebra in 6th grade, DE classes in high school). No matter how smart your child is they can’t do that without a lot of outside help.

The more interesting question is why are we in such a rush (my eldest was taking math classes in HS that my engineer brother was taking in his Junior year of college). We’re all locked in a weird arms race.

No we aren’t. Those are some poorly educated parents if they think that pushing chapter books on 5 year olds makes any difference long term. Pushing math faster than necessary will guarantee that the slow but steady smart kids who followed the guidelines will be much more proficient than the ones who sped through the necessary basics.

Some kids enjoy learning and why wouldn't you stimulate them. You sound lazy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve never seen someone keep it a secret- almost everyone I know (and I talk to a lot of parents) has their kid do some kind of academic enrichment or tutoring. It’s just part of the culture here combined with the fact that everyone is looking to accelerate their kids (chapter books in kindergarten, algebra in 6th grade, DE classes in high school). No matter how smart your child is they can’t do that without a lot of outside help.

The more interesting question is why are we in such a rush (my eldest was taking math classes in HS that my engineer brother was taking in his Junior year of college). We’re all locked in a weird arms race.

No we aren’t. Those are some poorly educated parents if they think that pushing chapter books on 5 year olds makes any difference long term. Pushing math faster than necessary will guarantee that the slow but steady smart kids who followed the guidelines will be much more proficient than the ones who sped through the necessary basics.

Smart kids will become behavior cases in "slow and steady" classes.

Children either have behavior problems or they don’t. Smart kids don’t exhibit bad behavior unless they have a behavior issue. Parent claim their kids are bored but that very small amount of super smart kids know how to use their time wisely.

If they use their time wisely and get their work done, yes, they are bored. They have to sit there and wait till the other kids are done.