Familiarity with a disruptive kid in the classroom (FCPS) - what to do?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In our ES, one class per grade (out of 5) is deemed “the inclusion class.” Although the school does not advertise it, you can request your child NOT be put in this class. Which we have done every year since a horrific kindergarten experience.

I actually fought to take my kid out if special Ed. in order for him not to be in the inclusion class. It was awful. He didn't get any attention or help with reading because the special Ed teacher and aide had to spend all their time on behavior issues. There were 4 kids who needed to be in a classroom with one special Ed teacher and 2 aides and maybe 10 kids max. They just couldn't function in a class of 24. What happened to special Ed classes where kids spent the majority of the day in them? And when they were ready they were gradually included? There should be a class like that that is k-2, 3-4, 5-6 on every elementary campus.

PP here. We also have a self-contained K-2 class and 3-5 class. But those are only for severe special needs - autism, etc. The severe ADHD kids are still put in the inclusion class. SN parents have been brainwashed by activists to think self-contained is to be avoided at all costs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, all of the speculation about the other child doesn't solve your problem. Here is how to solve your problem.

You immediately schedule an appointment with the Principal. At the meeting you tell the Principal that 1) your child feels unsafe and in danger on a daily basis, 2) your child is not able to learn because she is feeling unsafe and constantly on edge because she is concerned about being hurt or that another outburst will occur, and 3) your child needs a placement that provides her with the same gifted services but removed from the danger. It will help your case immeasurably if you document several instances that were particularly egregious and describe the negative impact on your child.

You should encourage other parents to go in and argue the same points. If enough voices are raised then the other child will be moved to a placement better suited to his needs. Until then the school system is content to let the situation occur. If there is not a major change in a week then you escalate.

In other words, right now the other child's parents are being the squeaky wheel. You need to out-squeak them.

In other words, you are advising OP to lie. The original post said "It has come to our attention that my child's classroom has a gifted child with social issues...Apparently this has been doing on since the beginning of the year but we just learned of it." Hard to believe it is having such an adverse impact on OP's child when nothing had been mentioned until now.

There is no liar here except you. You've conveniently left out the 2nd sentence. Here is OP's full 1st paragraph. I've highlighted the relevant sentences since you seem to have reading comprehension issues.

It has come to our attention that my child's classroom has a gifted child with social issues. He will attack other kids, throw desks and disrupt the classroom. Apparently this has been doing on since the beginning of the year but we just learned of it. We have asked our kid to tell us when these incidents happen and what they are. It happens as infrequently as once a week and as frequently as three times a week. When an incident happens they clear everyone else from the classroom and they sit in the hallway until the kid can be calmed down. No one can touch the kid and a counselor and principal are brought in.

Tell the truth, PP. Always. Shame on you for not telling the truth.

How does adding back in any of that change the fact that the parent just found out about this. Her kid can't be that traumatized if she never mentioned it before now! Therefore how can it be said the kid feels unsafe on a daily basis and is unable to learn?

Sure, go ahead and complain, and document. But do it honestly.

DP. Oh, come on. You are being truly awful here. I was sexually assaulted as a child, but was too scared to tell anyone for a very long time. Are you going to tell me too that I didn't feel unsafe and wasn't traumatized because I didn't tell anyone? Is that really your take on kids?

Are you actually comparing the behavior of a dysregulated child to that of an adult child molester/predator. Get help. Stop projecting.

I was repeatedly sexually assaulted by a fellow student, not an adult. I went to school every day regardless. I told no adult because I was terrified. Your insistence that a child who doesn't talk about trauma at school isn't traumatized is horrific. You are truly an awful person.

Again get help. I am not an awful person and I think people need to be stop throwing around the trauma drama. It is trivializes true trauma victims. There are adults in the room tasked with protecting these kids. Nothing is happening behind closed doors in secret. You might not like how it is being addressed but it is being addressed.

New poster here - and yes, you are truly awful. YOU need to get help. How DARE you tell someone their trauma of repeated sexual assault is nothing but unnecessary "drama"?? I am astounded by how obtuse you are about the original post (the PP is right, just because the kid didn't start talking about it until now doesn't mean they weren't being affected by it - Are you truly that stupid?), and how horrible you are to downplay someone else's childhood sexual assaults. You SUCK

I would be offended by your comments if you weren’t so obviously simple minded, emotionally challenged and fragile. Get a grip and read the post again. No one downplayed sex assault. I said stop equating the trauma experienced by a victim of sex assault to that of a child who wotnesss another child in a meltdown. One has nothing to do with the other and the poster who brought it in to the picture has unresolved issues. That attitude is why kids with SN are discriminated against. There are degrees of everything so you get a grip too. And maybe take a course in general reading comp.

DP. It's people with attitudes like yours who cause special needs kids to be discriminated against. The fact that you think people should accept their child being subjected to violent behavior on a regular basis as normal creates resentment towards special needs kids. There has to be a line where inclusion in a regular classroom is denied. I think that line is when there is continuous violent outbursts that threaten the safety of other children. Your dismissal of the legitimate concerns about physical safety of the other students as "trauma drama" can create overall resentment towards inclusion classrooms if parents feel that even their kids' physically safety is trivialize and disregarded. You're not helping special needs kids with your dismissive attitude and attacks on other posters.

Why waste your time In here. I am merely one person who thinks you are misguided. Put the word out. I here the Voices if Fairfax/Great Falls are looking for a new cause. Maybe you could start a lobby to change Federal law.

Which federal law says that violent kids must be kept in an inclusion classroom?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Welcome to my [teacher] world. It’s all over LCPS also.

FCPS teacher here. It's all over everywhere.

"Twice exceptional" often means that parents are not willing to admit that their child has limitations. Thus, they would rather 24 other kids sit in the hall just so that their kid stay in the AAP program.

They also have hopes that William & Mary and law school will be in the kid's future.

Reality says no.

Wow- and this is why we moved my 2e dyslexic kiddo into a private school for kids with dyslexia. Her teacher’s lack of training and low expectations had caused her a clinical level of anxiety. So at least once a week she would burst into tears at school because her teacher or classmates were taunting her for her poor spelling or reading. She would go to the nurse to recover because we couldn’t get an IEP for her dyslexia because her grades were too high. They wouldn’t even evaluate her for learning disabilities. The teacher told us she must be emotionally disabled to cry so often.

Now she is reading above grade level and planning to go to law school. With her grades and test scores I have no doubt she will be very successful.

We were fortunate we could afford the education our child needed. But what happens to the other kids who aren’t getting the supports they need. These stories make me ill because that could have been our child if we hadn’t pursued private evaluations and services.

And we did have to choose between suing the school or paying for services as most parents do. So nobody is holding the administrators accountable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It has come to our attention that my child's classroom has a gifted child with social issues. He will attack other kids, throw desks and disrupt the classroom. Apparently this has been doing on since the beginning of the year but we just learned of it. We have asked our kid to tell us when these incidents happen and what they are. It happens as infrequently as once a week and as frequently as three times a week. When an incident happens they clear everyone else from the classroom and they sit in the hallway until the kid can be calmed down. No one can touch the kid and a counselor and principal are brought in.

I started talking to some friends in other FCPS and apparently this is more of the norm than what I would believe or even thought. I know I am coming off as insensitive and I am not the parent of this kid with issues -- but 25 other kids are suffering in their education. How is this fair for the teacher to have these kinds of disruptions on such a regular basis. And, what is my recourse if this kid hurts my kid since apparently he almost hit another kid with a chair (but missed) in one of these outbursts. He has pulled a kids hair and shoved another.

This is a result of activism. The disruptive kid can not be removed from the classroom. That is considered "exclusion." Teachers can only use positive methods of discipline.
Sometimes, these kids have serious disabilities that lead to this behavior, but must be mainstreamed. He's probably labeled "twice-exceptional."

I taught years ago. There have always been kids who behaved like this--although, there appear to be more now. There is also a difference in a "discipline" problem and a kid with special needs. Some kids are just troublemakers because they are spoiled or neglected. Others cannot seem to help it and the parents, too, are likely desperate.
But, these parents have no understanding of what this disruption does to others. It's the death of common sense. Kids like that need to be placed elsewhere if this happens regularly.

So much ignorance here. I don't believe that you taught in schools, because then you would know the problem is lack of funding for appropriate training of staff and also lack of more appropriate placements. No parent is ok with their kid having multiple violent meltdowns that require a classroom to be cleared out. That parent is desperately fighting for their child to receive appropriate services that can actually effectively address the issues at play. But those services take money and schools are working with a finite pot.

OP, your child deserves to be comfortable and safe, as does every child in that class, including the child who is acting out. When a child in the class has unmet needs that lead to interruptions and dangers for everyone, all the parents are on the same side. It's "insensitive" to speak about the other child as if he is a problem that needs to be removed. It is not insensitive to go to the principal and express concern about that child and your child's safety and how these disruptions are affecting them. Sometimes other parents speaking up are the push principals need to get additional help or make changes.

Of course, for privacy reasons the school will not be able to tell you anything about the other child: what they are trying, what the issue is, etc. They likely will not even be able to confirm which child it is. But that's ok, you don't need that information. Just let them know that you are aware and concerned about it.

Tell that to the parents of the kids shot dead by the Parkland shooter. This was a kid who acted out for years in the classroom and the school system did nothing.

The parkland shooter went to at least one alternative school. I guess they aren’t magic cures.

The school stopped all services for the Parkland shooter the year his mom died. They were criminally negligent.

[Anonymous]

The school stopped all services for the Parkland shooter the year his mom died. They were criminally negligent.

Cruz was already 18. I think with all the red flags he had given, that it is the sheriff's dept that was criminally negligent. He was pretty much done with school. Of course, the school system was limited by federal laws, as well.

[Anonymous]

Make no mistake. My kid does that too. I have school alert me and I go right over and get his little butt out. Public school should not be a right. It’s a privilege and it’s for everyone. Until parents like me stand up and say NO, this isn’t right, it will continue to happen. Don’t let this happen. Call your school board member because all that is not helpful for anyone. Poor kid is struggling. Pardon me for mine but I’m on him!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In our ES, one class per grade (out of 5) is deemed “the inclusion class.” Although the school does not advertise it, you can request your child NOT be put in this class. Which we have done every year since a horrific kindergarten experience.

I actually fought to take my kid out if special Ed. in order for him not to be in the inclusion class. It was awful. He didn't get any attention or help with reading because the special Ed teacher and aide had to spend all their time on behavior issues. There were 4 kids who needed to be in a classroom with one special Ed teacher and 2 aides and maybe 10 kids max. They just couldn't function in a class of 24. What happened to special Ed classes where kids spent the majority of the day in them? And when they were ready they were gradually included? There should be a class like that that is k-2, 3-4, 5-6 on every elementary campus.

We had to fight too and remove our IEP for our child to get out of that class. We might be at the same school. We entered and needed and IEP and weren't told we'd be put in the special education classroom when the issues were not ones that required it nor did my child get any extra help in the classroom or IEP followed. There was one child very aggressive toward mine who got physical with mine every morning. Teachers claimed it was a hug but my child was clear that the hug was not welcome and it scarring my child into not wanting to go to school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It has come to our attention that my child's classroom has a gifted child with social issues. He will attack other kids, throw desks and disrupt the classroom. Apparently this has been doing on since the beginning of the year but we just learned of it. We have asked our kid to tell us when these incidents happen and what they are. It happens as infrequently as once a week and as frequently as three times a week. When an incident happens they clear everyone else from the classroom and they sit in the hallway until the kid can be calmed down. No one can touch the kid and a counselor and principal are brought in.

I started talking to some friends in other FCPS and apparently this is more of the norm than what I would believe or even thought. I know I am coming off as insensitive and I am not the parent of this kid with issues -- but 25 other kids are suffering in their education. How is this fair for the teacher to have these kinds of disruptions on such a regular basis. And, what is my recourse if this kid hurts my kid since apparently he almost hit another kid with a chair (but missed) in one of these outbursts. He has pulled a kids hair and shoved another.

This is a result of activism. The disruptive kid can not be removed from the classroom. That is considered "exclusion." Teachers can only use positive methods of discipline.
Sometimes, these kids have serious disabilities that lead to this behavior, but must be mainstreamed. He's probably labeled "twice-exceptional."

I taught years ago. There have always been kids who behaved like this--although, there appear to be more now. There is also a difference in a "discipline" problem and a kid with special needs. Some kids are just troublemakers because they are spoiled or neglected. Others cannot seem to help it and the parents, too, are likely desperate.
But, these parents have no understanding of what this disruption does to others. It's the death of common sense. Kids like that need to be placed elsewhere if this happens regularly.

So much ignorance here. I don't believe that you taught in schools, because then you would know the problem is lack of funding for appropriate training of staff and also lack of more appropriate placements. No parent is ok with their kid having multiple violent meltdowns that require a classroom to be cleared out. That parent is desperately fighting for their child to receive appropriate services that can actually effectively address the issues at play. But those services take money and schools are working with a finite pot.

OP, your child deserves to be comfortable and safe, as does every child in that class, including the child who is acting out. When a child in the class has unmet needs that lead to interruptions and dangers for everyone, all the parents are on the same side. It's "insensitive" to speak about the other child as if he is a problem that needs to be removed. It is not insensitive to go to the principal and express concern about that child and your child's safety and how these disruptions are affecting them. Sometimes other parents speaking up are the push principals need to get additional help or make changes.

Of course, for privacy reasons the school will not be able to tell you anything about the other child: what they are trying, what the issue is, etc. They likely will not even be able to confirm which child it is. But that's ok, you don't need that information. Just let them know that you are aware and concerned about it.

Tell that to the parents of the kids shot dead by the Parkland shooter. This was a kid who acted out for years in the classroom and the school system did nothing.

The parkland shooter went to at least one alternative school. I guess they aren’t magic cures.

The school stopped all services for the Parkland shooter the year his mom died. They were criminally negligent.

Those schools, if you've ever visited are holding cells till the kids age out. They don't really have good teachers or mental health services and not all parents do outside help.

[Anonymous]

Extreme inclusionists who think it's OK for classrooms to be evacuated 3-4 times/week will be death of public education. Between specials and transition time and recess, kids don't have THAT much time for core instruction. Inclusion is very important, where appropriate. Sometimes there may be gray areas where a judgment call is appropriate. But there is no gray in what OP is reporting. If that kid can get his behavioral issues to the point that the class is evacuating once, maybe twice a week, OK. But there has to be limit on this. Inclusion at the expense of 27 other kids is preposterous.

[Anonymous]

What's the difference between 2 vs 3 times a week? That seems pretty random.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

The school stopped all services for the Parkland shooter the year his mom died. They were criminally negligent.

Cruz was already 18. I think with all the red flags he had given, that it is the sheriff's dept that was criminally negligent. He was pretty much done with school. Of course, the school system was limited by federal laws, as well.

No- with his profile if he had a living and involved parent the school should have provided services to prepare him for employment until he aged out at 21. They wanted him to go away and drove him into a crisis that killed other kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The school stopped all services for the Parkland shooter the year his mom died. They were criminally negligent.

Cruz was already 18. I think with all the red flags he had given, that it is the sheriff's dept that was criminally negligent. He was pretty much done with school. Of course, the school system was limited by federal laws, as well.

No- with his profile if he had a living and involved parent the school should have provided services to prepare him for employment until he aged out at 21. They wanted him to go away and drove him into a crisis that killed other kids.

Do you even hear yourself?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

The school stopped all services for the Parkland shooter the year his mom died. They were criminally negligent.

Cruz was already 18. I think with all the red flags he had given, that it is the sheriff's dept that was criminally negligent. He was pretty much done with school. Of course, the school system was limited by federal laws, as well.

No- with his profile if he had a living and involved parent the school should have provided services to prepare him for employment until he aged out at 21. They wanted him to go away and drove him into a crisis that killed other kids.

No way. This was a kid with extreme mental illness at a young age. He was killing animals at a young age. The school did not drive him into a crisis. This was a troubled
mentally ill kid at a young age.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Extreme inclusionists who think it's OK for classrooms to be evacuated 3-4 times/week will be death of public education. Between specials and transition time and recess, kids don't have THAT much time for core instruction. Inclusion is very important, where appropriate. Sometimes there may be gray areas where a judgment call is appropriate. But there is no gray in what OP is reporting. If that kid can get his behavioral issues to the point that the class is evacuating once, maybe twice a week, OK. But there has to be limit on this. Inclusion at the expense of 27 other kids is preposterous.

Best post on the thread. Evacuating a classroom for unregulated behavior maybe once or twice a year is understandable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Extreme inclusionists who think it's OK for classrooms to be evacuated 3-4 times/week will be death of public education. Between specials and transition time and recess, kids don't have THAT much time for core instruction. Inclusion is very important, where appropriate. Sometimes there may be gray areas where a judgment call is appropriate. But there is no gray in what OP is reporting. If that kid can get his behavioral issues to the point that the class is evacuating once, maybe twice a week, OK. But there has to be limit on this. Inclusion at the expense of 27 other kids is preposterous.

Best post on the thread. Evacuating a classroom for unregulated behavior maybe once or twice a year is understandable.

And, the question is--how long are the kids sitting in the hall. I doubt seriously that this is a matter of five or ten minutes. If the kid is that enraged, it likely takes some time for him to calm down. And, the teacher certainly does not want to take her kids back into the classroom to just have to walk out again.

This is emotionally disturbing to the teacher, too. Even the best teachers will have a tough time walking back in the classroom and picking up where they left off. It disrupts the schedule and the projects and learning in the classroom. Remember when your two year old threw temper tantrums? Were you always cool, calm, and collected?