My DS wants to be a musician. WWYD?

[Anonymous]

LOL -- the kid totally realizes that you are mooching off the brother and trying to act like your way of life is the better/safer one. You made your bed and now you have to lie in it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would like to point out that pursuing a career in the performing arts does not mean you have to bypass college.

Lupita N'yongo is an A-list actress. She graduated from Yale. Charlie Puth is a successful pop musician and he graduated from the Berklee College of Music.

Pursuing a career in music or film/TV doesn't mean you can't do college. And college can be a useful stepping stone as in the two examples I just shared.

Teens have very limited, narrow mindsets about the path to success and what it looks like.

Yes, but it’s also true that college is by no means necessary and if a teenager says that, it doesn’t mean they have a limited, narrow mindset about the path to success.

College is not necessary for success in life. True. But people who have college degrees have higher odds and rates of successful outcomes. Not being able to recognize that and insisting that the only way to be successful is by avoiding or dropping out of college is a limited viewpoint. For every success story, there are countless people who dropped out or bypassed college and are barely scraping by. We have to stop romanticizing this pathway. It leaves behind a lot of damaged, broken and failed people.

For rock music in particular, I’m not convinced that’s true. If you can prove otherwise, please link to it.

We’re not talking about life in general here. We’re talking about rock music for a kid OBSESSED with it, like OP’s son.

I was obsessed with anime when I was a teen. I taught myself how to draw my favorite anime characters. I'm glad my parents didn't take my adolescent interests and assume that they had to be lifelong passions.

At one point, I also said I wanted to be a marine biologist. Today, I have zero interest in anything like working with animals full-time.

You do realize how bad teenagers are at knowing who they are and what they want, right? That's why so many of them change majors multiple times in college. If you treat teens like they are adults, you can enable some pretty poorly thought out decisions that they will regret and then later blame you for.

Please stop minimizing the work and commitment associated with playing an instrument well. It is not the same as spending time as a teenager drawing your favorite anime character on any level. You wouldn't say that if the kid had been playing violin since he was 6. You're just saying it now because you don't think that THIS kind of music is worth investing in.

Teenagers are not actually terrible at knowing what they want. They are learning what they want. They are developing interests. It makes sense that some of those interests would die on the vine, like your love of anime. It also makes sense that some personal interests would never turn into career interests. It is pretty shortsighted to have a blanket assumption that you should not take seriously the interests of teenagers because you don't share them.

My point is treating the adolescent mind and its opinions as gospel is not wise. They are learning what they want, as you yourself said, so they can and will say one thing is their lifelong passion today and completely drop it tomorrow. You can't take everything they say seriously.

Okay, but at what point do you START taking them seriously? This is a kid who is clearly pretty dedicated to his craft, and the response here is basically "take away his guitar, he doesn't really know what he wants."

No, the kid is about to fail high school and the responses here indicate that he
needs to invest enough time time in academics to graduate with a decent enough GPA to have college as an option.

In 5 years he might completely change his mind on music and find himself a High School drop out. If elite athletes can do it, so can OP’s kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Adam Duritz from Counting Crows has talked a lot in interviews about what he got out of his college education and how it helped his music. He studied English at Berkeley. (He didn't graduate, but was one paper shy.) His music really does reflect his education.

Adam has also been very candid about how music goes from a passion to a job once you make it your career.

You might do a search for interviews with Adam Duritz.

I'd keep reminding your son that music is better when you have experiences and knowledge to write about. Literary and historical references make music richer, but you need information in your head to do that. He needs to educate himself.

Is Adam Duritz more popular than Shawn Mendes? I don't recall Shawn Mendes ever attended college and he writes good music.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would like to point out that pursuing a career in the performing arts does not mean you have to bypass college.

Lupita N'yongo is an A-list actress. She graduated from Yale. Charlie Puth is a successful pop musician and he graduated from the Berklee College of Music.

Pursuing a career in music or film/TV doesn't mean you can't do college. And college can be a useful stepping stone as in the two examples I just shared.

Teens have very limited, narrow mindsets about the path to success and what it looks like.

Yes, but it’s also true that college is by no means necessary and if a teenager says that, it doesn’t mean they have a limited, narrow mindset about the path to success.

College is not necessary for success in life. True. But people who have college degrees have higher odds and rates of successful outcomes. Not being able to recognize that and insisting that the only way to be successful is by avoiding or dropping out of college is a limited viewpoint. For every success story, there are countless people who dropped out or bypassed college and are barely scraping by. We have to stop romanticizing this pathway. It leaves behind a lot of damaged, broken and failed people.

For rock music in particular, I’m not convinced that’s true. If you can prove otherwise, please link to it.

We’re not talking about life in general here. We’re talking about rock music for a kid OBSESSED with it, like OP’s son.

I was obsessed with anime when I was a teen. I taught myself how to draw my favorite anime characters. I'm glad my parents didn't take my adolescent interests and assume that they had to be lifelong passions.

At one point, I also said I wanted to be a marine biologist. Today, I have zero interest in anything like working with animals full-time.

You do realize how bad teenagers are at knowing who they are and what they want, right? That's why so many of them change majors multiple times in college. If you treat teens like they are adults, you can enable some pretty poorly thought out decisions that they will regret and then later blame you for.

Please stop minimizing the work and commitment associated with playing an instrument well. It is not the same as spending time as a teenager drawing your favorite anime character on any level. You wouldn't say that if the kid had been playing violin since he was 6. You're just saying it now because you don't think that THIS kind of music is worth investing in.

Teenagers are not actually terrible at knowing what they want. They are learning what they want. They are developing interests. It makes sense that some of those interests would die on the vine, like your love of anime. It also makes sense that some personal interests would never turn into career interests. It is pretty shortsighted to have a blanket assumption that you should not take seriously the interests of teenagers because you don't share them.

My point is treating the adolescent mind and its opinions as gospel is not wise. They are learning what they want, as you yourself said, so they can and will say one thing is their lifelong passion today and completely drop it tomorrow. You can't take everything they say seriously.

Okay, but at what point do you START taking them seriously? This is a kid who is clearly pretty dedicated to his craft, and the response here is basically "take away his guitar, he doesn't really know what he wants."

No, the kid is about to fail high school and the responses here indicate that he
needs to invest enough time time in academics to graduate with a decent enough GPA to have college as an option.

In 5 years he might completely change his mind on music and find himself a High School drop out. If elite athletes can do it, so can OP’s kid.

It doesn't take much to graduate HS these days. He can go to NVCC and transfer to UVA, not difficult at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My 15 years old DS is no longer cared about school and it is creating so much tensions in the family between my wife and I. DS spent this past summer with my younger brother who is touring musician and he performed at many venues. DS has a completely different attitude after the summer and he says that school is no longer a priority for him. FWIW, my brother is doing very well for himself as a musician with a net worth of around 7M at the age of 39 (he generously let us live in one of his homes rent free, we only pay for utilities) and he dropped out of UCLA after two years. For the past month, DS spends very little time on homework and all of his time practicing the guitar and writing music. DS has made it clear that he wants to be a musician like his uncle. I've told DS that the odd of succeeding like his uncle is like winning the Powerball lottery which is slim to none but DS is not listening and my DW is very upset about this, and blames me for letting DS hang out with my brother in the summer. My brother doesn't want to get involved in my family internal dispute. WWYD? TIA

Send him to Berkeley summer program next year and make it contingent on school grades. Once he comes back, tell him he has to have grades to get in to places like Berkeley. Maybe he will put two and two together.

[Anonymous]

The chances of getting into UC Berkeley out of state are about zero.

Do you mean Berklee school of music in Boston?

Why not encourage music school? You have to graduate from high school to go ....

[Anonymous]

Your brother has not been staying out of it. If he has been paying for guitar lessons for years and taking your son touring, he is all in. The least he can do is tell your son that focusing on academics in High School is important.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Adam Duritz from Counting Crows has talked a lot in interviews about what he got out of his college education and how it helped his music. He studied English at Berkeley. (He didn't graduate, but was one paper shy.) His music really does reflect his education.

Adam has also been very candid about how music goes from a passion to a job once you make it your career.

You might do a search for interviews with Adam Duritz.

I'd keep reminding your son that music is better when you have experiences and knowledge to write about. Literary and historical references make music richer, but you need information in your head to do that. He needs to educate himself.

Is Adam Duritz more popular than Shawn Mendes? I don't recall Shawn Mendes ever attended college and he writes good music.

Is it a competition? Adam Duritz has several decades of experience on Shawn and is undeniably successful in the music industry. If you want to compare net worths, Adam beats Shawn about about $20m.

But truly, it's a silly question to even ask. Adam has given interviews on the topic and has a pretty mature perspective that may be useful for OP. It's not the only perspective, but it's good to hear from a rock star that values education and considers that it has improved his music.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Adam Duritz from Counting Crows has talked a lot in interviews about what he got out of his college education and how it helped his music. He studied English at Berkeley. (He didn't graduate, but was one paper shy.) His music really does reflect his education.

Adam has also been very candid about how music goes from a passion to a job once you make it your career.

You might do a search for interviews with Adam Duritz.

I'd keep reminding your son that music is better when you have experiences and knowledge to write about. Literary and historical references make music richer, but you need information in your head to do that. He needs to educate himself.

Is Adam Duritz more popular than Shawn Mendes? I don't recall Shawn Mendes ever attended college and he writes good music.

Would he write even better music if he had an education? We'll probably never know.

If OP's son has an album debut at #1 before he turns 18, I'm sure OP would have a different perspective on the importance of college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Adam Duritz from Counting Crows has talked a lot in interviews about what he got out of his college education and how it helped his music. He studied English at Berkeley. (He didn't graduate, but was one paper shy.) His music really does reflect his education.

Adam has also been very candid about how music goes from a passion to a job once you make it your career.

You might do a search for interviews with Adam Duritz.

I'd keep reminding your son that music is better when you have experiences and knowledge to write about. Literary and historical references make music richer, but you need information in your head to do that. He needs to educate himself.

Is Adam Duritz more popular than Shawn Mendes? I don't recall Shawn Mendes ever attended college and he writes good music.

Is it a competition? Adam Duritz has several decades of experience on Shawn and is undeniably successful in the music industry. If you want to compare net worths, Adam beats Shawn about about $20m.

But truly, it's a silly question to even ask. Adam has given interviews on the topic and has a pretty mature perspective that may be useful for OP. It's not the only perspective, but it's good to hear from a rock star that values education and considers that it has improved his music.

I recalled neither Harry Styles nor Eric Clapton attending college (Clapton might have been a college dropout), and both of them are much more successful than Adam Duritz.  I don't even know who Adam Duritz is until this thread.  I do know who Shawn Mendes is because my daughter is a big fan of Mendes, and I am an old guy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Would he write even better music if he had an education? We'll probably never know.

If OP's son has an album debut at #1 before he turns 18, I'm sure OP would have a different perspective on the importance of college.

Have you seen college grads working at Starbuck?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would like to point out that pursuing a career in the performing arts does not mean you have to bypass college.

Lupita N'yongo is an A-list actress. She graduated from Yale. Charlie Puth is a successful pop musician and he graduated from the Berklee College of Music.

Pursuing a career in music or film/TV doesn't mean you can't do college. And college can be a useful stepping stone as in the two examples I just shared.

Teens have very limited, narrow mindsets about the path to success and what it looks like.

Yes, but it’s also true that college is by no means necessary and if a teenager says that, it doesn’t mean they have a limited, narrow mindset about the path to success.

College is not necessary for success in life. True. But people who have college degrees have higher odds and rates of successful outcomes. Not being able to recognize that and insisting that the only way to be successful is by avoiding or dropping out of college is a limited viewpoint. For every success story, there are countless people who dropped out or bypassed college and are barely scraping by. We have to stop romanticizing this pathway. It leaves behind a lot of damaged, broken and failed people.

For rock music in particular, I’m not convinced that’s true. If you can prove otherwise, please link to it.

We’re not talking about life in general here. We’re talking about rock music for a kid OBSESSED with it, like OP’s son.

I posted a list of 25 notable rock musicians who got degrees. At best, even if college is not necessary, it's not like getting a college degree has stopped anyone from being a rock star. If it's meant to be, it will be.

If it means giving up a spot in a successful band, it can set someone back. Tons of musicians get their start in their late teens/early 20s. That’s a sweet spot.

Why do think so many musicians either didn’t go to college or dropped out?

And so many musicians look back and regret that they didn't educate themselves because they realized they were taken advantage of in the music business because they lacked education.

You guys have to stop selling the myth that dropping out of school or skipping college in pursuit a career in music is peaches and creams. There are risks and tradeoffs to both approaches. You pick your poison and live with the consequences.

I would never say it’s peaches and cream. Far from it. And making sure you have trusted people helping you is huge.

But if you want to try to make it, hiding in college until you’re 22 could actually hurt you. You’re missing out on important years of gigging and networking.

A good number of the prominent musicians with degrees got them during or after their bands’ success.

Are you a 40 year old dude still gigging and networking and waiting for your big break?

I’m a 36 year old woman with a day job who is gigging and networking and waiting for my big break. You can call it pathetic all you want. I don’t care.

[Anonymous]

He should have learned to dem guitars.
He should have learned to play dem drums!!

Maybe get a blister on his little finger, Maybe get a blister on his thumb!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Adam Duritz from Counting Crows has talked a lot in interviews about what he got out of his college education and how it helped his music. He studied English at Berkeley. (He didn't graduate, but was one paper shy.) His music really does reflect his education.

Adam has also been very candid about how music goes from a passion to a job once you make it your career.

You might do a search for interviews with Adam Duritz.

I'd keep reminding your son that music is better when you have experiences and knowledge to write about. Literary and historical references make music richer, but you need information in your head to do that. He needs to educate himself.

Is Adam Duritz more popular than Shawn Mendes? I don't recall Shawn Mendes ever attended college and he writes good music.

Is it a competition? Adam Duritz has several decades of experience on Shawn and is undeniably successful in the music industry. If you want to compare net worths, Adam beats Shawn about about $20m.

But truly, it's a silly question to even ask. Adam has given interviews on the topic and has a pretty mature perspective that may be useful for OP. It's not the only perspective, but it's good to hear from a rock star that values education and considers that it has improved his music.

I recalled neither Harry Styles nor Eric Clapton attending college (Clapton might have been a college dropout), and both of them are much more successful than Adam Duritz.  I don't even know who Adam Duritz is until this thread.  I do know who Shawn Mendes is because my daughter is a big fan of Mendes, and I am an old guy.

Harry Styles was famous by 16. Eric Clapton was in successful, record producing bands by 17.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would like to point out that pursuing a career in the performing arts does not mean you have to bypass college.

Lupita N'yongo is an A-list actress. She graduated from Yale. Charlie Puth is a successful pop musician and he graduated from the Berklee College of Music.

Pursuing a career in music or film/TV doesn't mean you can't do college. And college can be a useful stepping stone as in the two examples I just shared.

Teens have very limited, narrow mindsets about the path to success and what it looks like.

Yes, but it’s also true that college is by no means necessary and if a teenager says that, it doesn’t mean they have a limited, narrow mindset about the path to success.

College is not necessary for success in life. True. But people who have college degrees have higher odds and rates of successful outcomes. Not being able to recognize that and insisting that the only way to be successful is by avoiding or dropping out of college is a limited viewpoint. For every success story, there are countless people who dropped out or bypassed college and are barely scraping by. We have to stop romanticizing this pathway. It leaves behind a lot of damaged, broken and failed people.

For rock music in particular, I’m not convinced that’s true. If you can prove otherwise, please link to it.

We’re not talking about life in general here. We’re talking about rock music for a kid OBSESSED with it, like OP’s son.

I posted a list of 25 notable rock musicians who got degrees. At best, even if college is not necessary, it's not like getting a college degree has stopped anyone from being a rock star. If it's meant to be, it will be.

If it means giving up a spot in a successful band, it can set someone back. Tons of musicians get their start in their late teens/early 20s. That’s a sweet spot.

Why do think so many musicians either didn’t go to college or dropped out?

And so many musicians look back and regret that they didn't educate themselves because they realized they were taken advantage of in the music business because they lacked education.

You guys have to stop selling the myth that dropping out of school or skipping college in pursuit a career in music is peaches and creams. There are risks and tradeoffs to both approaches. You pick your poison and live with the consequences.

I would never say it’s peaches and cream. Far from it. And making sure you have trusted people helping you is huge.

But if you want to try to make it, hiding in college until you’re 22 could actually hurt you. You’re missing out on important years of gigging and networking.

A good number of the prominent musicians with degrees got them during or after their bands’ success.

Are you a 40 year old dude still gigging and networking and waiting for your big break?

I’m a 36 year old woman with a day job who is gigging and networking and waiting for my big break. You can call it pathetic all you want. I don’t care.