Timeline and Criteria for MS Magnets

[Anonymous]

We have a 5th grader. Can anyone point us to the timeline and criteria used for getting into a Magnet.

Specifically hoping for entry into the Takoma Park magnet.

[Anonymous]

Start here:

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/curriculum/specialprograms/middle

[Anonymous]

Can change year to year, but has not meaningfully changed in the past few.

Your 5th grader's Fall MAP-M RIT score (and their Spring one from last year if they are in Math 5/6 or somehow above that) will be "locally normed"/compared with the scores that period of others in MCPS schools with similar FARMS rates. The cutoff, there, was 85th percentile (either Spring or Fall, if in the Math 5/6 case, above).

That could be in the upper 90s for low-FARMS schools, changing slightly year to year; they generally do not publish this, though a public information request a couple of years back showed the actual RIT cutoffs for the prior year. High-FARMS schools almost certainly will see a lower cutoff, and that is by design/best practice recommendations for such data, accounting, to some degree, for the more difficult learning conditions one would expect. If your DC receives services (individually FARMS-identified, IEP, 504 or EML) an additional allowance is given (reportedly 70th percentile, locally normed).

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

If meeting all of these conditions (MAP %ile, grades & reading level) your DC is placed in the lottery pool for the magnet. It's the luck of the draw (late at that point, except that those within the TPMS catchment are placed in a separate pool, which results in their being several times more likely to be offered a spot in the program, given that the 25-seat local set-aside is rather disproportionately high in relation to the in-catchment population when compared with the ~100 non-local-catchment seats. If not selected for the magnet, students placed in the pool are supposed to be offered PreAlgebra (the more accelerated 6th-grade course) in their home MS.

The Humanities magnet (Eastern/MLK) pool is similar, though with MAP-R (Fall only/no Spring being taken into account), grades in English & Social Studies and reading reported as above-level (vs on or above for TPMS/Clemente). I don't think they get the same set-aside as TPMS. If not selected, local placement in HIGH (supposed to be advanced Social Studies, but several schools moved to a HIGH-for-all model) is supposed to be guaranteed.

[Anonymous]

Oh wow- I thought it would go off winter or end of 5th grade MAP- fall MAP is hard as they are overcoming the summer drop off.

Wish we had known before!

With MCPS there is always some secret formula that trips you up!!!

[Anonymous]

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

.



Thanks a lot. I was confused about the above. Are you talking about As in those subject for the first quarter/marking period of grade 5 or the kid’s whole elementary school career?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

.



Thanks a lot. I was confused about the above. Are you talking about As in those subject for the first quarter/marking period of grade 5 or the kid’s whole elementary school career?

First marking period of grade 5 only. It’s pretty stupid if you ask me. We had an ELA teacher who openly admitted to subjective grading and giving B’s to “motivate” students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

.



Thanks a lot. I was confused about the above. Are you talking about As in those subject for the first quarter/marking period of grade 5 or the kid’s whole elementary school career?

First marking period of grade 5 only. It’s pretty stupid if you ask me. We had an ELA teacher who openly admitted to subjective grading and giving B’s to “motivate” students.

All this magnet selection stuff is done very narrowly and is pretty stupid in my opinion. I sent my 99 pct COGAT third grade kid to school when she wasn’t 100 pct feeling well one day and it turned out to be MAP-R testing day (unannounced) and her score was well below her normal 95 pct plus level. But since they don’t look at COGAT to choose for CES and only look at one MAP data point, guess whose kid wasn’t deemed eligible for CES lottery?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

.



Thanks a lot. I was confused about the above. Are you talking about As in those subject for the first quarter/marking period of grade 5 or the kid’s whole elementary school career?

First marking period of grade 5 only. It’s pretty stupid if you ask me. We had an ELA teacher who openly admitted to subjective grading and giving B’s to “motivate” students.

That’s kind of ridiculous. Do you know if HS magnet selection only looks at grade 8 first MP grades?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

.



Thanks a lot. I was confused about the above. Are you talking about As in those subject for the first quarter/marking period of grade 5 or the kid’s whole elementary school career?

First marking period of grade 5 only. It’s pretty stupid if you ask me. We had an ELA teacher who openly admitted to subjective grading and giving B’s to “motivate” students.

That’s kind of ridiculous. Do you know if HS magnet selection only looks at grade 8 first MP grades?

I believe it is that plus all of the "final" (i.e., not interim) quarter grades in 7th.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

.



Thanks a lot. I was confused about the above. Are you talking about As in those subject for the first quarter/marking period of grade 5 or the kid’s whole elementary school career?

First marking period of grade 5 only. It’s pretty stupid if you ask me. We had an ELA teacher who openly admitted to subjective grading and giving B’s to “motivate” students.

PP from "In addition..."

This is also my understanding -- lottery pool qualification involves grades only from the first quarter of 5th.

Unfortunately, it also is my understanding that there is enough variation in grading across the system that a student getting a B from one teacher may have gotten an A from another with the same work. There are grading rubrics, but teachers have latitude and not all are followed. While some teachers might knowingly employ the threat of a B in a lottery-pool-sensitive period to coerce behavior, others may not be aware of the import of that marking period's grade in the first place. I'd like to think that the former are few, and I hope that they remain few between them.

[Anonymous]

I’m also a parent of a r5th grader. We got a letter in the mail yesterday with info about the timelines for Magnets and dates for the various presentations.

My biggest concern is what 7th grade will look like as it’s the year the boundary and program changes start. I don’t trust MCPS to continue staffing an old program while bringing in the new ones.

I also don’t want my child to move buildings between 5th and 6th and then again between 6th and 7th. I have written the BOE about my concerns as this cohort of students already endured the trauma of online kindergarten and the hybrid first grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

.



Thanks a lot. I was confused about the above. Are you talking about As in those subject for the first quarter/marking period of grade 5 or the kid’s whole elementary school career?

First marking period of grade 5 only. It’s pretty stupid if you ask me. We had an ELA teacher who openly admitted to subjective grading and giving B’s to “motivate” students.

All this magnet selection stuff is done very narrowly and is pretty stupid in my opinion. I sent my 99 pct COGAT third grade kid to school when she wasn’t 100 pct feeling well one day and it turned out to be MAP-R testing day (unannounced) and her score was well below her normal 95 pct plus level. But since they don’t look at COGAT to choose for CES and only look at one MAP data point, guess whose kid wasn’t deemed eligible for CES lottery?

I hope you appealed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

.



Thanks a lot. I was confused about the above. Are you talking about As in those subject for the first quarter/marking period of grade 5 or the kid’s whole elementary school career?

First marking period of grade 5 only. It’s pretty stupid if you ask me. We had an ELA teacher who openly admitted to subjective grading and giving B’s to “motivate” students.

All this magnet selection stuff is done very narrowly and is pretty stupid in my opinion. I sent my 99 pct COGAT third grade kid to school when she wasn’t 100 pct feeling well one day and it turned out to be MAP-R testing day (unannounced) and her score was well below her normal 95 pct plus level. But since they don’t look at COGAT to choose for CES and only look at one MAP data point, guess whose kid wasn’t deemed eligible for CES lottery?

I hope you appealed.

Nope. I didn't know "appeals" existed for CES. I'm not sure on what grounds I would be able to appeal on anyway. MCPS doesn't look at COGAT for selection to CES, and their narrow criteria for the MAP tests is stupid but it's clearly defined.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

.



Thanks a lot. I was confused about the above. Are you talking about As in those subject for the first quarter/marking period of grade 5 or the kid’s whole elementary school career?

First marking period of grade 5 only. It’s pretty stupid if you ask me. We had an ELA teacher who openly admitted to subjective grading and giving B’s to “motivate” students.

All this magnet selection stuff is done very narrowly and is pretty stupid in my opinion. I sent my 99 pct COGAT third grade kid to school when she wasn’t 100 pct feeling well one day and it turned out to be MAP-R testing day (unannounced) and her score was well below her normal 95 pct plus level. But since they don’t look at COGAT to choose for CES and only look at one MAP data point, guess whose kid wasn’t deemed eligible for CES lottery?

I hope you appealed.

Nope. I didn't know "appeals" existed for CES. I'm not sure on what grounds I would be able to appeal on anyway. MCPS doesn't look at COGAT for selection to CES, and their narrow criteria for the MAP tests is stupid but it's clearly defined.

I hope they still allow appeals. Back when my now senior was in third grade, dc had the highest MAP-R score in their class (the teacher told us), but not the requisite CogAt score. (Kid has disability related to math, but math isn’t part of CES.) This was pre Covid, before CES admissions was lottery based. My kid wasn’t even considered for the first round of admissions or in the waitpool. I appealed by describing my child’s abilities and submitting a high quality writing sample my child had written outside of school. The decision on my dc’s eligibility was reversed on appeal and my dc was placed in the waitpool before the second round of admissions. DC ended up being randomly selected from the waitpool of qualified applicants, attended a CES, and did very well. In your case, I would have submitted previous MAP-R scores to illustrate that my dc’s illness during the most recent MAP testing had affected their performance.

I’m not saying all this to make you feel like you feel any regret; I’m sharing it because appeals used to work a fair amount of the time. If they still work in some cases now, parents should avail themselves of every possible recourse. You’ve got nothing to lose by trying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

In addition, from the first quarter/marking period, your DC must have an A in Math, an A in Science and an at or above on-grade reading level.

.



Thanks a lot. I was confused about the above. Are you talking about As in those subject for the first quarter/marking period of grade 5 or the kid’s whole elementary school career?

First marking period of grade 5 only. It’s pretty stupid if you ask me. We had an ELA teacher who openly admitted to subjective grading and giving B’s to “motivate” students.

All this magnet selection stuff is done very narrowly and is pretty stupid in my opinion. I sent my 99 pct COGAT third grade kid to school when she wasn’t 100 pct feeling well one day and it turned out to be MAP-R testing day (unannounced) and her score was well below her normal 95 pct plus level. But since they don’t look at COGAT to choose for CES and only look at one MAP data point, guess whose kid wasn’t deemed eligible for CES lottery?

I hope you appealed.

Nope. I didn't know "appeals" existed for CES. I'm not sure on what grounds I would be able to appeal on anyway. MCPS doesn't look at COGAT for selection to CES, and their narrow criteria for the MAP tests is stupid but it's clearly defined.

You can appeal to get into the wait pool if you can demonstrate "A unique hardship impacted a student’s academic profile"-- not sure how high the bar is on that and whether illness would count. (Also you can appeal if there was a genuine error in their data.) Your chances are pretty low to get in at that point because the first round of kids have already been selected so it's just to fill slots for kids who decline or drop out later on, but it's possible.