I hate my parents

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My father just killed himself.

You are horrible, OP. Wish I'd never read this damn post.

I'm sorry for your loss.

But projecting your grief onto OP doesn't bring your dad back, and has nothing to do with OP's real frustrations.

[Anonymous]

Is this a relatively recent thing?

In the past when life expectancy wasn't as long, there wouldn't have been so many 50, 60 and even 70 somethings still dealing with their parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is this a relatively recent thing?

In the past when life expectancy wasn't as long, there wouldn't have been so many 50, 60 and even 70 somethings still dealing with their parents.

This isn’t accurate. Childhood mortality was so terrible pre-antibiotic, pre-vaccine etc, that the enormous numbers of children who died under five dramatically skew the averages. Averages are seldom a good measure, and here is a good example. Elders and their care are not a new phenomenon at all.

[Anonymous]

Um... when the retirement age of 65 was instituted in the 1930ties, the average life expectancy was only 58 years for men and 62 for women (they were higher for whites and lower for POC). The population of over 65+ was only 5.4%. Only about 5% of elders were expected to draw SS for 5+ years and less than 1% 20 years. Having your parents alive in your 60-70ties indeed was almost unheard of.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Is this a relatively recent thing?

In the past when life expectancy wasn't as long, there wouldn't have been so many 50, 60 and even 70 somethings still dealing with their parents.

It’s not talked about enough.
My father is 79 and is determined to live another 20 years. I wouldn’t be surprised if he did.
I have zero desire to take care of him until I am 68. Zero!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All geriatric people are self-focused, in the sense that they talk mostly about themselves, worry about themselves and want others to hear about themselves. This is somewhat like toddlers, who are incredibly limited in their ability to empathize (the whole world must feel the way they do, everyone ought to entertain their wishes). This is partly because old people have very small worlds, and their field of reference gets increasingly smaller with health issues and brain dysfunction. But it is also nature’s last gasp at gene transmission - the elderly have a tendency to overshare personal stories, accomplishments, histories and thoughts because they are at the end of life. “Someone please remember me” is the guiding subconscious principle as we age, and it’s good to realize we will be in the same place someday.

Can we please stop with the ageism? It's just as uncool and unjust as sexism and racism. Thankyouverymuch!

It’s not ageism. It is a biological reality (much like toddler behavior) that the inhibitory functions of the brain deteriorate rapidly in old age.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Um... when the retirement age of 65 was instituted in the 1930ties, the average life expectancy was only 58 years for men and 62 for women (they were higher for whites and lower for POC). The population of over 65+ was only 5.4%. Only about 5% of elders were expected to draw SS for 5+ years and less than 1% 20 years. Having your parents alive in your 60-70ties indeed was almost unheard of.

Life expectancies were so low because of infant deaths. After that, wealth was a major determinant of how long you lived.

Most of the founding fathers and presidents and wealthy people from the 1800s lived long lives.

Jefferson lived to 83. John Adams 91. Carnegie 84. Washington was actually an outlier at 67.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A parent of mine is laying dying right now. I have/had similar feelings to you for most of my life. As the end approaches, you will feel remorse for those feelings and regret that you couldn’t have a different relationship with your parents, even if it was out of your control for most of your life. What you’re feeling will corrode you. Take steps now so your future self appreciates what you’re doing right now.

It may not corrode her, but rather might further ( or more deeply) grieve the parenting relationship she wanted but never had. We can’t lose sight that not all parent/ child relationships form a bond. There is connection of origin, a shared history, an acknowledgement of food, shelter, and basic needs met but no emotional relationship. That’s what I am picking up on from the comments.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All geriatric people are self-focused, in the sense that they talk mostly about themselves, worry about themselves and want others to hear about themselves. This is somewhat like toddlers, who are incredibly limited in their ability to empathize (the whole world must feel the way they do, everyone ought to entertain their wishes). This is partly because old people have very small worlds, and their field of reference gets increasingly smaller with health issues and brain dysfunction. But it is also nature’s last gasp at gene transmission - the elderly have a tendency to overshare personal stories, accomplishments, histories and thoughts because they are at the end of life. “Someone please remember me” is the guiding subconscious principle as we age, and it’s good to realize we will be in the same place someday.

My mother is like this. She calls and goes on and on about her health and neighborhood or someone’s misfortunes, it’s much of the same over and over again.

My parents retired and never moved and are still in the same house they purchased over 50 years ago. I feel bad for them because they’re stuck in the past— she’s resentful of the fact that I married and moved away and my sister, her devoted daughter who stayed close by, never married nor had kids. I think deep down my mother would love to see me stumble and suffer for it as punishment for not putting her wishes first. She has always been the queen of schadenfreude.

So, I cut off the calls at the 30 minute mark because the conversations are not improving our relationship—well, they’re NOT really even conversations, they’re monologues— and I don’t want to lose time with my kids. What I have with her now doesn’t feel like a healthy relationship, and I don’t want to feed it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Um... when the retirement age of 65 was instituted in the 1930ties, the average life expectancy was only 58 years for men and 62 for women (they were higher for whites and lower for POC). The population of over 65+ was only 5.4%. Only about 5% of elders were expected to draw SS for 5+ years and less than 1% 20 years. Having your parents alive in your 60-70ties indeed was almost unheard of.

Life expectancies were so low because of infant deaths. After that, wealth was a major determinant of how long you lived.

Most of the founding fathers and presidents and wealthy people from the 1800s lived long lives.

Jefferson lived to 83. John Adams 91. Carnegie 84. Washington was actually an outlier at 67.

Incorrect. The population of over 65+ was only 5.4%. Only about 5% of elders were expected to draw SS for 5+ years and less than 1% 20 years. SS was certainly not instituted for the rich.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Um... when the retirement age of 65 was instituted in the 1930ties, the average life expectancy was only 58 years for men and 62 for women (they were higher for whites and lower for POC). The population of over 65+ was only 5.4%. Only about 5% of elders were expected to draw SS for 5+ years and less than 1% 20 years. Having your parents alive in your 60-70ties indeed was almost unheard of.

Life expectancies were so low because of infant deaths. After that, wealth was a major determinant of how long you lived.

Most of the founding fathers and presidents and wealthy people from the 1800s lived long lives.

Jefferson lived to 83. John Adams 91. Carnegie 84. Washington was actually an outlier at 67.

Incorrect. The population of over 65+ was only 5.4%. Only about 5% of elders were expected to draw SS for 5+ years and less than 1% 20 years. SS was certainly not instituted for the rich.

Got it…but older wealthy people lived long lives. That’s the main point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, while I don’t feel the way you do right now, I’ve heard people say and admit to feeling similar ways. It makes me think that—just like when teens are ready to leave the nest and there’s conflict and drama and tears—this is part of nature’s way of preparing you for their death. Imagine how hard it would be if parents were always ripped away in their 40s, 50s, 60s when things were still better. I think when people get to be of an advanced age, there are natural processes that make it both easier for them to let go of life, and for their loved ones to be ready for them to go.

I’m sorry you are feeling this way. I do think there’s some natural order stuff at work here, if that gives you any kind of comfort or sense of belonging.

Wow you are so wise. So nice to see comments like this. Admittedly I was going to be less charitable to OP- I’m so tired of hearing my friends complain about how awful it is to be stuck helping their elderly parents- to me, it is a gift to be able to spend time with my elderly parents and I’m reminded how lucky I am to have had them as parents, good and bad. Your post was a reminder to be kind

[Anonymous]

Hi OP - I could have written this. I feel the same way except it’s my mother who is the narcissist. I see things so differently now that they’re older. She never ever tried to form a close bond or relationship with me when I was young. When they visit, it’s all about the facade of them as grandparents. It’s really messed up and I hope I don’t have to deal with it much longer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If they were that horrible, you would have known before you were over 50 years old.

NP. When you are young, you only know what you know. So if you live with broken people, that’s your normal. It takes many years and a lot of experience to establish new normals. By then, you’re not living with those broken people anymore, and you haven’t for a long time. Your life is yours now. Maybe you try not to look back too much. You don’t want to dwell. So you never really look too deep, and you believe that you’ve moved on.

And then your parents get old. And suddenly you can’t avoid it anymore, you can’t avoid them anymore, there’s so little time and also now your own kids are grown and aren’t the buffer that they were. And those old patterns from your childhood are still there, all those familiar interactions are still there, but YOU are different, and suddenly it’s like the scales have fallen from your eyes, and it’s like, “Ohhhhh. I really didn’t get what I needed.” And that’s when it all comes bubbling up.

Or I dunno, maybe that’s just me.

Are you better, though? You are different, sure.

Our kids will all have stuff to say about us and our less than perfect parenting too.

My parents are far from ideal — they are divorced so not really one entity — but I’m not perfect either.

My best friend’s mom is schizophrenic and is currently living under an overpass or something. My friend has good reason to hate her. Being boring, on the other hand, is just what old people are.

PP. That’s the million dollar question, isn’t it?

In my house there was physical abuse, so in that way I can say definitively: yes, I’m better. My kids have been safe in their home.

The emotional stuff is trickier, murkier. While I have done a lot of work to be “better,” a family is at best a bunch of flawed human beings who bump up against each other again and again. And parents have a tremendous amount of power, so our flaws are amplified for our children.

Am I better? Am I better enough? These questions have been a constant thrum in my mind since the day I became a parent. I hope I am. I try to be. I try.

Still, the question will always be there.

I have a close friend who works in the mental health field. She is seeing massive amounts of young adults angry at their parents for not being “emotionally supportive” enough. The lists of grievances run from helicoptering to letting me stop playing softball when I was in middle school even though maybe I would have been great at it, to being too steady in the face of adversity and not feeling their pain acutely enough, etc. One of her coworkers also told her that her community center’s biggest support group is parents of estranged adult children. Two couples started it and now there are over 50 people in it. The next biggest support group has about a dozen members. This is in an are with a real mix of liberals, moderates, and conservatives.

My point in relaying this is that while we may think we are doing better and that our children would never treat us the way we are treating our “objectively” worse parents, I wouldn’t count on it. The bar got raised for parenting so “our best” might not be cutting it. We, for instance, have wound up in therapy for what seemed like some really minor stuff in our view and in the view of a couple of close confidants, but it’s an attempt to grapple with this before our DC is fully independent in the hopes of fending off adult estrangement.

I blame this on Tik Tok amateur psychology. It’s SO damaging to relationships and real mental health.

[Anonymous]

I love my parents but I wish they were gone. I don’t have the energy, time or desire to be with them anymore. My kids are draining enough, they are my focus now. I wish my brother lived closer to help out but zi think even if he did live near us. He wouldn’t be much help.