Forum Index
»
Infertility Support and Discussion
Sound of a Newborn's Cry
![[Post New]](/jforum/templates/default/images/icon_minipost_new.gif){kind=icon}
Anonymous
| Seriously, infertility is hard enough....and this post is pretty brutal and I imagine hurtful to more than one poster. It seems to me that it would be best to put this to rest and go back to being supportive on posts. |
Anonymous
|
I am surprised at how many people were so offended by the first PP's response. The OP is clearly very sensitive and in a really hard place, but she said herself she was two aisles away. My first reaction was oh, poor OP (sincerely, not sarcastically). But my second reaction was, thirty minutes? Really? I'm sure it seemed like that long, but we all know that a crying baby can make minutes seem like hours! And if the baby was really shrieking as if in pain and severe distress, and the OP believed the mother wasn't doing anything, wouldn't she try to find the baby just to make sure the baby hadn't been abandoned or something? I would have, if I actually thought that a distressed baby was being *that* ignored. I guess the OP could have done this, but her original post didn't sound like that -- it made it sound like she just heard it for 30 minutes and assumed the mom wasn't helping because the crying didn't stop.
I have a really easy baby, but she still screamed her head off at Barnes and Noble for ten minutes (or what felt like ten minutes) the other day, while I tried to figure out what was wrong with her. I thought she was hungry (she wasn't), I thought she needed to be strolled/rocked to sleep (she didn't), I thought she was too hot so I took off her sweater and her hat (didn't help), I thought she just wanted to be held (nope). Finally I realized she must be wet (even though I had JUST changed her), so I took her immediately to the restroom -- a trip that required strapping her back in her stroller (another 30 seconds of wailing) and wheeling her as fast as I could across the store (another minute of crying). Someone like OP could have stood two aisles away and had no idea that I was trying whatever I could think of and doing the best I could. I was talking to her and trying to soothe her, but she was MUCH louder than I was so a bystander wouldn't have necessarily known what I was doing. I have nothing but empathy for the OP's plight, but her original post did make it sound (to me, and obviously to a couple of other posters) that she might have overreacted and assumed just a little. Seriously, if you heard a baby screaming in distress for 30 minutes, wouldn't you check on the baby (and maybe even say something to the mother)? |
Anonymous
|
Yikes, this thread has gotten a little mean. I feel for the OP. I personally, without judging ANYONE'S parenting, cannot stand listening to the newborns cry. Breaks my heart, could never work in the L&D at the hospital, Iwould be like a lunatic.
That being said, I understand how I must have looked to other parents over the years. When I was too preggers to pick up my first DD and had to sit on the curb outside the grocery while she threw a fit in the rain. HORRIBLE. If that didn't look social services, nothing did. My DD was screaming like she was being stabbed to death. I have had countless moments that not only looked awful but WERE awful. Sometimes it was what needed to happen. Sometimes I had no more energy to do "the best mom thing." So, I think the OP may be a little extra sensitive and I think the mom SHOULD have picked up that screaming baby, but I have definitely learned that we never really know what is going on... |
Anonymous
The cry of a newborn is distinct and I have had enough exposure to newborns to recognize the sound of a very young baby through volunteer and charitable work where I am often around babies..at Childrens Hospital and also organizing support groups for moms with babies. Moerover, I have a child myself. I know that little resolution was provided because the woman was in the same section for nearly 30 minutes with a newborn that did not stop shrieking. Oh give me a break and stop making it about you or me or any other mom's feelings of being judged. It is another attempt to get the focus off what is the best and most appropriate reaction to that crying newborn, or on a larger issue, what is best for all newborns. I do focus on my own family. But so what does that mean? I shouldn't be concerned about other people's children if they might be mistreated? If every person did what you advise me to do, neglected and even abused children should be disregarded and noone should draw attention to them. What a lovely world that would be eh? |
Anonymous
OP here..No I absolutely did not go and check on that baby. Because I have been in situations like this before where I saw a shrieking newborn crying for a while and it upsets me too much emotionally to see parents neglecting their babies like that. Once I did more than just check on the baby, I actually commented to the mother who was ignoring her newborn (yes it was a newborn). I merely said, "Ohhhh, she doesn't seem too happy today!" The moms answer upset me too much because it showed either ignorance or an utter lack of concern. I have realized that there are neglectful parents out there. But we know that newborns need the most attentive caregiver as it promotes healthy growth- healthy neurological growth, emotional and psychological growth, and even physical growth. Newborns need to to held alot, they need to be cuddled, their cries should be answered promptly. And if they have special needs or reflux or sensory issues, they need to be soothed even more. |
Anonymous
Op here. Yes I am very likely more sensitive than most parents. But I have seen the effect of newborns that are neglected. A child who is promptly soothed and attended to learns to self soothe eventually. She is more emotionally stable. She has an internal calm because her needs have essentially been met. This will, of course, be less true if the child is truly special needs. In these cases, they still need lots of soothing and guidance but they will take longer to learn self soothing skills and a much longer time to be emotionally stable. In some extreme special needs cases they will not learn to self soothe, however. There is a fantastic child psychiatrist named Dr. Stanley Greenspan. When my child was very young, he was so high maintenance I was certain he was autistic. I sought the advice of Dr. Greenspan. I had read several of his unbelievable books which teach parents how to calm, soothe, and raise children with various issues. His books are also a wonderful support for parents who simply want to know how to raise neurotypical children too though. As it turns out, my child was not autistic at all, just strong-willed with very mild sensory issues! But I was taught by his books and by him that a newborn and a baby and even a young child needs the most attentive parents. When I did volunteer work later I saw the effect of neglectful parenting - angry, frustrated children who were aggressive and took their aggression out on their parents or other children, children who lose their temper more frequently, and for longer periods of time, children who can not self soothe because they never learned what it felt like to be cuddled or have their needs attended to quickly or their cries responded to promptly. Parents seem to think that by letting a newborn cry, aren't they in effect teaching their child to self soothe? The opposite is true actually. The American Academy of Pediatrics has now stated that they do not advise parents to ignore the cries of a newborn. I have a pediatrician and a child psychiatrist in my own family who confirm what I learned from Dr. Greenspan. So it makes some moms feel badly about themselves. I'm sorry. But forget about your feelings. It's not about you or me or any other moms feelings. Its just about doing what is best for your baby. And I understand that some moms just don't have the energy to respond to their baby immediately. But then you shouldn't have the energy to shop in housewares for 30 minutes either. |
Anonymous
| OK, OP, you win. You are hereby declared Top Mother of the Eastern Seaboard and Official Expert on Child Development -- the rest of us parents are mere pretenders at best, if not potentially and/or currently abusive. We kneel in awe of your superior knowledge of all children, whatever their age or stage. We also acknowledge your diagnostic sixth sense, not to mention your x-ray vision and telepathy. We all wish we could be as compassionate as you are. |
Anonymous
|
OP - take a look at the volumes you've posted here. Clearly you've got some issues that could use a more professional outlet to address. And clearly, nothing anyone else says to you is going to convince you that your outrage over what you perceived to be the neglect of a newborn - without any actual evidence of such neglect, other than what you describe as your expertise on infant crying - might possibly be misplaced. So I won't try. Feel free to go about the world convinced that your reading of infant care books and parenting of one individual child has given you superior knowledge to every other mother of every crying child out there. What a life that must be, for you and for your family.
Two final questions: if you were so upset by what you witnessed (or didn't witness but heard, based on what you've written), why didn't you get someone in authority or contact child services? And if this is not related to your own angst about your infertility issues, why are you posting to the TTC board? |
Anonymous
| One of the things I have appreciated about this discussion board vs some of the others on DCUM is that people try to live (or, more precisely, post) according to the kindergarten rule "if you don't have something nice (or helpful) to say, don't say anything at all". How about we try to get back to that? OP, I wish you luck if you continue to TTC for number 2. I am going through infertility treatments for the first time and have so much respect for people who can go through this more than once!!! As for having trouble hearing newborn's cry, I wish I could give you some advice -- I can't see newborns at all without wanting to stab my eyes out from the pain of infertility. |
Anonymous
|
What do you mean, "take a look at the volumes that OP has posted," as a refleciton of "issues that need professional help?" The woman is just trying to defend herself and provide even more information for those of you who are too dense to recognize a most unfortunate situation when you see/ read/ hear about one.
Why are you all so sensitive about this? Does it make YOU feel judged in some way? And what, exactly, is wrong with OP judging this situation, anyway? If the facts are as she describes, and even if only as she describes, then this is exactly the kind of thing that we should be commenting on, discussing, and even confronting the offending party (that mother in the store). I'll never understand the irony of people who say that "it takes a village" to raise a child, as long as that doesn't mean criticism of any kind. |
Anonymous
Skip the sarcasm and, instead, argue without it if you can. I would venture you can not so you must resort to sarcasm. Would you call every child psychologist that writes a parenting book "Top Parent of the Year"? Would you use the same sarcasm to Dr. Stanley Greenspan's face, though he is a renowned psychiatrist? Would you call every pediatrician or the American Academy of Pediatrics "Top Advisers of the Year." The reason you must resort to silly sarcasm is because you're right, I won. I have shown you that some mothers do need to be more attentive to their newborns. Okay, it is offensive to you. Get over it. Because there's something of greater importance at stake here - our newborns are our future children and our children are our future citizens of our community. |
Anonymous
Before you begin to write, try to first accept that you might actually be wrong in your opinion. You have to open up your mind to fight fair. But when you fight fair, the truth prevails, even if it makes some people 'feel bad.' AGain, another attempt to get off the subject of whether that poor newborn was treated properly and whether that mom reacted properly. Because I am so saddened by the way some mothers treat their newborns that means I need a psychiatrist? Or is the truth really that SOME mothers should just be more attentive to their newborns? Which do you think is closer to the real truth? I think we all know what the real truth is. But because it makes you feel bad about yourself, you have to shoot the messenger. I'm paraphrasing what I've read in child psychiatry books. What do I need to do, get Dr. Greenspan or another renowned psychiatrist to come to your house to talk to you personally? Actually, I have contacted CPS in several incidents. One incident where there was a clear cut case of abuse - a child being abused in the bathroom of a public establishment. The police attended to that situation. I have contacted CPS when I saw a mom man-handle a 3 year old child because she snatched a toy away from her 2 year old. In this case, there was crying, not a clear cut case of physical abuse. I said very clearly it was neglect. Nelgect that rises to the level of CPS intervention is a different matter and I did not see that situation here. I posted to the TTC board because I truly wonder what makes moms want to have children, only to ignore them so much once they are actually born. Is it to be able to say they gave birth? To be able to say "I have two or three kids"? Is it because that's the 'thing' to do? Because it makes them feel more like a woman? There are those of us who are desperate to have children because we want to love and be completely attentive to them. Life isn't fair. Infertility isn't fair. But I still want other women who are lucky enough to have newborns to be completely attentive to them because I am concerned about their welfare. |
Anonymous
I love children. If I could have 7 kids I would! Regardless of whether we can have biological kids I intend to also adopt. Because of my love for kids I probably am more sensitive than many. But I never feel pain when I see other people's kids; quite the opposite, actually. But I totally understand your pain and, who knows, next year you might be sitting there typing away in DCUM with a sleeping baby in your arms! |
Anonymous
|
OP, back to your original question for a moment. I think the question "what makes women want to have babies only to ignore them once they are born" is an interesting one, whether or not it applies to this situation.
I, like you, could never, ever stand to have my newborn cry hysterically for any period of time. Being in a public place would make me even more aware, and I, like you, would do whatever I had to do (including leaving store) to soothe him/ her. I know I'm going to get God-forbid JUDGED for saying this, but it would have been interesting if you'd had a peek at the mom in question here to even guess what was going through her mind. Was she young, like a teen-mom, or older? Any guess on socio-economic class? And before everyone gets high and mighty and writes in horror that I would even say that matters... stop and think. Of course it does. And it also may help answer your question of why she even had a baby in the first place, and thought it was OK to ignore the cries. |
Anonymous
|
Okay, this thread has gotten a little weird. OP, you are very passionate about your feelings and I applaud that. You are clearly attentive AND have done the homework to know what newborns need. Your many MANY posts, though, are making me wonder...you just seem, ummm, very wound up and a bit manic.
I hate listening to babies cry (WHO like it?!?!?!), and I am not even sure what the disagreements are about anymore, but certainly we can agree that not every mother who lets their baby cry is a bad mother. And not every person who thinks the crying is bad is correct in their assumptions. There is (almost) always more to the picture, isn't there? |