Need private school ASAP for ADHD 5yo — eloping, dysregulated, needs active learning

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unfortunately, it's unlikely that any private school will take him. There just aren't any private schools that serve this population.

My kid is similar but much older now. My advice:
1. Medicate. He can't learn skills (or academics) when dysregulated.
2. Get him OT out of school.
3. Fight for accommodations in public.

Give it some time. For my kid, the beginning of the year is a CF. Then it gets better for 2nd & 3rd quarter. Then kid burns out towards the end of the year. Rinse and repeat. But each year does get a little easier, on average.

The extra year of preschool is not a bad idea. Do a TON of OT during that year.

OT would not be beneficial for a child like this.

False. OT can help teach skills to address dysregulation.

OT are not trained in behavior management. Find someone qualified.

Huh? OTs help kids learn skills to self regulate.

Exactly why they’d be a terrible choice in this case. This child’s needs exceed that of an OT. You might use them for supplemental therapy but you’re kidding yourself and doing your child a huge disservice if you treat a case like this by just “getting lots of OT” and putting them in another school.

You seem unfamiliar with OTs.

Out of all of the therapies that my similar kid had, OT was the most beneficial for dysregulation. It had immediate therapeutic effects and kid learned skills over time.

Excellent, but this child clearly needs more than that.

Yes, it does take a village.

Psychologist for full neuropsych
Psychiatrist (meds?)
Parent training coach
SPED advocate

And OT for frequent sessions to address dysregulation.

Had you been paying any attention at all, instead of just bashing opinions, you’d see my original comment was in response to someone that said something along the lines of just get them lots of OT. Frankly I don’t care what you think about OT, don’t care about what worked for your child. I was trying to save OPs kid from making those same mistakes. At the end of the day though do whatever you want. Don’t care.

I posted about OT and never say "just" OT.

I've referred to medication (psychiatrist), accommodations (advocate), and parent training (coach).

OT can be incredibly beneficial for a dysregulated kid. Not sure why you're getting all ODD about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I haven’t read the whole thread but I’ll add a few things. When my son started K he went from a very structured prek daycare where he’d been for years and through Covid and he had a terrible time in K at first. He was undiagnosed and would elope, have major meltdowns, was sent home from school several times for aggressive/violent behavior, had to be restrained sometimes, and it was generally hell for all of us. We got him in by a miracle for a neuropsych assessment in Dec/ January and he was diagnosed by February with Autism, ADHD. The level of services with the autism diagnosis helped immediately. He’s been on meds with a monthly ped psychiatrist since then. We begged and pleaded with the school to let him repeat K. He has a summer birthday and needed the time. We were able to get the psychiatrist and neuropsychologist write letters recommending repeating K. We were exploring how to have him repeat K privately if needed. The school agreed and it was the best decision. We got him in ABA 3x a week which really helped with the behavior regulation. We spent a lot of time collaborating between the school BCBA (behavior specialist), ABA BCBA and the psychiatrist. My son is in 3rd now and it’s not a picnic but every year gets better. He’s doing well in school (still have challenges with aggression, disruptive behavior and occasional elopement) and has remained mainstreamed.

My advice. Do not delay on a neuropsych evaluation. I know so many parents delay this. Get it now. Get the info. My insurance covered it and I’ve done it 3x now (my daughter has had one twice). ADHD is often comorbid with something else. Find out the something else. Don’t delay on meds. My child unmedicated is a completely different and farrrrr more challenging kid than medicated.

Sure you can bounce around to another school but you will just start over again with a new team and cause more disruption to your kid. I would get to the root of the issues and then deal with those. Partner with the people who are helping your kid day in and day out.

Just dropping a note here to say that my similar kid got an autism diagnosis from a psychologist at an autism clinic covered by insurance - there was no “neuropsych” needed. And this was after we already got a very comprehensive IEP under the “developmental delay” label due to motor skills and behavioral issues based on the school testing and my advocacy.

I just think it is really important for parents to be informed consumers. Anyone trying to say you need to run to spend thousands on a “full neuropsych” is misinformed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unfortunately, it's unlikely that any private school will take him. There just aren't any private schools that serve this population.

My kid is similar but much older now. My advice:
1. Medicate. He can't learn skills (or academics) when dysregulated.
2. Get him OT out of school.
3. Fight for accommodations in public.

Give it some time. For my kid, the beginning of the year is a CF. Then it gets better for 2nd & 3rd quarter. Then kid burns out towards the end of the year. Rinse and repeat. But each year does get a little easier, on average.

The extra year of preschool is not a bad idea. Do a TON of OT during that year.

OT would not be beneficial for a child like this.

False. OT can help teach skills to address dysregulation.

OT are not trained in behavior management. Find someone qualified.

Huh? OTs help kids learn skills to self regulate.

Exactly why they’d be a terrible choice in this case. This child’s needs exceed that of an OT. You might use them for supplemental therapy but you’re kidding yourself and doing your child a huge disservice if you treat a case like this by just “getting lots of OT” and putting them in another school.

You seem unfamiliar with OTs.

Out of all of the therapies that my similar kid had, OT was the most beneficial for dysregulation. It had immediate therapeutic effects and kid learned skills over time.

Excellent, but this child clearly needs more than that.

Yes, it does take a village.

Psychologist for full neuropsych
Psychiatrist (meds?)
Parent training coach
SPED advocate

And OT for frequent sessions to address dysregulation.

Had you been paying any attention at all, instead of just bashing opinions, you’d see my original comment was in response to someone that said something along the lines of just get them lots of OT. Frankly I don’t care what you think about OT, don’t care about what worked for your child. I was trying to save OPs kid from making those same mistakes. At the end of the day though do whatever you want. Don’t care.

I posted about OT and never say "just" OT.

I've referred to medication (psychiatrist), accommodations (advocate), and parent training (coach).

OT can be incredibly beneficial for a dysregulated kid. Not sure why you're getting all ODD about it.

DP. because most OTs don’t actually focus on emotional regulation or behavioral interventions (for that you need ABA). No amount of “sensory diet” will help a kid regularly throwing stuff in school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven’t read the whole thread but I’ll add a few things. When my son started K he went from a very structured prek daycare where he’d been for years and through Covid and he had a terrible time in K at first. He was undiagnosed and would elope, have major meltdowns, was sent home from school several times for aggressive/violent behavior, had to be restrained sometimes, and it was generally hell for all of us. We got him in by a miracle for a neuropsych assessment in Dec/ January and he was diagnosed by February with Autism, ADHD. The level of services with the autism diagnosis helped immediately. He’s been on meds with a monthly ped psychiatrist since then. We begged and pleaded with the school to let him repeat K. He has a summer birthday and needed the time. We were able to get the psychiatrist and neuropsychologist write letters recommending repeating K. We were exploring how to have him repeat K privately if needed. The school agreed and it was the best decision. We got him in ABA 3x a week which really helped with the behavior regulation. We spent a lot of time collaborating between the school BCBA (behavior specialist), ABA BCBA and the psychiatrist. My son is in 3rd now and it’s not a picnic but every year gets better. He’s doing well in school (still have challenges with aggression, disruptive behavior and occasional elopement) and has remained mainstreamed.

My advice. Do not delay on a neuropsych evaluation. I know so many parents delay this. Get it now. Get the info. My insurance covered it and I’ve done it 3x now (my daughter has had one twice). ADHD is often comorbid with something else. Find out the something else. Don’t delay on meds. My child unmedicated is a completely different and farrrrr more challenging kid than medicated.

Sure you can bounce around to another school but you will just start over again with a new team and cause more disruption to your kid. I would get to the root of the issues and then deal with those. Partner with the people who are helping your kid day in and day out.

Just dropping a note here to say that my similar kid got an autism diagnosis from a psychologist at an autism clinic covered by insurance - there was no “neuropsych” needed. And this was after we already got a very comprehensive IEP under the “developmental delay” label due to motor skills and behavioral issues based on the school testing and my advocacy.

I just think it is really important for parents to be informed consumers. Anyone trying to say you need to run to spend thousands on a “full neuropsych” is misinformed.

It really depends on the child. Some children with higher support needs can be diagnosed very quickly. Children with lower support needs often do need a more thorough evaluation. My kid may seem NT to many, loves to please other people and does great in structured environments, but really struggles with the intricacies of social communication. She needed someone to spend time reviewing her history, getting teacher and therapist input, getting input from us (parents) and testing including the ADOS.

For a complex child with a potential history of trauma I would absolutely want a thorough evaluation and that takes time, which costs money. It could be you can find a place that takes insurance to cover this, but people here have asked this many times and the answers are the same 2.plscws with long wait lists.

[Anonymous]

Btw the most important thing in supporting kids with behavior issues is personalizing treatment. The diagnosis by itself is important, but it is not enough. Providers need to understand why the behavior is occurring to identify effective treatment approaches.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven’t read the whole thread but I’ll add a few things. When my son started K he went from a very structured prek daycare where he’d been for years and through Covid and he had a terrible time in K at first. He was undiagnosed and would elope, have major meltdowns, was sent home from school several times for aggressive/violent behavior, had to be restrained sometimes, and it was generally hell for all of us. We got him in by a miracle for a neuropsych assessment in Dec/ January and he was diagnosed by February with Autism, ADHD. The level of services with the autism diagnosis helped immediately. He’s been on meds with a monthly ped psychiatrist since then. We begged and pleaded with the school to let him repeat K. He has a summer birthday and needed the time. We were able to get the psychiatrist and neuropsychologist write letters recommending repeating K. We were exploring how to have him repeat K privately if needed. The school agreed and it was the best decision. We got him in ABA 3x a week which really helped with the behavior regulation. We spent a lot of time collaborating between the school BCBA (behavior specialist), ABA BCBA and the psychiatrist. My son is in 3rd now and it’s not a picnic but every year gets better. He’s doing well in school (still have challenges with aggression, disruptive behavior and occasional elopement) and has remained mainstreamed.

My advice. Do not delay on a neuropsych evaluation. I know so many parents delay this. Get it now. Get the info. My insurance covered it and I’ve done it 3x now (my daughter has had one twice). ADHD is often comorbid with something else. Find out the something else. Don’t delay on meds. My child unmedicated is a completely different and farrrrr more challenging kid than medicated.

Sure you can bounce around to another school but you will just start over again with a new team and cause more disruption to your kid. I would get to the root of the issues and then deal with those. Partner with the people who are helping your kid day in and day out.

Just dropping a note here to say that my similar kid got an autism diagnosis from a psychologist at an autism clinic covered by insurance - there was no “neuropsych” needed. And this was after we already got a very comprehensive IEP under the “developmental delay” label due to motor skills and behavioral issues based on the school testing and my advocacy.

I just think it is really important for parents to be informed consumers. Anyone trying to say you need to run to spend thousands on a “full neuropsych” is misinformed.

It really depends on the child. Some children with higher support needs can be diagnosed very quickly. Children with lower support needs often do need a more thorough evaluation. My kid may seem NT to many, loves to please other people and does great in structured environments, but really struggles with the intricacies of social communication. She needed someone to spend time reviewing her history, getting teacher and therapist input, getting input from us (parents) and testing including the ADOS.

For a complex child with a potential history of trauma I would absolutely want a thorough evaluation and that takes time, which costs money. It could be you can find a place that takes insurance to cover this, but people here have asked this many times and the answers are the same 2.plscws with long wait lists.

Sure but where you are incorrect is that an extensive battery of standardized cognitive tests is actually what leads to better diagnosis. For a complex child, a clinical evaluation and observation are likely more important. At the end of the day though treatment is more important and no family should be opting to pay Stixrud or CAAT $8k instead of getting immediate behavioral therapy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Btw the most important thing in supporting kids with behavior issues is personalizing treatment. The diagnosis by itself is important, but it is not enough. Providers need to understand why the behavior is occurring to identify effective treatment approaches.

Correct except providers don’t even need a diagnosis to provide treatment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven’t read the whole thread but I’ll add a few things. When my son started K he went from a very structured prek daycare where he’d been for years and through Covid and he had a terrible time in K at first. He was undiagnosed and would elope, have major meltdowns, was sent home from school several times for aggressive/violent behavior, had to be restrained sometimes, and it was generally hell for all of us. We got him in by a miracle for a neuropsych assessment in Dec/ January and he was diagnosed by February with Autism, ADHD. The level of services with the autism diagnosis helped immediately. He’s been on meds with a monthly ped psychiatrist since then. We begged and pleaded with the school to let him repeat K. He has a summer birthday and needed the time. We were able to get the psychiatrist and neuropsychologist write letters recommending repeating K. We were exploring how to have him repeat K privately if needed. The school agreed and it was the best decision. We got him in ABA 3x a week which really helped with the behavior regulation. We spent a lot of time collaborating between the school BCBA (behavior specialist), ABA BCBA and the psychiatrist. My son is in 3rd now and it’s not a picnic but every year gets better. He’s doing well in school (still have challenges with aggression, disruptive behavior and occasional elopement) and has remained mainstreamed.

My advice. Do not delay on a neuropsych evaluation. I know so many parents delay this. Get it now. Get the info. My insurance covered it and I’ve done it 3x now (my daughter has had one twice). ADHD is often comorbid with something else. Find out the something else. Don’t delay on meds. My child unmedicated is a completely different and farrrrr more challenging kid than medicated.

Sure you can bounce around to another school but you will just start over again with a new team and cause more disruption to your kid. I would get to the root of the issues and then deal with those. Partner with the people who are helping your kid day in and day out.

Just dropping a note here to say that my similar kid got an autism diagnosis from a psychologist at an autism clinic covered by insurance - there was no “neuropsych” needed. And this was after we already got a very comprehensive IEP under the “developmental delay” label due to motor skills and behavioral issues based on the school testing and my advocacy.

I just think it is really important for parents to be informed consumers. Anyone trying to say you need to run to spend thousands on a “full neuropsych” is misinformed.

It really depends on the child. Some children with higher support needs can be diagnosed very quickly. Children with lower support needs often do need a more thorough evaluation. My kid may seem NT to many, loves to please other people and does great in structured environments, but really struggles with the intricacies of social communication. She needed someone to spend time reviewing her history, getting teacher and therapist input, getting input from us (parents) and testing including the ADOS.

For a complex child with a potential history of trauma I would absolutely want a thorough evaluation and that takes time, which costs money. It could be you can find a place that takes insurance to cover this, but people here have asked this many times and the answers are the same 2.plscws with long wait lists.

Sure but where you are incorrect is that an extensive battery of standardized cognitive tests is actually what leads to better diagnosis. For a complex child, a clinical evaluation and observation are likely more important. At the end of the day though treatment is more important and no family should be opting to pay Stixrud or CAAT $8k instead of getting immediate behavioral therapy.

Strongly disagree on so many levels. First of all we paid less than half of that at CAAT for a 5 year old because at that age the testing takes less time. We also go reimbursed by insurance for most of the cost.

Second the diagnosis has been transformative for us as parents and we have no doubt it will help our child immensely when she is old enough to understand what it means. We were already doing the right therapies but would definitely have stopped had we not known about the diagnosis because our child.had improved so much. Now we know these are ongoing supports she needs.

The cognitive tests were helpful because we needed to fully understand her strengths and challenges and the school was not going to evaluate in her case.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven’t read the whole thread but I’ll add a few things. When my son started K he went from a very structured prek daycare where he’d been for years and through Covid and he had a terrible time in K at first. He was undiagnosed and would elope, have major meltdowns, was sent home from school several times for aggressive/violent behavior, had to be restrained sometimes, and it was generally hell for all of us. We got him in by a miracle for a neuropsych assessment in Dec/ January and he was diagnosed by February with Autism, ADHD. The level of services with the autism diagnosis helped immediately. He’s been on meds with a monthly ped psychiatrist since then. We begged and pleaded with the school to let him repeat K. He has a summer birthday and needed the time. We were able to get the psychiatrist and neuropsychologist write letters recommending repeating K. We were exploring how to have him repeat K privately if needed. The school agreed and it was the best decision. We got him in ABA 3x a week which really helped with the behavior regulation. We spent a lot of time collaborating between the school BCBA (behavior specialist), ABA BCBA and the psychiatrist. My son is in 3rd now and it’s not a picnic but every year gets better. He’s doing well in school (still have challenges with aggression, disruptive behavior and occasional elopement) and has remained mainstreamed.

My advice. Do not delay on a neuropsych evaluation. I know so many parents delay this. Get it now. Get the info. My insurance covered it and I’ve done it 3x now (my daughter has had one twice). ADHD is often comorbid with something else. Find out the something else. Don’t delay on meds. My child unmedicated is a completely different and farrrrr more challenging kid than medicated.

Sure you can bounce around to another school but you will just start over again with a new team and cause more disruption to your kid. I would get to the root of the issues and then deal with those. Partner with the people who are helping your kid day in and day out.

Just dropping a note here to say that my similar kid got an autism diagnosis from a psychologist at an autism clinic covered by insurance - there was no “neuropsych” needed. And this was after we already got a very comprehensive IEP under the “developmental delay” label due to motor skills and behavioral issues based on the school testing and my advocacy.

I just think it is really important for parents to be informed consumers. Anyone trying to say you need to run to spend thousands on a “full neuropsych” is misinformed.

This is great if your child has autism, but OP’s child sounds fairly complex and could have a host of things at play. I assumed my DD had autism, she had a full neuropsych and as it turns out, she doesn’t, but has various other things going on that we would not have learned if we just did an ADOS. A neuropsych isn’t always needed, but sometimes it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid's private school would only grant accomodations if we submitted a neuropsych evaluation.

Do you mean an ADHD diagnosis?

No, I mean exactly what I just said. My child’s private school would only grant accommodations for their learning disability if a neuropsych eval was submitted. We tried submitting an abbreviated form from the psychologist because the neuropsych contained private information. They would not accept it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven’t read the whole thread but I’ll add a few things. When my son started K he went from a very structured prek daycare where he’d been for years and through Covid and he had a terrible time in K at first. He was undiagnosed and would elope, have major meltdowns, was sent home from school several times for aggressive/violent behavior, had to be restrained sometimes, and it was generally hell for all of us. We got him in by a miracle for a neuropsych assessment in Dec/ January and he was diagnosed by February with Autism, ADHD. The level of services with the autism diagnosis helped immediately. He’s been on meds with a monthly ped psychiatrist since then. We begged and pleaded with the school to let him repeat K. He has a summer birthday and needed the time. We were able to get the psychiatrist and neuropsychologist write letters recommending repeating K. We were exploring how to have him repeat K privately if needed. The school agreed and it was the best decision. We got him in ABA 3x a week which really helped with the behavior regulation. We spent a lot of time collaborating between the school BCBA (behavior specialist), ABA BCBA and the psychiatrist. My son is in 3rd now and it’s not a picnic but every year gets better. He’s doing well in school (still have challenges with aggression, disruptive behavior and occasional elopement) and has remained mainstreamed.

My advice. Do not delay on a neuropsych evaluation. I know so many parents delay this. Get it now. Get the info. My insurance covered it and I’ve done it 3x now (my daughter has had one twice). ADHD is often comorbid with something else. Find out the something else. Don’t delay on meds. My child unmedicated is a completely different and farrrrr more challenging kid than medicated.

Sure you can bounce around to another school but you will just start over again with a new team and cause more disruption to your kid. I would get to the root of the issues and then deal with those. Partner with the people who are helping your kid day in and day out.

Just dropping a note here to say that my similar kid got an autism diagnosis from a psychologist at an autism clinic covered by insurance - there was no “neuropsych” needed. And this was after we already got a very comprehensive IEP under the “developmental delay” label due to motor skills and behavioral issues based on the school testing and my advocacy.

I just think it is really important for parents to be informed consumers. Anyone trying to say you need to run to spend thousands on a “full neuropsych” is misinformed.

It really depends on the child. Some children with higher support needs can be diagnosed very quickly. Children with lower support needs often do need a more thorough evaluation. My kid may seem NT to many, loves to please other people and does great in structured environments, but really struggles with the intricacies of social communication. She needed someone to spend time reviewing her history, getting teacher and therapist input, getting input from us (parents) and testing including the ADOS.

For a complex child with a potential history of trauma I would absolutely want a thorough evaluation and that takes time, which costs money. It could be you can find a place that takes insurance to cover this, but people here have asked this many times and the answers are the same 2.plscws with long wait lists.

Sure but where you are incorrect is that an extensive battery of standardized cognitive tests is actually what leads to better diagnosis. For a complex child, a clinical evaluation and observation are likely more important. At the end of the day though treatment is more important and no family should be opting to pay Stixrud or CAAT $8k instead of getting immediate behavioral therapy.

Strongly disagree on so many levels. First of all we paid less than half of that at CAAT for a 5 year old because at that age the testing takes less time. We also go reimbursed by insurance for most of the cost.

Second the diagnosis has been transformative for us as parents and we have no doubt it will help our child immensely when she is old enough to understand what it means. We were already doing the right therapies but would definitely have stopped had we not known about the diagnosis because our child.had improved so much. Now we know these are ongoing supports she needs.

The cognitive tests were helpful because we needed to fully understand her strengths and challenges and the school was not going to evaluate in her case.

A “neuropsych” is a battery of standardized tests administered by a neuropsychologist generally focusing on IQ. To say you need a “neuropsych” for diagnosis is nonsensical.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid's private school would only grant accomodations if we submitted a neuropsych evaluation.

Do you mean an ADHD diagnosis?

No, I mean exactly what I just said. My child’s private school would only grant accommodations for their learning disability if a neuropsych eval was submitted. We tried submitting an abbreviated form from the psychologist because the neuropsych contained private information. They would not accept it.

Do you mean an IQ test? What specifically do you mean?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I haven’t read the whole thread but I’ll add a few things. When my son started K he went from a very structured prek daycare where he’d been for years and through Covid and he had a terrible time in K at first. He was undiagnosed and would elope, have major meltdowns, was sent home from school several times for aggressive/violent behavior, had to be restrained sometimes, and it was generally hell for all of us. We got him in by a miracle for a neuropsych assessment in Dec/ January and he was diagnosed by February with Autism, ADHD. The level of services with the autism diagnosis helped immediately. He’s been on meds with a monthly ped psychiatrist since then. We begged and pleaded with the school to let him repeat K. He has a summer birthday and needed the time. We were able to get the psychiatrist and neuropsychologist write letters recommending repeating K. We were exploring how to have him repeat K privately if needed. The school agreed and it was the best decision. We got him in ABA 3x a week which really helped with the behavior regulation. We spent a lot of time collaborating between the school BCBA (behavior specialist), ABA BCBA and the psychiatrist. My son is in 3rd now and it’s not a picnic but every year gets better. He’s doing well in school (still have challenges with aggression, disruptive behavior and occasional elopement) and has remained mainstreamed.

My advice. Do not delay on a neuropsych evaluation. I know so many parents delay this. Get it now. Get the info. My insurance covered it and I’ve done it 3x now (my daughter has had one twice). ADHD is often comorbid with something else. Find out the something else. Don’t delay on meds. My child unmedicated is a completely different and farrrrr more challenging kid than medicated.

Sure you can bounce around to another school but you will just start over again with a new team and cause more disruption to your kid. I would get to the root of the issues and then deal with those. Partner with the people who are helping your kid day in and day out.

Just dropping a note here to say that my similar kid got an autism diagnosis from a psychologist at an autism clinic covered by insurance - there was no “neuropsych” needed. And this was after we already got a very comprehensive IEP under the “developmental delay” label due to motor skills and behavioral issues based on the school testing and my advocacy.

I just think it is really important for parents to be informed consumers. Anyone trying to say you need to run to spend thousands on a “full neuropsych” is misinformed.

It really depends on the child. Some children with higher support needs can be diagnosed very quickly. Children with lower support needs often do need a more thorough evaluation. My kid may seem NT to many, loves to please other people and does great in structured environments, but really struggles with the intricacies of social communication. She needed someone to spend time reviewing her history, getting teacher and therapist input, getting input from us (parents) and testing including the ADOS.

For a complex child with a potential history of trauma I would absolutely want a thorough evaluation and that takes time, which costs money. It could be you can find a place that takes insurance to cover this, but people here have asked this many times and the answers are the same 2.plscws with long wait lists.

Sure but where you are incorrect is that an extensive battery of standardized cognitive tests is actually what leads to better diagnosis. For a complex child, a clinical evaluation and observation are likely more important. At the end of the day though treatment is more important and no family should be opting to pay Stixrud or CAAT $8k instead of getting immediate behavioral therapy.

Strongly disagree on so many levels. First of all we paid less than half of that at CAAT for a 5 year old because at that age the testing takes less time. We also go reimbursed by insurance for most of the cost.

Second the diagnosis has been transformative for us as parents and we have no doubt it will help our child immensely when she is old enough to understand what it means. We were already doing the right therapies but would definitely have stopped had we not known about the diagnosis because our child.had improved so much. Now we know these are ongoing supports she needs.

The cognitive tests were helpful because we needed to fully understand her strengths and challenges and the school was not going to evaluate in her case.

A “neuropsych” is a battery of standardized tests administered by a neuropsychologist generally focusing on IQ. To say you need a “neuropsych” for diagnosis is nonsensical.

DP please stop coming here to confuse people with false statements


[youtube]A neuropsychological evaluation measures a child’s intellectual abilities, attention, learning, memory, visual-spatial skills, visual-motor integration, language, motor coordination and executive functioning skills such as organization and planning. It may also address emotional, social and behavioral functioning. It can help in determining a child’s strengths and challenges and developing a treatment plan.

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/all-childrens-hospital/services/institute-brain-protection-sciences/programs-and-services/center-for-behavioral-health/neuropsychology/neuropsychological-evaluation-faq

An IEE is, in the IDEA’s wording, an “evaluation conducted by a qualified examiner who is not employed by the public agency responsible for the education of the child in question.” Typically, that evaluation is a comprehensive neuropsychological workup that identifies the child’s strengths and weaknesses, ultimately proposing actionable interventions that both schools and parents can pursue to nurture more successful academic outcomes.

Since these IEEs can cost thousands of dollars and often aren’t covered by insurance, you may want to initiate a process that compels your school district to cover the costs. This can be a contentious process, one that varies across states and municipalities. Here is what you need to know if you’re considering undertaking this process.

How do I know when my child needs an independent neuropsychological evaluation?

A neuropsychological evaluation can reveal a lot about how your child’s brain works and what is causing their struggles in school. And most schools don’t have the capacity to thoroughly assess students’ needs and abilities.

https://childmind.org/article/how-to-get-an-independent-neuropsychological-evaluation/

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=theflash1985][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Was preschool okay? What accommodations did he need there? [/quote]

OP doesn't want to answer this. Wonder why. [/quote]

[b]LOL. I was playing video games with my son and getting him ready for bed. [/b]

We confirmed his ADHD in preschool after his private Christian school admitted he’d been covering his ears, hiding under desks, and not responding to questions and being mute. At home, he started showing anxiety and physical aggression on us from holding it all in all day. [b]We got him diagnosed that week with ADHD and severe anxiety, [/b]did PCIT therapy over the summer which helped tremendously, and had an IEP ready for fall. (Fun Fact: The first IEP they gave us was literally blank — we had to tell them every single accommodation and service a kid with ADHD and Anxiety needs. PGCPS is insane - won't be here too much longer.)

[/quote]


Diagnosed within a week? Have you actually had a neuropsych evaluation?

It usually takes months to get a diagnosis. When you have a child like this a) you want the best and most experienced provider - a developmental pediatrician or a highly recommended psychologist to do a full neuropsych. You must have one.

Also, is your kid in therapy? He needs to be. If he spent any time in an orphanage or with bio parents, I would be concerned that there are other issues at play. (This is also why you need a neuropsych evaluation). I say this from experience with an adopted child with intense emotional dysregulation (only at home, great in school). They were later diagnosed with autism as a teen and have struggled with school refusal. You need to stop being so defensive while simultaneously being in denial. There isn’t a magic solution here - no magic school, no magic OT program. Just hard work.

Also, a FIVE YEAR OLD with ADHD should not be playing video games. And playing video games (or any screen time) before bed is absolutely moronic. You need to take a parenting class for kids with special needs pronto. [/quote]

It does not take a neuropsych to get an ADHD diagnosis. And, if you have good relationships with your school and pediatrician, you can get diagnosed within a week. A neuropsych is not always recommended as early as age 5. [/quote]

Anyone doling out ADHD diagnoses to 5 year olds without extensive testing should have their licenses revoked.[/quote]

This. Especially with a kid with violent behaviors. When we were getting my kid diagnosed with ADHD and later autism, I was looking for “the best of the best” providers and obviously, neuropsych evaluations were recommended by all.[/quote]

I'm sure that you believe you made the very best decisions for your child. But they are not the very best decisions for every child. I see a lot of value in getting a quick diagnosis so that you can get immediate services and accommodations in school. Those quick evaluations do not prevent you from getting additional evaluations. But failure to get a diagnosis can prevent your child from getting school services. [/quote]

When kids are that young they usually don’t need a diagnosis and can get services through a school assessment of developmental delay. But yes, if you need something quick to push that, do so. An expensive neuropsych in 6-18 months won’t help now. [/quote]

Hmm. Has the “quick diagnosis” and advice from that provider helped? It sure doesn't look like it. The kid absolutely needs a neuropsych and should get on a list ASAP. They should also be looking for a a whole new mental health team here. [/quote]

A “neuropsych” doesn’t even diagnose ADHD. I’m all in favor of consulting experts but in such a young kid it’s a lot less simple than shelling out $8k for a “neuropsych,” although I’m sure many providers would take OP’s money. What OP needs is whatever paperwork is necessary to get an IEP or update it (or BIP if they don’t have one), plus and advocate to get the school to implement it or find a new placement. [/quote]


Stop providing misinformation. A neuropsych diagnoses ADHD, using the TOVA, questionnaires, and other tests of attention. The evaluation lasts between 4-8 hours and will also help determine whether behaviors are due to learning disabilities, mental illness and other conditions. In the case of this adopted child, is important to figure out which behaviors are driven by anxiety, FASD/in útero drug exposure, reactive attachment disorder, learning disabilities, or neurodivergence. A pediatrician or school psychologist doesn’t have the expertise for this.

Not only that, everyone on this thread agrees that the school SPED departments are overworked and aren’t always 100% operating in the best interest in the child, and yet you are recommending that their evaluation and recommendations are all that’s needed? [/quote]

[b]You are not describing a “neuropsych.” You are describing a different type of evaluation. We had a “neuropsych” that included none of what you listed.[/b] Sounds like you feel like you got adequate testing which is great. But in general a “neuropsych” means a battery of cognitive testing not everything else you listed. [/quote]

Lady, I don't know what your deal is or why you are so intent on showing your ignorance. I don't even think your kid had a neuropsych, which is hilarious. You most likely had what is called a diagnostic evaluation. And on the off chance they did have a neuropsych, you do understand that neuropsych tests are tailored to each child's individual concerns? They will all be different.

Now, what are the differences between diagnostic evaluations and neuropsychological evaluations?
The biggest differences are the cost, time it takes, specificity of the tests and who assesses the tests.

Neuropsychological evaluations take anywhere from ten to twelve hours and is usually completed over two or three sessions, while diagnostic evaluations take between two and four hours and are usually completed in one or two sessions. Here is a link for you since you are struggling so much with understanding what a neuropsych is: https://www.thrivingwellnesscenter.com/blog/neuropsycheval

[/quote]

Nothing that you wrote supports that a “neuropsych” (which as your source says is not actually a single test) is necessary or sufficient for everything. In particular it is not generally considered adequate for ADHD which requires clinical assessment and collateral, not standardized tests. A neuropsychologist might be able to administer instruments like the ADOS but you don’t need a “full neuropsych” for that (ie 12 hours of testing including all the cognitive tests).

My objection is that stressed parents are being marketed a very expensive nonspecific packages of tests labeled the “full neuropsych” that may not even include the diagnostic assessment needed on the one had, and may be overkill on the other hand.

This is a good discussion of the issue with respect to ADHD and younger kids: https://www.reddit.com/r/medicine/comments/17if67i/adhd_testing_referrals_for_preschool_age_children/


[/quote]

The ADOS you mention is typically given when there are indications of autism or to rule out autism, and thus it is not always used in the ADHD diagnosis process.

While a neuropsychological is not necessary for an ADHD diagnosis, it is definitely more than adequate for an ADHD diagnosis and it is conducted by a "clinician". You can get an ADHD diagnosis from a primary care doctor, a pediatrician, or a psychiatrist, who will usually observe clinically and ask for some forms like the Connors or Vanderbilt to be completed by parent, child and teacher, the results of which are used in the diagnostic process. This diagnostic visit with a health professional is "adequate" for diagnosing ADHD.

However, many kids with ADHD also have 1 or more co-morbid disorders - autism, anxiety, depression, or learning disabilities (dyslexia, reading disorder NOS, coordination disorders, language processing disorders, or dyscalculia). That is why many parents seek a full neuropsychological assessment. The neuropsychological typically includes IQ/ability testing, achievement testing, and computer or paper questionnaires by parent/teacher/child to assess executive function (like the BRIEF), mood, and other characteristics. Computerized testing of attention via the TOVA, IVA, D-KEFS is often also included, as well as other tests like the Tower of London (executive function/planning), WRAML3 (memory), Rapid Automatized Naming, Beery Visual Motor Integration, Ray-Osterreith and so many more.

Most of these tests administered by a psychologist or neuropyschologist are normed and standardized tests, both of which are very helpful test qualities for diagnosis as well as for the legal processes under disability law; however, a pediatrician can still diagnose ADHD with questionnaires like Connors or Vanderbilt, which are standardized and based on norm-referenced data.

The "clinical assessment" is usually done by the psychologist who meets with the parents, and observes the child during testing and/or in a separate interview. The neuropsychologist, who is a "clinician," selects from among many testing instruments to decide what is appropriate for each particular child. Thus, not every child will get the same battery of tests.

Of course, even where a child is being assessed by a psychologist, the child's pediatrician should also examine the child to rule out physical causes of inattention like - thyroid or parathyroid problems, sleep issues, anemia, other nutrients, eyesight, etc. As well as running blood work (liver and kidney function) which are often required before starting medication.

Parents have to make a lot of complicated decisions about how to spend their time and money to get a diagnosis and support for a child in need. I am not sure why PPs keep criticizing each other's ways of pursuing diagnosis for their child, except where there is misinformation being presented. There are a range of options from school-based assessment to pediatrician to full blown neuropsychological and each child and family will have different needs and resources.

For more information on diagnosis, see [url]https://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/publications/attention-deficit-hyperactivity-disorder-what-you-need-to-know
[/url]

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous][quote=theflash1985][quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]Was preschool okay? What accommodations did he need there? [/quote]

OP doesn't want to answer this. Wonder why. [/quote]

[b]LOL. I was playing video games with my son and getting him ready for bed. [/b]

We confirmed his ADHD in preschool after his private Christian school admitted he’d been covering his ears, hiding under desks, and not responding to questions and being mute. At home, he started showing anxiety and physical aggression on us from holding it all in all day. [b]We got him diagnosed that week with ADHD and severe anxiety, [/b]did PCIT therapy over the summer which helped tremendously, and had an IEP ready for fall. (Fun Fact: The first IEP they gave us was literally blank — we had to tell them every single accommodation and service a kid with ADHD and Anxiety needs. PGCPS is insane - won't be here too much longer.)

[/quote]


Diagnosed within a week? Have you actually had a neuropsych evaluation?

It usually takes months to get a diagnosis. When you have a child like this a) you want the best and most experienced provider - a developmental pediatrician or a highly recommended psychologist to do a full neuropsych. You must have one.

Also, is your kid in therapy? He needs to be. If he spent any time in an orphanage or with bio parents, I would be concerned that there are other issues at play. (This is also why you need a neuropsych evaluation). I say this from experience with an adopted child with intense emotional dysregulation (only at home, great in school). They were later diagnosed with autism as a teen and have struggled with school refusal. You need to stop being so defensive while simultaneously being in denial. There isn’t a magic solution here - no magic school, no magic OT program. Just hard work.

Also, a FIVE YEAR OLD with ADHD should not be playing video games. And playing video games (or any screen time) before bed is absolutely moronic. You need to take a parenting class for kids with special needs pronto. [/quote]

It does not take a neuropsych to get an ADHD diagnosis. And, if you have good relationships with your school and pediatrician, you can get diagnosed within a week. A neuropsych is not always recommended as early as age 5. [/quote]

Anyone doling out ADHD diagnoses to 5 year olds without extensive testing should have their licenses revoked.[/quote]

This. Especially with a kid with violent behaviors. When we were getting my kid diagnosed with ADHD and later autism, I was looking for “the best of the best” providers and obviously, neuropsych evaluations were recommended by all.[/quote]

I'm sure that you believe you made the very best decisions for your child. But they are not the very best decisions for every child. I see a lot of value in getting a quick diagnosis so that you can get immediate services and accommodations in school. Those quick evaluations do not prevent you from getting additional evaluations. But failure to get a diagnosis can prevent your child from getting school services. [/quote]

When kids are that young they usually don’t need a diagnosis and can get services through a school assessment of developmental delay. But yes, if you need something quick to push that, do so. An expensive neuropsych in 6-18 months won’t help now. [/quote]

Hmm. Has the “quick diagnosis” and advice from that provider helped? It sure doesn't look like it. The kid absolutely needs a neuropsych and should get on a list ASAP. They should also be looking for a a whole new mental health team here. [/quote]

A “neuropsych” doesn’t even diagnose ADHD. I’m all in favor of consulting experts but in such a young kid it’s a lot less simple than shelling out $8k for a “neuropsych,” although I’m sure many providers would take OP’s money. What OP needs is whatever paperwork is necessary to get an IEP or update it (or BIP if they don’t have one), plus and advocate to get the school to implement it or find a new placement. [/quote]


Stop providing misinformation. A neuropsych diagnoses ADHD, using the TOVA, questionnaires, and other tests of attention. The evaluation lasts between 4-8 hours and will also help determine whether behaviors are due to learning disabilities, mental illness and other conditions. In the case of this adopted child, is important to figure out which behaviors are driven by anxiety, FASD/in útero drug exposure, reactive attachment disorder, learning disabilities, or neurodivergence. A pediatrician or school psychologist doesn’t have the expertise for this.

Not only that, everyone on this thread agrees that the school SPED departments are overworked and aren’t always 100% operating in the best interest in the child, and yet you are recommending that their evaluation and recommendations are all that’s needed? [/quote]

[b]You are not describing a “neuropsych.” You are describing a different type of evaluation. We had a “neuropsych” that included none of what you listed.[/b] Sounds like you feel like you got adequate testing which is great. But in general a “neuropsych” means a battery of cognitive testing not everything else you listed. [/quote]

Lady, I don't know what your deal is or why you are so intent on showing your ignorance. I don't even think your kid had a neuropsych, which is hilarious. You most likely had what is called a diagnostic evaluation. And on the off chance they did have a neuropsych, you do understand that neuropsych tests are tailored to each child's individual concerns? They will all be different.

Now, what are the differences between diagnostic evaluations and neuropsychological evaluations?
The biggest differences are the cost, time it takes, specificity of the tests and who assesses the tests.

Neuropsychological evaluations take anywhere from ten to twelve hours and is usually completed over two or three sessions, while diagnostic evaluations take between two and four hours and are usually completed in one or two sessions. Here is a link for you since you are struggling so much with understanding what a neuropsych is: https://www.thrivingwellnesscenter.com/blog/neuropsycheval

[/quote]

Nothing that you wrote supports that a “neuropsych” (which as your source says is not actually a single test) is necessary or sufficient for everything. In particular it is not generally considered adequate for ADHD which requires clinical assessment and collateral, not standardized tests. A neuropsychologist might be able to administer instruments like the ADOS but you don’t need a “full neuropsych” for that (ie 12 hours of testing including all the cognitive tests).

My objection is that stressed parents are being marketed a very expensive nonspecific packages of tests labeled the “full neuropsych” that may not even include the diagnostic assessment needed on the one had, and may be overkill on the other hand.

This is a good discussion of the issue with respect to ADHD and younger kids: https://www.reddit.com/r/medicine/comments/17if67i/adhd_testing_referrals_for_preschool_age_children/


[/quote]

The ADOS you mention is typically given when there are indications of autism or to rule out autism, and thus it is not always used in the ADHD diagnosis process.

While a neuropsychological is not necessary for an ADHD diagnosis, it is definitely more than adequate for an ADHD diagnosis and it is conducted by a "clinician". You can get an ADHD diagnosis from a primary care doctor, a pediatrician, or a psychiatrist, who will usually observe clinically and ask for some forms like the Connors or Vanderbilt to be completed by parent, child and teacher, the results of which are used in the diagnostic process. This diagnostic visit with a health professional is "adequate" for diagnosing ADHD.

However, many kids with ADHD also have 1 or more co-morbid disorders - autism, anxiety, depression, or learning disabilities (dyslexia, reading disorder NOS, coordination disorders, language processing disorders, or dyscalculia). That is why many parents seek a full neuropsychological assessment. The neuropsychological typically includes IQ/ability testing, achievement testing, and computer or paper questionnaires by parent/teacher/child to assess executive function (like the BRIEF), mood, and other characteristics. Computerized testing of attention via the TOVA, IVA, D-KEFS is often also included, as well as other tests like the Tower of London (executive function/planning), WRAML3 (memory), Rapid Automatized Naming, Beery Visual Motor Integration, Ray-Osterreith and so many more.

Most of these tests administered by a psychologist or neuropyschologist are normed and standardized tests, both of which are very helpful test qualities for diagnosis as well as for the legal processes under disability law; however, a pediatrician can still diagnose ADHD with questionnaires like Connors or Vanderbilt, which are standardized and based on norm-referenced data.

The "clinical assessment" is usually done by the psychologist who meets with the parents, and observes the child during testing and/or in a separate interview. The neuropsychologist, who is a "clinician," selects from among many testing instruments to decide what is appropriate for each particular child. Thus, not every child will get the same battery of tests.

Of course, even where a child is being assessed by a psychologist, the child's pediatrician should also examine the child to rule out physical causes of inattention like - thyroid or parathyroid problems, sleep issues, anemia, other nutrients, eyesight, etc. As well as running blood work (liver and kidney function) which are often required before starting medication.

Parents have to make a lot of complicated decisions about how to spend their time and money to get a diagnosis and support for a child in need. I am not sure why PPs keep criticizing each other's ways of pursuing diagnosis for their child, except where there is misinformation being presented. There are a range of options from school-based assessment to pediatrician to full blown neuropsychological and each child and family will have different needs and resources.

For more information on diagnosis, see [url]https://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/publications/attention-deficit-hyperactivity-disorder-what-you-need-to-know
[/url][/quote]

TLDR do you have a point?