Harvard study about downside of redshirting

[Anonymous]

You really shouldn't judge other parents choices here. You child may be perfectly fine going to kindergarten when she is 5. Mine was not. It isn't a race, after all.

Not judging your choice based on YOUR child - if he really was having trouble, you did what was best for him. Just like my parents felt I would have been bored in kindergarten and had me tested to go straight into 1st grade. You do what is right for YOUR child.

I just think people are looking at this trend (like the 11 year old vs. 13 year old athletics comment) and deciding to do it because it is "what everyone else is doing" or some such nonsense. The reason there are 13 year olds where 11 year olds should be is BECAUSE of this trend...

[Anonymous]

To the two PPs, you are exactly expressing my concern. I am seeing kids 17 months or so older than my child. it is amazing to see these much larger and older kids being bored and boisterous in the class room because their parents felt they could use the self-esteem.

I was struck by this passage in the cited article:

"When you give kids a little bit more time to develop, they find the tasks associated with school developmentally more appropriate, and so they are more successful with them than they would otherwise be," Mr. Davison said. "People in the world who feel good about themselves are more effective adults, and more effective adults have higher income."


Are you kidding me? of course they find the tasks easier. they are 7 year olds learning letters in Kindergarten. This is the codification of the demise of education in our society, when parents don't think having their children challenged in school is a good thing. When 3 year olds around the world are reading and our kids are finger painting at the same age, it is troubling.

[Anonymous]

I agree, PP. I have no doubt that this is what some children need, but when it becomes a "trend," as it is now, it's just lowering the bar on our kids.

[Anonymous]

OMG, lowering the bar? What are you talking about? All the kids still go to kindergarten. And there is no reason for three year olds to read. In fact, studies have found that pushing children to read too early robs them of the building blocks they need for later learning.

I'm just troubled by how everyone here is sniffing with superiority about how their kids are perfectly ready for kindergarten at age 5 and those kids are being held back because their parents don't want them challenged and they are trying to game the system and it is really hurting MY CHILD.

nonsense. Some kids are ready, some aren't. My son taught himself how to read around his 4th birthday (taught himself -- as I said it is not a good idea to teach kids this young how to read.). but had I sent him to kindergarten when he was 5 he would have had no friends, been miserable, and been set up for failure. He was 6 when he started and he is absolutely flourishing. And he isn't dumbing down your kids, promise.

Codification of the demise of education? Puleazzzze.

[Anonymous]

To the PP, tell it to the Chinese and Indians.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OMG, lowering the bar? What are you talking about? All the kids still go to kindergarten. And there is no reason for three year olds to read. In fact, studies have found that pushing children to read too early robs them of the building blocks they need for later learning.

I'm just troubled by how everyone here is sniffing with superiority about how their kids are perfectly ready for kindergarten at age 5 and those kids are being held back because their parents don't want them challenged and they are trying to game the system and it is really hurting MY CHILD.

nonsense. Some kids are ready, some aren't. My son taught himself how to read around his 4th birthday (taught himself -- as I said it is not a good idea to teach kids this young how to read.). but had I sent him to kindergarten when he was 5 he would have had no friends, been miserable, and been set up for failure. He was 6 when he started and he is absolutely flourishing. And he isn't dumbing down your kids, promise.

Codification of the demise of education? Puleazzzze.

Please provide a source for this? which building blocks are missing?
In terms of the reference to hurting other kids, I think there is a real chance of physical harm, in a soccer game, for instance...

[Anonymous]

Let's face it. Some kids are smarter than others. Some kids are better socialized than others. And some very privileged moms will always try to compensate for their not-so-smart or anti-social kids.

Having said that, holding them back a year will not change a darn thing twenty years from now. You think you're doing your child a huge favor, but he knows that he's been held back a year and is larger and not as smart as the younger kids around him.

Flame away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Let's face it. Some kids are smarter than others. Some kids are better socialized than others. And some very privileged moms will always try to compensate for their not-so-smart or anti-social kids.

Having said that, holding them back a year will not change a darn thing twenty years from now. You think you're doing your child a huge favor, but he knows that he's been held back a year and is larger and not as smart as the younger kids around him.

Flame away.

I agree- but in support of NOT redshirting- that is just not right- unless your child had developmental issues, there is no good reason to hold someone back- i hvae heard from preschools that "that's what's done" so they tend to recommend this- but can we just stop this trend? It only helps kids to be bigger than classmates- can help with sports but overall- are we trying to encourage this? so what if our boy is the smallest since he;s actually 5 in K? next thing you know the kids will be 7 by the time they go to K..

[Anonymous]

PP here. My son (the redshirted one who was socially behind) will never think he is less smart than the other children. He would not have thought that if we had pushed him into kindergarten before he was ready. He has always been more advanced academically than his classmates -- in preschool and beyond. None of you have any idea what it is like to have a child who is socially behind the other children. You don't know what it is like to have your child teased and ignored. You have no idea how it affects learning.

And while he is one of the oldest kids in his class, he is still one of the smallest. Trust me, he won't
hurt your precious darlings on the soccer field.

I'm done with this thread. If you guys see 6 year olds as threats to western civilization and can't recognize that some of us have had to make very difficult decisions but have always done what is best for our child, well, you are just being mean.

[Anonymous]

Dear PP, I am sorry people cannot be civil in an anonymous forum. It's like people in cars in traffic -- they demonstrate no accountability since they'll never see the people they cut off or raise the middle finger to again.

My neice is being "redshirted" in NYC. She'll be six in August, but will be repeating kindegarten. She did public kindegarten, and now she's going to a great private school (one of the crazy difficult ones to get into) but was asked to go in as a kindegartener.

I look at my sister's decision as pragmatic. Yes, she would have preferred first grade for her daughter. But that is not what they offered, and she looked at the 13 years of great schooling my neice would get at that school. It's just not practical in this private school environment to talk about people redshirting. The rules at the schools have changed, and parents have little say in the matter.

[Anonymous]

For children with delayed social skills....why not try a social skills group for kids? I used to run those (I'm a child psychologist) before I had kids. They are a great way to help kids out in those areas without having to delay a year of school when everything else is there.

[Anonymous]

PP -- the suggestion to make use of a social skills group is a really good one. Our DC would definitely have benefited from such a group, but ironically, we were not aware of that need until he was already in K. In preschool, there was a lot more parallel play and our child's social delays were not as apparent. We knew he had them but did not really know the extent of his difficulties (which were compounded by language delays) until a bit later. So the "red shirting" decision had already been made before we were fully clued in the situation. (BTW, we did not red shirt but were fortunate to have a November birthday that kind of did it for us.)

[Anonymous]

There were 20 some odd pages of discussion on this topic on another thread and it seems to me that both sides are pretty well dug in their positions. I haven't seen my child's education impaired in any way by the presence of kids who are older and/or bigger and/or more mature, but if I did, I'd address the specific problem with my child's teachers and school administrators. In the abstract, though, I'm prepared to believe that most parents who redshirt do so because they genuinely believe it is their child's best interest, and I am in no position to argue with another child's parents about what is best for him or her. Making blanket accusations about parents' motives and hyping the "threats" of an older child hurting someone on the soccer field (the last thread was replete with fears of future statutory rapists) is unfair and ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

Wow, I missed that entire thread and my life was better for it. What is fascinating to me is how often the posters attribute some form of competitiveness to the parents who held their children back, but they reveal that they are the competitive ones with their vitriol, threats and whiffs of superiority.

I also wonder how many of the anti-redshirters are parents of onlies. I think one thing that happens when you have more than one child is that you realize that your stereotypes of "children" are often wrong -- based on your own small sample -- and that raising children requires some complexities that you just don't have when you only have to decide for one. I mean, all children are different and require different calls by their parents and I am trying to figure out why so many posters here don't get that and are so judgmental of other parents' decisions.

[Anonymous]

This may have been said earlier--if so, apologies. I have no problem with individual kids being held back if that is what their parents/teachers deem best. The problem comes when enough people do it to essentially turn it into the de facto norm. There is an "arms race" sort of situation--i.e., people think "Well, X and Y were held back so my child will be small and young in comparison, so we'd better hold him/her back," etc., etc. Already many private schools have a de facto cut-off date of June 1 (some, such as Green Acres, make it official). Our son, who was not redshirted, has an early winter birthday (very early Dec.). Before he started school I was sure he would be one of the oldest--after all, with a Sept. 1 cutoff, he logically should have been among roughly the oldest quarter of kids. Well, not even close! He is smack in the middle of the age spectrum because of all the summer birthday kids being held back. I find that shocking. I agree with the PPs that it is a slippery slope--after all, *someone* has to be the youngest/smallest in the class. The line must be drawn before the norm becomes 6 for kindergarten.