Algebra 1HN compared to AOPS Algebra

[Anonymous]

Is the ease/difficulty level of these two similar?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is the ease/difficulty level of these two similar?

(This is about the online version of AoPS, and a MS version of Algebra IH taught in VA):

AoPS is harder in its problems, has more interesting problems, but involves far fewer problems and overall takes less time. AoPS involves mathematical writing assignments to be typed in LaTeX that are graded by a human. Covers a few more areas (such as complex numbers).

School Algebra IH involves a lot more problems, all of which are just below the level of being interesting. Takes more time due to daily, repetitive homework. There is no mathematical writing practice. But provides practice opportunities for timed tests and quizzes. Elides complex numbers and involves no proofs (not even deriving the quadratic formula).

It is best to have your kid take both if you have the opportunity.

[Anonymous]

Here is an excerpt from the Prealgebratextbook: https://s3.amazonaws.com/aops-cdn.artofproblemsolving.com/products/prealgebra/exc2.pdf

Here is the intro to algebra ToC: https://s3.amazonaws.com/aops-cdn.artofproblemsolving.com/products/intro-algebra/toc.pdf
vs FCPS: https://www.fcps.edu/academics/high-school-grades-9-12/mathematics/algebra-1-and-algebra-1-honors#assessments

Here are some excerpts from the Intro to algebra book:
https://s3.amazonaws.com/aops-cdn.artofproblemsolving.com/products/intro-algebra/exc1.pdf
https://s3.amazonaws.com/aops-cdn.artofproblemsolving.com/products/intro-algebra/exc2.pdf
https://s3.amazonaws.com/aops-cdn.artofproblemsolving.com/products/intro-algebra/exc3.pdf
https://s3.amazonaws.com/aops-cdn.artofproblemsolving.com/products/intro-algebra/index.pdf
FCPS doesn't provide any.

Here are some diagnostic exams:https://data.artofproblemsolving.com//products/diagnostics/intro-algebra-pretest.pdf
https://data.artofproblemsolving.com//products/diagnostics/intro-algebra-posttest.pdf
Once again, FCPS doesn't provide any diagnostic exams, either

[Anonymous]

not even deriving the quadratic formula)

Great job Virgina, removing the math from math class, turning it into trivia class.

Glad that Loudon County rises above Virginia's abhorrently low expectations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

not even deriving the quadratic formula)

Great job Virgina, removing the math from math class, turning it into trivia class.

Glad that Loudon County rises above Virginia's abhorrently low expectations.

I was abhorred by this lack of depth as well, but let me say some positive things, too.
The class is actually correctly graded - that is, lots of quizzes, tests, and (small but frequent amount of) graded homework. Tests were graded correctly: if you did a wrong step on a multistep problem and got the wrong answer, you got a zero and no partial credit for the other steps. No "projects", "participation grades" and the like, and very very limited opportunities for grade-boosting extra credit (in DC's class, the only extra credit opportunities were test corrections where you could get 25% of the points you lost if you submitted them. He got close to 100%, but not 100% across the many tests and quizzes. I'm tempted to file a FOIA to learn the class GPA because I suspect it's probably not an A. The textbook used was 12 years old - not as good as perhaps a textbook from 20 years ago, but better than the crap that's recently published. A huge contrast to subjects like ELA, Social Science, or Science, where there are no timed tests and lots of "participation grades" just for showing up or submitting something. Despite the shortcomings in the curriculum, I need to give my child's Algebra (and Geometry) MS teachers credit where it's due.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is the ease/difficulty level of these two similar?

(This is about the online version of AoPS, and a MS version of Algebra IH taught in VA):

AoPS is harder in its problems, has more interesting problems, but involves far fewer problems and overall takes less time. AoPS involves mathematical writing assignments to be typed in LaTeX that are graded by a human. Covers a few more areas (such as complex numbers).

School Algebra IH involves a lot more problems, all of which are just below the level of being interesting. Takes more time due to daily, repetitive homework. There is no mathematical writing practice. But provides practice opportunities for timed tests and quizzes. Elides complex numbers and involves no proofs (not even deriving the quadratic formula).

It is best to have your kid take both if you have the opportunity.

NP. This description of Algebra 1H sounds very teacher/school specific and not at all like my DC's experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

not even deriving the quadratic formula)

Great job Virgina, removing the math from math class, turning it into trivia class.

Glad that Loudon County rises above Virginia's abhorrently low expectations.

I was abhorred by this lack of depth as well, but let me say some positive things, too.
The class is actually correctly graded - that is, lots of quizzes, tests, and (small but frequent amount of) graded homework. Tests were graded correctly: if you did a wrong step on a multistep problem and got the wrong answer, you got a zero and no partial credit for the other steps. No "projects", "participation grades" and the like, and very very limited opportunities for grade-boosting extra credit (in DC's class, the only extra credit opportunities were test corrections where you could get 25% of the points you lost if you submitted them. He got close to 100%, but not 100% across the many tests and quizzes. I'm tempted to file a FOIA to learn the class GPA because I suspect it's probably not an A. The textbook used was 12 years old - not as good as perhaps a textbook from 20 years ago, but better than the crap that's recently published. A huge contrast to subjects like ELA, Social Science, or Science, where there are no timed tests and lots of "participation grades" just for showing up or submitting something. Despite the shortcomings in the curriculum, I need to give my child's Algebra (and Geometry) MS teachers credit where it's due.

Which textbook?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

not even deriving the quadratic formula)

Great job Virgina, removing the math from math class, turning it into trivia class.

Glad that Loudon County rises above Virginia's abhorrently low expectations.

I was abhorred by this lack of depth as well, but let me say some positive things, too.
The class is actually correctly graded - that is, lots of quizzes, tests, and (small but frequent amount of) graded homework. Tests were graded correctly: if you did a wrong step on a multistep problem and got the wrong answer, you got a zero and no partial credit for the other steps. No "projects", "participation grades" and the like, and very very limited opportunities for grade-boosting extra credit (in DC's class, the only extra credit opportunities were test corrections where you could get 25% of the points you lost if you submitted them. He got close to 100%, but not 100% across the many tests and quizzes. I'm tempted to file a FOIA to learn the class GPA because I suspect it's probably not an A. The textbook used was 12 years old - not as good as perhaps a textbook from 20 years ago, but better than the crap that's recently published. A huge contrast to subjects like ELA, Social Science, or Science, where there are no timed tests and lots of "participation grades" just for showing up or submitting something. Despite the shortcomings in the curriculum, I need to give my child's Algebra (and Geometry) MS teachers credit where it's due.

So not only is logic not taught, but attempts to use logic are not given credit? And grading for homework where cheating is a simple matter of photographing the problem in an app?
It just gets worse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

not even deriving the quadratic formula)

Great job Virgina, removing the math from math class, turning it into trivia class.

Glad that Loudon County rises above Virginia's abhorrently low expectations.

I was abhorred by this lack of depth as well, but let me say some positive things, too.
The class is actually correctly graded - that is, lots of quizzes, tests, and (small but frequent amount of) graded homework. Tests were graded correctly: if you did a wrong step on a multistep problem and got the wrong answer, you got a zero and no partial credit for the other steps. No "projects", "participation grades" and the like, and very very limited opportunities for grade-boosting extra credit (in DC's class, the only extra credit opportunities were test corrections where you could get 25% of the points you lost if you submitted them. He got close to 100%, but not 100% across the many tests and quizzes. I'm tempted to file a FOIA to learn the class GPA because I suspect it's probably not an A. The textbook used was 12 years old - not as good as perhaps a textbook from 20 years ago, but better than the crap that's recently published. A huge contrast to subjects like ELA, Social Science, or Science, where there are no timed tests and lots of "participation grades" just for showing up or submitting something. Despite the shortcomings in the curriculum, I need to give my child's Algebra (and Geometry) MS teachers credit where it's due.

Which textbook?

In the AAP of our school district (not FCPS) they are using Prentice Hall Algebra 1 (Virginia Edition). Every child gets 2 copies, one is kept at home for the daily homework, one in the classroom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

not even deriving the quadratic formula)

Great job Virgina, removing the math from math class, turning it into trivia class.

Glad that Loudon County rises above Virginia's abhorrently low expectations.

I was abhorred by this lack of depth as well, but let me say some positive things, too.
The class is actually correctly graded - that is, lots of quizzes, tests, and (small but frequent amount of) graded homework. Tests were graded correctly: if you did a wrong step on a multistep problem and got the wrong answer, you got a zero and no partial credit for the other steps. No "projects", "participation grades" and the like, and very very limited opportunities for grade-boosting extra credit (in DC's class, the only extra credit opportunities were test corrections where you could get 25% of the points you lost if you submitted them. He got close to 100%, but not 100% across the many tests and quizzes. I'm tempted to file a FOIA to learn the class GPA because I suspect it's probably not an A. The textbook used was 12 years old - not as good as perhaps a textbook from 20 years ago, but better than the crap that's recently published. A huge contrast to subjects like ELA, Social Science, or Science, where there are no timed tests and lots of "participation grades" just for showing up or submitting something. Despite the shortcomings in the curriculum, I need to give my child's Algebra (and Geometry) MS teachers credit where it's due.

So not only is logic not taught, but attempts to use logic are not given credit? And grading for homework where cheating is a simple matter of photographing the problem in an app?
It just gets worse.

No my friend. Math is an exact science. The final answer matters, not just the steps. This distinguishes A from B students.
Homework counts for a small portion, and students who photograph or use ChatGPT hurt themselves when the tests/quizzes come that count for the other 90%.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is the ease/difficulty level of these two similar?

(This is about the online version of AoPS, and a MS version of Algebra IH taught in VA):

AoPS is harder in its problems, has more interesting problems, but involves far fewer problems and overall takes less time. AoPS involves mathematical writing assignments to be typed in LaTeX that are graded by a human. Covers a few more areas (such as complex numbers).

School Algebra IH involves a lot more problems, all of which are just below the level of being interesting. Takes more time due to daily, repetitive homework. There is no mathematical writing practice. But provides practice opportunities for timed tests and quizzes. Elides complex numbers and involves no proofs (not even deriving the quadratic formula).

It is best to have your kid take both if you have the opportunity.

NP. This description of Algebra 1H sounds very teacher/school specific and not at all like my DC's experience.

Mind sharing yours?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

not even deriving the quadratic formula)

Great job Virgina, removing the math from math class, turning it into trivia class.

Glad that Loudon County rises above Virginia's abhorrently low expectations.

I was abhorred by this lack of depth as well, but let me say some positive things, too.
The class is actually correctly graded - that is, lots of quizzes, tests, and (small but frequent amount of) graded homework. Tests were graded correctly: if you did a wrong step on a multistep problem and got the wrong answer, you got a zero and no partial credit for the other steps. No "projects", "participation grades" and the like, and very very limited opportunities for grade-boosting extra credit (in DC's class, the only extra credit opportunities were test corrections where you could get 25% of the points you lost if you submitted them. He got close to 100%, but not 100% across the many tests and quizzes. I'm tempted to file a FOIA to learn the class GPA because I suspect it's probably not an A. The textbook used was 12 years old - not as good as perhaps a textbook from 20 years ago, but better than the crap that's recently published. A huge contrast to subjects like ELA, Social Science, or Science, where there are no timed tests and lots of "participation grades" just for showing up or submitting something. Despite the shortcomings in the curriculum, I need to give my child's Algebra (and Geometry) MS teachers credit where it's due.

So not only is logic not taught, but attempts to use logic are not given credit? And grading for homework where cheating is a simple matter of photographing the problem in an app?
It just gets worse.

No my friend. Math is an exact science. The final answer matters, not just the steps. This distinguishes A from B students.
Homework counts for a small portion, and students who photograph or use ChatGPT hurt themselves when the tests/quizzes come that count for the other 90%.

This makes no sense, given that students who make a single sign error obviously have a much higher level of understanding than one which leaves the question blank. If this was the grading scheme used, I would have failed algebra despite knowing it.

[Anonymous]

My HN 7th grader got A for his Algebra 1 HN at school so far. For unit tests at school, he often got 100+ out of 100. There are extra points. But for Algebra 1 midterms at AOPS (in person), he never got above 80% problems correct. At school, before test, teacher provided a review guide. The problem students saw at test were very similar to the problem in the review guide. No math textbook at school. Systematic cheating led by the teacher. And parents are happy seeing "A "s on children's school report.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My HN 7th grader got A for his Algebra 1 HN at school so far. For unit tests at school, he often got 100+ out of 100. There are extra points. But for Algebra 1 midterms at AOPS (in person), he never got above 80% problems correct. At school, before test, teacher provided a review guide. The problem students saw at test were very similar to the problem in the review guide. No math textbook at school. Systematic cheating led by the teacher. And parents are happy seeing "A "s on children's school report.

A review guide is not cheating. How can you teach your DC about cheating if you don't even know what it is?

Cheating is a real issue in high school. But you may need to learn more before your DC gets to high school. Or you may be teaching them to cheat since you don't even know what studying looks like so you won't recognize actual cheating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

not even deriving the quadratic formula)

Great job Virgina, removing the math from math class, turning it into trivia class.

Glad that Loudon County rises above Virginia's abhorrently low expectations.

I was abhorred by this lack of depth as well, but let me say some positive things, too.
The class is actually correctly graded - that is, lots of quizzes, tests, and (small but frequent amount of) graded homework. Tests were graded correctly: if you did a wrong step on a multistep problem and got the wrong answer, you got a zero and no partial credit for the other steps. No "projects", "participation grades" and the like, and very very limited opportunities for grade-boosting extra credit (in DC's class, the only extra credit opportunities were test corrections where you could get 25% of the points you lost if you submitted them. He got close to 100%, but not 100% across the many tests and quizzes. I'm tempted to file a FOIA to learn the class GPA because I suspect it's probably not an A. The textbook used was 12 years old - not as good as perhaps a textbook from 20 years ago, but better than the crap that's recently published. A huge contrast to subjects like ELA, Social Science, or Science, where there are no timed tests and lots of "participation grades" just for showing up or submitting something. Despite the shortcomings in the curriculum, I need to give my child's Algebra (and Geometry) MS teachers credit where it's due.

So not only is logic not taught, but attempts to use logic are not given credit? And grading for homework where cheating is a simple matter of photographing the problem in an app?
It just gets worse.

No my friend. Math is an exact science. The final answer matters, not just the steps. This distinguishes A from B students.
Homework counts for a small portion, and students who photograph or use ChatGPT hurt themselves when the tests/quizzes come that count for the other 90%.

You are embarrassing yourself. Go talk to a mathematician or scientist. You are raising your child to be a calculator. Everyone already has a better calculator than your child in their pocket.