Harvard slashing PhD programs + layoffs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Focus on training US citizens and giving rural and city kids a chance. The US imports way too much foreign talent.

I agree in theory, but the US K-12 STEM curriculum is sh*t in most places. It is really hard/too late to correct for a poor foundation once the students are at the college and post-grad level, when you are talking about cutting edge research. That’s how you end up with school like Harvard having to add remedial math courses like pre-calculus to get some of their admits up to speed.

It’s not either/or. We need to get our students better trained and we need to continue to attract the best from other countries. It’s what makes us powerful.

That will never happen in a million years. You need solid family support for this kind of education which is lacking in US. Most students are dealing with non-academic stuff. The only option to get high achieveing American students are to have more naturalized Americans from Asian countries. Their kids (Asian-Americans) are killing it here.

Yep.
To be fair, Asian-American kids are dealing with plenty of non-academic stuff too. But the parents and extended family all prioritize and highly value education. It’s not about being a tiger mom, it’s just about priorities. Also these parents pay for their kids’ education so there is ideally no debt - then the kids pay for their kids’ education. It’s just values and priorities.

The cuts to science, engineering, and medicine are already destroying America as we know it….. but that is the plan of this administration, so i guess they are winning. Those who think otherwise just have no ability to see a bit into the future or are so self-focused and not personally affected yet but they will be soon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Focus on training US citizens and giving rural and city kids a chance. The US imports way too much foreign talent.

I agree in theory, but the US K-12 STEM curriculum is sh*t in most places. It is really hard/too late to correct for a poor foundation once the students are at the college and post-grad level, when you are talking about cutting edge research. That’s how you end up with school like Harvard having to add remedial math courses like pre-calculus to get some of their admits up to speed.

It’s not either/or. We need to get our students better trained and we need to continue to attract the best from other countries. It’s what makes us powerful.

That will never happen in a million years. You need solid family support for this kind of education which is lacking in US. Most students are dealing with non-academic stuff. The only option to get high achieveing American students are to have more naturalized Americans from Asian countries. Their kids (Asian-Americans) are killing it here.

Yep.
To be fair, Asian-American kids are dealing with plenty of non-academic stuff too. But the parents and extended family all prioritize and highly value education. It’s not about being a tiger mom, it’s just about priorities. Also these parents pay for their kids’ education so there is ideally no debt - then the kids pay for their kids’ education. It’s just values and priorities.

The cuts to science, engineering, and medicine are already destroying America as we know it….. but that is the plan of this administration, so i guess they are winning. Those who think otherwise just have no ability to see a bit into the future or are so self-focused and not personally affected yet but they will be soon.

The issue isn't that there aren't qualified Americans, it's that they're going into consulting, investment banking, MBA programs and other easier and more lucrative fields instead of getting science PhDs.

When Americans complain there aren't jobs, they dont mean that they want to work in the fields picking food. That's why we have temporary visa programs for immigrants to help come harvest. It's not that different in science. There had been (prior to the Trump funding cuts) spots for every qualified American who wanted to enter a science PhD program. But we need additional labor, as doing science is a lot of work, so foreign talent is welcomed too. That's how America has stayed a leader in science.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Focus on training US citizens and giving rural and city kids a chance. The US imports way too much foreign talent.

I agree in theory, but the US K-12 STEM curriculum is sh*t in most places. It is really hard/too late to correct for a poor foundation once the students are at the college and post-grad level, when you are talking about cutting edge research. That’s how you end up with school like Harvard having to add remedial math courses like pre-calculus to get some of their admits up to speed.

It’s not either/or. We need to get our students better trained and we need to continue to attract the best from other countries. It’s what makes us powerful.

That will never happen in a million years. You need solid family support for this kind of education which is lacking in US. Most students are dealing with non-academic stuff. The only option to get high achieveing American students are to have more naturalized Americans from Asian countries. Their kids (Asian-Americans) are killing it here.

Asian-Americans are good at regurgitating overly prepped info. It is the culture. Good or bad.
But you need creative minds for ground-breaking research. Look at the demographics of pretty much all the great inventors. You'll see what I mean.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Focus on training US citizens and giving rural and city kids a chance. The US imports way too much foreign talent.

I agree in theory, but the US K-12 STEM curriculum is sh*t in most places. It is really hard/too late to correct for a poor foundation once the students are at the college and post-grad level, when you are talking about cutting edge research. That’s how you end up with school like Harvard having to add remedial math courses like pre-calculus to get some of their admits up to speed.

It’s not either/or. We need to get our students better trained and we need to continue to attract the best from other countries. It’s what makes us powerful.

That will never happen in a million years. You need solid family support for this kind of education which is lacking in US. Most students are dealing with non-academic stuff. The only option to get high achieveing American students are to have more naturalized Americans from Asian countries. Their kids (Asian-Americans) are killing it here.

Asian-Americans are good at regurgitating overly prepped info. It is the culture. Good or bad.
But you need creative minds for ground-breaking research. Look at the demographics of pretty much all the great inventors. You'll see what I mean.

This will change in the next decade or so. There will be more and more Asian inventors. The founder of Nvdia is Taiwanese origin. Scale AI's founder is Asian American.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Focus on training US citizens and giving rural and city kids a chance. The US imports way too much foreign talent.

I agree in theory, but the US K-12 STEM curriculum is sh*t in most places. It is really hard/too late to correct for a poor foundation once the students are at the college and post-grad level, when you are talking about cutting edge research. That’s how you end up with school like Harvard having to add remedial math courses like pre-calculus to get some of their admits up to speed.

It’s not either/or. We need to get our students better trained and we need to continue to attract the best from other countries. It’s what makes us powerful.

That will never happen in a million years. You need solid family support for this kind of education which is lacking in US. Most students are dealing with non-academic stuff. The only option to get high achieveing American students are to have more naturalized Americans from Asian countries. Their kids (Asian-Americans) are killing it here.

Asian-Americans are good at regurgitating overly prepped info. It is the culture. Good or bad.
But you need creative minds for ground-breaking research. Look at the demographics of pretty much all the great inventors. You'll see what I mean.

This will change in the next decade or so. There will be more and more Asian inventors. The founder of Nvdia is Taiwanese origin. Scale AI's founder is Asian American.

Actually most of the unicorn founders are Asian Americans these days. It’ll be like a tsunami destroying the fragile ego of white supremacists.

[Anonymous]

Harvard’s class of 2029 is now 41% Asian. Everyone needs to think long and hard about the implications here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Harvard’s class of 2029 is now 41% Asian. Everyone needs to think long and hard about the implications here.

Implications? Smart group of students who study diligently, score well, and don't waste time getting into trouble.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Focus on training US citizens and giving rural and city kids a chance. The US imports way too much foreign talent.

I agree in theory, but the US K-12 STEM curriculum is sh*t in most places. It is really hard/too late to correct for a poor foundation once the students are at the college and post-grad level, when you are talking about cutting edge research. That’s how you end up with school like Harvard having to add remedial math courses like pre-calculus to get some of their admits up to speed.

It’s not either/or. We need to get our students better trained and we need to continue to attract the best from other countries. It’s what makes us powerful.

That will never happen in a million years. You need solid family support for this kind of education which is lacking in US. Most students are dealing with non-academic stuff. The only option to get high achieveing American students are to have more naturalized Americans from Asian countries. Their kids (Asian-Americans) are killing it here.

Asian-Americans are good at regurgitating overly prepped info. It is the culture. Good or bad.
But you need creative minds for ground-breaking research. Look at the demographics of pretty much all the great inventors. You'll see what I mean.

Asian and Jewish?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Agree a’ righting of the ship’ was needed in many universities. But we do need to be careful to cultivate our capabilities in research, etc.

Honestly, I am more worried about American students coming out of HS and if they can compete with our watered down math and science in education.

This right here. +1

A more judicious approach to government sponsored research and support at the university level was long overdue. Yes, we absolutely should support fundamental research, but there's been a lot of bloat and questionable spending --funded by our taxes-- that needs to be trimmed.

Agree with the comment on HS education, very concerned. Students are far worse prepared for college and grade inflation is a big part of the problem that must be addressed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hardly. Tell that to Edison and Ford.

You mean inventors during a time when women and minorities were not legally allowed to have the same education?!?!

[Anonymous]

If you’re concerned about bloat, there was a measured approach that could have been taken to reduce the percentage of admin costs covered by the feds. That isn’t what happened. Research funds have been indiscriminately slashed and by a lot. This has had a generational impact on American science and killed many worthwhile projects that were underway. Not just at Harvard. Trumps goal wasn’t reducing bloat. It was killing institutions of higher education.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you’re concerned about bloat, there was a measured approach that could have been taken to reduce the percentage of admin costs covered by the feds. That isn’t what happened. Research funds have been indiscriminately slashed and by a lot. This has had a generational impact on American science and killed many worthwhile projects that were underway. Not just at Harvard. Trumps goal wasn’t reducing bloat. It was killing institutions of higher education.

Overhead rates on grants are negotiated between the institution and the government. The institution doesn't just get to pick. The US government has agreed to these rates. There are statues and regs about how this is to be done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid was planning to apply to SEAS at Harvard…. This just sucks

SEAS is not affected by this cut.

Per the article OP shared, the Phd admission cuts are in the Arts & Humanities dept and the Science dept.
SEAS is a different department within Harvard FAS.

Nor does it affect undergraduate SEAS admissions.

SEAS is part of School of Arts and Sciences. It is amazing how people spread shit information like this without knowing anything.

Yes, SEAS is part of SAS. But PP was correct that the PhD admissions cuts are not in SEAS. The cuts in SEAS are admin/staff; very different things.

Read carefully.

[Anonymous]

Research funds have been slashed.
MD residency positions still awaiting expansion.
Grant programs decimated.
Investment in green energy killed.
Healthcare on the brink.
Government shutdown

Soo much greatness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One third to 50% of phD students are international. Most of the phD cuts are in very small departments. Even with the cuts, American students will likely have the same chances as in prior years, due to all programs cutting internationals most. They will not go abroad because phD is not funded abroad. That is why so many come here! Our funding is much better than overseas phD programs.
Top internationals will continue to get in. Harvard and the rest of the top 20-30 phd programs in STEM will continue to have the same quality of students they have always had--the pool is deep. Lower ranked schools will suffer.
Additionally, the SEAS cuts are admin cuts, not phd-student cuts. SEAS phd remain a priority for top schools.

You're just wrong. These were deep cuts that are hurting American science and American students. Many PhD programs aren't able to accept students right now because their funding was slashed. And many foreign students come with their own funding from their home country, so these cuts are hurting American students the most.

This makes no sense.

If you're low on funding, you'll take an international with their own funding over a better home student that you can no longer afford.

Not true.

Our top-tier university funds all of our PhD students, regardless if they are domestic or international. International students typically cost us as much and often more (due to visa support and the fact that they're ineligible for many US gov't based fellowships and grants).