Just figured I'd share because it might benefit lots of folks here...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Everyone has all APs, so stand out by not having all APs and doing something else?

That might be fine for the selective schools, but like a pp said, for the most selectives, you should probably aim for the APs and the interesting experience.

Have the APs necessary for your major/area and go above and beyond in your area. Easier for humanities than STEM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Everyone has all APs, so stand out by not having all APs and doing something else?

That might be fine for the selective schools, but like a pp said, for the most selectives, you should probably aim for the APs and the interesting experience.

lol This is so dcum. Their snowflakes are not competitive, so they disparage the competitive ones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. Any college admissions officer would say that the kid who stands out at elite colleges is the one who took AP Chem while at the same time taking doing the independent music thing.

This actually isn't true. In most cases, the kid who stands out is the one with a unique story. Right now, a lot of kids have the same (overachieving, overtaxed) story.

but hasn't this been true for 10 years now? this is what they call the spike. this is why kids start fake NFPs or write AI-generated self published books on amazon. makes them sound deep into a passion! and colleges were falling for the NFPs for a while - and the books now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. Any college admissions officer would say that the kid who stands out at elite colleges is the one who took AP Chem while at the same time taking doing the independent music thing.

This actually isn't true. In most cases, the kid who stands out is the one with a unique story. Right now, a lot of kids have the same (overachieving, overtaxed) story.

but hasn't this been true for 10 years now? this is what they call the spike. this is why kids start fake NFPs or write AI-generated self published books on amazon. makes them sound deep into a passion! and colleges were falling for the NFPs for a while - and the books now.

Yes, but the point (I think) is, don't actually do all the other STEM AP stuff if you are deep into colonial women's history. Do the minimal amount of necessary and then do buckets and buckets of extra on the colonial history front? So yes its a spike, but showing initiative to double up on history electives could help and you don't need AP physics...Honors might be enough?

There's a guy on FB (private counselor) who has a whole thing that goes through why this is a better strategy and shows "passion" and drive. And helps not make you look like a bot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Meh. Any college admissions officer would say that the kid who stands out at elite colleges is the one who took AP Chem while at the same time taking doing the independent music thing.

This actually isn't true. In most cases, the kid who stands out is the one with a unique story. Right now, a lot of kids have the same (overachieving, overtaxed) story.

but hasn't this been true for 10 years now? this is what they call the spike. this is why kids start fake NFPs or write AI-generated self published books on amazon. makes them sound deep into a passion! and colleges were falling for the NFPs for a while - and the books now.

Yes, but the point (I think) is, don't actually do all the other STEM AP stuff if you are deep into colonial women's history. Do the minimal amount of necessary and then do buckets and buckets of extra on the colonial history front? So yes its a spike, but showing initiative to double up on history electives could help and you don't need AP physics...Honors might be enough?

There's a guy on FB (private counselor) who has a whole thing that goes through why this is a better strategy and shows "passion" and drive. And helps not make you look like a bot.

Don't know if this is actually true? Or at least not across the board. A former T10 AO (from another thread here) on Reddit said the below this week:

"She seems to think that prioritizing rigor is aligned mostly with major interests, at least in the videos I've seen.

That's not right. We value rigor across the board, no matter major preferences. Our pools are so competitive that I've gotten accustomed, as have other AOs, to seeing the most rigorous curriculum in all subjects. A humanities kid still challenging themselves with calculus or above. A STEM kid taking AP Lit.

There is no AO that gives a shit about passion projects. We don't even use that term in the admissions office. This passion project idea is just born out of the college consulting industry, with consultants who are trying to sell that this is a golden ticket. And it's smart, I suppose, because they take advantage of an incredibly opaque process with students that don't know any better. But when I was reading files, when I was in committees, I can assure you, most students did not have a passion project, and if a student did, barely any mention of it came up in the discussion of the student's admissibility.

Wrt a central theme in the entire, this is a bit more nuanced. You can have one, but it's not necessary. A lot of people push this because they think it's easier for an AO to identify what's special about a student, so they then can pitch the student much more easily in committee. This works for some students, doesn't work for others. The way we select students is simply looking for the strongest in the pool relative to others. So you can have a great "theme" to your app, but the kid that has no theme, that is more dynamic, has the pieces we're looking for as far as priorities and has strong essays that demonstrate who they are without trying to string everything together coherently can STILL get in. And in fact, they do at higher quantities than someone who is trying to weave a "theme" throughout the app."

https://www.reddit.com/r/ApplyingToCollege/comments/1lxo48y/comment/n39q77w/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Everyone has all APs, so stand out by not having all APs and doing something else?

That might be fine for the selective schools, but like a pp said, for the most selectives, you should probably aim for the APs and the interesting experience.

You would not get rated at our private for “most rigorous” by the HS college counselor if you don’t have the APs/honors of others. You are compared against kids from your own HS. Period

[Anonymous]

Maybe the nuance to the above is that the AO wants rigor across the board in core subjects…but just taking AP Psych or Human Geography doesn’t really matter vs say participating in music for all four years (if your school has that during the day).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the nuance to the above is that the AO wants rigor across the board in core subjects…but just taking AP Psych or Human Geography doesn’t really matter vs say participating in music for all four years (if your school has that during the day).

Maybe, but I think some schools might be so desperate for true history majors that sabotaging your own STEM education helps by demonstrating that you’re not a crypto premed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just had a long coffee meetup with a private college counselor who has been doing this for many years (since the late 1990s). I know her from my neighborhood but also wanted to talk to her professionally as my DS is a rising sophomore. For context, my kid is a good student but not an academic superstar (as in, does not take all APs and does not have all As); sporty but not on par to be recruited by a college; and very talented at visual arts. I actually don't think we'll work together because she lives nearby, and to be honest not sure it's even in my budget to work with anybody, but she did level with me about what she's seeing in an objective, kind-neighbor way and I thought it might help some other folks here. If it helps, I am on the East Coast but no longer in DC.

Right now, top schools are inundated with many kids who all look the same on paper. All APs. High GPAs. Top SAT scores. Club sports. Check whichever box you like. These applicants are virtually indistinguishable from one another. It's like, in her words, "picking rabbits out of a hat" in terms of who gets accepted (legacy admits notwithstanding). The arbitrary nature is fueling mega anxiety for kids and parents alike.

Kids who stand out show a longstanding commitment to an interest and a willingness to pursue that thoughtfully. For example, she pointed to a client who opted for college-prep (not AP) chemistry in order to pursue an independent study in music theory. Less workload in a class they did not plan to pursue in college also left this kid time to tutor younger kids in piano.

Essays also weigh heavily. I forget the phrase she used, but in an era of AI and SEO, this is an area where a kid's personality and passion for a school can truly shine. She emphasized that kids who tailor essays to the school, who have done their research and use specifics about why they want to go there, really stand out now more than ever. Kids who emphasize how they will contribute to the school community and why it's a fit stand out.

I am going to try to think of more takeaways from our conversation and can add them here, but I thought this was useful especially as I was wringing my hands over my kid's AP course selection next year.

Thanks for sharing but there is nothing “new” here. Yes water is wet.

[Anonymous]

I've posted before, but the most helpful thing for me over the last few cycles (2 kids) was listening to podcasts with former AOs where they walked through an application. It was eye-opening.

Ingenius Prep had one walking through some Yale, Dartmouth & JHU applications last winter:
https://insidetheadmissionsoffice.podbean.com/e/107-what-former-admissions-officers-really-think-of-these-common-applications/

Here's a new one they have for CalTech:
https://insidetheadmissionsoffice.podbean.com/

Also, the Dean Coffin/Dartmouth podcast walked through the AO committee process - makes you realize that they are looking for something "different" or unique. So doing MUN, DECA, HOSA, marching band etc isn't the right strategy.

And of course there's DCUM's fav: YCBK (filter through the old episodes to find the roundtable with the counselors).

If you have the time, I think a lot of the 3rd party podcasts have some value - just sift through the junk and advertising.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just had a long coffee meetup with a private college counselor who has been doing this for many years (since the late 1990s). I know her from my neighborhood but also wanted to talk to her professionally as my DS is a rising sophomore. For context, my kid is a good student but not an academic superstar (as in, does not take all APs and does not have all As); sporty but not on par to be recruited by a college; and very talented at visual arts. I actually don't think we'll work together because she lives nearby, and to be honest not sure it's even in my budget to work with anybody, but she did level with me about what she's seeing in an objective, kind-neighbor way and I thought it might help some other folks here. If it helps, I am on the East Coast but no longer in DC.

Right now, top schools are inundated with many kids who all look the same on paper. All APs. High GPAs. Top SAT scores. Club sports. Check whichever box you like. These applicants are virtually indistinguishable from one another. It's like, in her words, "picking rabbits out of a hat" in terms of who gets accepted (legacy admits notwithstanding). The arbitrary nature is fueling mega anxiety for kids and parents alike.

Kids who stand out show a longstanding commitment to an interest and a willingness to pursue that thoughtfully. For example, she pointed to a client who opted for college-prep (not AP) chemistry in order to pursue an independent study in music theory. Less workload in a class they did not plan to pursue in college also left this kid time to tutor younger kids in piano.

Essays also weigh heavily. I forget the phrase she used, but in an era of AI and SEO, this is an area where a kid's personality and passion for a school can truly shine. She emphasized that kids who tailor essays to the school, who have done their research and use specifics about why they want to go there, really stand out now more than ever. Kids who emphasize how they will contribute to the school community and why it's a fit stand out.

I am going to try to think of more takeaways from our conversation and can add them here, but I thought this was useful especially as I was wringing my hands over my kid's AP course selection next year.

My only comment to the above is that it’s surprising how many kids are rejected for technical reasons.

Somebody involved in Stanford admissions said that it wasn’t uncommon for kids to regurgitate basically the same essays but forget to replace Harvard with Stanford.

Also, a surprising number never checked their portal and missed deadlines for transcripts (admittedly their school screwed up but the kid needed to pay attention and pursue) and other things like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone has all APs, so stand out by not having all APs and doing something else?

That might be fine for the selective schools, but like a pp said, for the most selectives, you should probably aim for the APs and the interesting experience.

You would not get rated at our private for “most rigorous” by the HS college counselor if you don’t have the APs/honors of others. You are compared against kids from your own HS. Period

At our private, they don't fill those rankings out. So maybe the advice only applies to certain high schools? It's why all this generic advice is pointless, because it boils down to your high school, then your region.

[Anonymous]

Maybe the secret is that there's no secret, and places with 5 percent admissions rates cull out the 70 or 80 percent of applicants who aren't highly qualified, and after that it's mostly a crapshoot?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone has all APs, so stand out by not having all APs and doing something else?

That might be fine for the selective schools, but like a pp said, for the most selectives, you should probably aim for the APs and the interesting experience.

You would not get rated at our private for “most rigorous” by the HS college counselor if you don’t have the APs/honors of others. You are compared against kids from your own HS. Period

At our private, they don't fill those rankings out. So maybe the advice only applies to certain high schools? It's why all this generic advice is pointless, because it boils down to your high school, then your region.

All high schools (private and public) have a school profile that is part of the transcript they send. It includes all APs, honors, etc offered at the school, grading system, etc.

They know what is available and what you chose to take from that…and they compare you against what peers from you school took when applying to sane school.

It will also note if teacher/school approval is needed for taking an AP, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Everyone has all APs, so stand out by not having all APs and doing something else?

That might be fine for the selective schools, but like a pp said, for the most selectives, you should probably aim for the APs and the interesting experience.

You would not get rated at our private for “most rigorous” by the HS college counselor if you don’t have the APs/honors of others. You are compared against kids from your own HS. Period

At our private, they don't fill those rankings out. So maybe the advice only applies to certain high schools? It's why all this generic advice is pointless, because it boils down to your high school, then your region.

All high schools (private and public) have a school profile that is part of the transcript they send. It includes all APs, honors, etc offered at the school, grading system, etc.

They know what is available and what you chose to take from that…and they compare you against what peers from you school took when applying to sane school.

It will also note if teacher/school approval is needed for taking an AP, etc.

Yes, we all know that. Everyone here knows about Landscape, your school profile, and Slate.
But the point is private CCO don't fill out "most rigorous" section of the counselor report (frankly they leave most of it blank and attach a lengthy 3-5 page letter per student at the end - at our private). Yes, I've seen several completed reports.
Not completing that section is standard across NAIS schools. It does help with better placement for kids (often in very small class sizes or cohorts).