Takoma Park Magnet Decision

[Anonymous]

We received a letter today which said DC "met the criteria to be included in the lottery" and received a waitlist position (no ranking number) thru the lottery.

Does anyone know what the "waitlist" means? Is it like private school -- no one is rejected and everyone is waitlisted? Is the waitlist also by lottery or is it ranked? Has anyone been accepted off the waitlist? If so, what time of year?

I'd be very curious to hear the range of percentile scores for accepted kids. The letter gives individual raw scores for each section and then correlates the raw score to "percentile scores for kindergarten students who applied to the magnet program." Our DC scored around the 50th percentile, which seems low and not commensurate with his other private cognitive testing. But his percentile scores on the private cognitive testing are based on national norms, so it's not really comparable to the pool of "kindergarten kids who applied to the magnet program." I recognize that it's like comparing apples and oranges, but at the same time it seems odd that the pools would be so different that a kid who scores at the 99%ile on a national normed cognitive test would only score at the 50%ile on this test.

Anyone else care to share percentile scores and admissions decision?

[Anonymous]

Interesting. OP, do you mind sharing raw scores? Our DC received a letter that said she did NOT meet criteria for inclusion in the program.

Raw scores:
Verbal 36- (between 50 and 75th percentile)
Quantitative Reasoning 37 (between 50 and 75th percentile)
Non verbal 38 (90th percentile)

No mention of how other criteria might have been used is made in the letter, it's just a standard form letter.

Also, anybody know what test they took? Just curious.

[Anonymous]

20:26 : Those scores seem awfully high to not meet the criteria. But the testing is only part of the picture they use, right?

I wonder how much of their decision is weighted by teacher/current school recommendations and parent descriptions.

[Anonymous]

I'm happy someone started this post. We just got the letter today. Anyway, DC did NOT meet the criteria. I was starting to second guess myself about different things with daughter's education and DH was trying to help me put it in perspective. This definitely helps.

As for the waitlist etc. From the way it was explained during the info sessions, people have 2 weeks to confirm that they are taking the spot (although the default assumption is that you will if offered). I imagine there will be some movement on the wait list after that deadline. Not everyone gets a waitlist number. Basically out of X number of applications last year, maybe 90 met the criteria for the 30 out of boundary spots. Of all that met the criteria - they were put in a lottery and the first say 30 were offered a spot and the rest waitlisted. From what I heard this year 175 applicants for the out of boundary spots.

[Anonymous]

DC did get in. For those of you on the waitlist, those of us who got in have until May 25 to send response back to the county.

[Anonymous]

What scores are kids who met the criteria getting? I'm sure they won't provide the information willingly, but doesn't the county have to provide info on how they made their decisions? The letter gives scores, says whether the child met or didn't meet the criteria, and that's it. It doesn't actually say what the criteria was. So can you score 50th percentile and meet criteria and 90th percentile and not meet the criteria based on teacher and parent recommendations? I wonder if the county has been able to get around providing this information in past years, and if so, how. Seems it should be publicly available. Not that I'm really worried about whether DC attends their program, but the process needs to be transparent.

[Anonymous]

welcome to MCPS, first grade parents! Oh if you only knew. MCPS has not been providing this information for at least the ten years in have had kids in the System. You are right. it is disrespectful in the face of all their noise about parent engagement and parent partnership. It is unconscionable, but somehow they continue to get away with it. As you are at the beginning of your MCPS school journey I urge you to pay attention, get involved, get organized and demand change. P.S. I had a child in the TPES and it was the start of my MCPS "education."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Interesting. OP, do you mind sharing raw scores? Our DC received a letter that said she did NOT meet criteria for inclusion in the program.

Raw scores:
Verbal 36- (between 50 and 75th percentile)
Quantitative Reasoning 37 (between 50 and 75th percentile)
Non verbal 38 (90th percentile)

No mention of how other criteria might have been used is made in the letter, it's just a standard form letter.

Also, anybody know what test they took? Just curious.

I am OP. The letter specifies that the test was the Cognitive Abilities Test. Based on the number of questions and the age group of the kids, I would guess that it was the Primary Edition CogAT, Level K.

BTW, your scores are higher across the board than ours -- a point or two on M/V but significantly so in NV, so I would definitely call the AEI person listed on the letter and ask what the other criteria were beside testing, what the cutoffs were and why your child didn't meet them.

You have the right under the Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act to inspect and review your child's education record (it varies as to whether you can get copies of things or have to review in person). An educational record includes anything personally identifiable to your child (in this case, that should be test scores, test booklet, parent and teacher forms, and anything else with your child's name on it, etc.) Google for more information on this.

Did the letter which you received that said your child did not meet the criteria give you any information about appealing this determination? If so, what issues are you allowed to raise in appeal? I know from other parents who were rejected at other magnet programs, that they were offered a chance to appeal and the issues on appeal were fairly narrow -- e.g. wrong information and only 2 other things (can't remember all). But, in that (different) magnet process the family did appeal according to form offered and were successful.

I agree with another poster that the whole process for magnets and g/t determination is not very transparent as to how the various factors are weighed and how decisions are made. Although, IMO, MoCo should be more transparent, parents can help each other by sharing information.

If you decide to ask for more info, please consider sharing what you learn here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting. OP, do you mind sharing raw scores? Our DC received a letter that said she did NOT meet criteria for inclusion in the program...

...Also, anybody know what test they took? Just curious.

I am OP. The letter specifies that the test was the Cognitive Abilities Test. Based on the number of questions and the age group of the kids, I would guess that it was the Primary Edition CogAT, Level K...

OP, thank you for this informative post. I will follow up with the AEI office and try to find out how the decision was made. I will gladly share any information I get.

[Anonymous]

I followed up with the AEI office today. I found out that (generally speaking) it was necessary to score 50th percentile or better on all 3 sections to meet the benchmarks for inclusion in the lottery. I say generally b/c the office is also supposed to conduct outreach and try to find kids who would benefit but who may be on the cusp with test scores if they're high with other indicators. Reading and math levels needed to be above grade level. This year the reading level benchmark was 16 at the low end but since a lot of kids had high reading levels it was (again generally) necessary to be about 3 grade levels ahead, as reported by the home school. It was necessary to be one grade level ahead in math. As it happens, the reading and math levels listed for my child were not correct. I was told initially that the teacher checklist was not available to be viewed by parents as that would be a violation of confidentiality. When I asked how it could be that I am prevented from viewing my own child's education records, the subject was changed. At least I succeeded in getting part of the information.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was told initially that the teacher checklist was not available to be viewed by parents as that would be a violation of confidentiality. When I asked how it could be that I am prevented from viewing my own child's education records, the subject was changed. At least I succeeded in getting part of the information.

I would pursue this. You have a right to this information.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I followed up with the AEI office today. I found out that (generally speaking) it was necessary to score 50th percentile or better on all 3 sections to meet the benchmarks for inclusion in the lottery. I say generally b/c the office is also supposed to conduct outreach and try to find kids who would benefit but who may be on the cusp with test scores if they're high with other indicators. Reading and math levels needed to be above grade level. This year the reading level benchmark was 16 at the low end but since a lot of kids had high reading levels it was (again generally) necessary to be about 3 grade levels ahead, as reported by the home school. It was necessary to be one grade level ahead in math. As it happens, the reading and math levels listed for my child were not correct. I was told initially that the teacher checklist was not available to be viewed by parents as that would be a violation of confidentiality. When I asked how it could be that I am prevented from viewing my own child's education records, the subject was changed. At least I succeeded in getting part of the information.

Did you ask about a right to appeal the determination that your child was not deemed to have met the criteria? I would definitely pursue this ASAP, since admit acceptances must be returned by May 25th per a PP above. Your best chance to be reconsidered and actually get a space comes if you demand a chance to make the correction to the record and appeal the determination of having met/not met the criteria before spaces become available when a few of the admitted parents/kids turn down their slot.

As for confidentiality -- that is precisely the point of FERPA, a school system is not allowed to unilaterally deem an individualized school record as "confidential". Many schools get around this by having a parent sign a waiver of confidentiality on the teacher recommendation form before giving it to the teacher. I can't remember, but I don't think the Takoma Magnet form had a line for this? Anyone else remember?

Assuming you didn't sign a waiver, you are right that the teacher checklist should be available to you under FERPA. You will, probably have to write a letter to Monique Felder making a request to have a copy or view the teacher checklist and all other elements of your application file. There are consequences for violations of FERPA.

Also, you have a right under FERPA to ask that the school amend any part of the education record that you believe is inaccurate or misleading. (This doesn't extend to substantive judgments, but if you have documentation about your child's reading levels that differs from what was in the record they reviewed for the magnet decision then your right to amend the record under FERPA would apply to correct that.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I followed up with the AEI office today...

Did you ask about a right to appeal the determination that your child was not deemed to have met the criteria?

As for confidentiality -- that is precisely the point of FERPA, a school system is not allowed to unilaterally deem an individualized school record as "confidential". Many schools get around this by having a parent sign a waiver of confidentiality on the teacher recommendation form before giving it to the teacher. I can't remember, but I don't think the Takoma Magnet form had a line for this? Anyone else remember?

PP here. I did not ask specifically about appeal b/c the AEI office said they would follow up with the home school on reading and math levels. The teacher checklist was sent direct from TPES to the home school and then returned directly. However, I do not recall at any time signing a confidentiality waiver. Thanks for pointing out that the schools do that, I was not aware.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We received a letter today which said DC "met the criteria to be included in the lottery" and received a waitlist position (no ranking number) thru the lottery.

Does anyone know what the "waitlist" means? Is it like private school -- no one is rejected and everyone is waitlisted? Is the waitlist also by lottery or is it ranked? Has anyone been accepted off the waitlist? If so, what time of year?

OP, I asked the AEI office about chance of getting off the waitlist. I was told that there are other students who were higher ranked than my child on the waitlist. So it appears that the waitlist is not by lottery, but is ranked. I was told that in some years quite a few students get off the wait list and that they have yet to hear from a number of parents. Maybe the concern about whether or not there will be bus service is causing people to hold back with their replies.