Jackson Reed - why do their public presentations not talk about APs?

[Anonymous]

The problem with the Deal accelerated math track is that it feels like a road to nowhere.
The highest level math offered at JR is AP Calculus BC. You end up topping out. Most MCPS high schools offer one or two levels beyond AP Calculus BC

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:But, what should a parent presume, think, extract when a HS doesn’t even talk ab APs in it’s information sessions and almost seems to be avoiding the topic?

Personally I would conclude that JR has no marketing budget and that parent information sessions are not a high priority for the school. There are other schools in the neighborhood with much, much bigger marketing budgets if that’s the sort of thing you like.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The problem with the Deal accelerated math track is that it feels like a road to nowhere.
The highest level math offered at JR is AP Calculus BC. You end up topping out. Most MCPS high schools offer one or two levels beyond AP Calculus BC

It's also really crappy instruction. My kid went from Deal to St. Albans and had to retake Algebra 2 because he had never been taught half the concepts (despite getting As at Deal).
Best friend experienced the same at Sidwell. These schools all do placement testing on arrival.

We elected not to accelerate the next kid at Deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Transplant_1 wrote:Is "career and tech ed" to provide preparation for more non-college bound students, or students that are not focused on selective colleges

Career tech is supposed to be for vocational students and also college bound.
The focus is not necessarily on competitive colleges, just on getting kids into college with some idea of what they want to do.
Unfortunately, DCPS does a poor job of vocational pathways. Also of preparing students for college. Less than 10% of DCPS graduates actually finish college within 6 years.

This seems like a made up number. Do you have a citation? How would DCPS know if kids finish college six years after they graduate from DCPS? Why would they track that information?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Transplant_1 wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Deal sounds like a disaster.

It is not a disaster. I like the principal. But I do wish the academic standards were a bit higher.
My kids coasted at Deal. Then 9th grade at JR was even easier than 8th grade at Deal. Very frustrating.
Rigor comes in at JR only with APs unfortunately. I know private schools don’t like APs but I’m not sure how JR would manage without them.

OP here: And thus why, I started this thread and asked why Jackson Reed's presentations don't present / barely present about APs.

From what I've picked up, APs have become the "anchor" for academic rigor across US public high schools, since colleges can't "trust" grades (as much as they used to?) because of grade inflation - for whatever reasons, to hide the acievement gap or to keep selective college bound kids/parents happy. Well then, so be it - that's another debate. But then, why doesn't Jackson Reed present on APs?

Why the focus on academies almost exclusively?

Because DCPS has decided to spend $$$ on Academy Directors at all the high schools. These are high level director salaries. 3 at JR. Academies also fall under career and tech Ed which is flush with money these days. The goal is to force every kid into an academy and make them complete the pathway

Someone is asserting this on multiple threads. How do you know this? I have two kids at JR--neither in an academy--and have not gotten this impression.

You can speak to any of the JR NAF directors and ask them about the vision of the CTE Academies. Or you can write to the CTE director at the DCPS Central Office. They are in the process of trying to implement the Academy plan. Each academy has required courses for all 4 years of HS. Students are also supposed to pass some type of CTE certification exam. AP classes are only part of the IT academy, not the other Academies although the Biomed track encourages AP Biology

The "Academy Plan" = every JR student must join an academy? That's the part I'm not seeing evidence of.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Transplant_1 wrote:Is "career and tech ed" to provide preparation for more non-college bound students, or students that are not focused on selective colleges

Career tech is supposed to be for vocational students and also college bound.
The focus is not necessarily on competitive colleges, just on getting kids into college with some idea of what they want to do.
Unfortunately, DCPS does a poor job of vocational pathways. Also of preparing students for college. Less than 10% of DCPS graduates actually finish college within 6 years.

This seems like a made up number. Do you have a citation? How would DCPS know if kids finish college six years after they graduate from DCPS? Why would they track that information?

Of course, they should track this type of information. I am not sure whether DCPS tracks it or some other organization. It is an important metric as it shows how well a school district is preparing its students for college. It was mentioned in a recent Washington Post article on the Coolidge Early College HS program.
You should be able to google it

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I have visited DCPS and MCPS schools, and the difference in the public discussion of academics in open houses is striking. MCPS principals will up-front address acceleration. I even heard one say “It is our obligation to give students the challenge they need.” Long discussions of math tracking and selection of classes.

In DCPS, academics seem to be practically a dirty word at open houses. Parents who ask about it get stared at questioningly, as if they just ripped a big fart.

I was just chatting with a friend in Moco schools and was blown away at the support for academic rigor, there are multiple magnet middle schools, her kid is in 5th grade and they tested kids to determine if any were eligible, he was automatically offered a seat at a STEM middle magnet (but they are turning it down), lots of accelerated classes in his elem school to for math and reading.
Why is DC so afraid of this? Perfomative equity. meaning all kids get a mediocre education and honors/AP "for all"

Ha. You are not automatically offered a spot in a STEM middle school if you qualify in MCPS.

We moved from DCPS to MCPS in ES for access to accelerated programming and have been disappointed outside of math. Our kids qualified for the GT magnet programs for both elementary and middle schools. What that means is that you are thrown into a lottery, and it's all luck of the draw. The vast majority of kids who are qualified do not get in. There is nothing automatic about it.

However, there is acceleration in math available to all kids who qualify. All ES offer "compacted" math to kids who qualify, allowing them to compact 3 years of Math (math 4, math 5, and math 6) into two years. There is further compaction in middle school available for those who do well with the compaction in ES, so a fair number of students end up taking Algebra 1 in 7th grade. Some can take it in 6th, but that is rare (and requires students to accelerate outside of MCPS).

MCPS has largely gone the "honors for all" model outside of math. At B-CC, all students take honors English 9 and 10, which is really just on-level. They do offer honors science classes, but the honors and on-level science students are mixed together in the same class -- the honors just means taking a harder test. The only really accelearation avialable outside of math is through AP/IB courses.

The grass is not always greener. We have found MCPS to be fine, but I suspect it's similar to the experience at WOTP DCPS.

I think you may not know how bad DCPS is. I went to MCPS and DCPS open houses and the differences are stark. Did your kid barely read any books or have any writing assignments all through MS? The fact that MCPS has compacted math and a clear pathway for kids who want to accelerate is huge. In DCPS you may be able to do that, but there will NEVER be an articulated, clearly discussed and supported way to do that. Because we are not supposed to publicy discuss or support advanced kids. It may be that some MCPS and DCPS kids end up in the same place but a lot of DCPS kids are left behind.

I had two kids go through Deal in the last five years, and the accelerated math pathway was extremely clearly articulated for both. At 6th grade orientation for both kids, Ms. Neal carefully walked through the different paths. Is that no longer happening?

NP. Agree that accelerated math is clearly discussed and opened to those who qualify. I have a current 8th grader. As for reading entire books, my kid’s class was assigned the whole book. My older kid who went through Deal also had to read entire books. They said your kid isn’t telling you the truth.

Then you are lucky. DC is also In accelerated math. DC is an avid reader and finished the books on their own. The 8th grade ELA class never finished or discussed.

I think this is totally plausible, though luckily it wasn’t my child’s experience. What I find tiresome about DCUM is the speed with which the discussion moves from “one weak teacher” to absolute certainty that every teacher is equally weak, and that the whole situation is a malicious conspiracy directed by the central office.

That’s fair. But it doesn’t negate the fact that several of DC’s best teachers have quit and there has been hardly any teaching of writing, from strong or weak teachers.

Right. And something as important as writing/researching should not be the luck of the draw. There should be uniform requirements that the principal enforces. Your kid might have lucked out and gotten a good teacher, but the other kids deserve the same content.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Transplant_1 wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Deal sounds like a disaster.

It is not a disaster. I like the principal. But I do wish the academic standards were a bit higher.
My kids coasted at Deal. Then 9th grade at JR was even easier than 8th grade at Deal. Very frustrating.
Rigor comes in at JR only with APs unfortunately. I know private schools don’t like APs but I’m not sure how JR would manage without them.

OP here: And thus why, I started this thread and asked why Jackson Reed's presentations don't present / barely present about APs.

From what I've picked up, APs have become the "anchor" for academic rigor across US public high schools, since colleges can't "trust" grades (as much as they used to?) because of grade inflation - for whatever reasons, to hide the acievement gap or to keep selective college bound kids/parents happy. Well then, so be it - that's another debate. But then, why doesn't Jackson Reed present on APs?

Why the focus on academies almost exclusively?

Because DCPS has decided to spend $$$ on Academy Directors at all the high schools. These are high level director salaries. 3 at JR. Academies also fall under career and tech Ed which is flush with money these days. The goal is to force every kid into an academy and make them complete the pathway

Someone is asserting this on multiple threads. How do you know this? I have two kids at JR--neither in an academy--and have not gotten this impression.

You can speak to any of the JR NAF directors and ask them about the vision of the CTE Academies. Or you can write to the CTE director at the DCPS Central Office. They are in the process of trying to implement the Academy plan. Each academy has required courses for all 4 years of HS. Students are also supposed to pass some type of CTE certification exam. AP classes are only part of the IT academy, not the other Academies although the Biomed track encourages AP Biology

The "Academy Plan" = every JR student must join an academy? That's the part I'm not seeing evidence of.

That is the goal for the academies. Many of the other DCPS high schools are based on this model. JR is trying to get there as well. I’m not sure if they will succeed with 100% academy participation but they are trying to at least get most students to enroll. Walls and Banneker do not have CTE classes so they don’t follow the academy model for better or worse. This is one reason neither school offers AP CS because the AP CS classes in DCPS fall under the CTE department

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Transplant_1 wrote:Is "career and tech ed" to provide preparation for more non-college bound students, or students that are not focused on selective colleges

Career tech is supposed to be for vocational students and also college bound.
The focus is not necessarily on competitive colleges, just on getting kids into college with some idea of what they want to do.
Unfortunately, DCPS does a poor job of vocational pathways. Also of preparing students for college. Less than 10% of DCPS graduates actually finish college within 6 years.

How does choosing a focus earlier give college-bound students more information about what they want to do? It just seems that it gets them stuck on a track that they may or may not be happy about years later.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Transplant_1 wrote:Is "career and tech ed" to provide preparation for more non-college bound students, or students that are not focused on selective colleges

Career tech is supposed to be for vocational students and also college bound.
The focus is not necessarily on competitive colleges, just on getting kids into college with some idea of what they want to do.
Unfortunately, DCPS does a poor job of vocational pathways. Also of preparing students for college. Less than 10% of DCPS graduates actually finish college within 6 years.

How does choosing a focus earlier give college-bound students more information about what they want to do? It just seems that it gets them stuck on a track that they may or may not be happy about years later.

Students are exposed to potential careers such as Engineering, nursing and premed (biomedical), hospitality, finance, etc. while still in high school.
This is important for low income students as they may not have actually met any engineers, doctors, bankers, etc in real life.
Also, college costs $$$ so going in with potential career knowledge is valuable. Academies are not for everyone but for a subset of kids, they can help launch them into a lucrative and stable career - at least that is the idea behind the academy model. Also, good way for kids to explore different career tracks

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Transplant_1 wrote:Is "career and tech ed" to provide preparation for more non-college bound students, or students that are not focused on selective colleges

Career tech is supposed to be for vocational students and also college bound.
The focus is not necessarily on competitive colleges, just on getting kids into college with some idea of what they want to do.
Unfortunately, DCPS does a poor job of vocational pathways. Also of preparing students for college. Less than 10% of DCPS graduates actually finish college within 6 years.

How does choosing a focus earlier give college-bound students more information about what they want to do? It just seems that it gets them stuck on a track that they may or may not be happy about years later.

Students are exposed to potential careers such as Engineering, nursing and premed (biomedical), hospitality, finance, etc. while still in high school.
This is important for low income students as they may not have actually met any engineers, doctors, bankers, etc in real life.
Also, college costs $$$ so going in with potential career knowledge is valuable. Academies are not for everyone to but for a subset of kids, they can help launch them into a lucrative and stable career - at least that is the idea behind the academy model. Also, good way for kids to explore different career tracks

That is a good explanation of how academies can be helpful. But you do note they are not for everyone. That's why it's disturbing if, as a poster or two believes, J-R is moving towards having everyone do academies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Transplant_1 wrote:Is "career and tech ed" to provide preparation for more non-college bound students, or students that are not focused on selective colleges

Career tech is supposed to be for vocational students and also college bound.
The focus is not necessarily on competitive colleges, just on getting kids into college with some idea of what they want to do.
Unfortunately, DCPS does a poor job of vocational pathways. Also of preparing students for college. Less than 10% of DCPS graduates actually finish college within 6 years.

How does choosing a focus earlier give college-bound students more information about what they want to do? It just seems that it gets them stuck on a track that they may or may not be happy about years later.

Students are exposed to potential careers such as Engineering, nursing and premed (biomedical), hospitality, finance, etc. while still in high school.
This is important for low income students as they may not have actually met any engineers, doctors, bankers, etc in real life.
Also, college costs $$$ so going in with potential career knowledge is valuable. Academies are not for everyone to but for a subset of kids, they can help launch them into a lucrative and stable career - at least that is the idea behind the academy model. Also, good way for kids to explore different career tracks

That is a good explanation of how academies can be helpful. But you do note they are not for everyone. That's why it's disturbing if, as a poster or two believes, J-R is moving towards having everyone do academies.

Looks like you haven’t figured out DCPS game plan of only caring about the bottom performers.

So instead of providing a broad high school experience in many subjects and rigor with AP, sounds like they want to track all kids into academies and get rid of AP if many don’t have them. It’s basically equivalent to tech track whatever field that is.

But of course to DCPS, your kid will be fine. Their definition of fine of course is to graduate high school.

[Anonymous]

Let me get this straight. So the school now has 3 academy directors but no added position for college counselors. It’s pretty obvious what the priorities are, isn’t it?

[Anonymous]

JR received grant money to invest in academy directors. That money cannot be spent on other things. The money also came with curriculum requirements which is why some classes and pathways have changed in the past 2 years. Before this academies were run on a volunteer basis by over burdened teachers and the investment and organization in each one varies greatly. When the school switched from 7 to 8 classes annually, many of the teachers who had been running academies stepped down because they had another class to teach, and academies and programs fell apart. This focus and staffing should improve the academy structure.

That being said the college and career staffing is ridiculous. They have one person responsible for all college counseling, college coordination, AND AP testing. There is a a no way one person could do that for even a classes half that size. Add to it the incredible diversity of school choice from Harvard to vocational schools at JR, and the need to start working with families in junior years, it was s really a huge disservice to the community that the office doesn’t receive more investment. And it is why there are threads every year about people hiring private college counselors. The last 2 FT counselors went private when they left too, which tells you they liked the work but not the workplace.

[Anonymous]

^^Interesting. Thanks for the background.