Antisemitism vs anticatholicism

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's ridiculous to even compare, OP. My maternal family is very Catholic and I really don't think there's anti-Catholicism discrimination in western countries (US and Europe).

In the West, I feel it's Islam that is by far the most heavily discriminated against. It's normalized so you don't even realize it, which is a terrible thing. Hardly anyone talks about it, unless someone's on the news for stabbing or raping Muslims (which has happened in our area).

Anti-Semitism exists too, of course, but at least there are many extremely influential Jewish people and organizations to speak out against it.

Your blanket statement that there’s no discrimination against Catholics in US or Europe is laughably ridiculous. Sure, over time things have gotten better — much better, maybe — but this country has a history of blatant discrimination against Catholics in general and immigrants from largely Catholic countries in particular. Just ask the Irish for starters.

Interestingly I just watched the Ed Sullivan documentary on Netflix. The empathy that he felt for black performers— and his dedication to getting them airtime — was rooted in the experience of his parents as Irish immigrants.

Are you one of those people who thinks that there’s no longer discrimination against blacks in our country since we once elected Obama? Because that’s how you come across.

Plus many Catholic communities immigrated because of anti-Catholic discrimination in their prior countries.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t hate Catholics for who they are. I hate Catholics that are seeking to shove their beliefs down my throat and force me to live their strange version of reproductive morality under penalty of law, all while seeking to avoid accountability for the worst child sex abuse scandal in the history of the planet.

I don’t hate Jews for they are. I hate the Jews that support the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians and have co-opted my government to pay for it.

See the difference? I hate them not for what they are, but what they do. As a former Catholic married to a Jew, I’m pretty good at separating the “who” from the “what.” Love the believer, hate the belief-driven action. You’re not a victim because someone wants to hold you accountable for the reprehensible things you do that hurt other people. And saying you are just loses all sympathy any one might have had for you.

And how are you deciding which Catholics and which Jews hold the beliefs and take the actions that you find objectionable? And when you post about your concerns, do you just say Jews and Catholics or do you say "people who are trying to force a brand of morality on me that I disagree with" and "people who support ethnic cleansing" and "people who support pedophiles" -- or do you use broad categorical terms not narrowed to those actions you object to?

DP and these are all great questions.

I’m Catholic. This PP says she’s pretty good at separating the who from the what.

Upon meeting me, how’s she going to do that? How will she size me up to determine if she should hate me or not?

(And the fact I won’t hate her back either way… does that impact her at all?)

NP. It comes down to what you do. Do you actively participate in those activities or support organizations/institutions that do? There's a big difference between, say, believing that abortion is wrong versus advocating for forced births against a woman's choice. There's also a big difference between holding Catholic religious beliefs versus being part of, and financial supporters to, the Roman Catholic Church.

And how do you know which is which? You want to believe you are not being a bigot, but you are. Not all members of a religion believe and support the things you also object to. It's not very different from being a US citizen who does not support the policies of the current administration.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Anti Catholism easy
Amy Comey Barret, Brett Kavanaugh, John Roberts.....
Child Sexual abusers still protected by the church.

So it's OK to be anti people who are Catholic who don't agree with any of the above?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Antisemitism is not just about religious belief.

Bingo. Jews are despised for being Jewish, not because they are religious.

No. We despise Zionism.

Zionism is code for Jews.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hhmm, could it be the millennia of discrimination endured by Jews? Maybe the 6 million gassed and shot? What a dumb question.

Look, we can all agree that there is no singular event in Western history as horrific as the Nazis and their crimes against the Jews. That doesn’t give anyone a free pass to Catholic bash though.

No religious group should be discriminated against, but anti-Catholicism and antisemitism are two completely different beasts.

By the way, not to nitpick but slavery was pretty horrific too.

Yea you’re not being nitpicky. I hear what you’re saying. Probably best not to rank. I mean, one could argue that the British committed genocide against Irish Catholics and led to the starvation deaths of millions in the potato famine. Would that come in third place?

Pretty much everything the British Empire did was horrible and swept under the rug.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Antisemitism is not just about religious belief.

Bingo. Jews are despised for being Jewish, not because they are religious.

No. We despise Zionism.

Zionism is code for Jews.

No, it's not. Zionism is the minority of American Jews who still support Israel.

Zionism is also Christians who have nothing but violence in their hearts, for the sake of their messianic mythological prophecy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Being Jewish isn't necessarily about DNA. It's a religion AND a people AND a culture AND a shared history...

A Jewish person can stop practicing Judaism and still be Jewish in those other ways. It's an identity that pre-dates the silo-ing of religion and nationality and other factors, which makes it more difficult to understand today. It also makes antisemitism "work" on multiple levels, so people can hate Jews because of our religion or because of our ethnicity or because of our culture, and any of those reasons by themselves are antisemitism.

A lot of it is about DNA. My mother did one of those 23 and Me things and hers came back “100% Ashkenazi Jew.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Antisemitism is not just about religious belief.

Bingo. Jews are despised for being Jewish, not because they are religious.

No. We despise Zionism.

Zionism is code for Jews.

You really don't know what Zionism is?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Synagogues are vandalized far more often than Catholic churches. There were more than twice as many attacks on synagogues than Catholic Churches in 2023 even though the Catholic population is 10 times larger than the Jewish population.

https://faithbased-isao.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/Analsyis-and-Review-of-Attacks-on-Houses-of-Worship-in-2023.pdf

So that means that anticatholicism should be minimized?

Why are you bothering with this fake equivalency? A person is not born Catholic. Catholic is not something a DNA test will reveal. Jewish and Catholic are not the same kind of thing at all. You can stop being Catholic simply by deciding to go to a different church. One cannot stop being Jewish, regardless of religious practice or belief.

That's not true. Once you are baptized in the Catholic Church, you are Catholic forever.

That sounds like something Catholics are taught, but former Catholics don’t believe any more.

I'm a non-practicing Catholic and I accept this as a fact.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's ridiculous to even compare, OP. My maternal family is very Catholic and I really don't think there's anti-Catholicism discrimination in western countries (US and Europe).

In the West, I feel it's Islam that is by far the most heavily discriminated against. It's normalized so you don't even realize it, which is a terrible thing. Hardly anyone talks about it, unless someone's on the news for stabbing or raping Muslims (which has happened in our area).

Anti-Semitism exists too, of course, but at least there are many extremely influential Jewish people and organizations to speak out against it.

Your blanket statement that there’s no discrimination against Catholics in US or Europe is laughably ridiculous. Sure, over time things have gotten better — much better, maybe — but this country has a history of blatant discrimination against Catholics in general and immigrants from largely Catholic countries in particular. Just ask the Irish for starters.

Interestingly I just watched the Ed Sullivan documentary on Netflix. The empathy that he felt for black performers— and his dedication to getting them airtime — was rooted in the experience of his parents as Irish immigrants.

Are you one of those people who thinks that there’s no longer discrimination against blacks in our country since we once elected Obama? Because that’s how you come across.

Plus many Catholic communities immigrated because of anti-Catholic discrimination in their prior countries.

MAGA catholics do not remember that fact of immigration because of anti catholic discrimination in their prior countries or when they got here how they were treated.

The Catholic church starting schools in America was smart very smart. Kept the indoctrination going on a large scale.

Now MAGA Catholics is a big portion of MAGA, and SCOTUS is a common denominator spewing hate against anyone not ...... When they come for me they will come for thee..... MAGA Catholics' cult of stupidity.

Catholics also still support the church over the child abuse, which is disgusting.

Op's ? Anti Catholic vs Anti Semitism.

There is no comparison.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Antisemitism is not just about religious belief.

Bingo. Jews are despised for being Jewish, not because they are religious.

No. We despise Zionism.

Zionism is code for Jews.

No, it's not. Zionism is the minority of American Jews who still support Israel.

Zionism is also Christians who have nothing but violence in their hearts, for the sake of their messianic mythological prophecy.

I assure you that the vast majority of American Jews are still Zionists -- they (we) believe that the State of Israel should exist. However, most American Jews also believe Israel is committing war crimes in Gaza and that Netanyahu is a bad leader of Israel.

Zionism doesn't mean "bad thing that I don't like" or "favors the extermination of Palestinians," though obviously, and I think horrifyingly, some Jewish Zionists do support that. There's a very broad range of political beliefs that fit under the term. Which is why I, as a longtime critic of the occupation and of Israeli government policies, still bristle at seeing people talk about how much they hate Zionists.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Antisemitism is not just about religious belief.

Bingo. Jews are despised for being Jewish, not because they are religious.

No. We despise Zionism.

Zionism is code for Jews.

No, it's not. Zionism is the minority of American Jews who still support Israel.

Zionism is also Christians who have nothing but violence in their hearts, for the sake of their messianic mythological prophecy.

Zionism is still the majority view of most American Jews. I think you're misunderstanding what Zionism is. One can (and many do) support the existence of the State of Israel and the right of its citizens to live in peace without supporting Bibi's administration or the specifics of the way his government is handling the war in Gaza (or settlements in the West Bank). Much like how I can be a patriotic American without supporting Trump or the Republican majority's policies. This really shouldn't be that hard to understand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Antisemitism is not just about religious belief.

Bingo. Jews are despised for being Jewish, not because they are religious.

No. We despise Zionism.

Zionism is code for Jews.

No, it's not. Zionism is the minority of American Jews who still support Israel.

Zionism is also Christians who have nothing but violence in their hearts, for the sake of their messianic mythological prophecy.

Zionism is still the majority view of most American Jews. I think you're misunderstanding what Zionism is. One can (and many do) support the existence of the State of Israel and the right of its citizens to live in peace without supporting Bibi's administration or the specifics of the way his government is handling the war in Gaza (or settlements in the West Bank). Much like how I can be a patriotic American without supporting Trump or the Republican majority's policies. This really shouldn't be that hard to understand.

1000% this

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Antisemitism is not just about religious belief.

Bingo. Jews are despised for being Jewish, not because they are religious.

No. We despise Zionism.

Zionism is code for Jews.

No, it's not. Zionism is the minority of American Jews who still support Israel.

Zionism is also Christians who have nothing but violence in their hearts, for the sake of their messianic mythological prophecy.

Zionism is still the majority view of most American Jews. I think you're misunderstanding what Zionism is. One can (and many do) support the existence of the State of Israel and the right of its citizens to live in peace without supporting Bibi's administration or the specifics of the way his government is handling the war in Gaza (or settlements in the West Bank). Much like how I can be a patriotic American without supporting Trump or the Republican majority's policies. This really shouldn't be that hard to understand.

You're confused. Zionism is not simply that "State of Israel should exist." In particular, it is that the state of Israel should specifically exist as a Jewish state, creating and maintaining a nation-state built on privileging one ethnic and religious identity above others. Zionism inherently limits religious freedom and equality for all citizens. Non-Jewish populations, particularly Palestinians, are relegated to a second tier of citizenship, facing structural barriers in areas such as land ownership, immigration rights, political representation, and access to resources.

Believing Israel should exist as nation-state with religious, ethnic, and racial freedom, and civil rights promoting equality, is contradictory to Zionism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Antisemitism is not just about religious belief.

Bingo. Jews are despised for being Jewish, not because they are religious.

No. We despise Zionism.

Zionism is code for Jews.

No, it's not. Zionism is the minority of American Jews who still support Israel.

Zionism is also Christians who have nothing but violence in their hearts, for the sake of their messianic mythological prophecy.

Zionism is still the majority view of most American Jews. I think you're misunderstanding what Zionism is. One can (and many do) support the existence of the State of Israel and the right of its citizens to live in peace without supporting Bibi's administration or the specifics of the way his government is handling the war in Gaza (or settlements in the West Bank). Much like how I can be a patriotic American without supporting Trump or the Republican majority's policies. This really shouldn't be that hard to understand.

I agree with this.