How to get around teen freezing Life 360

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your kid can’t be trusted, I get it. But if they’re generally trustworthy, why do this? With my three, including two teens and one young adult, I told them I wouldn’t track as long as they were abiding by our rules. We have Life360 for car trips and the like, but we otherwise never check. They know that if we have reason to stop trusting, they will get less freedom and independence. But I want to prepare them for a world in which no one is following their every movement to ensure they’re only making perfect decisions. Somehow all of us on here survived the teen years, and I can’t imagine there are many of us who didn’t make a few questionable decisions along the way. We learned from those as well. I do understand tightening the leash if your child is a habitual liar or meeting strangers from the internet at the mall or doing drugs, but otherwise, you’re doing no one any favors, including yourself. My anxiety would be through the roof if I felt responsible for tracking my kids all the time.

We use life360 to track each other for pickups and to know when to have meals ready.

My kids track us to see where we are when picking them up. My younger DC walks alone from one activity to another. I would have anxiety if I could not track them.

The older DC is 18 and at college. We asked them if they wanted to remove life360. They said, no, that they didn't care. This DC also goes to see their s/o at a big city every so often, so I like that we know when they get there safely and back.

Please read what you wrote. “I would have anxiety if I could not track them.”

DP. So? My mom always needed to know where I was going as a teen, who with, who would be there, and when I would be back. It would give her “anxiety” if I didn’t do this. It was also her right to know. Teens aren’t adults and shouldn’t have the same expectations of privacy. Would I read my teen’s diary? Absolutely not, but I will install Life360.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your kid can’t be trusted, I get it. But if they’re generally trustworthy, why do this? With my three, including two teens and one young adult, I told them I wouldn’t track as long as they were abiding by our rules. We have Life360 for car trips and the like, but we otherwise never check. They know that if we have reason to stop trusting, they will get less freedom and independence. But I want to prepare them for a world in which no one is following their every movement to ensure they’re only making perfect decisions. Somehow all of us on here survived the teen years, and I can’t imagine there are many of us who didn’t make a few questionable decisions along the way. We learned from those as well. I do understand tightening the leash if your child is a habitual liar or meeting strangers from the internet at the mall or doing drugs, but otherwise, you’re doing no one any favors, including yourself. My anxiety would be through the roof if I felt responsible for tracking my kids all the time.

We use life360 to track each other for pickups and to know when to have meals ready.

My kids track us to see where we are when picking them up. My younger DC walks alone from one activity to another. I would have anxiety if I could not track them.

The older DC is 18 and at college. We asked them if they wanted to remove life360. They said, no, that they didn't care. This DC also goes to see their s/o at a big city every so often, so I like that we know when they get there safely and back.

Please read what you wrote. “I would have anxiety if I could not track them.”

DP. So? My mom always needed to know where I was going as a teen, who with, who would be there, and when I would be back. It would give her “anxiety” if I didn’t do this. It was also her right to know. Teens aren’t adults and shouldn’t have the same expectations of privacy. Would I read my teen’s diary? Absolutely not, but I will install Life360.

Right? This is how many parents were too. As long as I was living in their home for free, being provided a phone, car, car insurance, etc etc… I followed their rules. That included being quizzed about where I was going and who with and what we were going to do. And on the occasion I was lying they normally ended up catching me (bad liar) and privileges were taken away. Even when I was older but still living at home it was the same rules because not knowing gave them anxiety. If they were technologically savvy and the tech was available back then, they would have tracked me.

And yes, I get along wonderfully with my parents still to this day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just trust my kids. If they haven’t given me a reason to think they are misbehaving, I trust them. I don’t track them.

I am the OP. I have lost trust in my 15yr old when I sensed something was off and did a deep dive on their phone. That is the problem. So when they got their phone back after 2 weeks, of course I am going to track them, which we always had as a family and I rarely looked at. But it sounds like kids are hacking life 360 to sneak out, leave school for lunch, staying after school, etc… so I just wanted to be one up on it. They also get around ring cameras.

They can already not do sleepovers and to the person that said check their bed at 3am every night, thank you. Caught again last night after coming home at 11:00pm, even when life 360 said they were home. So punished and loss of phone again.

And for those judging. I am trying. We live in a normal 4 person two parent home and my 17yr old is nothing like this. We are pretty flexible and never helicopterish. This is a new friend group and it’s been hell since Sept.

Op this is more than a phone problem.
1. Get kid in therapy.
2. Change kids school or homeschool. 3. No more of that friends group. Escort kid to all activities. Enroll kid in sport/hobby/skill at least three nights a week. Quit your job if you have to.

This is the critical drug/alcohol period. Your kid needs you. Yes they will hate you. In ten years they will thank you.

OP here

They are in therapy and on a new medication as of a month ago

Trying to get them away from the friend group but they are also in their school

I can’t switch schools. It wouldn’t matter.

They are in a club sport that starts Jan until July so hopeful that will help. Will be with team a lot.

I hate taking away phone but it’s what needed to happen.

I work from home PT. I am the driver almost all the time. The biggest thing was taking away sleepovers.

Thanks for the suggestions - honestly.

It sounds like you are doing a great job. It sucks to not have trust in your kid. Some of the posters here don't realize the hell that kids can put you through when they are engaged in dangerous behaviors. Definitely stay on top of your child and definitely no sleepovers.

[Anonymous]

Sleepovers are the biggest no no once they hit high school. It is always a sneak out or doing something they shouldn’t be doing. And many parents like one on this thread are far too lax

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sleepovers are the biggest no no once they hit high school. It is always a sneak out or doing something they shouldn’t be doing. And many parents like one on this thread are far too lax

Meh, on the sleepover thing. I’m the PP who said I still have a wonder relationship with my parents even though they pretty strictly restricted my social life while they provided for me. Sleep overs were okay with kids who’s parents they knew and talked to and trusted, also if they were at our house, and also my close-in-age family member who’s parents are still to this day more like siblings and best friends to my Mom and Dad than their own siblings are.

In general I agree though. WAY TOO lax. And also act so… helpless? JFC you guy’s are their parents! It’s not hard and not controversial and not extreme to.. take things away and ground them?… like.. society has done for decades upon decades if not hundreds of years?…

The necessities are food, shelter, education, and hygiene. The kid doesn’t need their car insurance paid for, or to get their license, or be given access to a car, or a phone, or their own laptop (computer in the family room for homework/school?…), or spending money. ESPECIALLY not if they don’t respect the rules you set or listen to you. I don’t even care about once they’re past 18, if they want these things paid for still, or college money from Mum and Dad, or for us to even cosign loans so they have the ability to go to college even just to get away from Mum and Dad—

— (which is honestly why I think wayyyy too many kids—even with non-strict parents—go to college and end up having issues with repaying their loans—and it’s quite honestly ridiculous and something our society needs to work on… “the college experience” should not be a factor in choosing a school )

—then they obey the house rules. They don’t? They lose that extra stuff, and eventually get kicked out when they’re adults.

When they DO obey the rules?.. feel free to give them extra perks of any kind your kid enjoys. Buy new video games, give him extra spending money— jfc if your kid is an angel you can even let him have a glass of champagne when you have some sort of family event. Give them extra positive reinforcement along with the basics that so many seem to think are “necessities” these days.

When they don’t follow your rules? They can see how life was for their Grandparents/great-Parents.


YOU are the parent. YOU will only have authority in these formative years. THIS is the time to teach them. Not just frilly shit, but also that there are consequences.


And to those of you hung up on the tracking aspect alone—because being able to track them 24/7 is such a new concept and your own parents, you yourselves, and Grandparents never had it?—well technology changes—these days elementary schoolers expect a smart phone with 5g and unlimited data, expect to be able to stream shit on demand on netflix rather than have to wait week to week and if you miss when your show airs on cable? You’re just SOL.


Technology chsnges, people adapt and change with it. Times changing goes both ways. Kids expect more stuff and freeoms? They and society should also expect more strict monitoring of that stuff.


Not a hard concept, and while it may sound strict and your kids might resent you in the moment? (Mine were strict, and in the moment I definitely resented them, even though they were more strict on certain freedoms than other parents they were more lenient on others. And I appreciate all they did for me.) if *being a parent* rather than a *friend who provides for all your wants and needs* is the litmus test as to whether your children cut you off when they’re adults?… then there’s more trauma there than your what-used-to-be-normal parenting styles, you’re too insecure about whether your teenager thinks you’re cool, or your kids are just spoiled buttholes.


#end-truth-rant.

[Anonymous]

I just saw a tik tok that life 360 fixed the hacks for the parents benefit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just trust my kids. If they haven’t given me a reason to think they are misbehaving, I trust them. I don’t track them.

I am the OP. I have lost trust in my 15yr old when I sensed something was off and did a deep dive on their phone. That is the problem. So when they got their phone back after 2 weeks, of course I am going to track them, which we always had as a family and I rarely looked at. But it sounds like kids are hacking life 360 to sneak out, leave school for lunch, staying after school, etc… so I just wanted to be one up on it. They also get around ring cameras.

They can already not do sleepovers and to the person that said check their bed at 3am every night, thank you. Caught again last night after coming home at 11:00pm, even when life 360 said they were home. So punished and loss of phone again.

And for those judging. I am trying. We live in a normal 4 person two parent home and my 17yr old is nothing like this. We are pretty flexible and never helicopterish. This is a new friend group and it’s been hell since Sept.

Op this is more than a phone problem.
1. Get kid in therapy.
2. Change kids school or homeschool. 3. No more of that friends group. Escort kid to all activities. Enroll kid in sport/hobby/skill at least three nights a week. Quit your job if you have to.

This is the critical drug/alcohol period. Your kid needs you. Yes they will hate you. In ten years they will thank you.

OP here

They are in therapy and on a new medication as of a month ago

Trying to get them away from the friend group but they are also in their school

I can’t switch schools. It wouldn’t matter.

They are in a club sport that starts Jan until July so hopeful that will help. Will be with team a lot.

I hate taking away phone but it’s what needed to happen.

I work from home PT. I am the driver almost all the time. The biggest thing was taking away sleepovers.

Thanks for the suggestions - honestly.

NP a little off topic to just say I’m sorry and others can’t possibly know how bad it can be until they live it. It sounds like you are doing everything you can. Post in the special needs forum if you need more support from us who have been there and understand. Teen behaviors can be hell. My entire family hit rock bottom (I hope) last year when my kid got involved with a different group with some very bad consequences. We made drastic changes but it didn’t happen overnight and now are dealing with social isolation and homeschool but no drugs or crimes or other terrible things that were happening. You do the best you can to get through these years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just trust my kids. If they haven’t given me a reason to think they are misbehaving, I trust them. I don’t track them.

I am the OP. I have lost trust in my 15yr old when I sensed something was off and did a deep dive on their phone. That is the problem. So when they got their phone back after 2 weeks, of course I am going to track them, which we always had as a family and I rarely looked at. But it sounds like kids are hacking life 360 to sneak out, leave school for lunch, staying after school, etc… so I just wanted to be one up on it. They also get around ring cameras.

They can already not do sleepovers and to the person that said check their bed at 3am every night, thank you. Caught again last night after coming home at 11:00pm, even when life 360 said they were home. So punished and loss of phone again.

And for those judging. I am trying. We live in a normal 4 person two parent home and my 17yr old is nothing like this. We are pretty flexible and never helicopterish. This is a new friend group and it’s been hell since Sept.

Op this is more than a phone problem.
1. Get kid in therapy.
2. Change kids school or homeschool. 3. No more of that friends group. Escort kid to all activities. Enroll kid in sport/hobby/skill at least three nights a week. Quit your job if you have to.

This is the critical drug/alcohol period. Your kid needs you. Yes they will hate you. In ten years they will thank you.

OP here

They are in therapy and on a new medication as of a month ago

Trying to get them away from the friend group but they are also in their school

I can’t switch schools. It wouldn’t matter.

They are in a club sport that starts Jan until July so hopeful that will help. Will be with team a lot.

I hate taking away phone but it’s what needed to happen.

I work from home PT. I am the driver almost all the time. The biggest thing was taking away sleepovers.

Thanks for the suggestions - honestly.

NP a little off topic to just say I’m sorry and others can’t possibly know how bad it can be until they live it. It sounds like you are doing everything you can. Post in the special needs forum if you need more support from us who have been there and understand. Teen behaviors can be hell. My entire family hit rock bottom (I hope) last year when my kid got involved with a different group with some very bad consequences. We made drastic changes but it didn’t happen overnight and now are dealing with social isolation and homeschool but no drugs or crimes or other terrible things that were happening. You do the best you can to get through these years.

Thank you. I really appreciate this reply

-OP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How about telling your kid that if they do that again, they lose their phone for a week.

No actually if they do that again they won’t have access to a phone. Seriously. I wish my teen would try this stunt and I find it out. I pay the phone bill. Their location will be turned on.

How did you find this out anyway?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How old is the teen, and what are you worried they are doing when they have location turned off?

We just had this discussed in our house. 17 year old wants privacy and not to be tracked. He does occasionally go to “hang outs” he sometimes has beer. He swears he never has and never will drink and drive. We talked about what good the tracking does us - it doesn’t let us keep our kid safe and alive, which is what we’d like to do. It does allow us to catch him in a lie if he wants to lie to us and we want to snoop.

We agreed to skip it. Everyone in the family has Life360, but we all agreed to use it for checking when people will be home, that they are still alive on a road trip without texting for updates, etc. Our life has been more peaceful and I worry a lot less than I did when I checked the tracking more.

This is clearly age and kid dependent. I have a kid who is almost and adult, and he is generally a kind and thoughtful person who doesn’t get into trouble very often. A younger kid is a different story.

We do have a hard and fast rule that if kid breaks rules in the car (excessive speed, drinking and driving) we take the car keys. You could do the same with the phone - disable Life360 and the phone goes away. There is also a premium version of Life360 that can’t be disabled. But kids can just leave their phones someplace allowed while they go make mischief. Tracking may not actually keep them safe. It does make you crazy checking, though. I know that from experience!

DP. My 17 yo has an IPhone and so do I. We share locations. Neither of us have any reason for the other to not know where we are. As long as I pay the phone bill location share will be used.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just trust my kids. If they haven’t given me a reason to think they are misbehaving, I trust them. I don’t track them.

I am the OP. I have lost trust in my 15yr old when I sensed something was off and did a deep dive on their phone. That is the problem. So when they got their phone back after 2 weeks, of course I am going to track them, which we always had as a family and I rarely looked at. But it sounds like kids are hacking life 360 to sneak out, leave school for lunch, staying after school, etc… so I just wanted to be one up on it. They also get around ring cameras.

They can already not do sleepovers and to the person that said check their bed at 3am every night, thank you. Caught again last night after coming home at 11:00pm, even when life 360 said they were home. So punished and loss of phone again.

And for those judging. I am trying. We live in a normal 4 person two parent home and my 17yr old is nothing like this. We are pretty flexible and never helicopterish. This is a new friend group and it’s been hell since Sept.

Op this is more than a phone problem.
1. Get kid in therapy.
2. Change kids school or homeschool. 3. No more of that friends group. Escort kid to all activities. Enroll kid in sport/hobby/skill at least three nights a week. Quit your job if you have to.

This is the critical drug/alcohol period. Your kid needs you. Yes they will hate you. In ten years they will thank you.

OP here

They are in therapy and on a new medication as of a month ago

Trying to get them away from the friend group but they are also in their school

I can’t switch schools. It wouldn’t matter.

They are in a club sport that starts Jan until July so hopeful that will help. Will be with team a lot.

I hate taking away phone but it’s what needed to happen.

I work from home PT. I am the driver almost all the time. The biggest thing was taking away sleepovers.

Thanks for the suggestions - honestly.

NP a little off topic to just say I’m sorry and others can’t possibly know how bad it can be until they live it. It sounds like you are doing everything you can. Post in the special needs forum if you need more support from us who have been there and understand. Teen behaviors can be hell. My entire family hit rock bottom (I hope) last year when my kid got involved with a different group with some very bad consequences. We made drastic changes but it didn’t happen overnight and now are dealing with social isolation and homeschool but no drugs or crimes or other terrible things that were happening. You do the best you can to get through these years.

Thank you. I really appreciate this reply

-OP

OP I posted earlier in the thread. Just wanted to wish you luck. It sounds like you are going through a rough time. I hope it gets better for you and your child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just trust my kids. If they haven’t given me a reason to think they are misbehaving, I trust them. I don’t track them.

I am the OP. I have lost trust in my 15yr old when I sensed something was off and did a deep dive on their phone. That is the problem. So when they got their phone back after 2 weeks, of course I am going to track them, which we always had as a family and I rarely looked at. But it sounds like kids are hacking life 360 to sneak out, leave school for lunch, staying after school, etc… so I just wanted to be one up on it. They also get around ring cameras.

They can already not do sleepovers and to the person that said check their bed at 3am every night, thank you. Caught again last night after coming home at 11:00pm, even when life 360 said they were home. So punished and loss of phone again.

And for those judging. I am trying. We live in a normal 4 person two parent home and my 17yr old is nothing like this. We are pretty flexible and never helicopterish. This is a new friend group and it’s been hell since Sept.

Op this is more than a phone problem.
1. Get kid in therapy.
2. Change kids school or homeschool. 3. No more of that friends group. Escort kid to all activities. Enroll kid in sport/hobby/skill at least three nights a week. Quit your job if you have to.

This is the critical drug/alcohol period. Your kid needs you. Yes they will hate you. In ten years they will thank you.

OP here

They are in therapy and on a new medication as of a month ago

Trying to get them away from the friend group but they are also in their school

I can’t switch schools. It wouldn’t matter.

They are in a club sport that starts Jan until July so hopeful that will help. Will be with team a lot.

I hate taking away phone but it’s what needed to happen.

I work from home PT. I am the driver almost all the time. The biggest thing was taking away sleepovers.

Thanks for the suggestions - honestly.

You don’t even have to take the phone. Just disconnect the service. Turn it off. Period.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just trust my kids. If they haven’t given me a reason to think they are misbehaving, I trust them. I don’t track them.

I am the OP. I have lost trust in my 15yr old when I sensed something was off and did a deep dive on their phone. That is the problem. So when they got their phone back after 2 weeks, of course I am going to track them, which we always had as a family and I rarely looked at. But it sounds like kids are hacking life 360 to sneak out, leave school for lunch, staying after school, etc… so I just wanted to be one up on it. They also get around ring cameras.

They can already not do sleepovers and to the person that said check their bed at 3am every night, thank you. Caught again last night after coming home at 11:00pm, even when life 360 said they were home. So punished and loss of phone again.

And for those judging. I am trying. We live in a normal 4 person two parent home and my 17yr old is nothing like this. We are pretty flexible and never helicopterish. This is a new friend group and it’s been hell since Sept.

Op this is more than a phone problem.
1. Get kid in therapy.
2. Change kids school or homeschool. 3. No more of that friends group. Escort kid to all activities. Enroll kid in sport/hobby/skill at least three nights a week. Quit your job if you have to.

This is the critical drug/alcohol period. Your kid needs you. Yes they will hate you. In ten years they will thank you.

OP here

They are in therapy and on a new medication as of a month ago

Trying to get them away from the friend group but they are also in their school

I can’t switch schools. It wouldn’t matter.

They are in a club sport that starts Jan until July so hopeful that will help. Will be with team a lot.

I hate taking away phone but it’s what needed to happen.

I work from home PT. I am the driver almost all the time. The biggest thing was taking away sleepovers.

Thanks for the suggestions - honestly.

You don’t even have to take the phone. Just disconnect the service. Turn it off. Period.

Most kids get burner phones

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just trust my kids. If they haven’t given me a reason to think they are misbehaving, I trust them. I don’t track them.

I am the OP. I have lost trust in my 15yr old when I sensed something was off and did a deep dive on their phone. That is the problem. So when they got their phone back after 2 weeks, of course I am going to track them, which we always had as a family and I rarely looked at. But it sounds like kids are hacking life 360 to sneak out, leave school for lunch, staying after school, etc… so I just wanted to be one up on it. They also get around ring cameras.

They can already not do sleepovers and to the person that said check their bed at 3am every night, thank you. Caught again last night after coming home at 11:00pm, even when life 360 said they were home. So punished and loss of phone again.

And for those judging. I am trying. We live in a normal 4 person two parent home and my 17yr old is nothing like this. We are pretty flexible and never helicopterish. This is a new friend group and it’s been hell since Sept.

Op this is more than a phone problem.
1. Get kid in therapy.
2. Change kids school or homeschool. 3. No more of that friends group. Escort kid to all activities. Enroll kid in sport/hobby/skill at least three nights a week. Quit your job if you have to.

This is the critical drug/alcohol period. Your kid needs you. Yes they will hate you. In ten years they will thank you.

OP here

They are in therapy and on a new medication as of a month ago

Trying to get them away from the friend group but they are also in their school

I can’t switch schools. It wouldn’t matter.

They are in a club sport that starts Jan until July so hopeful that will help. Will be with team a lot.

I hate taking away phone but it’s what needed to happen.

I work from home PT. I am the driver almost all the time. The biggest thing was taking away sleepovers.

Thanks for the suggestions - honestly.

NP a little off topic to just say I’m sorry and others can’t possibly know how bad it can be until they live it. It sounds like you are doing everything you can. Post in the special needs forum if you need more support from us who have been there and understand. Teen behaviors can be hell. My entire family hit rock bottom (I hope) last year when my kid got involved with a different group with some very bad consequences. We made drastic changes but it didn’t happen overnight and now are dealing with social isolation and homeschool but no drugs or crimes or other terrible things that were happening. You do the best you can to get through these years.

NP.

Another reason to read the whole thread. And, yes, what a supportive post. We, likewise, had a severe blip first year at a new school but it was the “new” friends (and their parents) who helped pull DC (and me!) back from the brink. That’s probably the exception rather than the rule and one of the reasons we’ve emphasized to our kids that one of the biggest decisions/choices they’ll ever make is…..who their “friends” are. That doesn’t change from 5 to 50.

Hang in there, OP. Do what your gut tells you to protect your child, your family AND yourself. Caretakers so often forget to take care of themselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just trust my kids. If they haven’t given me a reason to think they are misbehaving, I trust them. I don’t track them.

I am the OP. I have lost trust in my 15yr old when I sensed something was off and did a deep dive on their phone. That is the problem. So when they got their phone back after 2 weeks, of course I am going to track them, which we always had as a family and I rarely looked at. But it sounds like kids are hacking life 360 to sneak out, leave school for lunch, staying after school, etc… so I just wanted to be one up on it. They also get around ring cameras.

They can already not do sleepovers and to the person that said check their bed at 3am every night, thank you. Caught again last night after coming home at 11:00pm, even when life 360 said they were home. So punished and loss of phone again.

And for those judging. I am trying. We live in a normal 4 person two parent home and my 17yr old is nothing like this. We are pretty flexible and never helicopterish. This is a new friend group and it’s been hell since Sept.

Op this is more than a phone problem.
1. Get kid in therapy.
2. Change kids school or homeschool. 3. No more of that friends group. Escort kid to all activities. Enroll kid in sport/hobby/skill at least three nights a week. Quit your job if you have to.

This is the critical drug/alcohol period. Your kid needs you. Yes they will hate you. In ten years they will thank you.

OP here

They are in therapy and on a new medication as of a month ago

Trying to get them away from the friend group but they are also in their school

I can’t switch schools. It wouldn’t matter.

They are in a club sport that starts Jan until July so hopeful that will help. Will be with team a lot.

I hate taking away phone but it’s what needed to happen.

I work from home PT. I am the driver almost all the time. The biggest thing was taking away sleepovers.

Thanks for the suggestions - honestly.

NP a little off topic to just say I’m sorry and others can’t possibly know how bad it can be until they live it. It sounds like you are doing everything you can. Post in the special needs forum if you need more support from us who have been there and understand. Teen behaviors can be hell. My entire family hit rock bottom (I hope) last year when my kid got involved with a different group with some very bad consequences. We made drastic changes but it didn’t happen overnight and now are dealing with social isolation and homeschool but no drugs or crimes or other terrible things that were happening. You do the best you can to get through these years.

Thank you. I really appreciate this reply

-OP

You’re welcome. I wanted to add something else about the phone. I hope you never go through this but if you ever suspect your kid could run away or go missing and they have their phone, the police can find them by pinging it if it’s not dead. Unfortunately we have had this experience and have other consequences but now never take phones. I realize this doesn’t apply to most kids and thought it would never apply to us until it did.