Physician assistant vs nurse practitioner

[Anonymous]

How are these careers perceived? Seems like those who want/have kids looking to pursue medical field (which aren’t many to my surprise) always gun for pre-med. however I know more kids who switched out of that major than actually went to medical school.

How do NP and PA compare in terms of pay, work-life balance, job growth, stability, and I guess in DCUM fashion, I guess I have to say in prestige as well

[Anonymous]

Kids who want to be doctors but don’t want to go through the academics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kids who want to be doctors but don’t want to go through the academics.

Or debt.

[Anonymous]

I'm curious about the differences as well. It seems like the path to PA is easier. Does that make them less qualified?

My surgeon (head of spine institute at Georgetown) has a PA that follows him everywhere, including into the operating room and I have to think that he is highly compensated. The surgeon told me that he was able to complete my surgery due to his PA encouraging him - he said that he almost gave up and which would have meant a second surgery for me.

[Anonymous]

As a hospital physician of 20 years who works with both daily, I find that our PAs have a better knowledge foundation than NPs who go straight from Nursing school to their NP degrees. Too many programs(especially online programs) churning out unprepared NPs. That said, those NPs who started out as nurses and have several years of nursing under their belt before going to NP school are well prepared. Sadly, I see this route less and less each year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a hospital physician of 20 years who works with both daily, I find that our PAs have a better knowledge foundation than NPs who go straight from Nursing school to their NP degrees. Too many programs(especially online programs) churning out unprepared NPs. That said, those NPs who started out as nurses and have several years of nursing under their belt before going to NP school are well prepared. Sadly, I see this route less and less each year.

Yes, this is the problem. NPs who went to solid programs and have experiences as nurses are great.

Unfortunately, there are many that just got the online degree from a degree mill. They are, for the most part, not nearly as good as the traditional nurses. Frankly, many of them shouldn’t be allowed to practice. I don’t even know how those degree mills got accredited.

[Anonymous]

PAs have more autonomy by law, and the training is considered more rigorous. There is a lot of variation, however, depending on when and how people got training.

[Anonymous]

I'm a physician who works for a health system that employs many NPs and PAs in primary care, urgent care, and some surgical specialties. Qualities vary. Not sure if that has to do with the individual (and thus unpredictable) or has to do with quality of training or programs attended. They are great at following protocols and supporting physicians. Some PAs are like robots and cannot or don't want to think critically. That's a problem in specialties that require cerebral thinking, a lot of uncerrtainties, and constant recalibration of differential diagnoses and treatment adjustments. They would make better surgical PAs than medical PAs. Most NPs tend to be in primary care or OB or geriatrics. I think NPs cost health systems more in compensation because they are often unionized whereas most PAs (and MDs) are not.

I'm not sure if above was helpful. I personally wouldn't encourage my children to go into health care, MD or midlevel...

[Anonymous]

My niece is about to start in PA school this fall. I don’t think she had aspirations to be a medical doctor, but was always interested in physical therapy and other roles related to sports medicine and orthopedics. She is an athlete.

Maybe the popularity of PAs has grown in the past few years because I had never really paid attention to PAs in the medical setting until my niece started pursuing it. She graduated 2 years ago and was behind in the process so spent the past few years working as a medical assistant and taking biology pre-reqs and getting “patient hours”.

From my understanding PA and medical Dr are pretty different. She says she will pretty much be able to do A lot of the procedures that doctors can, but will also have a lot of restrictions as well. But after four years of undergrad, 2.5 gap years taking classes and working for minimum wage, she can go to school and graduate with her masters in 2 years and start working…. So about 9 years total. She’s studying a lot and we are all rooting for her.

A doctor has a different path - a lot more schooling and in-depth knowledge and responsibility - with the main difference being at least 12 years of schooling and residency.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm curious about the differences as well. It seems like the path to PA is easier. Does that make them less qualified?

My surgeon (head of spine institute at Georgetown) has a PA that follows him everywhere, including into the operating room and I have to think that he is highly compensated. The surgeon told me that he was able to complete my surgery due to his PA encouraging him - he said that he almost gave up and which would have meant a second surgery for me.

???!!??!!!?

[Anonymous]

I am a physician. They are equally respected (and greatly appreciated) in the settings where I have worked.

My understanding is being an np involves being an rn first and obv PAs don’t have that as part of their background.

To some people that’s appealing and to some people it’s not-they just aren’t drawn to that work. (No value jusgement-I am not suited to nursing and I would have been a PA if I didn’t go to med school.) I recommend an honest self appraisal and going from there.

[Anonymous]

I have taught a number of Columbia NP students over the years. Yes, they get an RN degree but it seems more like a formality as they have little to no bedside nursing experience. I was surprised to learn they didn’t even learn venipuncture or IVs. There is also very little in the study of pathophysiology so that the knowledge base is somewhat superficial and protocol driven. Many lectures are asynchronous and students are seldom taught by one FT professor with older students serving like TAs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a hospital physician of 20 years who works with both daily, I find that our PAs have a better knowledge foundation than NPs who go straight from Nursing school to their NP degrees. Too many programs(especially online programs) churning out unprepared NPs. That said, those NPs who started out as nurses and have several years of nursing under their belt before going to NP school are well prepared. Sadly, I see this route less and less each year.

Nurse here and I completely agree. It’s frightening when I see some of my barely competent co-workers get into NP school. FYI. I think PA school is much better at pathophysiology. At least CRNA programs require ICU experience. There are good NP programs but many will just take anyone with a pulse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm a physician who works for a health system that employs many NPs and PAs in primary care, urgent care, and some surgical specialties. Qualities vary. Not sure if that has to do with the individual (and thus unpredictable) or has to do with quality of training or programs attended. They are great at following protocols and supporting physicians. Some PAs are like robots and cannot or don't want to think critically. That's a problem in specialties that require cerebral thinking, a lot of uncerrtainties, and constant recalibration of differential diagnoses and treatment adjustments. They would make better surgical PAs than medical PAs. Most NPs tend to be in primary care or OB or geriatrics. I think NPs cost health systems more in compensation because they are often unionized whereas most PAs (and MDs) are not.

I'm not sure if above was helpful. I personally wouldn't encourage my children to go into health care, MD or midlevel...

Why would you discourage medicine for your kids and what would you prefer them to do?

Seems like everyone just thinks their own job sucks and have a grass is greener mentality.

[Anonymous]

This is helpful, but really doesn't answer what the real difference are between the two. From what I read, they are very similar and both can do patient care. Do some of the above posters have insight.

Also, what if my DD goes to a direct admit nursing school, but then decides to switch to a PA after graduation (and will have her BSN). Anyone seen that happen?